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Speculation Pokemon Remakes patterns

I think HGSS is the most complete game of the three remakes.

Because it has the Battle Frontier and gym leader rematches. But HGSS hasn't got anything brand new to offer apart of the Pokeathlon and Sinjoh and a Special Pichu. Instead, it reunites the best features of GS, Crystal AND the Frontier from the third Shinnoh installment.

A lot of cool content united in the same game...


While ORAS, while being a remake, has a lot of brand new and mostly exclusive features like Soaring, Dex Nav, sneaking, Pokémon appearing visuslly represented, a brand new Content storyline, a brand new postgame Episode, going to space, Mirage Spots, and a core game mechanic expanding on Mega Evolution... On top of more Megas.

So, if we rate the remakes as individual games, The Johto Remakes are the best remakes to date. But if we have already played the previous games, they can feel a bit like a been there done that especially if you have already played the originals,and Platinums Frontier. While on the other hand ORAS feels more like a fresh new original experience that you can't find in any previous generation or game. I feel that HGSS should be better than ORAS, but when i play them, i feel the exact opposite.

Because for a fan who started with Silver, and owns Gold as well, HGSS didn't feel new and unique enough to me. I surprisingly found myself struggling to finish it because it felt to me like replaying silver with cool new graphics.

And the Hoenn remakes made feel as if I was playing a brand new game and a remake. Two in one.

I can't really place one over the other as I think the perfect remake would be a mixture of both... Basically it would be like ORAS, with the extra content that HGSS has.
 
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@Meta Boss;

I don't want to get into a sort of "is to, is not" fight, since i know you are biased towards ORAS, but i think even from a critical standpoint, ORAS was not as good as HGSS: ORAS's average score is ~83 percent while HGSS's score is ~87 percent. yes, ORAS had some really nice content, however, it failed to address not only glaring series-wide issues, but also the issues it inherited from the original RSE. that's not to say HGSS revolutionized Pokemon and completely fixed GSC, but it did a much better job of fixing the core game, building upon it (without making it unrecognizable), and moving the series as a whole forward.
 
it depends I think...

Generally speaking, new region/remake/third version seems to work best, as it breaks up the 'monotony' of revisiting the same region twice in a row (though I guess it doesn't ahve to feel that way either, I mean, BW and BW2 seemed to work quite well)


On the other hand, if something like Pokémon Ranger or PMD gets released in that generation as well, I think it would be so bad if a remake was at the end, cause you could get new region/side game/third version/remake for example, which also doesn't have the same region twice in a row

And some people might not consider the games not part of the core series as important, but they still definitely get played, the only difference is that they're spin-offs so the concepts are a bit different

EDIT: I forgot to add; as for release pattern of remakes, I really don't think we should look to deep into that. I mean, yeah there's a sortof pattern going on, but really, remakes have mostly been released when the time was 'right', so there's a combination of factors at play here
 
@Meta Boss;

I don't want to get into a sort of "is to, is not" fight, since i know you are biased towards ORAS, but i think even from a critical standpoint, ORAS was not as good as HGSS: ORAS's average score is ~83 percent while HGSS's score is ~87 percent. yes, ORAS had some really nice content, however, it failed to address not only glaring series-wide issues, but also the issues it inherited from the original RSE. that's not to say HGSS revolutionized Pokemon and completely fixed GSC, but it did a much better job of fixing the core game, building upon it (without making it unrecognizable), and moving the series as a whole forward.

Actually I should be more biased towards the Johto Remakes as Silver is the first Pokemon game I ever played. And I love them as well. Honestly I am kinda biased for most Pokemon games LOL.

It's not bias though... I think it can't be said objectively which one is better. HGSS are more complete and they have a better postgame. But they are a lot less revolutionary in terms of new content and never-before-seen content.

I will be honest here, if you own Pokemon Crystal and Platinum at home, HGSS hasn't got that much other stuff to offer really. I think its biggest advantage over the other remakes is the Battle Frontier. And if you have played that in Platinum, it is no advantage really. Why would you play it again with the exact SAME pokemon selection? No matter how simple the Maison may be, at least in ORAS you get to try the new Megas that have been added and were not available in Kalos. No new Pokemon were added to HGSS. Ho-oh and Lugia could have recieved an alternative form like Giratina did in Platinum but they did not, nor did the dog trio. HGSS didn't even have the evolutionary locations to evolve the new eevee evos introduced in that SAME generation... It was a step back in some aspects...

