SwSh Should SwSh have had more fantasy elements than it did?

[Kallyle]

As much as I like the current setting of Galar, I can't help but feel that Game Freak missed an opportunity here: to include more fantasy elements in a Pokémon game than usual! When you think of Great Britain, sports isn't the only thing that's worth mentioning. Britain is famous for its fantasy lore and is often attributed with fairy tales and swords and sorcery, yet we only got the bare minimum in terms of certain Pokémon while almost everything in Galar is relegated to being about the Gym Challenge. Opal was kind of what I was looking for, but I can't help but feel that there could have been more of a fantasy vibe.

When I say I wanted more fantasy in Pokémon SwSh, I'm not talking about being back in the middle ages and ignoring the urban real-world feel the franchise is known for. I'm more talking about having non-Pokémon fantasy creatures/races integrated into the setting; it would have been cool to see elves among the trainer roster you fight in the games, or maybe a few trolls happen to join Team Yell because Marnie doesn't judge people based on looks and excepts them as fellow people. Failing that, maybe such trainers could be relegated to the Wild Area if Game Freak feels such creatures would clash with the urban environments, giving the open-world space more things to do. Or maybe I just want confirmation of non-human and non-Pokémon lifeforms in the Pokémon world.

Another example would be the nature of Dynamax/Gigantamax. In an interview with Game Freak about SwSh (I forget which one), it was said that the Dynamax phenomenon was due to natural energies in the Galar region, and that one of the themes would involve facing nature's wrath. This lead people to think that Dynamax involved some sort of mystical force of nature, which I think would have fit perfectly with Rose being concerned about Galar's running out of resources. Instead, we get a copy-paste of Necrozma's backstory from USUM in terms of the mechanic being tied to an extraterrestrial legendary Pokémon (Dynamax energy/Galar particles/watts coming from Eternatus as Z-Power comes from Necrozma) and trying to use said Pokémon's energy as an infinite battery of sorts (making Rose's plan for Eternatus sound a lot like what the ancestors of Ultra Megalopolis's populace tried to do to Necrozma). Instead of a generic last-minute sci-fi excuse that's been done already, it would have been way cooler for Dynamax to stay this magical force of nature and for the wishing stars and stuff to act as a magical seal for the creature, but with Rose having no idea of Eternatus until later. Not only would a magical context for the mechanic and Eternatus make it less out of place with the Legendary wolves (who are devoid of having any extraterrestrial association and give off a more fantasy vibe), but this would make Rose's panic trying to get Leon to act quickly make a lot more sense. However, since Leon wants to wait until after the Championship match as it hasn't yet awakened, Rose decides to try and handle Eternatus by himself (fitting his impatient nature). It only ends up making things worse.

What do you guys think? Should Pokémon Pokémon Sword and Shield have had a couple of more fantasy elements than it did? Or is the urban sci-fi view of the games good enough for you despite Eternatus's plot being a near clone of Necrozma's backstory? What fantasy elements would you think would fit these games, if any? Discuss!

 

[Esserise]

Hmm. I was actually thinking along similar lines the other day, but came to sort of the opposite conclusion, that I liked how they didn't lean into the usual clichés about old Britain as much, and instead went for a more modernized portrayal. I believe James Turner mentioned something to that effect a while back in regards to the design of the kinds of signage in Galar; originally they had a more medieval look, but he suggested that they aim for a more realistic design that reflected his own personal experience.

I don't really recall what you've said about them describing Dynamax as being "nature's wrath," although I do remember Ohmori saying that it was partly inspired by old British lore about giants. So that's at least a small tether to what you're taking about. I do agree that Eternatus's gist is kind of repetitive, although I really like Zacian and Zamazenta. Rather than going for something like woodland fae magick, they are more like the story of King Arthur, which I think adds both a tangible and historic, but also mystical and timeless quality to them.

I don't think they'd ever add like, actual elves and fantasy creatures though. Pokémon already has an established standard of absorbing those kinds of ideas and reproducing them as Pokémon, so I think the likes of Impidimp and Ponyta were always the closest you would ever get.

I'll go with Option #3 in the poll because I'm sure it would be neat to see them do something a little more fantastical, but I am satisfied with the games as they are.

