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Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

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@Joshawott;

I wouldn't call it a "split-second" but our measurement of what counts as "split-second" is probably different. I find it hard to believe Red's holding onto a bubble the entire time.
 
You do realize if there's anything more repetitive than CoD it's Pokemon's "Get 8 badges, catch all Pokemon, defeat the bad guys!" formula that's been going on since it started, right? And of course, when you bring that up with Pokemon fans you get "If it ain't broke don't fix it". If you're honestly concerned about Pokemon's repetitiveness, I'd be less concerned about Game Freak's obvious Kanto-boner than it is about how slow it takes Game Freak to change up its formula.

And they are using brand new shiny stuff to sell brand new shiny games. They're using Mega Evolutions as the hot topic this month, but obviously you have a problem with the "old-Pokemon focus" with that even though Game Freak outright claims Mega Evolution to be the biggest news for this generation. So they use new features to promote a new game, and these features happen to be tied to old Pokemon....yet you're complaining they're focusing on the old.
In the past, we've always had new species of Pokémon being related to previous Pokémon. The problem is that this time, the new Pokémon are hardly receiving anywhere near the focus that the old Pokémon are getting.

Because those games featured an old legendary Pokémon and were released in tandem with a special about previous games, right? Go ahead and assume that it's just pandering if it makes you feel better.
It's specifically titled Pokémon: The Origin and is looking back at the first games. Regardless of whether Mewtwo will be involved in XY's story or not (which we have no idea if it will be. The Mega Stone to Mega Evolve it could easily be a post-game only item).

To I dunno, promote XY and the Kalos region?
They don't need a special just for that when the regular anime will serve that purpose soon enough. Again, there may be a special later down the road when the story isn't a secret anymore.
Why are you so insistent that an XY focused special would be full of spoilers? All it needs is the little amount that the B2W2 animated trailers had to generate discussion and hype. It doesn't need to go through the entire games' story like this special is. As I said before, a 30-60 minute special focusing on the beginning of the games, then with a hint of something more at the end to get people pumped.

Also, from what you're saying, it's that in order to express an opinion based on facts and franchise trends, I shouldn't bring facts and trends into the discussion when justifying my opinion?
You aren't doing much by regurgitating facts about the past.
Better than not using facts to base my opinions.

Would it kill them to actually give some kind of hype to Xerneas or Yveltal?
They never did that for previous releases. A special about the mascots would no doubt be spoilerific.
All they need to mention is that there is some relation between Xerneas/Yveltal and Mega Pokémon, or that Team Flare are interested in a specific aspect of the legendary Pokémon. Y'know, something other than "Hey look, here's two legendary Pokémon. Now, let's go back to talking about that legendary Pokémon from 17 years ago".

@Joshawott;

I wouldn't call it a "split-second" but our measurement of what counts as "split-second" is probably different. I find it hard to believe Red's holding onto a bubble the entire time.
Yet if it is a Mega Stone, then we have the question of "If Red knew about Mega Stones, then why did they not surface until years later?". We know that Gen II/IV take place 3 years after Gen I, then we have BW taking place after them and B2W2 taking place 2 years after that.
 
In the past, we've always had new species of Pokémon being related to previous Pokémon. The problem is that this time, the new Pokémon are hardly receiving anywhere near the focus that the old Pokémon are getting.

While Mewtwo was the first reveal, no information was given, making talk about it really stagnant. It's been less than a month since Mega Evolutions are released, and we've had a steady release of new Pokemon up to this point, and suddenly we're not giving any new Pokemon attention? If you want to complain about Skiddo, the Pikaclone and that rabbit being shafted....I think there's a reason Game Freak showcased Pokemon like that in August (you know, so attention wouldn't be divided between more important Pokemon and Mega Evolutions). I mean, yeah, we haven't given them any attention in the past few weeks but they've gotten a lot of attention up to this point, and still have a month of coverage left.

Yet if it is a Mega Stone, then we have the question of "If Red knew about Mega Stones, then why did they not surface until years later?". We know that Gen II/IV take place 3 years after Gen I, then we have BW taking place after them and B2W2 taking place 2 years after that.

