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Non-Alola Pokémon Competitive Viability

Envoy

Formerly GTT
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You guys know all those fancy new Pokémon we got? You guys remember all those Pokémon that got new forms? You guys aware of all those nifty Ultra Beasts? Well, this is not the thread to talk about them. You're looking for this one.

This is a thread to discuss how all of the Pokémon from Bulbasaur to Volcanion were affected by Gen VII competitively.

How well will Mega Venusaur fare in a meta filled with Fairy types?

Can Gengar remain OU with Cursed Body?

Did Dragonite gain any new toys that will help it stand out?

How does the general priority nerf affect Scizor and Bisharp?

How will the nerf to burn and paralysis affect certain Pokémon going forward?

How about that Porygon-Z huh?

And what about poor Klefki and Talonflame? Do they still have a place in the OU meta game? If not, what tier do you predict they will go to? Why?

You can also discuss doubles, triples, rotations, and royales here, but keep it to Gen VII and keep it about the pre-Alola mons.
 
I'm guessing Talonflame won't be used as much after Gale Wings took a hit.

Although that was never really a big deal for me. I figured it was fast enough without the ability.

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Guts users like Conkeldurr and Swellow will definitely enjoy the burn nerf. Swellow also has +25 to its Special Attack alongside Hurricane now, making a Specs set with Scrappy Boomburst feasible.

Poor old Flareon is probably the only Pokémon with Guts to not benefit from the weakened burns.
 
The only way I can see Talonflame having any sort of utility in OU after the nerf to Gale Wings is if it fills an anti-lead niche. Other than that, I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up falling all the way to NU tbh.

As for Z-Crystals, I can see them being extremely popular with Unburden pokemon... in particular those who used to run gems in their sets back in Gen V. I mean, Z-Crystals are essentially gems on roids after all
 
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The only way I can see Talonflame having any sort of utility in OU after the nerf to Gale Wings is if it fills an anti-lead niche, holding a Z-Crystal while running Acrobatics. Other than that, I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up falling all the way to NU tbh.

As for Z-Crystals, I can see them being extremely popular with Unburden pokemon... in particular those who used to run gems in their sets back in Gen V. I mean, Z-Crystals are essentially gems on roids after all

Z-Crystals are never consumed- even after use. They're useless on Pokémon with Acrobatics or Unburden.
 
What Talonflame would like now is for the Flying Gem to finally return and let it pull off some pre Generation VI Acrobatics abuse, since Brave Bird is completely counterproductive to the new Gale Wings. I'm doubtful as to how much mileage one could get with that when its Attack stat is barely beaten by Cacnea though. At least it has Bulk Up and I think Swords Dance.
 
Is Gale Wings really that big a deal? I always figured a base 126 speed was enough to make Talonflame viable.


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Is Gale Wings really that big a deal? I always figured a base 126 speed was enough to make Talonflame viable.


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Gale Wings was literally the only reason why Talonflame was viable. Without it,it loses to speed boosters (like DD Mega Gyara), Choice Scarf users, opposing priority (like a +2 Mega Pinsir QA), etc. Also, because of Gale Wings, Talon was able to run a lot of HP and SpDef investment to artificially increase its bulk without sacrificing speed
 
Talonflame really got screwed by the generational shift. Which did at least have the unintended benefit of getting rid of one of bulky grass' biggest nuisances.
 
Please note: The thread is from 7 years ago.
Please take the age of this thread into consideration in writing your reply. Depending on what exactly you wanted to say, you may want to consider if it would be better to post a new thread instead.
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