What do you guys think? Should Pokémon Pokémon Sword and Shield have had a couple of more fantasy elements than it did? Or is the urban sci-fi view of the games good enough for you despite Eternatus's plot being a near clone of Necrozma's backstory?

This is pretty biased phrasing. Frankly, even though I would agree that Eternatus and Necrozma have more similarities than I'd like, it's not really a "near clone." Eternatus is an alien creature with no pretext at all other than being the cause of the ancient disaster in Galar's history. It's a sheer force of nature, whereas Necrozma's tale is more personal and tragic (it shared a symbiotic relationship with the people of another world, becoming something of a culture hero to them, until they decided to betray and exploit it, which hurt it and drove it mad). Furthermore, in the context of the present storyline, they're also at rather opposite angles. Necrozma is a looming threat that the Ultra Recon Squad constantly warn us about, and wish to prevent. Eternatus is not mentioned directly at all, and the antagonist wants to revive it, not keep it restrained.

 

[WyndonCalling]

I voted no, because I think Galar already has a solid amount of fantastical/olde worlde elements. You've got the nods to both Nordic and Arthurian mythology with the mascots, then goblins, witches, unicorns, knights, some very traditional ghost depictions, Hammerlocke, the Slumbering Weald, the Alice in Wonderland themes of Glimwood and Ballonlea (not to mention Galarian Meowth - notice how it smiles?). There's plenty of fodder for a swords-and-sorcery team or headcanon, IMO.

But the more substantive reason for me is that a Galar more heavily dedicated to this stuff would be a cultural parody of the UK, not the deep and complex region we ended up with. Galar is Cool Britannia, hooliganism, the Industrial Revolution, dilapidated coastal towns, railway viaducts, sports, the Beatles, corporatism, punk, school ties, Phil Collins, bobbies, Agatha Christie, twee country villages and dark satanic mills. I was expecting a story and region that owed more to royalty and fairytales and would have been absolutely pleased as punch with such, but I was thrilled with what we got.

That's not to say I don't share some of the same gripes with the weakness of the Rose plot. I think Eternatus was freaky and powerful enough to work as a final boss and my issues lie more with Rose's motivations (though who on Earth decided that the mascots would join the protagonists for that battle, rather than have Bede and Marnie rock up for a Dynamax showdown?!). Rose is a very interesting character for his unfailingly mild and friendly personality, but he has Lysandre's problem in that his goals just don't make sense within rational scope, even a supremely cynical one, and the stakes of his plan are actually quite low at the outset - at the time of his disruption of the championship, it's not even apparent that anyone or anything will be hurt by his plans. He's just... a bit of a weirdo for prioritising this now.

 

[Emmy]

Having fantasy stuff outside of the Pokémon themselves would be really weird, not gonna lie. Mostly because it clashes with it being mostly absent from the rest of the 'verse outside of little things like "Pokémon and humans used to be the same" and "A boy with strong psychic powers woke up to find he was a Kadabra" that I frankly prefer to ignore.

I found SwSh to be perfectly balanced in how it incorporated Britain into Galar. The only thing I would've liked is the Legendary Hero to have been actually wielding a transformed Zacian/Zamazenta as an actual Sword and Shield rather than what we got.

 

[Kallyle]

Hmm. I was actually thinking along similar lines the other day, but came to sort of the opposite conclusion, that I liked how they didn't lean into the usual clichés about old Britain as much, and instead went for a more modernized portrayal. I believe James Turner mentioned something to that effect a while back in regards to the design of the kinds of signage in Galar; originally they had a more medieval look, but he suggested that they aim for a more realistic design that reflected his own personal experience.

But the more substantive reason for me is that a Galar more heavily dedicated to this stuff would be a cultural parody of the UK, not the deep and complex region we ended up with. Galar is Cool Britannia, hooliganism, the Industrial Revolution, dilapidated coastal towns, railway viaducts, sports, the Beatles, corporatism, punk, school ties, Phil Collins, bobbies, Agatha Christie, twee country villages and dark satanic mills. I was expecting a story and region that owed more to royalty and fairytales and would have been absolutely pleased as punch with such, but I was thrilled with what we got.