I don't know, maybe that special that you say doesn't tie into XY may actually explain it? Maybe it'll be the event that precipitates a research team who develops Mega Stones to think to themselves "Hey, maybe there is something beyond Evolution!" since up to now there's no reason to come to that conclusion. Perhaps the reason it took 10+ years is the reason a lot of scientific discoveries take awhile? They discovered Mega Evolution but didn't know how to reliably induce it?

If you want what I think will happen, I've posted it already and you were quoted in it (you know that one that I misread your post).

Related to the video, there is a stone on Red's hand and one moving rhythmically with Charizard's chest. If the one on Charizard's chest is a bubble, that's an amazingly coordinated bubble.
 
While Mewtwo was the first reveal, no information was given, making talk about it really stagnant. It's been less than a month since Mega Evolutions are released, and we've had a steady release of new Pokemon up to this point, and suddenly we're not giving any new Pokemon attention? If you want to complain about Skiddo, the Pikaclone and that rabbit being shafted....I think there's a reason Game Freak showcased Pokemon like that in August (you know, so attention wouldn't be divided between more important Pokemon and Mega Evolutions). I mean, yeah, we haven't given them any attention in the past few weeks but they've gotten a lot of attention up to this point, and still have a month of coverage left.
Talk of Mega Mewtwo was all the rage, with people speculating about whether it was a new species or a new forme. Sure, there was the whole Sylveon's type thing, but people's attention were drawn to Mewtwo more because of the nostalgia.

Yet if it is a Mega Stone, then we have the question of "If Red knew about Mega Stones, then why did they not surface until years later?". We know that Gen II/IV take place 3 years after Gen I, then we have BW taking place after them and B2W2 taking place 2 years after that.

I don't know, maybe that special that you say doesn't tie into XY may actually explain it? Maybe it'll be the event that precipitates a research team who develops Mega Stones to think to themselves "Hey, maybe there is something beyond Evolution!" since up to now there's no reason to come to that conclusion. Perhaps the reason it took 10+ years is the reason a lot of scientific discoveries take awhile? They discovered Mega Evolution but didn't know how to reliably induce it?

If you want what I think will happen, I've posted it already and you were quoted in it (you know that one that I misread your post).

Related to the video, there is a stone on Red's hand and one moving rhythmically with Charizard's chest. If the one on Charizard's chest is a bubble, that's an amazingly coordinated bubble.

Except the official website doesn't indicate that this will tie into XY in any way. The way the official website is worded makes it seem like more of a "In celebration of Pokémon X and Y, let's take a look back and see where it all began" kind of thing. If a Mega Stone and Mega Charizard are shoe-horned into it, then yes it will be pure fan pandering because it will be randomly shoe-horning the Mega Evolutions into an established story where they didn't exist.
 
Established story? That was a post-game event (and in FrLg post- Sevii event if I recall) that we didn't have to go through, and which future generations that tied specifically to it didn't make a specific mention of either. It's not like they're shoehorning Mega Evolution into the final battle with Blue.

Its hardly established when the last things we know is that Red won the Pokemon league....then disappeared into the mountains (or ran around some islands before disappearing into the mountains)
 
It's specifically titled Pokémon: The Origin and is looking back at the first games.
And it's specifically referred to on the official website as a special commemorating XY's release. Connect the dots.

Regardless of whether Mewtwo will be involved in XY's story or not (which we have no idea if it will be. The Mega Stone to Mega Evolve it could easily be a post-game only item).
There is strong evidence to suggest that Mewtwo has a role in the story. They put it alongside the mascots for a reason.

Why are you so insistent that an XY focused special would be full of spoilers? All it needs is the little amount that the B2W2 animated trailers had to generate discussion and hype. It doesn't need to go through the entire games' story like this special is. As I said before, a 30-60 minute special focusing on the beginning of the games, then with a hint of something more at the end to get people pumped.
30-60 minutes dedicated to the beginning? Again, why? It wouldn't be very different than the first few episodes of the XY series. As for a short teaser, that could be added at the end of Origin if they wanted. Or it could just be aired separately even next month.

Better than not using facts to base my opinions.
It isn't better than not jumping to conclusions while looking for a deeper explanation than the most banal one.

