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Speculation Sevii Islands in Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire

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I absolutely love this, completely. But I don't like the idea that Team Rocket invades Hoenn. Let's leave that for the Anime. Same with Red being there lol
Come on, Team Rocket in Hoenn? How awesome is that? I'd buy a 3DS just for that. Team Rocket are the classic villains. They were active in both Kanto and Johto, so why not Hoenn, even if it is temporary?
 
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Goddarn... you just got everything planned out, don't you? Even NPC quotes... Impressive.
But holy Arceus yes. I'd love to see the Sevii Islands return. They are my absolute favorite part of LeafGreen, and their remixed Johto soundtracks always hit me with nostalgia. Of course, New Island, Naval Rock, etc would be nice islands to visit... although with Naval Rock, everyone has easy access to Ho-Oh and Lugia these days.

Also, they managed to include both Johto AND Kanto in HG/SS, didn't they? I mean, sure, the two regions also showed up in the originals... but still, having 2 regions in one game is not completely out of the question. And in my opinion, seven small-ish islands that don't even include the ocean in between take less effort to re-create than an entire landmass like Kanto. Sadly, I kind of also doubt GF is actually going to do this.
It very well could. I've been on some of the other Pokemon forums and found that a lot of people are discussing the Sevii Islands coming back. It really is amazing that so many people have thought up the same thing. It's also amazing in that this is the first time people have discussed the Sevii Islands in years.
 
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I absolutely love this, completely. But I don't like the idea that Team Rocket invades Hoenn. Let's leave that for the Anime. Same with Red being there lol
Come on, Team Rocket in Hoenn? How awesome is that? I'd buy a 3DS just for that. Team Rocket are the classic villains. They were active in both Kanto and Johto, so why not Hoenn, even if it is temporary?
Because they're so overdone. We already got them in the Sevii Islands, which is technically where Hoenn and Kanto meet (like the Sinjoh Ruins or Tojoh Falls) Do we really need them in MAIN Hoenn? We even got a TR grunt in Unova. I'm kind of shocked they didn't reemerge in B2W2, since Giovanni was there for the PWT...
 
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There is a big difference between Team Rocket and Red. In the former case, we already know that they left the Sevii Islands to prepare the radio wave experiment in Johto in order to lure Giovanni back, and there isn't any mystery about that. But as far as Red is concerned, we really don't know what happened him between the Cerulean Cave and Mt. Silver events. Did he really catch Mewtwo, and if so, why did he release it? Did he ever try to find out more about Mewtwo's origin? Why did Cerulean Cave collapse? Why did he end up isolating himself from society, including his own mother? A sequel story on the Sevii Islands could address these mysteries.
 
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TC's idea has a bit too much Kanto nostalgia for me personally, and probably for Game Freak too. Including Team Rocket would create an unprecedented three-villainous-team scenario where Game Freak would likely want to work more to expand Magma and Aqua's scope. The level of detail in the idea makes it exceedingly unlikely for Game Freak to follow even loosely. And with the increasing tendency for delivered events and shiny locks on them, I have my doubts we'll ever see events on islands again.

Nevertheless, trying to second-guess Game Freak is pretty futile sometimes.

That, and the AI is different and the chance-based effects seem to favor the CPU.
The AI and chance-based effects have long been proven to be the same as anywhere else by RNG researchers. This isn't an issue at all.
 
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An idea for post-game Sevii quest in ORAS: Even after being defeated by Red, I think Team Rocket might go back to Sevii because of Mega Evolution mystery (Team Plasma took actions twice in the same region, so Rocket can too.) and because of knowing that Red went away to Mt. Silver. Sevii Islands would be connected to Mega Evolution because of Deoxys, like @Silktree mentioned. Rocket’s research might have something to do with their future evolution experiments in Lake of Rage. Besides, researching Mega Evolution seems like better goal than just looking for precious gems like they did in FRLG.