I wouldn't want Game Freak changing Galar's setting that much, as I very much agree that part of Pokémon's charm comes from that realistic urban sci-fi feel. That isn't the vibe I meant to convey about incorporating fantasy elements. At most, I'd like there be additional fantasy-like areas as optional locations just so the whole region isn't built entirely around the sports theme like it currently is.

I don't really recall what you've said about them describing Dynamax as being "nature's wrath," although I do remember Ohmori saying that it was partly inspired by old British lore about giants. So that's at least a small tether to what you're taking about. I do agree that Eternatus's gist is kind of repetitive, although I really like Zacian and Zamazenta. Rather than going for something like woodland fae magick, they are more like the story of King Arthur, which I think adds both a tangible and historic, but also mystical and timeless quality to them.

Wasn't there something along the line of Dynamax being fueled by natural energy part of the same interview? I could have sworn there was.

I don't think they'd ever add like, actual elves and fantasy creatures though. Pokémon already has an established standard of absorbing those kinds of ideas and reproducing them as Pokémon, so I think the likes of Impidimp and Ponyta were always the closest you would ever get.

Having fantasy stuff outside of the Pokémon themselves would be really weird, not gonna lie. Mostly because it clashes with it being mostly absent from the rest of the 'verse outside of little things like "Pokémon and humans used to be the same" and "A boy with strong psychic powers woke up to find he was a Kadabra" that I frankly prefer to ignore.

When it comes to integrating things like elves and trolls into the Pokémon games, I was thinking something more along the lines of the Fairy Tale Girls trainer class from the sixth generation rather than beings that cast spells and junk. There's numerous hints that they either communicate with fairies or are actual fairies themselves. That in itself implies that there's more to world than just human and Pokémon. In this case, it'd just be actual elves and trolls acting like Pokémon trainers in a similar fashion to the aforementioned trainer class. I guess I just want confirmation of there being more than just human and Pokémon in the Pokémon world since classifying everything non-human as a Pokémon just seems a little odd.

This is pretty biased phrasing. Frankly, even though I would agree that Eternatus and Necrozma have more similarities than I'd like, it's not really a "near clone." Eternatus is an alien creature with no pretext at all other than being the cause of the ancient disaster in Galar's history. It's a sheer force of nature, whereas Necrozma's tale is more personal and tragic (it shared a symbiotic relationship with the people of another world, becoming something of a culture hero to them, until they decided to betray and exploit it, which hurt it and drove it mad). Furthermore, in the context of the present storyline, they're also at rather opposite angles. Necrozma is a looming threat that the Ultra Recon Squad constantly warn us about, and wish to prevent. Eternatus is not mentioned directly at all, and the antagonist wants to revive it, not keep it restrained.

Ironically, I actually prefer Eternatus to Necrozma as the Galar legend just seems cooler all-around. I also see how the context between the two legendaries are different. I just don't like that the same concept for an antagonistic legendary was used soo close together. I feel like Game Freak could have done much better in regards to the origin of Dynamax than they did.

 

[venusboi79]

I always saw the Fairytale girls from Kalos to be somewhat akin to the Psychics, Channelers, Spooky Girls, etc that have been around since the beginning. Just using the new type as opposed to focusing on Ghost and Psychic types.

And to be honest, outside of the Psychics (like Sabrina), I find the lot of them to be at odds with the world they inhabit; Ghost Pokémon are clearly not the souls of the dead, and the majority of Fairy types are cute, pink and sparkly ‘mons, not other-worldly fae who capriciously mess with mortals to amuse themselves.

So, much like the flavor text in the Pokédex throwing out random weight/height and body temperature, I mostly ignore them in the lore.

 

[SerenaToAlola]

While I would like Galar to have more fantasy elements, I wouldn't go as far as to wanting Elves and Trolls as trainers.

Because this is the first brand new game with over world encounters, they really should have done more to match the pokemon available (in terms of both preexisting pokemon and also the newly designed ones) with the environment. I think the routes that did this best was Glimwood Tangle and the Slumbering Weald. Route 8 I think with the Falinks was also fantastic. I really felt like I was in another world then and I wished the rest of the routes were that conceptually rich.

