Porygon not really "plastic"?

[~Shimmer Shock~]

for years I'ved loooved our littel friend Porygon, and I have always hated people who think:
a) it has no thoughts, no hopes, no dreams

or

b)It is a robot
and people who genarly abuse it in fics

so anywayz this is discusion about porygons familys role in the pokemon world and what it and its family really are

to get us started off:

Red &Blue: A Pokémon that consists entirely of programming code. Capable of moving freely in cyberspace.

yes, ok so its made out of a programming code we know that but what dose that mean?

Yellow: The only Pokémon people anticipate can fly into space. None has managed the feat yet, however.

ok that one dosen't tell us a whole lot.

Stadium: A man-made Pokémon that consists entirely of programming code. It is capable of moving freely in cyberspace.

nether dose that....

Gold: It is a manmade Pokémon. Since it doesn't breathe, people are eager to try it in any environment.

what dose that prove, some other pokemon don't breath either!

Silver: A manmade Pokémon that came about as a result of research. It is programmed with only basic motions.

ok so it can't do much, i never said it did, I said I think it has thoughts, hopes and dreams.

Crystal: An artificial Pokémon created due to extensive research, it can perform only what is in its program.

refer to my last comment.

Ruby: Porygon is capable of reverting itself entirely back to program data and entering cyberspace. This Pokémon is copy-protected so it cannot be duplicated by copying.


got ya they cannot be copied thats one more point for my theory!

FireRed: Using the most advanced technologies, scientists finally succeeded in making the first artificial Pokémon.


^^ remind you of anyone? *coughmewtwocough*

Pearl: The world's first artificially created Pokémon. It can travel through electronic space.

ok yes (note the word pokemon NOT ROBOT)

And now porygon2

Gold: This upgraded version of Porygon is designed for space exploration. It can't fly, though.

ok the first few words say it all

Silver : Further research enhanced its abilities. Sometimes, it may exhibit motions that were not programmed.

THANK YOU!!!!! its alive it thinks for itself it lives !!

Crystal : This manmade Pokémon evolved from the latest technology. It may have unprogrammed reactions.

yaaay

Ruby : Porygon2 was created by humans using the power of science. The man-made Pokémon has been endowed with artificial intelligence that enables it to learn new gestures and emotions on its own.

this basicly says....it can think.

Diamond: With planetary development software installed, it became capable of working in space.

it has a job ^-^


now for porygon-Z

pearl:Additional software was installed to make it a better Pokémon. It began acting oddly, however.

oddly? (some say glitchy) could these glitches be.. free will?

soo let it begin!!

 

[Sato]

Interesting topic you have here. Here's how I see it...

I'd consider Porygon a highly developed form of artificial intelligence. As some of the entries up there said of the original Porygon that "it can perform only what is in its program", saying to me that while Porygon has sentience, it isn't capable of much independant thought. (I'm not saying it's completely incapable though.) It is basically, a drone that'll do stuff without ever questioning orders, although it is still capable of a lot of logic based calculations.

As described, Porygon2 is an upgraded intelligence which "may have unprogrammed reactions", showing that this upgraded form has greater capacity for independant thought and opinion. It is no longer a mere drone, however it will be able come up with it's own ideas and actions, making it less of a drone and more independant than it's predecessor.

The final form, PorygonZ, is currently much more improved to work completely independantly of outside input. "It began acting oddly, however."

We have to wonder where this great scientific achievement will lead us... Will we have future Porygons helping both the human and Pokemon races reaching new levels of knowledge and peace? Or will the PorygonIV's behaviour become even odder and slaughter all lesser beings in it's quest for universal conquest? Only time will tell.

 

[Nekusagi]

You know, I think this delves VERY heavily into philosophy, with the question of "when does a robot/computer program develop enough sentience to become human/a living being", a topic that's been explored by many science fiction authors (Isaac Asimov, Phillip Dick, etc). I, Robot, for example, or Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep (the book Blade Runner was based on), or even manga like Chobits and Ghost in the Shell, where the question is, if it seems completely identical to a human, but it's still a machine, is it human?

Either way, Porygon DOES bring up a lot of food for thought as far as Pokemon go.

 

[Amewsment]

What isn't clear to me is how the porygons escaped the virtual world and became "real". It's a program but not a robot or cloned or anything of the sort, I wish they would explain that to us.

 

[Coontank!]

What isn't clear to me is how the porygons escaped the virtual world and became "real". It's a program but not a robot or cloned or anything of the sort, I wish they would explain that to us.

Yeah, I've wondered that too. And they say all this stuff about space exploration, but where are the results of that?

 

[Nekusagi]

There was a theory awhile back in the Pokemon World forums about how Pokeballs work by converting Pokemon to data form for storage in the Pokeball/box. I suspect that Porygon is simply data all of the time but takes a physical form somehow when out of the Pokeball. Like a hologram. Or the Mirage System.

 

[Drakon]

. I suspect that Porygon is simply data all of the time but takes a physical form somehow when out of the Pokeball. Like a hologram. Or the Mirage System.

Ok, if Porygon is a hologram how can it tackle its opponent and inflict damage? How does data PHYSICALLY harm someone (I'm not talking about screwing up life support equipment here!).

For me, it seems like a robot that can upload its consciousness and mind into a computer and traverse cyberspace in that manner.

​

 

[Nekusagi]

...I never said it WAS a hologram. I'm saying it worked in a way similar to one.

Look, I'm not a science person. I'm sure someone who DOES know a thing or two about science, maybe physics,`could come up with their own theory. My initial post was more about the philosophical implications of Porygon that the physiological ones, and I think that was the intent of the thread's original poster as well. I just post theories. And we've established Porygon isn't a robot, but a computer program.

