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Pokemon Legends: Arceus General Discussion

But again, if what we want is variation- which I agree is a good thing- why do we need to keep some elements static? Why does it have to be one notable Pokemon, and not something else like a location or person?

Location might be feasible, if it's something like a location strengthening the Pokemon.

Totem Pokemon and Nobles both have outside influences powering them up. There’s a strongest creature in any ecosystem, but whether that strength is enough to be interesting enough for people to journey out to it is a separate thing. There’s a queen ant in every anthill, after all.

It might not matter to certain people if they're the type of person who wants to test their strength against everything.

But not all cultures think of Pokemon the same way. The trailers have discussed how some people are afraid of Pokemon, and there’s people who don’t value Pokemon beyond practical use. (the legend about a man who went around killing Pokemon, people like Team Rocket) Wouldn’t they have a different approach?

No, that's all the more reason to have someone like a Captain or Warden. If people are afraid of Pokemon, that still creates a need for someone to protect humans from them. As for people that don't value Pokemon, they'd still need a way of fighting them regardless if one came attacking.

Seems strange that gyms today have no trace of these Pokemon remaining, to the point of even switching types or having no type specialty. If these Pokemon are culturally significant enough to have this system built around them,

Those Pokemon might have been too dangerous or the outside forces too uncontrollable to be integrated into the gym system. Does Arceus really care enough to lend out its strength to gym Pokemon? I doubt it, Arceus doesn't seem to care much about testing trainers' strength, just rendering judgment when humans do something it doesn't like. But we have seen one region where there's still traces of that and that's Galar, where the gyms are designed around Dynamax. This makes a little more sense because the Power Spots are stationary and therefore they can build the giant stadium gyms around them so that challengers can consistently use Dynamax in gym battles every time (and presumably because they're stationary, they can design them to be safe to use by making the arenas sufficiently large enough to reduce the chances of stray attacks hitting spectators, and presumably other countermeasures that we can't see). We haven't seen how Alola would adapt to the Gym Challenge (I really wish we would've gotten SM2 instead of USUM to address this), but presumably because Ultra Wormholes seem to be located to certain spots of Alola and they seem to have a lot of knowledge on how to control Ultra Wormholes, they might be able to create Gym Challenges that function similarly to the Trials. The older regions probably didn't have some kind of power boosting phenomenon that could safely and reliably be adapted like Dynamax in Galar.
 
Location might be feasible, if it's something like a location strengthening the Pokemon.
Again, why limit it to strong Pokemon appearing in every region? A location could be significant because of historical events, myths, or, following the idea of challenge, difficult terrain.
It might not matter to certain people if they're the type of person who wants to test their strength against everything.
Yeah, if they’re a certain type of person. That type of person might not be common enough in some places for a trial like this to develop. (Also, if they’re willing to travel the region in search of strong Pokemon, doesn’t that imply they’re not satisfied by the strength of the ones around them?)
No, that's all the more reason to have someone like a Captain or Warden. If people are afraid of Pokemon, that still creates a need for someone to protect humans from them.
And they want people to go around the region and fight the Pokemon’s protectors?
As for people that don't value Pokemon, they'd still need a way of fighting them regardless if one came attacking.
That just means they’ll have some Pokemon on hand, not that they’ll enjoy having a challenge to go around the region fighting them.
Those Pokemon might have been too dangerous or the outside forces too uncontrollable to be integrated into the gym system.
They don’t have to literally be there. I realize now that I forgot to finish my thought, but there could easily be statues or graves or something else reflecting their influence. At the very least, you’d expect them to keep the type, but we see gym leagues changing type in Unova and Galar.
Does Arceus really care enough to lend out its strength to gym Pokemon? I doubt it, Arceus doesn't seem to care much about testing trainers' strength, just rendering judgment when humans do something it doesn't like. But we have seen one region where there's still traces of that and that's Galar, where the gyms are designed around Dynamax. This makes a little more sense because the Power Spots are stationary and therefore they can build the giant stadium gyms around them so that challengers can consistently use Dynamax in gym battles every time (and presumably because they're stationary, they can design them to be safe to use by making the arenas sufficiently large enough to reduce the chances of stray attacks hitting spectators, and presumably other countermeasures that we can't see).
It’s also a more recent development- Professor Magnolia is the creator of dynamax bands, so this isn’t even a century old.
We haven't seen how Alola would adapt to the Gym Challenge (I really wish we would've gotten SM2 instead of USUM to address this), but presumably because Ultra Wormholes seem to be located to certain spots of Alola and they seem to have a lot of knowledge on how to control Ultra Wormholes, they might be able to create Gym Challenges that function similarly to the Trials.
This is a sidebar, but I’m pretty sure they don’t have a lot of knowledge on controlling them- they’re largely the stuff of legend, Burnett is actively studying them, and Lusamine’s plot is to get a Pokemon that can make them.
The older regions probably didn't have some kind of power boosting phenomenon that could safely and reliably be adapted like Dynamax in Galar.
But why do we have to assume there’s power boosting phenomenon everywhere in the first place?
 