All they need to mention is that there is some relation between Xerneas/Yveltal and Mega Pokémon, or that Team Flare are interested in a specific aspect of the legendary Pokémon. Y'know, something other than "Hey look, here's two legendary Pokémon. Now, let's go back to talking about that legendary Pokémon from 17 years ago".
What have they said about Mewtwo? That it has a Mega Evolution with higher Special Attack? We know the basic details about the mascots, too. And once more, story details weren't revealed for the previous mascots, either.
 
I want this to be successful. I want the Pokémon Company to know that this franchise can survive beyond Ash Ketchum, that kids can follow a new protagonist, a far more successful protagonist.

Can it? Because of course Pokemon Chronicles was a huge success without him. I agree I'd like to see him more competent, Johto and Sinnoh had it about right, but I don't want him to be in game good. The fact that a 10 year old child can go from complete beginner to greatest trainer in the region, in less than a year is a little mind baffling at best.

Ash and Pikachu, ARE Pokemon, you can't have one without the other. I know in Japan the games came first, but in the UK, and probably the rest of Europe, (and probably the rest of the world) it was the cartoon that was the huge success and made people want to go out and buy the games. Still to this day, Ash and Pikachu are the most recongisable of the franchise. How many kids on the GTS name themselves Ash or Satoshi? He is still an icon.

Just look at Digimon with that Tamer series, or Yugioh with what they are currently doing, they replaced the main characters, and the new seriess just don't pull in strong enough numbers, Digimon folded eventually, while Pokemon continues to soar, I think YUGIOH is still going, but not here in the UK, (well I dont know what channel its on if it is) and it's faded away if not died altogether.

EDIT: Apparently Digimon is still lingering on too so maybe they can survive, just not have any level of success or exposure outside of Japan.

Currently there's no evidence to the contrary that Pokémon cannot survive without Ash and Pikachu. It's a given that it has been marketing gold since the show's inception, but that series ain't selling games in NA anymore, or Europe for that matter. I've never ran into someone on the GTS named Ash, so that's a moot point. It's a variable I won't take into consideration since I've never seen it occur, plus, it is impossible to determine if those users are actual kids, or nostalgic fans. I have named characters Red, but that's the generation I come from.

Franchises can survive and blossom without the initial set of characters, Legend of Korra is the greatest example of successfully moving a franchise on. Numerous fans blasted the change, and it's Nick's biggest show. Pokémon could become a huge hit if kids had someone new to latch on to, and someone who could succeed and become a champion. In a show like this, realism is not the top priority, kids can achieve great things. Pokémon is an empowerment series, after all. We play as, and follow, kids who can accomplish what adults cannot.

All of this sums up that Ash and Pikachu are not Pokémon. They aren't selling these games. The duo are mascots, to be sure, but you do not need Ash. He is not Pokémon to these kids that pick it up today.
 
My two cents...

New Pokemon don't necessarily make a game. If we look at other popular games (specifically Nintendo ones) they use an almost identical cast with every game, but change the features. And new Pokemon are a given, so why can't they focus on how the new features are going to impact old Pokemon? I think that's a question a lot of people would have if they only showed Mega Evolutions working on Gen 6 or even Gen 5 Pokemon. I'm guessing that this anime isn't just a simple Gen 1 rehash, and that they're trying to use this as an opportunity to show how Gen 1 would work if we applied updated mechanics.

Also the "underwater" scene everyone's referring too doesn't really look like water to me, but I could be wrong about that. It just doesn't make sense for them to be chilling underwater with all those lights. It looks more like some kind of "bonding" moment in the form of a cut scene where they might unlock Mega Evolution, or something similar to this.
 
Well, it certainly seems like we'll see Charizard Mega Evolving in this special. Which is odd, because according to the official site:
Mega Evolution is described as an Evolution beyond all Evolution, a transformation found only in the Kalos region.

I guess that could just be the English site editors trying to say "exclusive to Pokemon X and Y" in a fancy way, and instead created a new meaning.
 
And it's specifically referred to on the official website as a special commemorating XY's release. Connect the dots.
I already did. It's a "Hey, these new games are coming out, so let's just take a step back and see where it all began". It's clearly The Pokémon Company trying to recapture the attention of older fans who have outgrown the franchise in Japan. Which is a dangerous move as the present and recent past have shown us that anything related to Nintendo have no clue on how to advertise the same product to two different target audience.