While OR AS offers a brand new ending, new characters, and features never before seen in any game, especially Soaring, and dex nav.

And I think I couldn't have explained it any better... My logic is telling me HG should be better, but when I play them, I have more fun playing ORAS.

Why though? Well, because I have the original silver and emerald very fresh in my head, and therefore I have more interest in playing something more than just a remake. ORAS just felt like a brand new game to me AND a remake, while HGSS felt to me only like a remake.

But I mean, it could be that ORAS was in glorious 3D and actually offered new Pokemon forms, and HGSS offered nothing similar. Or it could be that I like the ORAS exclusive features more.

I don't know but it's just a fact that ORAS feels like a new adventure to me and HGSS feels like the almost PERFECT remake. But "only" a remake of an adventure I have already experienced.

Post Data: about the official scores of the games... LOL you know about all that too much water bias.

In general I would say if you judge them individually, HGSS is better. If you judge them as a new entry to the same franchise, ORAS has more new things to offer.

I think HGSS is the better game and ORAS is the better new game, while also delivering as a nostalgic game.
 
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Actually I should be more biased towards the Johto Remakes as Silver is the first Pokemon game I ever played. And I love them as well.
what should be isn't always a reflection of the reality, however. for example, i should be more biased towards FRLG, since RBY were my first games and yet i'm not, i think they're probably the worst entries in the modern (ie., post-RSE) Pokemon series, if not the whole series.

It's not bias though... I think it can't be said objectively which one is better. HGSS are more complete and they have a better postgame. But they are a lot less revolutionary in terms of new content and never-before-seen content.
sure you can: you literally just gave the reason to why HGSS is objectively superior to ORAS. HGSS is more complete and has a better postgame. just because a game is "revolutionary," doesn't mean it's a good game.

I will be honest here, if you own Pokemon Crystal and Platinum at home, HGSS hasn't got much to offer really. I think its biggest advantage over the other remakes is the Battle Frontier. And if you have played that in Platinum, it is no advantage really. Why would you play it again with the exact SAME pokemon selection?
but that issue isn't exclusive to HGSS. every single remake has had the Pokemon selection confined for the vast majority of the game, so i'm not sure why you're using it as a standard for saying that HGSS isn't as good or isn't a "newer" experience.

No matter how simple the Maison may be, at least in ORAS you get to try the new Megas that have been added. No new Pokemon were added to HGSS. Ho-Oh and Lugia could have recieved an alternative form like Giratina but they did not. HGSS didn't even have the evolutionary locations to evolve the eevee evos introduced in that SAME generation... It was a step back in some aspects...
and if HGSS is a step back for not including the location-based evolutions, then ORAS is a step back for not including customization, roller-blades, or PR vids. just because certain things aren't included, doesn't mean it isn't a step forward. RSE was still a step forward despite lacking Day and Night as well as other time-based events.

While OR AS offers a brand new ending, new characters, and features mever BEFORE seen in any game, especially Soaring, and dex nav.
it's not really a brand new ending so much as a fleshed out one. new characters? just one, unless you want to count the rewritten Team Magma and Aqua as new characters. even still, HGSS introduced new characters as well (re: Rocket execs). Soaring is a new feature, i'll give you that, but the DexNav is merely a marriage between the shaking grass in Gen V and the PokéRadar with a touch more control.

And I think I couldn't have explained it any better... My mind is telling me HG is better, but when I play them, I have more fun playing ORAS.

Why though? Well, because I have the original silver and emerald very fresh in my head, and therefore I have more interest in playing something more than just a remake. ORAS just felt like a brand new game to me AND a remake, while HGSS felt to me only like a remake.

But I mean, it could be that ORAS was in glorious 3D and actually offered new Pokemon forms, and HGSS offered nothing similar. Or it could be that I like the ORAS exclusive features more.