So I think it is with regard to the environment where I think having more fantastical elements would really help in making Galar come alive.

I'm not sure what Route 9 was supposed to be. It seemed kinda weird but still somewhat interesting. Anyone else annoyed by how Route 10, the last route was yet another Ice type route. I'm not sure if that made sense at all. It didn't help that both Circhester and Spikemuth had quite abit of ice going on. I think it would have been nice if they had gone with a castle theme there.

 

[Puddle]

I, too, was a little disappointed by the heavy focus on sport at first. I find real-life sport really boring; it's an aspect of British culture that I've never identified with. That being said, I ended up really enjoying the Gym Challenge. It's helped me to understand the appeal of sport culture a little, through the lens of a fictional sport that I actually do find interesting. If we had televised Pokemon battles in the UK instead of football, I'd watch that!

I've always enjoyed the way that Pokemon effortlessly juxtaposes the ancient and the modern. Alola was a seamless blend of traditional Hawaiian culture and science fiction. And Galar, too, manages to do the same thing. The Gym Challenge draws heavily from sport culture, while Sonia's storyline delves into the region's history. Zacian and Zamazenta have a very magical quality about them, and while Eternatus has a sci-fi appearance, its battle against the wolves is likely inspired by the legend of Saint George and the Dragon. The clash of fantasy and sci-fi is one of the things which, to me, makes that battle work so well.

But there's more, if you delve a little deeper. I'm certain that the Power Spots were inspired by ley lines - more specifically, the points where two or more ley lines cross, which are believed by some to be sources of great power. Stonehenge is said to be one of these sites, which is likely why Stonjourner has the Power Spot ability. If the guesswork in this Bulbapedia article is correct, Turffield and Route 8 were inspired by Avebury and Glastonbury respectively, two more places that are situated near ley lines and hold a lot of significance for Pagans and members of the New Age movement.

So there is something mystical (I use this term rather than "fantastical", since there are people who do believe in the power of ley lines) about Dynamax, even if the game doesn't make it particularly obvious. I definitely would have preferred Dynamax to come from earth energy, rather than from Eternatus, but the real-world inspiration for the concept is very mystical, at least.

It would have been nice to see some of these elements featured more overtly. But I'm just really happy that they were included in the game at all. My dad was interested in these things, and he loved to visit Avebury and Glastonbury, so I feel like I have a personal connection to Galar that goes beyond it simply being based on my home country.

 

[WyndonCalling]

It would have been nice to see some of these elements featured more overtly. But I'm just really happy that they were included in the game at all. My dad was interested in these things, and he loved to visit Avebury and Glastonbury, so I feel like I have a personal connection to Galar that goes beyond it simply being based on my home country.

Y'see, I grew up in a railway town not far from Chester and my dad's from Stoke - he's into canals, engineering, trains and the likes. My grandparents on the other side are farmers in the Cheshire wilderness, with a viaduct bisecting their land. I attended university in Hull and I'm currently based in London. I'm not much into sport or music myself but it still feels like James Turner's been spying on me.

 

[Esserise]

Wasn't there something along the line of Dynamax being fueled by natural energy part of the same interview? I could have sworn there was.

I'll try to investigate - me not remembering something is certainly not an indication that it didn't happen!

Edit: Maybe it was this?

> "The lore of the land is that the Galar region has this sort of mysterious energy that can power up things and make them massive, and we express that through the battle system; when they get bigger, they become stronger," Iwao says.

But that's pretty vague, and in hindsight we can say that the "mysterious energy" is just that which comes from Eternatus, which Iwao wouldn't have wanted to spoil.

When it comes to integrating things like elves and trolls into the Pokémon games, I was thinking something more along the lines of the Fairy Tale Girls trainer class from the sixth generation rather than beings that cast spells and junk. There's numerous hints that they either communicate with fairies or are actual fairies themselves. That in itself implies that there's more to world than just human and Pokémon.

Hmm. See, I just always assumed they were talking about Fairy-type Pokémon.

(Not that I don't think non-Pokémon life couldn't be an interesting avenue - I thought that's what the UBs would be at first, and was enticed by that notion - I just don't think it's a paradigm that Game Freak are particularly interested in exploring. I think they quite evidently prefer to explore new ideas within the framework of Pokémon.)