Regardless of whether Mewtwo will be involved in XY's story or not (which we have no idea if it will be. The Mega Stone to Mega Evolve it could easily be a post-game only item).
There is strong evidence to suggest that Mewtwo has a role in the story. They put it alongside the mascots for a reason.
Or maybe it's just there as a symbol of the Mega Pokémon? That piece of artwork is being used as the soundtrack artwork iirc? Then Mewtwo is simply on the back cover.

Why are you so insistent that an XY focused special would be full of spoilers? All it needs is the little amount that the B2W2 animated trailers had to generate discussion and hype. It doesn't need to go through the entire games' story like this special is. As I said before, a 30-60 minute special focusing on the beginning of the games, then with a hint of something more at the end to get people pumped.
30-60 minutes dedicated to the beginning? Again, why? It wouldn't be very different than the first few episodes of the XY series. As for a short teaser, that could be added at the end of Origin if they wanted. Or it could just be aired separately even next month.
It would be different to the beginning of the XY series because aside from the obvious (no Ash and Pikachu), the XY anime begins with Ash arriving in Lumiose City, whereas the games begin in Vaniville Town.

Better than not using facts to base my opinions.
It isn't better than not jumping to conclusions while looking for a deeper explanation than the most banal one.
I'm not even going to justify such an opinion and ironic statement with a response.

All they need to mention is that there is some relation between Xerneas/Yveltal and Mega Pokémon, or that Team Flare are interested in a specific aspect of the legendary Pokémon. Y'know, something other than "Hey look, here's two legendary Pokémon. Now, let's go back to talking about that legendary Pokémon from 17 years ago".
What have they said about Mewtwo? That it has a Mega Evolution with higher Special Attack? We know the basic details about the mascots, too. And once more, story details weren't revealed for the previous mascots, either.
Sure, we usually don't learn much about the mascots, but Xerneas and Yveltal do definitely risk being overshadowed by a past generation legendary at this point. For example, I see you talking about Mewtwo a lot, while hardly even touching the subject of Xerneas and Yveltal. Those two should be the big talking point in terms of legendary Pokémon, not Mewtwo.
 
I already did. It's a "Hey, these new games are coming out, so let's just take a step back and see where it all began". It's clearly The Pokémon Company trying to recapture the attention of older fans who have outgrown the franchise in Japan. Which is a dangerous move as the present and recent past have shown us that anything related to Nintendo have no clue on how to advertise the same product to two different target audience.
Or they do know what they're doing because the games are actually connected. You aren't jumping to conclusions at all.

Or maybe it's just there as a symbol of the Mega Pokémon? That piece of artwork is being used as the soundtrack artwork iirc? Then Mewtwo is simply on the back cover.
It's a promotional artwork that is also being used for the soundtrack. What difference does it make if Mewtwo is on the back cover? It's still alongside the mascots in the original artwork, and I am not arguing that it trumps the mascots.

It would be different to the beginning of the XY series because aside from the obvious (no Ash and Pikachu), the XY anime begins with Ash arriving in Lumiose City, whereas the games begin in Vaniville Town.
There is no fundamental difference that would warrant the investment in the project. But you've made your point: You really wish that this were a Vaniville Town special instead. Just don't pretend that most people would agree with you.

Sure, we usually don't learn much about the mascots, but Xerneas and Yveltal do definitely risk being overshadowed by a past generation legendary at this point. For example, I see you talking about Mewtwo a lot, while hardly even touching the subject of Xerneas and Yveltal. Those two should be the big talking point in terms of legendary Pokémon, not Mewtwo.
I'm allowed to talk about whatever I want; I don't think that I represent most fans at all. Besides, I recall that you were the one that suggested that the story should revolve around Mewtwo.
 
Or they do know what they're doing because the games are actually connected. You aren't jumping to conclusions at all.
I was more referring to things such as the Wii U, which Nintendo are trying to market to both the more hardcore gamers and the more casual ones and failing. Sort of like how when they marketed the Wii, they ended up gaining a huge casual following, but lost a significant hardcore market share. One of the worries I have is, if GameFreak, TPC and Nintendo try to get back the older Japanese players who have since moved on by advertising for them, they won't be able to balance that with the advertising of the games for the rotating younger audiences. Over the last few years, GameFreak have no doubt become aware of the size of the older fanbase (at least, the one abroad) due to the Video Game Championships and similar events (The Masters Division cap is equal to the combined cap of Juniors and Seniors in most events), but the question is whether it's possible to balance them and the younger ones. We'll have to wait and see, but it is concerning to me.