After Maxie/Archie realized errors of their actions, they would try to redeem themselves by preventing Team Rocket’s research on Mega Evolution. I’m assuming Maxie/Archie would know about Sevii and Mega Evolution already because they could probably use Mega Camerupt/Sharpedo against player in main story. So, player and Team Magma/Aqua would go to Sevii in order to kick out Team Rocket. Player could also unlock Magma/Aqua outfit, not necessary to wear during quest.

Anything related to Red and Mewtwo could be mentioned by NPCs on Sevii. I don’t think he should appear in person because I think it makes more sense for him to already go away to Mt. Silver, allowing Team Rocket to return to Sevii. Another reason is that he certainly wouldn’t say anything at all.
 
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Rocket’s research might have something to do with their future evolution experiments in Lake of Rage. Besides, researching Mega Evolution seems like better goal than just looking for precious gems like they did in FRLG.
But I don't think they should retcon the story. The Lake of Rage project wasn't about Mega Evolution so any Sevii Islands plot involving Team Rocket and Mega Evolution would mean retconning HGSS, creating a plothole which would never be properly addressed unless they remade HGSS. I am not in favor of that kind of sequel or interim story. Even the original Sevii Islands sidequest didn't lead to a retcon so much as a new mystery - the identity of Giovanni's child.

Anything related to Red and Mewtwo could be mentioned by NPCs on Sevii. I don’t think he should appear in person because I think it makes more sense for him to already go away to Mt. Silver, allowing Team Rocket to return to Sevii.
I don't see how it makes sense for Red to have been on Mt. Silver this entire time. It was Team Rocket who said they were leaving the islands in favor of Johto; Red could easily have stayed on the islands for a while longer.

I'm in favor of seeing a group of scientists handle the Mega Evolution and Deoxys plot. Specifically, the Pokémon Lab team who were said to have gone searching for the legendary birds in Cerulean Cave. We don't know anything about them or their encounter with Mewtwo, but they're much more intriguing than Team Rocket, and dare I say it, Team Magma and Team Aqua. Their story hasn't even begun yet, so there would be no repetition or retcons involved.

Another reason is that he certainly wouldn’t say anything at all.
I disagree. Just because he was silent during the Mt. Silver encounter doesn't necessarily mean that Game Freak are afraid of giving him a personality. I would think that Origins wouldn't have been made if Game Freak had taken issue with a talking Red.
 
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But I don't think they should retcon the story. The Lake of Rage project wasn't about Mega Evolution so any Sevii Islands plot involving Team Rocket and Mega Evolution would mean retconning HGSS, creating a plothole which would never be properly addressed unless they remade HGSS. I am not in favor of that kind of sequel or interim story. Even the original Sevii Islands sidequest didn't lead to a retcon so much as a new mystery - the identity of Giovanni's child.
If Mega Evolution would serve to Team Rocket only as some reference for Lake of Rage project, there wouldn’t be much of a plothole. There’s no need to explain everything behind that experiment in HGSS – in those games it’s said that the project is about artificially inducing evolution and that’s enough. Remaking Hoenn and giving it Fairy type is much more of a plothole. Does it mean they must now remake Johto, Sinnoh and Unova games?

I don't see how it makes sense for Red to have been on Mt. Silver this entire time. It was Team Rocket who said they were leaving the islands in favor of Johto; Red could easily have stayed on the islands for a while longer.
I didn’t say he would stay there all the time. He could stay on islands for a while, set off to Mt. Silver, and then Team Rocket would return to Sevii, about the time when ORAS protagonist would arrive to Sevii.

I'm in favor of seeing a group of scientists handle the Mega Evolution and Deoxys plot. Specifically, the Pokémon Lab team who were said to have gone searching for the legendary birds in Cerulean Cave. We don't know anything about them or their encounter with Mewtwo, but they're much more intriguing than Team Rocket, and dare I say it, Team Magma and Team Aqua. Their story hasn't even begun yet, so there would be no repetition or retcons involved.
They can appear as well as Team Rocket.

