Review S13 EP20: A Grand Fight for Winning!

[matt0044]

It's a perfect ending for Dawn's character... beating Zoey would just ruin it.

I don't see how. I would've liked it if Dawn won. Personally, it would've really completed her character development. But that would depend on how the writers would write the episode. Don't blame the puppet, blame the puppet master.

'sides, just because it hasn't happen doesn't mean it couldn't have.

 

[Mijumaru]

I don't see how. I would've liked it if Dawn won. Personally, it would've really completed her character development. But that would depend on how the writers would write the episode. Don't blame the puppet, blame the puppet master.

'sides, just because it hasn't happen doesn't mean it couldn't have.

It sets a new goal for Dawn and it makes the series less predictable, I think that's what he means.

 

[leafpikker]

i wish Dawn beat Zoey in the semi-finals and then lost against Nando or some other "expert coordinator"-type person

 

[Piplup]

yeah, I guess you're right, but in pretty much the same way, Ash won against Paul in the League officially for the first time. So this is pretty much the same thing (albeit not in the finals) except the other way around.

The Ash/Paul and Dawn/Zoey relationships are completely different
Ash wanted to prove Paul wrong, so obviously they'd make him win to resolve this
Zoey was a mentor to Dawn who constantly helped Dawn get over her problems and is like a figure for Dawn to idolize and aim to be like her one day
It's different, with Ash they really HAD to make him win to get a conclusion for their rivalry... while with Dawn and Zoey, it really wasn't about one being better than the other or anything like that

I don't see how.

The whole of Dawn's story is about losing confident, gaining it back, learning to deal with losing, realizing she has her Pokémon and friends for support...

By losing the GF instead of winning it, we could see Dawn's reaction to a lose again... and she acted very mature about it
She also proved that despite the fact she just lost, she finally realized what her mom told her since way back at DP 12 - she now has her Pokémon and friends and doesn't need to rely on her mom anymore
It's much more effective when the character realizes this despite losing rather than after winning...

Personally, it would've really completed her character development.

I can't see how Dawn's development could be any more "complete" than that
I honestly felt like this episode was the perfect conclusion of Dawn's story...

 

[matt0044]

I can't see how Dawn's development could be any more "complete" than that
I honestly felt like this episode was the perfect conclusion of Dawn's story...

That's why I said "personally". It's not a unanimous fact that everyone agrees on, it's just my opinion.

I'm not glad that Dawn lost but I'm not sad about it either. I am happy that the final battle was epic.

 

[Mijumaru]

I'm not glad that Dawn lost but I'm not sad about it either. I am happy that the final battle was epic.

It's character development. We might meet them again and she might win against Zoey.

Maybe they could've traded off a loss against Zoey for a win against Ursula.

 

[leafpikker]

i guess the writer were kinda unfair when they made May break down after she lost against Solidad

 

[matt0044]

It's character development. We might meet them again and she might win against Zoey.

Maybe they could've traded off a loss against Zoey for a win against Ursula.

I don't know. Best Wishes doesn't show signs of referencing past events to create a Continuity Lockout for the newer viewers they intend to bring. Hell, Iris calls Ash as kid (as in a beginning trainer) and Ash doesn't mention the fact that he's competed in five leagues so far.

Maybe. I would've like it if Dawn and Zoey tied showing that they were equally matched too.

 

[Piplup]

i guess the writer were kinda unfair when they made May break down after she lost against Solidad

Why unfair? Is May not allowed to show emotion? Dawn cried a few times too... May just finally beat her rivals and got to the Top 4 only to lose, of course she'd be sad about it and it's ok to cry
Dawn's story was very different than May and it focused on her learning to steal with losing, so it'd be extremely stupid if she'd cry in this ep... this ep was the conclusion of Dawn, not degrading her to DP12-Dawn

Best Wishes doesn't show signs of referencing past events to create a Continuity Lockout for the newer viewers they intend to bring.

Lies
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/3474/bw001ashroomdp.jpg

Hell, Iris calls Ash as kid (as in a beginning trainer)

Acting childish and being a beginner are two completely different things
Ash obviously only acted like that cause he was extremely excited of being in a brand new region filled with Pokémon he never saw and that actually has NO old Poké at all...
It'd be stupid if Ash wouldn't act like that and would be totally out of character
Also, Iris often tell him he's a "kid" for no real reason at all... she just likes to tease him like that, that's part of her character

and Ash doesn't mention the fact that he's competed in five leagues so far.