Or maybe it's just there as a symbol of the Mega Pokémon? That piece of artwork is being used as the soundtrack artwork iirc? Then Mewtwo is simply on the back cover.
It's a promotional artwork that is also being used for the soundtrack. What difference does it make if Mewtwo is on the back cover? It's still alongside the mascots in the original artwork, and I am not arguing that it trumps the mascots.
We already know that Mega Evolutions are significant in the games - the double helix being on the Japanese logos is indicative of that. Mega Mewtwo is simply the most marketable one that we know of right now, which is why it's there. If it was a piece of artwork directly referencing the story behind Xerneas of Yveltal, it would be different.

It would be different to the beginning of the XY series because aside from the obvious (no Ash and Pikachu), the XY anime begins with Ash arriving in Lumiose City, whereas the games begin in Vaniville Town.
There is no fundamental difference that would warrant the investment in the project. But you've made your point: You really wish that this were a Vaniville Town special instead. Just don't pretend that most people would agree with you.
You just told me not to jump to conclusions, yet constantly jump to conclusions about me...

I have never said that most people agree with me (in fact, I know I'm in the severe minority by not creaming my pants over this special) - I am merely speaking my own opinions and have never voiced anything to indicate otherwise. What I would prefer is a special focusing on the XY games, not one focusing on a game released 17 years ago that the majority of the current Japanese fanbase wouldn't have played.

Sure, we usually don't learn much about the mascots, but Xerneas and Yveltal do definitely risk being overshadowed by a past generation legendary at this point. For example, I see you talking about Mewtwo a lot, while hardly even touching the subject of Xerneas and Yveltal. Those two should be the big talking point in terms of legendary Pokémon, not Mewtwo.
I'm allowed to talk about whatever I want; I don't think that I represent most fans at all. Besides, I recall that you were the one that suggested that the story should revolve around Mewtwo.
That was more of a theory based on what we were presented with, rather than my personal belief of what it should revolve around. Besides, that post was made 4 months ago and opinions change. Now we know that Xerneas is the Life Pokémon and Yveltal is the Destruction Pokémon and I think that XY's story should focus on them as with classifications such as those, there are numerous possibilities without overshadowing them with Mewtwo.
 
We already know that Mega Evolutions are significant in the games - the double helix being on the Japanese logos is indicative of that.
You seem to be under the assumption that Mega Evolution is unrelated to the story. This isn't supported by the fact that Korrina is confirmed to appear several times throughout the story to help unlock Mega Evolution.

Mega Mewtwo is simply the most marketable one that we know of right now, which is why it's there. If it was a piece of artwork directly referencing the story behind Xerneas of Yveltal, it would be different.
And you know that it isn't referencing the story how? Xerneas and Yveltal are clashing in a dark place. What else would you expect from a single artwork? By your logic the mascots may not be relevant to the main plot, either.

I have never said that most people agree with me (in fact, I know I'm in the severe minority by not creaming my pants over this special) - I am merely speaking my own opinions and have never voiced anything to indicate otherwise. What I would prefer is a special focusing on the XY games, not one focusing on a game released 17 years ago that the majority of the current Japanese fanbase wouldn't have played.
If you don't presume to speak for anyone else, perhaps you shouldn't be worried so much about the young Japanese fanbase.

That was more of a theory based on what we were presented with, rather than my personal belief of what it should revolve around.
We were hardly presented with anything at that point. You shouldn't have pushed the theory so much based on so little if it didn't even reflect your personal belief.
 
You seem to be under the assumption that Mega Evolution is unrelated to the story. This isn't supported by the fact that Korrina is confirmed to appear several times throughout the story to help unlock Mega Evolution.
I never said that I think it's unrelated to the story - the evidence is clearly there (the double helix on the logos). What I'm saying is, I want Xerneas and Yveltal to have a prominent focus, rather than it being all about Mega Evolutions of old Pokémon. Heck, why not have Mega Xerneas and Mega Yveltal as part of the game's climax? What about some Mega Evolutions of Gen VI Pokémon? Admittedly, we currently only know one Stage 2 Kalos Pokémon (Talonflame), but I would like to see Mega Pokémon receive representation throughout all Gens.