I disagree. Just because he was silent during the Mt. Silver encounter doesn't necessarily mean that Game Freak are afraid of giving him a personality. I would think that Origins wouldn't have been made if Game Freak had taken issue with a talking Red.
Red may talk in Origins as well as in manga, but I doubt Game Freak would make him talking after making him silent in all games he was protagonist in.
 
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If Mega Evolution would serve to Team Rocket only as some reference for Lake of Rage project, there wouldn’t be much of a plothole. There’s no need to explain everything behind that experiment in HGSS – in those games it’s said that the project is about artificially inducing evolution and that’s enough. Remaking Hoenn and giving it Fairy type is much more of a plothole. Does it mean they must now remake Johto, Sinnoh and Unova games?

I don't see how it makes sense for Red to have been on Mt. Silver this entire time. It was Team Rocket who said they were leaving the islands in favor of Johto; Red could easily have stayed on the islands for a while longer.
I didn’t say he would stay there all the time. He could stay on islands for a while, set off to Mt. Silver, and then Team Rocket would return to Sevii, about the time when ORAS protagonist would arrive to Sevii.

I'm in favor of seeing a group of scientists handle the Mega Evolution and Deoxys plot. Specifically, the Pokémon Lab team who were said to have gone searching for the legendary birds in Cerulean Cave. We don't know anything about them or their encounter with Mewtwo, but they're much more intriguing than Team Rocket, and dare I say it, Team Magma and Team Aqua. Their story hasn't even begun yet, so there would be no repetition or retcons involved.
They can appear as well as Team Rocket.

I disagree. Just because he was silent during the Mt. Silver encounter doesn't necessarily mean that Game Freak are afraid of giving him a personality. I would think that Origins wouldn't have been made if Game Freak had taken issue with a talking Red.
Red may talk in Origins as well as in manga, but I doubt Game Freak would make him talking after making him silent in all games he was protagonist in.
Well red does talk when he's the protagonist, how else would he command his pokemon to fight or answer some questions you have to answer in game. :p
 
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If Mega Evolution would serve to Team Rocket only as some reference for Lake of Rage project, there wouldn’t be much of a plothole.
The idea that I'm discussing is that someone will deliberately shoot a laser beam at a meteor in order to create Mega Stones. If Team Rocket were behind that, why didn't it affect their HGSS story? They just gave up on Mega Evolution?

Remaking Hoenn and giving it Fairy type is much more of a plothole. Does it mean they must now remake Johto, Sinnoh and Unova games?
The Fairy type doesn't need to be acknowledged; it can exist without the characters acknowledging it as a separate type. Mega Evolution, on the other hand, is an element that should be addressed carefully. If the characters from the pre-XY games are strongly linked to Mega Evolution, then that begs the question why they never mentioned it. I'm saying that Mega Evolution should be a mystery to most characters, especially Team Rocket who wouldn't just forget about it a few years later.

I didn’t say he would stay there all the time. He could stay on islands for a while, set off to Mt. Silver, and then Team Rocket would return to Sevii, about the time when ORAS protagonist would arrive to Sevii.
But why would they return after leaving? FRLG were already a perfect pre-cursor to the Generation II story.

They can appear as well as Team Rocket.
I am not seeing the benefit of Team Rocket's return. They already lost on the Sevii Islands once, and they couldn't have succeeded with the Mega Evolution project even if they had been involved in such a thing. New characters would have no restrictions and could show up in new games (not remakes) after having their story set up.

There is a woman in Anistar City who mentions a group of people asking about Xerneas and Yveltal years ago; she specifically says that they weren't Team Flare. Perhaps those people extracted elements from the sundial stone in order to use them for an experiment. Now, this doesn't mean that those people couldn't have been Team Rocket, but I doubt they would be shrouded with such mystery even if Game Freak did want them to return.

Red may talk in Origins as well as in manga, but I doubt Game Freak would make him talking after making him silent in all games he was protagonist in.
All the player characters are silent when under the command of the player. If you're referring to the Generation II games where Red was an NPC, I think that he didn't talk for two reasons:

1. Game Freak knew that just having him return as an NPC would have a strong impact on people who played as him. His lack of dialogue was effective for the sense of mystery.
2. From the perspective of the story, something had happened to Red which made him isolate himself from people. He didn't want to talk to anyone.