I don't know but it's just a fact that ORAS feels like a new adventure to me and HGSS feels like the almost PERFECT remake. But "only" a remake of an adventure I have already experienced.
completely subjective, given as i felt that HGSS was a newer adventure while ORAS was a retread.

Post Data: about the official scores of the games... LOL you know about all that too much water bias.
HGSS got an 8 from IGN and ORAS a 7.8. doesn't seem like a huge bias on that part. even still, it is a legitimate complaint (esp in AlphaSapphire). yes, the original justification for #toomuchwater is a little bit silly, but it's not like it's an inaccurate assessment. i think Hoenn is a well designed region, but the execution of it is a little bit shoddy. it is disappointing that for the first half of the game you get to see many diverse locations and then by the last half you're just surfing around. because of the 3D, the water routes are somewhat less repetitive, but even still it can get boring.
 
^ @godiego I think you think you are being objective, but all you are saying is still based on YOUR personal experience. Same with me. :)

I will resume what I stated before: I think there are three ways of judging those games.

As individual games, I think HGSS is better. It has more content, and especially, 16 Leader remaches (0 in ORAS which is bad) and the Frontier which is the key difference. It is more of a well rounded game.

As a continuation in the franchise, supposing you have played the previous games, I think ORAS is a better game. It has better side content in my personal opinion. And more of it too. Most of the things you can do in HGSS is not new and you have already done it, if you have played previous Pokemon games, especially Crystal and Platinum.

While ORAS offers more exclusive brand new stuff, and therefore feels like a fresher experience, at least to me. Soaring, turning your secret base into a propper Gym, with you as the Gym leader (the best feature ever imo) , Contest Spectaculars with propper rivals and special appeal moves not available for normal battles and the concept of Primal reversion which I find very impressive and expands Hoenn's lore a lot more. They are a better original experience to me.

As remakes, it depends what you want. If you want a traditional remake, HG are better. Theyre very true to GSC and bring tons of nostalgia. But if you remeber the originals perfectly, then you might want some more new surprises, and ORAS delivers that better imo.

But it's all about personal taste and opinion.
 
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^ @godiego I think you think you are being objective, but all you are saying is still based on YOUR personal experience. Same with me. :)

I will resume what I stated before: I think there are three ways of judging those games.

As individual games, I think HGSS is better. It has more content, and especially, 16 Leader remaches (0 in ORAS which is bad) and the Frontier which is the key difference. It is more of a well rounded game.

As a continuation in the franchise, supposing you have played the previous games, I think ORAS is a better game. It has better side content in my personal opinion. And more of it too. Most of the things you can do in HGSS is not new and you have already done it, if you have played previous Pokemon games, especially Crystal and Platinum.

While ORAS offers more exclusive brand new stuff, and therefore feels like a fresher experience, at least to me. Soaring, turning your secret base into a propper Gym, with you as the Gym leader (the best feature ever imo) , Contest Spectaculars with propper rivals and special appeal moves not available for normal battles and the concept of Primal reversion which I find very impressive and expands Hoenn's lore a lot more. They are a better original experience to me.

As remakes, it depends what you want. If you want a traditional remake, HG are better. Theyre very true to GSC and bring tons of nostalgia. But if you remeber the originals perfectly, then you might want some more new surprises, and ORAS delivers that better imo.

But it's all about personal taste and opinion.

Well I think ORAS was worse than FRLG and HGSS. Soaring was obviously taken from Ranger 3. The contests were pointless and serves no purpose, you only battle 3 pokemon in secret base, no gym leader rematches, Battle Maison was copy and pasted into game, Battle Resort wasn't that great, and a few more flaws in the game. HGSS serves as the better remakes with FRLG following it. HGSS had a better post game while Delta Episode was handled poorly.

Anyway I think remakes should come between the first and last games.
 
^ @godiego I think you think you are being objective, but all you are saying is still based on YOUR personal experience. Same with me. :)

I will resume what I stated before: I think there are three ways of judging those games.

As individual games, I think HGSS is better. It has more content, and especially, 16 Leader remaches (0 in ORAS which is bad) and the Frontier which is the key difference. It is more of a well rounded game.