Why would he mention it randomly? he's not trying to prove anything to Iris... he's just doing whatever he wants and wonders why she insist on following him
Also, Oak did tell Ash he'll see here Pokémon that he never saw in Kanto, Johto, Hoenn and Sinnoh...

Maybe. I would've like it if Dawn and Zoey tied showing that they were equally matched too.

You can't really tie for something like that... what would they do? split the cup and each gets half?...

 

[Mijumaru]

You can't really tie for something like that... what would they do? split the cup and each gets half?...

You have a sudden death round in which they decide the winner once both of one side's Pokémon is knocked out.

 

[matt0044]

Lies
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/3474/bw001ashroomdp.jpg

By that I meant mention past events.

 

[Cybersai]

This marks the end of an era:

- The 8 year run of Contests have come to an end.

- Dawn's last Contest battle ever

- Jessie's coordinator career comes to an end

- Zoey's final episode


Overall, it was an alright battle, but this isn't exactly the match I would imagine would be, "THE FINAL CONTEST EVER" type of thing.

So long, Pokemon Contests, you were originally brought into the show to reduce the filler from Johto and give the main girl a quest at the time, but after watching a second girl go at it too, I'm glad we don't have to deal with a third coordinator girl after this.

The end of an era indeed.

 

[Piplup]

You have a sudden death round in which they decide the winner once both of one side's Pokémon is knocked out.

Which means a tie can't really happen

By that I meant mention past events.

What? That scene was full of continuity to past events, as was Oak talking with Ash about Kanto, Johto, Hoenn and Sinnoh...
There's absolutely no reason at all to randomly bring up stuff from the past - they'll be mentioned when needed

 

[Enzap]

I'm a bit sad that it's over already.

But this was definitely a good episode. I just wish that Zoey wasn't beating Dawn so badly from the start. I did like all the awesome combination attacks. I lol'd at the part when Dawn said "We have a spinning move of our own." I thought it just sounded a bit dumb. :/

But a very good episode.

9.5/10

 

[Thingamajig]

So, Grand Festival is over. I think it's a shame that they put the best battle in the previous episode with Nando and Zoey. After that, the final felt like kind of a let down. That's not to say the battle was bad... it just wasn't a highlight for me (although it might've been if a certain purple monkey hadn't been killed off).

Zoey got a decent farewell I guess, although another minute or so could've been cut out of the battle to flesh out seeing Zoey for a last time. (although thankfully we were spared an AG187 rehash, which would've been incredibly boring revolving around Zoey and Kenny).

Bring on the League dub!

 

[leafpikker]

no more contests. no more amazing combinations. no more coordinators.

i guess DP 177 was a rip-off after all

 

[pokemon_master2]

Too bad a main girl never won a Grand Festival, and never will. Just think about it, how amazing it was if they ended the contests and Grand Festivals like this-

May- Hoenn GF: Top 8
May- Kanto GF: Top 4
Dawn- Sinnoh GF: Top 2
Iris- Isshu GF: Winner

Instead we got a cruel ending, with Dawn losing to her main rival, again. Sad.

 

[Masurao]

Overall, it was an alright battle, but this isn't exactly the match I would imagine would be, "THE FINAL CONTEST EVER" type of thing.

Agreed.

It was a decent battle, but it wasn't the greatest. The Nando/Zoey battle was still superior IMO. Oh well, contest are over and done with in the anime. They were fun while they lasted, and freshened up the show a bit.

 

[Jukain]

Seeing this ep for myself has really put how close Dawn came into perspective. Seeing Jessie have a hissy fit just was not as ominous as seeing the discarded Jessalina outfit. "Going to cheer Ash, huh?" That only makes me remember the tremendous controversy over Dawn's fate. It makes me wonder if somewhere, that same controversy is playing out again. Now Dawn gets to take the backseat for the rest of the ride. Should I say farewell to Contests here? I still feel reluctant to do so, but we haven't seen a sign of anything in BW yet. Regardless, they certainly gave us something to remember it by. The Ultimate Challenge indeed. Sorry, Ash, your memorable performance is yet to come, and not at the gym.

 

[Froakie]

Nice episode. The battle was nice and I loved watching Glameow use its tail to make all of those combinations.

Goodbye contests! It was fun.
Isn't this the last time we see Mammoswine and Cyndaquil?
8/10