Pokémon Scarlet and Violet Predictions/Speculation/Discussion Thread

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

Not "human" but "people" for sure.

 

[AngryBinacle]

Couldn't care less about the A.I. (although I do hope they really got their happy ending), but I don't like the idea of the Paradox mons potentially not being "real". It kind of cheapens their existence if they're just imagined creatures brought to life instead of creatures that actually existed/will exist somewhere in the Pokemon world. The idea of imagined creatures brought to life is neat, but I'd rather they save that for another game where fantasy vs. reality is a larger theme (I think this would be an EXCELLENT concept for the first Pokemon VR game if they ever decided to make one).

A lot more lore-blurbs are pointing towards their imagined nature than anything truly from times past, or from the future. They're still real, organic (or metallic) beings, though.

Anyway, the point about the AI is moot: If it found a nice (imaginary) place in some kind of Tera-crystal or something, then it would be just as fine as a 'true' historical/futuristical location. It's an AI, not the parent of Arven himself. Their last comment to him was touching, don't get me wrong, but it seemed more of a 'messenger' than something with true feelings of humanity.

Keep in mind, time-travel isn't even a major theme for this game. Finding treasure and mystery are.

 

[escolopendror]

Keep in mind, time-travel isn't even a major theme for this game. Finding treasure and mystery are.

Say it louder for the people on the back! Now seriously; time-travel, like you said, is not the theme of ScarVio but one of the resources the narrative uses to explore its "Find your treasure/Follow your dream??" theme. I see a lot of folks clinging onto the past/future idea when I've always seen it as a metaphor for abandoning the present, your family and friends to follow blindly your goals (like the Professors did). Sorry if I didn't explain myself well enough, my English always sounds better in my head haha

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

Lysandre in the Manga is dead.

Popular consensus is in X version he is in a mangled but still alive state beneath his base due to Xerneas' energy blast.

Which manga? If you mean Pokespe, the extended version confirmed he SURVIVED.

Yup. The extended version confirmed that he just suffered spinal cord damage.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

A lot more lore-blurbs are pointing towards their imagined nature than anything truly from times past, or from the future. They're still real, organic (or metallic) beings, though.

Anyway, the point about the AI is moot: If it found a nice (imaginary) place in some kind of Tera-crystal or something, then it would be just as fine as a 'true' historical/futuristical location. It's an AI, not the parent of Arven himself. Their last comment to him was touching, don't get me wrong, but it seemed more of a 'messenger' than something with true feelings of humanity.

Keep in mind, time-travel isn't even a major theme for this game. Finding treasure and mystery are.

I know they're not his parents. That's not the issue. And yeah they're not human. That's not the issue either. Neither is time travel itself. I feel like you're missing the point I'm making.

 

[Bolt Strike]

A lot more lore-blurbs are pointing towards their imagined nature than anything truly from times past, or from the future. They're still real, organic (or metallic) beings, though.

It's the imagined nature that I care more about with them than them having "real" organic/robotic beings. That's the part that feels cheapened with the lore. It just feels so arbitrary and inauthentic to have them be the product of the professor's imagination, not to mention that it depressingly undermines the professors' entire motivation, it's almost like a monkey's paw in that they didn't get their wish in quite the way they wanted. If they wanted to make cool past/future Pokemon then just let them actually be past/future Pokemon. Having this bait and switch of "oh well they look like they're past/future Pokemon but PSYCH! They're just imagined Pokemon" is just way too convoluted and trollish. Again, this felt like something that should've been saved for a game where concepts like reality and imagination are a greater focus, not as an extra layer to the Treasure Hunt theme and the past/future theme.

 

[Jimothy]

I still find it perplexing that the imagination theory is so overwhelmingly accepted given that there really isn't much pointing towards it. It feels so out of place from just playing the game-- you wouldn't come up with it without the internet chatter.

Occulture-- don't know why this points to the imagination theory. All it tells us is that paradoxes that appear in one timeline are only understood as rumors in another. Nothing in Violet indicates that Iron Moth isn't real-- even if what little lore we get might just be tall tales and speculation. It's only in Scarlet that it's just a rumor in tabloids. Sounds more to me like some level of knowledge of the opposite version paradoxes leaked into each game.

Arven questioning the time machine's chronology-- honestly I'm surprised this was even addressed, because the very previous game was full of distortions taking monsters from various points in time and spitting them out in others. But given that he did question it, there probably is something still to be revealed about when exactly the time machine was made, or if the professors used it to meet Heath, thus introducing their paradox monsters to an earlier point in time.