As a continuation in the franchise, supposing you have played the previous games, I think ORAS is a better game. It has better side content in my personal opinion. And more of it too. Most of the things you can do in HGSS is not new and you have already done it, if you have played previous Pokemon games, especially Crystal and Platinum.

While ORAS offers more exclusive brand new stuff, and therefore feels like a fresher experience, at least to me. Soaring, turning your secret base into a propper Gym, with you as the Gym leader (the best feature ever imo) , Contest Spectaculars with propper rivals and special appeal moves not available for normal battles and the concept of Primal reversion which I find very impressive and expands Hoenn's lore a lot more. They are a better original experience to me.

As remakes, it depends what you want. If you want a traditional remake, HG are better. Theyre very true to GSC and bring tons of nostalgia. But if you remeber the originals perfectly, then you might want some more new surprises, and ORAS delivers that better imo.

But it's all about personal taste and opinion.

Well I think ORAS was worse than FRLG and HGSS. Soaring was obviously taken from Ranger 3. The contests were pointless and serves no purpose, you only battle 3 pokemon in secret base, no gym leader rematches, Battle Maison was copy and pasted into game, Battle Resort wasn't that great, and a few more flaws in the game. HGSS serves as the better remakes with FRLG following it. HGSS had a better post game while Delta Episode was handled poorly.

Anyway I think remakes should come between the first and last games.

I think it's ORAS = HGSS, i love them both.

HGSS is more complete and ORAS is more emotional and surprising in the good way. And they both are very nostalgic. And they feature my two favourite regions: Hoenn and Johto, it's a pitty that Johto relies so much on Kanto however.
 
If a slew of new features doesn't last me long, like most of what ORAS added, then I'd rather play with older features that have been expanded upon.

And TBH, I think that ORAS is still more samey despite its brand new details. The hardware jump between Generations 2 & 4 makes HGSS feel like a much more refreshing remake to me. Basic elements like the more complete graphics and color, the full touch screen interface, the structure of the bag, box management, new berry system, Natures, Abilities, and the more refined battle mechanics of 4th Gen places it so far ahead of the GameBoy/Color era...And in a few ways (namely the interface and box management), it was even a cut above Platinum.

With ORAS, I don't feel like I'm missing out on a-lot by just playing Emerald. There haven't been quite as many renovations since the original RSE completely overhauled the system for the structure we still have today (at least, not compared to the jump between the GB/C and DS eras). This is one of the reasons why I don't want to see remakes as often as so many others, so that the games can age a bit more before coming back.

ORAS also relegated the region in a number of ways by removing or downgrading certain elements..."Classic" Berry planting from the originals pales in comparison to the new farm system from XY...Dungeons were outright removed rather than rebuilt, like what HGSS did for the returning Uknown Dungeon, Seafoam Islands, etc...Custom avatars are gone...*Battle Frontier kerfuffle*...etc.

As individual games, I think HGSS is better. It has more content, and especially, 16 Leader remaches (0 in ORAS which is bad) and the Frontier which is the key difference. It is more of a well rounded game.

As a continuation in the franchise, supposing you have played the previous games, I think ORAS is a better game. It has better side content in my personal opinion. And more of it too. Most of the things you can do in HGSS is not new and you have already done it, if you have played previous Pokemon games, especially Crystal and Platinum.

While ORAS offers more exclusive brand new stuff, and therefore feels like a fresher experience, at least to me. Soaring, turning your secret base into a propper Gym, with you as the Gym leader (the best feature ever imo) , Contest Spectaculars with propper rivals and special appeal moves not available for normal battles and the concept of Primal reversion which I find very impressive and expands Hoenn's lore a lot more. They are a better original experience to me.

As remakes, it depends what you want. If you want a traditional remake, HG are better. Theyre very true to GSC and bring tons of nostalgia. But if you remeber the originals perfectly, then you might want some more new surprises, and ORAS delivers that better imo.

I think this is an understatement...The PokeWalker, custom Safari, and Pokeathlon were all new activities exclusive to HGSS, and fairly extensive. Even walking Pokemon was new because you weren't locked into Ash's Pikachu and you had much more potential interactions, like the Shiny Leaf sidequest or taking group photos with your full party.
 
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