I don't think that these factors apply anymore. It's been years since Gold and Silver were released, so just having Red return for a battle wouldn't be effective, especially after Origins. Also, ORAS are set before Generation II, so the in-universe reason for Red's silence doesn't apply just yet.
 
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The idea that I'm discussing is that someone will deliberately shoot a laser beam at a meteor in order to create Mega Stones. If Team Rocket were behind that, why didn't it affect their HGSS story? They just gave up on Mega Evolution?
I was thinking about meteor being irradiated before events of ORAS, because Deoxys’ Pokedex entry would rather refer to something that happened before plot of game. Team Rocket would simply research the effects of this irradiation, for their own scientific project presented in HGSS.
 
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I was thinking about meteor being irradiated before events of ORAS, because Deoxys’ Pokedex entry would rather refer to something that happened before plot of game.
I disagree that the Pokédex entry means that the event already happened in the past. This may be a matter of gameplay and story segregation, and besides, Game Freak probably didn't have much of a story in mind when they wrote that entry. Either way, someone should be responsible for the laser beam hitting the meteor, as it's a little too convenient otherwise.

Team Rocket would simply research the effects of this irradiation, for their own scientific project presented in HGSS.
While both projects entail using a type of electromagnetic radiation to induce some kind of evolution, Team Rocket being involved here would raise more questions about HGSS than it would answer. I respect your opinion about this, but it doesn't work for me.
 
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I disagree. Just because he was silent during the Mt. Silver encounter doesn't necessarily mean that Game Freak are afraid of giving him a personality. I would think that Origins wouldn't have been made if Game Freak had taken issue with a talking Red.
He talks in every other adaptation or re-interpretation. But in this case, I guess The Origin is a pretty special case compared to the others, being billed as "for the players of the original Red/Green" games. Though, you'd be surprised at the amount of "special" adaptations that are authorized to be produced and aspects that just don't jive with the original creator's intentions end up being slipped in. From a marketing standpoint, I don't think anyone - let alone Game Freak - felt that an anime with a mute protagonist was a good idea anyway, especially since the source material implies dialogue even though no dialogue is present. Not that I have any inclination that Game Freak really cared about butting into Xebec/Production I.G./OLM's creative business anyway, as long as they were making something (maybe individual employees like scriptwriters might have cared, but they're hardly the final say).

Do I personally think Red should talk? Of course, at least in situations where we're not controlling him (like in the Mother games... which, by the way, are echoed constantly to some degree in Pocket Monsters games), and it breaks Game Freak free from a blatant writing limitation. Plus, if we're going by the theory of something having happened to him during the Generation I-II gap that resulted in his silence (it could be jadedness or something of the sort), that wouldn't apply to ORAS, since Generation III takes place almost concurrently to Generation I. I just think it's weird that the fan-excuse of him being silent is "to keep a bit of ourselves in him" when we're not even making his decisions in those NPC appearances.

It's hard to say if I personally think Game Freak is going to take that into consideration and make Red talk if he appears in ORAS. My current impression of the company is one that plays it safe (they hardly made any other ambitious IPs like Pulseman or BUSHI Seiryuuden in over a decade, and have stuck to mostly making Pocket Monsters games and sticking to formula because it's a guaranteed profit). If the Seven Isles really do get included in ORAS with a story that takes place shortly after FRLG's post-game quest, and if Red's silence really isn't just a long-running spoof of silence protagonists, they'll probably just give him a cameo via in-game text rather than making an appearance that would break the fandom's stubborn "silent" impression of him.
 
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FANG-TAN said:
But in this case, I guess The Origin is a pretty special case compared to the others, being billed as "for the players of the original Red/Green" games.
Yes, it's a special case, and not just because of its billing or the fact that it is the closest adaptation to the games (even more so than the Zensho manga from what I've seen). It's also special in that it was made nearly 18 years after the original games' release and 10 years after their remakes. So if a talking Red was something that Game Freak had to put up with years ago for marketing reasons, it boggles the mind why Origins was made. There were better and cheaper ways of promoting Mega Charizard X (as we can see from the current Mega Evolution specials).
 