Again, why limit it to strong Pokemon appearing in every region? A location could be significant because of historical events, myths, or, following the idea of challenge, difficult terrain.

Because that's what gyms are about, challenging strong Pokemon to receive a badge to prove your strength. Whatever local traditions that gyms developed from had to operate similarly.

Yeah, if they’re a certain type of person. That type of person might not be common enough in some places for a trial like this to develop. (Also, if they’re willing to travel the region in search of strong Pokemon, doesn’t that imply they’re not satisfied by the strength of the ones around them?)

IDK, there's probably no shortage of people thinking they're an alpha type that can defeat anyone. Especially in older periods of history when physical strength and labor were crucial to survival.

And they want people to go around the region and fight the Pokemon’s protectors?

Fight the Pokemon, not simply the protectors.

They don’t have to literally be there. I realize now that I forgot to finish my thought, but there could easily be statues or graves or something else reflecting their influence. At the very least, you’d expect them to keep the type, but we see gym leagues changing type in Unova and Galar.

And what are statues or graves going to do to strengthen Pokemon or attract stronger Pokemon?

It’s also a more recent development- Professor Magnolia is the creator of dynamax bands, so this isn’t even a century old.

Well that also implies that the technology may not be there/hasn't been there until recently to harness the power that stronger Pokemon like the Totems and Noble Pokemon use, so the Pokemon League would probably have had to discard that from the challenge.

But why do we have to assume there’s power boosting phenomenon everywhere in the first place?

Not all of them might (Kanto especially stands out as one that might not have a power boosting phenomenon), but many of them probably do due to the presence of powerful legendaries that control important facets of life (especially ones that relate to energy of some sort).
 
Because that's what gyms are about, challenging strong Pokemon to receive a badge to prove your strength. Whatever local traditions that gyms developed from had to operate similarly.
You're taking it as a foregone conclusion that gyms originated from local traditions with strong Pokemon. I'm making the case that not all regions had a tradition following this format.
IDK, there's probably no shortage of people thinking they're an alpha type that can defeat anyone. Especially in older periods of history when physical strength and labor were crucial to survival.
But enough for a major cultural tradition to spring up?
Fight the Pokemon, not simply the protectors.
These protectors are doing a pretty terrible job at protecting their Pokemon if it's become a whole thing to try to hunt them down and fight them.
And what are statues or graves going to do to strengthen Pokemon or attract stronger Pokemon?
...What? I never said anything about these being functional, I'm talking about it from a cultural perspective.

You're making the case that these regions had powerful Pokemon, and that challenging these Pokemon was a cultural tradition that led to what we have in gyms today. My argument is that if this is the case, we would expect to see them still represented symbolically in some way.
Well that also implies that the technology may not be there/hasn't been there until recently to harness the power that stronger Pokemon like the Totems and Noble Pokemon use, so the Pokemon League would probably have had to discard that from the challenge.
So... they developed without powered-up Pokemon as the base for the league. So they didn't need them to develop the league, and we don't need to assume every other region did, either.
Not all of them might (Kanto especially stands out as one that might not have a power boosting phenomenon), but many of them probably do due to the presence of powerful legendaries that control important facets of life (especially ones that relate to energy of some sort).
My question isn't how, it's why. Why do we need to assume every region has a power boost that led to gyms?
 
Do you think this game might have some sort of champion equivalent? As in one extra strong trainer you have to battle after all of the wardens? Perhaps someone you have to beat to gain access to Mt. Coronet/Arceus. Or will the champion equivalent be Arceus themselves as opposed to a trainer.
 
Do you think this game might have some sort of champion equivalent? As in one extra strong trainer you have to battle after all of the wardens? Perhaps someone you have to beat to gain access to Mt. Coronet/Arceus. Or will the champion equivalent be Arceus themselves as opposed to a trainer.
I think it makes sense for Arceus to be the final boss.
 
The most I could see them doing is having a Cynthia lookalike show up in the post-game and explain that she was away so she couldn’t deal with the plot related problems and so in order to thank you she offers you a duel against the strongest [Insert Trainer equivalent here] that Hisui has to give. :unsure:
 
Oh, I dunno, I mean, Cynthia's family is rooted in Celestic Town and her grandma seems to know a lot about Sinnoh's old myths and traditions. I could easily see her ancestry tracing back to someone who was like a custodian of the Spear Pillar or something.