 

[The Outrage]

ok so it can't do much, i never said it did, I said I think it has thoughts, hopes and dreams.

It has thoughts, but not hopes or dreams unless programmed into it. All the Pokedex's say that Porygon can't do anything it is not programed, yet you keep jumping to " think it has thoughts, hopes and dreams" without further explanation.

Porygon2 however, can not only think, but analyse its thoughts much like we humans, so it is not out of the question that it can also hope and dream. If it can think about tis thoughts, then it can go against its programs.

 

[Nekusagi]

You know, I wonder if Asimov's First Law applies to Porygon.

 

[bell02+]

hehehe
On a technicality, any creature genetically altered could be considered "programmed" as you are dealing with the DNA as the program code. As for Porygon... I think when Creatures/Gamefreak was developing this pokemon they didn't put too much thought into the science. I mean... a being that can change into light to enter into computers as code is probably more complicated than creating Mewtwo, lol.

Also, I always pictured Porygon to feel like a hard gelatin for some reason (with a small level of softness like skin).

 

[~Shimmer Shock~]

Hmmmm, I know it dosen't do much but its not a robot I like to think of it as "a programable life form" I do belive it thinks,feels,hopes,lives,loves and dreams but it is unable to do what it wants because of its programing its like.....a prisoner in its own skin and it only becomes able to do more of what it wants when it evolves.

everyone always says "It cant think or feel like a normal pokemon till it evolves"
but are we expected to belive that a living thing can just suddenly "grow a mind and free will"? my computer is a machine, no matter how meany "up grades" i give it thats not gonna make it dream when I turn it off but we're not talking about a robot
no matter how much it seems like a robot,it is...alive.


But really, we arn't gonna find out unill a porygon brakes it programing

 

[Sato]

I mean... a being that can change into light to enter into computers as code is probably more complicated than creating Mewtwo, lol.

Why, something like that must be about as difficult as making small spherical objects that can capture and contain wild animals of all sizes by converting them into some kind of light! Oh, wait.

Hmmmm, I know it dosen't do much but its not a robot... (etc. It's the post above mine, no need to quote the whole thing)

I'll actually be willing to argue that if you upgrade your computer enough, it will be able to have it's own thoughts and dreams. Of course, the technology to make this happen doesn't yet exist, but still. Robots can think and feel if sophisticated enough. For example, C-3PO and R2-D2 from Star Wars often had their own thoughts.

 

[~Shimmer Shock~]

I'll actually be willing to argue that if you upgrade your computer enough, it will be able to have it's own thoughts and dreams. Of course, the technology to make this happen doesn't yet exist, but still. Robots can think and feel if sophisticated enough. For example, C-3PO and R2-D2 from Star Wars often had their own thoughts.

ok, fine but really there are other good porygon has thoughts arguments. look im not saying it can do what it wants im sayingthat there are things it wants and it can only do some of them when it evolves

 

[Nekusagi]

But as I said, what were the things in Mastermind? Weren't they like some kind of incredible holograms with the capability to pull off physical attacks? Porygon is probably something like a Mirage Pokemon, only without the psycho bishie scientist (and on Pokemon, aren't they ALL?) behind it (or maybe there was... heh heh heh...)

 

[~Shimmer Shock~]

But as I said, what were the things in Mastermind? Weren't they like some kind of incredible holograms with the capability to pull off physical attacks? Porygon is probably something like a Mirage Pokemon, only without the psycho bishie scientist (and on Pokemon, aren't they ALL?) behind it (or maybe there was... heh heh heh...)

but those "pokemon" have to stay in there system
its not that hard to have a progamable life form, the brain is like a computer all you have to do is download something on to it

 

[Infinity Mk-II]

The way I see it...

Porygon is a really complex form of artificial inteligence. Like, an emulation of the brain of an actual pokemon.

Porygon 2 is an upgrade. I think it's more like the generic Megaman robots (not Megaman himself), they can perfectly think and make decisions... But while they can do things not programmed (program their own actions), they have a limited will.

Porygon Z is a completelly different case. It's not only a massive upgrade over porygon 2, but it is a glich actually. It can do unexcepted things and it is out of the control that the previous two had. It does have a completelly free will... but becouse it is a glitch, it interferes with the original code, making ALL of them behave somewhat randomly.


Now, for it's phisical body... Probably it is some sort of virtual reality taken to an extreme. Or maybe becouse in the world of pokemon, data and the real world are connected... after all you can transfer stuff to PCs.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

If we're comparing it to other series, it's kinda like a very basic Digimon. Which means that Porygon could learn to have civilizations if properly upgraded.

 

[Hikari Kirameku]

If we're comparing it to other series, it's kinda like a very basic Digimon. Which means that Porygon could learn to have civilizations if properly upgraded.

Awesome, I'm not the only one who's compared it to a Digimon ^^;

What sucks is we're probably never gonna see it in the anime ever again, which is where they tend to flesh out the Pokemon beyond thier in-game Dex entries *sighs*

But I agree, it's basically an advanced AI, so it can probably think for itself and all that.

 

[Rappak]

I find it more interesting that they haven't tried to CREATE more pokemon in the series. The only digital/artifically created pokemon are in the Porygon series and the only scientifically created pokemon is Mewtwo. All the others are naturally born. This was all in the first game Blue/Red/Green, but no other game has created one since then. What stopped scientists from trying to create new ones to rival Porygon? Or, are they still trying to perfect Porygon and/or are afraid something like Mewtwo might happen again?