The imagined Pokemon doesn't even exist as a Paradox, so this is always a weird point I think. Heath didn't imagine something that then became real, he seemed to imagine something that looks like three different nonparadox monsters. Paradoxes of each of those three components do exist, but they don't reflect his drawings at all. That is, the imagined monster in the sketch looks like a combo of Entei, Raikou, and Suicune and not Walking Wake, et al. And if the crystals bring your imaginations to life, it did a terrible job because that composite monster from the sketch did not come to life.

"If only there were two of me" "oh! now there's an AI that is in some way possible because of the crystals"-- okay, that IS suspicious, and I can see how if you had been told about the imagination theory, it would seem to be a point in its favor. But taken alone, it seems more likely that the crystals functioned as a mystical power source to animate an already existing AI program with sentience, the same way that the unique energy of the crystals was the key component in time travel.

"The toxic chains gave the momotaro monsters what they wanted most." The toxic chain that doesn't seem to have any connection to the crystals or Terapagos?

And... that's all the points I see get brought up, I think. It's not much, and it seems more to me like people are just barely fitting these into an existing theory rather than working off of what's actually in the game. Honestly I think it's more likely that we never get any explanation as to where the paradoxes come from than it is that the explanation is "these were all just made up by someone."

 

[Viridian Beedrill]

Regarding Occulture, it seems like using it as evidence for the imagination theory revolves around its theories about the Paradox Pokémon making no sense (ex. "a BILLION year old Jigglypuff???? That's impossible! And if the lore can't be real, that must mean this came from imagination.") However, the games also take every opportunity to describe the magazine as "dubious", or some synonym thereof. I don't think we were ever supposed to take any of its theories seriously. If anything, I think the Occulture articles were supposed to be flavor text showing how alien the Paradoxes are to the current era. People have no context for them, so they either write them off entirely as tall tales or grasp at wild theories to try to explain them. Same thing for the Paradoxes' Pokedex entries. There is no research or even folklore about the Paradoxes, so all the Pokedex can come up with in their entries is that they look like a creature in this old book, or (in the opposite version) a tabloid magazine. Yes, the Pokedex echoes Occulture's theories about the Paradoxes, but that doesn't mean it's claiming they're true. In fact, the Pokedex takes care to warn the readers that what it's saying comes from a sketchy magazine. (This is a tangent, but I'd like to think that Pokedex entries for the UB's would have been similarly sparse if the player hadn't had access to Aether Foundation research by the time they started catching them.)

For the Paradox Beasts/Swords, the page with the fusion sketch says that it was created based on the creatures that the team saw in Area Zero. What if these creatures included the Paradox Beasts/Swords? The artist used them as the primary inspiration, resulting in the sketch looking like a fusion of those creatures. The sketch doesn't have to have spawned the Paradoxes...the Paradoxes could feasibly have spawned the sketch, based on what we've been told so far.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

Thing is that the wish theory works better for characters that aren't the professor. The characters it suits best are Geeta and Clavell.

We also know the professor didn't invent the machine, simply on account of how it was clearly functional in Heath's era and probably before. Everyone just ASSUMED they did, including Arven, but even the professor's own writings don't mention anything like that.

 

[Greninjaman]

Thing is that the wish theory works better for characters that aren't the professor. The characters it suits best are Geeta and Clavell.

We also know the professor didn't invent the machine, simply on account of how it was clearly functional in Heath's era and probably before. Everyone just ASSUMED they did, including Arven, but even the professor's own writings don't mention anything like that.

Maybe they DID make the time machine, they just chose not to say anything about it?

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

Well no because it was functioning two hundred years ago and likely even before

 

[Nicolas721]

The Imagination theory also comes from many of the paradoxes having their own inconsistencies and strange descriptions in lore and designs (credits to Spanish youtuber Kalimero for pointing most of them):

• Why is everything a robot in the future and has LED eyes?
• Why do every past Paradox (save for a couple exceptions) has a dinosaur tail and yellow eyes?
• Why are Sandy Shocks and Walking Wake in the past when Magneton is apparently a recent Pokemon (as only appears in time distorsions in Legends) and Suicune was explicitly created by Ho-Oh around 200 years ago?
• How was Scream Tail alive one billion years ago when at that time (in the real world) life forms were just starting to appear?
• If Cyclizar was present 10.000 years ago, how old is Koraidon?
• Paraphrasing a little, no fossils of either Slither Wing or Volcarona have been found.
• Why is Iron Bundle described as an ancient machine?
• How did protective and emotional Pokemon like Gardevoir, Gallade and Virizion turned into soulless robots?