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FANG-TAN said:
But in this case, I guess The Origin is a pretty special case compared to the others, being billed as "for the players of the original Red/Green" games.
Yes, it's a special case, and not just because of its billing or the fact that it is the closest adaptation to the games (even more so than the Zensho manga from what I've seen). It's also special in that it was made nearly 18 years after the original games' release and 10 years after their remakes. So if a talking Red was something that Game Freak had to put up with years ago for marketing reasons, it boggles the mind why Origins was made. There were better and cheaper ways of promoting Mega Charizard X (as we can see from the current Mega Evolution specials).
That's a fair point if and only if the prospect of Game Freak actually having a large hand/overseeing eye in the production/writing of the special was true. However, there's also an alternative, completely plausible and often commonplace scenario behind the special: The animation studios merely wanted to do a collaborative anime adaptation of RG to capitalize on Generation I nostalgia and also the then-upcoming XY games (also, I assume that including a reveal of Mega Lizardon X was possibly the only thing they were absolutely required to do in order for it to be green-lit), with Game Freak treating it as nothing more than another adaptation of their game series (as for their involvement: according to ANN, cooperative production is pretty the same as the regular anime, with Buy Our Toys East Japan Marketing & Communications and Nintendo being put into that position, rather than Game Freak - a company that is not owned by Nintendo).

Looking at it this way, The Origin ends up looking a lot like the current anime in terms of marketing function. And we're all familiar with how roundabout the current series anime is with a handful of its promotions and how much is shoehorned into that (I'd love to cite He Who Must Not Be Named as an example, but I'll probably get in trouble). Thus, not really a good example of digging into the eyes of Game Freak's scenario writers because, for all we know, we're really not.

If we give Game Freak's writing integrity the benefit of the doubt, but also take into account that they mostly play it safe (I'm still not sure whether the reaction towards B2W2 inspired them to shake things up or scared them instead), the most likely conclusion we'd be able to compromise with is them including Red as a text cameo for the proposed ORAS Seven Isles post-game rather than a true appearance.
 
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I disagree that the Pokédex entry means that the event already happened in the past. This may be a matter of gameplay and story segregation, and besides, Game Freak probably didn't have much of a story in mind when they wrote that entry. Either way, someone should be responsible for the laser beam hitting the meteor, as it's a little too convenient otherwise.
I think every species of Pokemon always existed prior to games plot for a reason. In games universe, Pokedex entries are created basing on information gathered by professors. It doesn’t feel right to witness creation of first and only Deoxys and having its Pokedex entry without any research done on Deoxys species. Arceus event is different case, because it created just another member of already existing species. Story of laser beam could be explained in the form of cutscene, the same like Ultimate Weapon in XY. Doesn’t have to be in distant past like the latter, could be only like year ago.

While both projects entail using a type of electromagnetic radiation to induce some kind of evolution, Team Rocket being involved here would raise more questions about HGSS than it would answer. I respect your opinion about this, but it doesn't work for me.
What exact questions do you think it would raise? I think any possible question raised by this sub-plot regarding to HGSS could be simultaneously answered by Rocket’s scientists' dialogues. Like I said, it wouldn’t be plothole in regard to HGSS, it would be more like a complement explaining how Team Rocket learned to use radiation to cause evolution. Events of HGSS didn’t need such explanation, because they focused on effects of the experiment, not on preparations.
 
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That's a fair point if and only if the prospect of Game Freak actually having a large hand/overseeing eye in the production/writing of the special was true.
Masuda tweeted in early March that he had just met OLM to discuss something. I'm pretty sure that he wouldn't do that for a project related to the regular anime, so my guess is that the meeting was releated to an Origins-like adaptation. Now, this doesn't mean that Masuda oversaw Origins' production, but it does lend credence to that possibility.