I just don't like that the same concept for an antagonistic legendary was used soo close together. I feel like Game Freak could have done much better in regards to the origin of Dynamax than they did.

That's fair. I think there are also a lot of other superficial similarities between the plots of SM and SwSh, what with like the more overt antagonists being a group of mischievous-but-sympathetic punks from a dilapidated town while the real threat comes from an ostensibly humanitarian, billion-dollar tech monolith. I wonder to what degree the story team were cognizant of those parallels, and how deliberate they were.

Ghost Pokémon are clearly not the souls of the dead

Ehhh idk about that. They're pretty explicit with the likes of Yamask and Spiritomb. I would say that it seems as though souls of the dead can become Pokémon through some means.

 

[prog rocker]

I, too, was a little disappointed by the heavy focus on sport at first. I find real-life sport really boring; it's an aspect of British culture that I've never identified with. That being said, I ended up really enjoying the Gym Challenge. It's helped me to understand the appeal of sport culture a little, through the lens of a fictional sport that I actually do find interesting. If we had televised Pokemon battles in the UK instead of football, I'd watch that!

Sincerely, that's how I feel about it, too. While both the anime and Special did this before (at least with the League itself), I would have preferred that the gym challenge was... bigger. Gym challenges in the games are, after all, half beating the obstacles and half beating the Leader. Something like that should be treated in a more special way. Watching something like that in TV must be interesting.

 

[SinnohEevee]

I wish there was Hogwarts in the games.

 

[Shib]

I’m from the UK and honestly it would have ruined the game for me if there were suddenly elves and trolls included in the Pokémon franchise as trainers because it would have just felt so out of universe. Same for if they’d put knight and wizards in as a current day thing - having story’s about them in the past would have been fine but seriously the only places in the UK you are likely to see people dressed like that are tourist hot spots and comic con.

The whole dynamax gimmick was based on fairytale story’s of giants fighting and there are a few new Pokémon that capture some fantasy elements from European fairytales - that’s the place I’d be happy to see more of a link to that sort of stuff. Even the whole hidden history of Zacian and Zamazenta feels like a nice nod to how our history is tied into folklore in a way that people often don’t know what is true and what is fairytales. To me suddenly going “elves and trolls exist in the Pokémon world as equals to humans” just wouldn’t work and would have pretty much turned me off the game altogether.

 

[SinnohEevee]

I’m from the UK and honestly it would have ruined the game for me if there were suddenly elves and trolls included in the Pokémon franchise as trainers because it would have just felt so out of universe. Same for if they’d put knight and wizards in as a current day thing - having story’s about them in the past would have been fine but seriously the only places in the UK you are likely to see people dressed like that are tourist hot spots and comic con.

The whole dynamax gimmick was based on fairytale story’s of giants fighting and there are a few new Pokémon that capture some fantasy elements from European fairytales - that’s the place I’d be happy to see more of a link to that sort of stuff. Even the whole hidden history of Zacian and Zamazenta feels like a nice nod to how our history is tied into folklore in a way that people often don’t know what is true and what is fairytales. To me suddenly going “elves and trolls exist in the Pokémon world as equals to humans” just wouldn’t work and would have pretty much turned me off the game altogether.

I would have liked to see elves and trolls as Pokémon.

 

[Phosphene]

I would have liked to see [...] trolls as Pokémon.

 

[Shib]

That would have been my exact reply - the impidimp line is a good elf/troll/fairy representation that still fits within the Pokémon universe.

Also Hatta line references witches so have a similar fairytale root.

sure they could have done more but I don’t think a ton of new designs being dedicated to the concept would have been good - especially as it would have likely come at the cost of Sinistea/Polteageist who are among my favourite new Pokémon design wise (even if they are terrible on a team!)

 

[Gengarzilla]

To speak bluntly, I'd gotten enough of a fantasy fix from all the Generation 6 and 7 games. Ancient king, ultimate weapon, sky dragon god cult, interdimensional wormholes and the otherworldly beings within... After all that, I personally welcome the comparatively mundane approach to Galar.