Also, think about it. A man goes to a deep cave with his dragon friend and pressumably encounters a blue turtle. A few years later the cave is filled with a group of Pokemon that share similarities within each other whether they come from the past or the future, a very strong version of his dragon friend and crystals that can change something we thought unchangeable like a Pokemon's type. However, the "time portal" he supposedly used no longer works and the Pokemon have all the same power regardless of who are their present counterparts and feel more like caricatures rather than authenthic ansestors or sucesors. I don't see it as unbelievable.

 

[Dr. Turtwig MT]

Something interesting to think about is how does the "Time Machine" work. Why does it need the Scarlet/Violet book. It gives the impression that the book is the focus the machine runs off of.

Also wasn't the machine only made 10 years ago by Turo/Sada. If the Machine was already there then why does it need a book written by Heath? In fact why would it need a book at all?

In addition think about the Tera crystals and how they seem to do so much, they allow the creation of a "Time Machine", they allow the creation of the AI professor, and they are also used to terastallize pokemon. That is kinda a lot of unrelated things for Tera crystals to do.

Also think about the Herba Mystica, why didn't we see any titan pokemon in Area Zero? Area Zero was where the Herba Mystica was discovered so why aren't there more Titan Pokemon in it.

 

[Jimothy]

The Imagination theory also comes from many of the paradoxes having their own inconsistencies and strange descriptions in lore and designs (credits to Spanish youtuber Kalimero for pointing most of them):

• Why is everything a robot in the future and has LED eyes?
• Why do every past Paradox (save for a couple exceptions) has a dinosaur tail and yellow eyes?
• Why are Sandy Shocks and Walking Wake in the past when Magneton is apparently a recent Pokemon (as only appears in time distorsions in Legends) and Suicune was explicitly created by Ho-Oh around 200 years ago?
• How was Scream Tail alive one billion years ago when at that time (in the real world) life forms were just starting to appear?
• If Cyclizar was present 10.000 years ago, how old is Koraidon?
• Paraphrasing a little, no fossils of either Slither Wing or Volcarona have been found.
• Why is Iron Bundle described as an ancient machine?
• How did protective and emotional Pokemon like Gardevoir, Gallade and Virizion turned into soulless robots?

Also, think about it. A man goes to a deep cave with his dragon friend and pressumably encounters a blue turtle. A few years later the cave is filled with a group of Pokemon that share similarities within each other whether they come from the past or the future, a very strong version of his dragon friend and crystals that can change something we thought unchangeable like a Pokemon's type. However, the "time portal" he supposedly used no longer works and the Pokemon have all the same power regardless of who are their present counterparts and feel more like caricatures rather than authenthic ansestors or sucesors. I don't see it as unbelievable.

1. Because it's cool. Also maybe there was a robot apocalypse, it's fun not knowing!
2. Okay so both this and the above item-- monsters within the same "group" sharing design traits is nothing new. The Hoenn box mascots all share similar skin markings, but no one's ever thought that was because they were fabricated by some machine.
3. Magnemite were in AZ's war 3,000 years ago, so they're not so recent. I think assuming Ho-Oh created the beasts as species is an incorrect assumption. Seems very likely they already existed (Entei's volcano births, at least) and Ho-Oh reanimated the fallen Pokemon into already existing (but special, and elementally themed) species.
4. Explained upthread, but plenty of dex entries seem to have dubious authenticity and the dex explicitly refers to Occulture as dubious.
5. Millions? Who cares.
6. Does that mean Volcarona doesn't really exist or that, as that same entry says, no fossils are known to be found. Which is different than saying they don't exist. But even if they didn't, not everything that dies leaves fossils. Lack of fossils doesn't mean that they don't exist.
7. Again, dubious magazine. But who cares if it is an ancient machine. So is Golurk, so is Registeel. Again, shared design elements just means that Bundle is in the same "group" as the other robot paradoxes.
8. A. Who says Gardevoir, et al turned into anything? Maybe the robots turned into them. Maybe they were built by people and modeled after those monsters. B. Who says they're soulless?