The animation studios merely wanted to do a collaborative anime adaptation of RG to capitalize on Generation I nostalgia and also the then-upcoming XY games
With OLM being one of those studios? I doubt that it was their initiative.

(also, I assume that including a reveal of Mega Lizardon X was possibly the only thing they were absolutely required to do in order for it to be green-lit)
They did a lot more than that, including things from the games that the other adaptations had never done. Why bother?

The Origin ends up looking a lot like the current anime in terms of marketing function.
It's wildly different. Origins did not feel like an obvious promotion tool.

the most likely conclusion we'd be able to compromise with is them including Red as a text cameo for the proposed ORAS Seven Isles post-game rather than a true appearance.
I guess. "Most likely" doesn't mean much when we just don't know what their thought process on this kind of thing is. I'm saying that they have no reason not have Red appear and actually talk, be it in ORAS or another game. It would be a missed opportunity if they didn't do it here considering that there may never be another chance to show what happened to Red between the first two generations.

shiny_magikarp said:
In games universe, Pokedex entries are created basing on information gathered by professors. It doesn’t feel right to witness creation of first and only Deoxys and having its Pokedex entry without any research done on Deoxys species. Arceus event is different case, because it created just another member of already existing species.
It was made very clear in Platinum that Cynthia didn't even know Arceus' name, nor did anyone else in those games. So why would any of the regional professors have known about it then? For all intents and purposes, Arceus was discovered in the Sinjoh Ruins event. The Pokédex entries being viewable in DPPt is just a gameplay element.

And how do you make sense of Mewtwo preceding Mew in the Pokédex? Not to mention that there was no evidence that Professor Oak knew of either one of them. As per Origins, he did not know their names before Red helped him connect the dots.

What exact questions do you think it would raise?
Basically: Why did Team Rocket just give up on Mega Evolution? Wouldn't that have been the perfect way to pique Giovanni's interest? The Lake of Rage experiment definitely had potential (giving Team Rocket easy access to evolved Pokémon), but compared to Mega Evolution (which isn't attainable by any means other than Mega Stones), it's a step back.

And another question: You assume that the laser experiment would need to have happened prior to the FRLG events. So why did Team Rocket just leave the islands? You don't think that an ORAS Sevii Islands plot would be set before the FRLG one, do you? You mentioned a flashback, so I guess you don't. Either way, I suppose that a prequel isn't outside the realm of possibilities, but I'd be surprised if Game Freak did that; it would limit the Sevii Islands' potential.

I am not saying that Team Rocket's involvement can't possibly make sense. But would it add to the story? I don't think so. I think their inclusion would detract from the potential new characters, which I envision as being the Pokémon Lab team.
 
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If Mew and Deoxys are available in Sevii Islands somewhere like in FRLG/Emerald (or anywhere for that matter) I might just be willing to break my head canon and get ORAS.
Suppose I could use the Celebi I caught in Ilex Forest (yes I CAUGHT it) to take me back in time and when I arrive there things are different ie the past has changed *spooky*

But yeah I think they definitely should be, after all they were in Emerald and remakes can incorporate the 3rd version.
 
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I think every species of Pokemon always existed prior to games plot for a reason. In games universe, Pokedex entries are created basing on information gathered by professors. It doesn’t feel right to witness creation of first and only Deoxys and having its Pokedex entry without any research done on Deoxys species. Arceus event is different case, because it created just another member of already existing species. Story of laser beam could be explained in the form of cutscene, the same like Ultimate Weapon in XY. Doesn’t have to be in distant past like the latter, could be only like year ago.
Point A: We do know for a fact that Pokemon like Aggron and Abomasnow existed long before their respective debuts (in universe). The ultimate weapon flashback showed quite a few species in fact.

Point B: The PokeDex entries don't actually mean anything in universe. They're a classic example of Gameplay and Story Segregation. We know that because well the PokeDex entries often make little sense. Besides they often contradict things. Banette for instance according to it's Pokedex is some sort of living doll but we know that's not true because it's an actual species. It evolves from Shuppet and that can breed.
 
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