I just can't really see this game diving into the ancestries of all these major Sinnoh characters (and even one Unovan character) and then not a) having an ancestor of Cynthia - literally Sinnoh's (and one of the whole franchise's) most popular character(s) - appear, and b) making that character be very plot-relevant.
 
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Here's something to think about:
We know how in Pokemon Legends the stats are generally higher than regular Pokemon, and they also seem to have bonus development with those numbers at the side. So i wonder how home connectivity will work. Will legends Pokemon just be super strong? Or will they somehow figure out a way to have the stat calculations changed back to the appropriate numbers for regular Pokemon (And other way around if you can bring Pokemon from home into Arceus)? And if so will they still be slightly stronger thanks to the bonus stat development thing? Just to lesser a degree. Perhaps they will be translated into EV's.
 
Here's something to think about:
We know how in Pokemon Legends the stats are generally higher than regular Pokemon, and they also seem to have bonus development with those numbers at the side. So i wonder how home connectivity will work. Will legends Pokemon just be super strong? Or will they somehow figure out a way to have the stat calculations changed back to the appropriate numbers for regular Pokemon (And other way around if you can bring Pokemon from home into Arceus)? And if so will they still be slightly stronger thanks to the bonus stat development thing? Just to lesser a degree. Perhaps they will be translated into EV's.
I'm thinking that the stats boost/variation may be caused by pokemon size. If pokemon have different sizes as noticed on the pokedex then the stats may be influnced by this like with Gourgeist.
 
Do you think this game might have some sort of champion equivalent? As in one extra strong trainer you have to battle after all of the wardens? Perhaps someone you have to beat to gain access to Mt. Coronet/Arceus. Or will the champion equivalent be Arceus themselves as opposed to a trainer.
Absolutely. I kind of feel like fans are underselling the battles we may have in this game. The concept of trainers isn't necessarily formally established, but I wouldn't be shocked to see traditional trainer classes appearing either, even if sparingly. Outside of the core mission, I can definitely imagine some rival/champion/villain boss battles as well.
 
Absolutely. I kind of feel like fans are underselling the battles we may have in this game. The concept of trainers isn't necessarily formally established, but I wouldn't be shocked to see traditional trainer classes appearing either, even if sparingly. Outside of the core mission, I can definitely imagine some rival/champion/villain boss battles as well.
To me, Arceus seems like the natural final boss. The noblest of the noble Pokémon.
 
To me, Arceus seems like the natural final boss. The noblest of the noble Pokémon.
Oh I absolutely think Arceus is going to play an essential role in that "final boss" fight, to the point where I personally think the battle is going to be presented in a fairly different way than traditional Pokemon battles (think Nihilego possessing Lusamine), but I still find a lot of fan expectations set on this just being a game where you chase Pokemon, battle them, and then catch them. Although I feel like recent info has shown otherwise, you still see this mindset among some fans that there won't be any battles for whatever reason. Maybe a future informational dump in the coming months that may change that perspective?
 
I think it makes sense for Arceus to be the final boss.
I think they're gonna pull a USUM- have Arceus be a final boss like Ultra Necrozma, and have a great trainer with multiple Pokémon as well. It doesn’t make sense to have the absolute final boss battle be a 1 vs 6 without a full battle in the game design somewhere.
 
I think they're gonna pull a USUM- have Arceus be a final boss like Ultra Necrozma, and have a great trainer with multiple Pokémon as well. It doesn’t make sense to have the absolute final boss battle be a 1 vs 6 without a full battle in the game design somewhere.
Yeah i imagine its going to be like USUM and SWSH, but this time they will probably switch it around. 6v6 trainer battle then Arceus battle.
 
I was just thinking that it would be super cool if the Arcphone would allow us to take photos of pokemon to add to a photodex. Something like BOTW with animals, monsters etc. The only problem is that Pokemon Snap was just released and I doubt TPCi allowed that feature in Legends.
 
I was just thinking that it would be super cool if the Arcphone would allow us to take photos of pokemon to add to a photodex. Something like BOTW with animals, monsters etc. The only problem is that Pokemon Snap was just released and I doubt TPCi allowed that feature in Legends.

Compared to Snap, that does kinda feel like it'd be underwhelming.

Though at the same time, I played Alba: A Wildlife Adventure right after playing Snap, and that was just chronicling wildlife with photos, which I still found highly enjoyable and would've loved a pokemon version of it. So maybe it won't be in this game, but I would 1000% support such a feature being in a future game.
 
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