 

[Adelon]

The Imagination theory also comes from many of the paradoxes having their own inconsistencies and strange descriptions in lore and designs (credits to Spanish youtuber Kalimero for pointing most of them):

• Why is everything a robot in the future and has LED eyes?
• Why do every past Paradox (save for a couple exceptions) has a dinosaur tail and yellow eyes?
• Why are Sandy Shocks and Walking Wake in the past when Magneton is apparently a recent Pokemon (as only appears in time distorsions in Legends) and Suicune was explicitly created by Ho-Oh around 200 years ago?
• How was Scream Tail alive one billion years ago when at that time (in the real world) life forms were just starting to appear?
• If Cyclizar was present 10.000 years ago, how old is Koraidon?
• Paraphrasing a little, no fossils of either Slither Wing or Volcarona have been found.
• Why is Iron Bundle described as an ancient machine?
• How did protective and emotional Pokemon like Gardevoir, Gallade and Virizion turned into soulless robots?

Also, think about it. A man goes to a deep cave with his dragon friend and pressumably encounters a blue turtle. A few years later the cave is filled with a group of Pokemon that share similarities within each other whether they come from the past or the future, a very strong version of his dragon friend and crystals that can change something we thought unchangeable like a Pokemon's type. However, the "time portal" he supposedly used no longer works and the Pokemon have all the same power regardless of who are their present counterparts and feel more like caricatures rather than authenthic ansestors or sucesors. I don't see it as unbelievable.

Don't forget the weirdness of Walking Wake and Raging Bolt clearly being dinosaurs (from two unrelated taxons, no less) even though their apparent future descendants seem to be based on members of the same order of mammals.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

Something interesting to think about is how does the "Time Machine" work. Why does it need the Scarlet/Violet book. It gives the impression that the book is the focus the machine runs off of.

Also wasn't the machine only made 10 years ago by Turo/Sada. If the Machine was already there then why does it need a book written by Heath? In fact why would it need a book at all?

In addition think about the Tera crystals and how they seem to do so much, they allow the creation of a "Time Machine", they allow the creation of the AI professor, and they are also used to terastallize pokemon. That is kinda a lot of unrelated things for Tera crystals to do.

Also think about the Herba Mystica, why didn't we see any titan pokemon in Area Zero? Area Zero was where the Herba Mystica was discovered so why aren't there more Titan Pokemon in it.

It doesn't need the book to run. It was encorporated into the security system in order to shut it down, and it had to specifically be their own copy as well, likely to ensure that only the professor could shut it off. The AI's programming was also part of it to ensure that they couldn't shut it off on their own (the professor had gotten extremely paranoid and the AI was likely asking a lot of very uncomfortable questions).

The machine is clearly much older than ten years, and far older than the professors. They just figured out how to use it actively.

This series always uses energy for a ton of unrelated things. Think of all the things Infinity Energy is used for. Or why does the energy from the Ultimate Weapon cause Mega Evolution?

We don't see any Herba Mystica in Area Zero, do we? I imagine there's probably some in the lab under grow lights but other than that.

 

[Bolt Strike]

Maybe I'm looking at too many memes, but with all of the jokes about Nemona being a yandere and Carmine being a tsundere... anyone want to see the two of them meet? That could make for some funny, harem anime-esque hijinx. Granted it would probably be in a family friendly way that only hints towards a potential romance, like wanting to battle with/against them or accompany them somewhere fun that the player could ambiguously interpret as a date/shipping moment (something like the fireworks scene with Shauna in XY or the rain scene with Lillie on Exeggutor Island in SM), rather than something more directly romantic. It'd be funny to see the two of them squabble and fight for our attention.

 

[Giramax2]

Something interesting to think about is how does the "Time Machine" work. Why does it need the Scarlet/Violet book. It gives the impression that the book is the focus the machine runs off of.

Also wasn't the machine only made 10 years ago by Turo/Sada. If the Machine was already there then why does it need a book written by Heath? In fact why would it need a book at all?

In addition think about the Tera crystals and how they seem to do so much, they allow the creation of a "Time Machine", they allow the creation of the AI professor, and they are also used to terastallize pokemon. That is kinda a lot of unrelated things for Tera crystals to do.

Also think about the Herba Mystica, why didn't we see any titan pokemon in Area Zero? Area Zero was where the Herba Mystica was discovered so why aren't there more Titan Pokemon in it.

The book simply haves codes writen on it by the professor

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

Another hint towards the imagination/wish theory I feel comes from The Teal Mask:

Spoiler: Spoilers for The Teal Mask

When Kieran punches the Loyal Three Monument, his hand glows briefly. And moments later, the Loyal Three are resurrected with no given explanation. Remember that Kieran had the Teal Mask with him at that moment. And the mask is embedded with Tera crystals. I think those crystals are the reason behind this.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

But if that's the case then anybody standing sufficiently near a crystal would be able to tap into that power and I feel like it would have been observed in the wild by that point, considering how many crystals there are poking around out of the ground. People would have noticed a pattern.