Mega Mewtwo is simply the most marketable one that we know of right now, which is why it's there. If it was a piece of artwork directly referencing the story behind Xerneas of Yveltal, it would be different.
And you know that it isn't referencing the story how? Xerneas and Yveltal are clashing in a dark place. What else would you expect from a single artwork? By your logic the mascots may not be relevant to the main plot, either.
It would be more likely that Mewtwo would have been on the front cover with Xerneas and Yveltal if they were directly correlated. However, for Mewtwo to be a considerable distance away from them (and on the back cover), makes it seem more likely that the two aren't connected.

I have never said that most people agree with me (in fact, I know I'm in the severe minority by not creaming my pants over this special) - I am merely speaking my own opinions and have never voiced anything to indicate otherwise. What I would prefer is a special focusing on the XY games, not one focusing on a game released 17 years ago that the majority of the current Japanese fanbase wouldn't have played.
If you don't presume to speak for anyone else, perhaps you shouldn't be worried so much about the young Japanese fanbase.
I speak for myself, but worry about the franchise I love. What's the problem?
 
Heck, why not have Mega Xerneas and Mega Yveltal as part of the game's climax?
That may or may not be the case, but I personally don't see the point of doing that now when Xerneas and Yveltal are brand new. Also, if you actually support this theory, then I don't see why you're insisting that their story is separate from Mewtwo's.

It would be more likely that Mewtwo would have been on the front cover with Xerneas and Yveltal if they were directly correlated. However, for Mewtwo to be a considerable distance away from them (and on the back cover), makes it seem more likely that the two aren't connected.
A considerable distance away? It's in the same place, simply not interfering with their battle. You do realize that they could have given it a separate artwork, right?
 
That may or may not be the case, but I personally don't see the point of doing that now when Xerneas and Yveltal are brand new. Also, if you actually support this theory, then I don't see why you're insisting that their story is separate from Mewtwo's.
Because they need to separate the old and the new. Sure, give old Pokémon Mega Evolutions, but keep the story focusing on the new.

It would be more likely that Mewtwo would have been on the front cover with Xerneas and Yveltal if they were directly correlated. However, for Mewtwo to be a considerable distance away from them (and on the back cover), makes it seem more likely that the two aren't connected.
A considerable distance away? It's in the same place, simply not interfering with their battle. You do realize that they could have given it a separate artwork, right?[/QUOTE][/quote]
Because having two completely different pieces of artwork on the front and back covers would look jarring - it could simply a stylistic choice. It also could not be, but that wouldn't be my preferred result.
 
Because they need to separate the old and the new. Sure, give old Pokémon Mega Evolutions, but keep the story focusing on the new.
Mega Evolution isn't the only way to give a Pokémon a story, especially when dealing with a legendary.

Because having two completely different pieces of artwork on the front and back covers would look jarring - it could simply a stylistic choice. It also could not be, but that wouldn't be my preferred result.
I just find it amusing that you're downplaying Mewtwo's role now that there is evidence to suggest it, whereas four months ago you argued in favor of it without much to go on.
 
Mega Evolution isn't the only way to give a Pokémon a story, especially when dealing with a legendary.
When did I say it was? What we know is, Mega Evolutions are involved in the story to some extent though.

Because having two completely different pieces of artwork on the front and back covers would look jarring - it could simply a stylistic choice. It also could not be, but that wouldn't be my preferred result.
I just find it amusing that you're downplaying Mewtwo's role now that there is evidence to suggest it, whereas four months ago you argued in favor of it without much to go on.
As I said, time changes and so do opinions.
 
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I have pretty much no interest in the anime since I stopped watching it years ago during the Johto season but the screenshots and the trailer of this has got me interested. Looks pretty promising. I won't mind if they don't dub it. I've never had a problem with watching stuff in Japanese with subs.
 
I have pretty much no interest in the anime since I stopped watching it years ago during the Johto season but the screenshots and the trailer of this has got me interested. Looks pretty promising. I won't mind if they don't dub it. I've never had a problem with watching stuff in Japanese with subs.

I wouldn't have a problem with it if they made it convenient to find legally online. Pokemon is almost impossible to watch nowadays it seems. So unless it's added to Hulu or another site like that, I would like a dubbed version.
 
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