• All content from the former Roleplaying Games forum has been merged into the Writers' Workshop forum. You can find more information in this thread.

    We hope to see you roleplaying away soon!
  • The World Beyond Restructure is now finished! Check out the update here!
  • It's time for the Writer's Workshop Summer event: our second themed one-shot competition! Check out the sign-up thread here!
  • Hey everyone! Bulbagarden is hosting its first Bulbaleague Conference Pokemon Showdown Tournament! Check out this thread to get the full details!
  • Hey everyone! The Writer's Workshop is hosting an exciting event, Trainers of Fanfiction! It's a community event focused around your characters!

Sinnoh Dex should have had all the Gen IV Pokémon

Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
So in Diamond and Pearl, Professor Rowan gives you the Sinnoh Pokédex with a mission to fill it just by seeing all the Pokémon (you don't have to catch them). You battle every trainer in Sinnoh on your way to the Elite Four to have seen a total of 149 Pokémon. Then you find the picture of the opposite version's legendary to complete your Sinnoh Dex. You show it to Professor Rowan and then Professor Oak comes in and upgrades it to the National Mode. You look through your new Pokédex that now starts with #025 Pikachu and has a lot of blanks for the Pokémon that weren't in the Sinnoh Dex, which you find to be normal, until you scroll down to the Sinnoh section and see it all filled except for 18 blanks between Weavile and Uxie. And then you battle new legendaries, to discover that there are more Pokémon beyond Palkia. How can you have missed so many Sinnoh Pokémon if you got the National Dex as a reward for seeing them all? Because there are Sinnoh Pokémon that aren't in the Sinnoh Dex. The blanks between Weavile and Uxie include 17 new evolutions of Pokémon not in Sinnoh, plus Rotom. Platinum improves the Sinnoh Dex by adding those missing evolution families to the Dex along with Rotom and Giratina. But there's still no Heatran, Regigigas, Cresselia, Phione, Darkrai, Shaymin or Arceus in Platinum's Sinnoh Pokédex. So the Sinnoh Pokédex is still not complete. And they are the only Pokémon that's not in any regional Pokédex. Other regional Pokédexes always included all the Pokémon introduced with that region. Don't you think all those Pokémon that were introduced in Sinnoh should have been in the Sinnoh Dex? All the Sinnoh Legendaries and Mythicals? Wouldn't it be cool to start the National Dex with the Gen IV section completely filled out from #387 Turtwig to #493 Arceus?
 
Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
Maybe the remakes'll fix it.
Yeah, I sure hope so. I would even like it if the remakes give you catchable Mythical Pokémon similar to the Deoxys in ORAS just so that you could fill the Sinnoh Dex without needing Mystery Gifts. And I guess the Hoenn Regis would have to be included because of Regigigas, and half of the Battle Zone should be accessable earlier than the original so that you could get Heatran from Stark Mountain.
 
Not Dead
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
18,911
Reaction score
12,618
A valid complaint, but there's nothing to discuss here.
 
Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
A valid complaint, but there's nothing to discuss here.
We could discuss how you could have done the Sinnoh Dex differently if you worked at Game Freak, or what you hope the remakes would change about the Sinnoh Dex. Maybe even where you could have seen the missing legendaries before beating Cynthia.
 
Young Battle Trainer
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
6,194
Reaction score
7,066
This could change in a possible remake.
 
Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2017
Messages
312
Reaction score
72
considering how everything i dont expect the national dex coming back the only thing its put all pokemons until generation iv and thats it the rest are vanished of existence

Thank me later
 
Young Battle Trainer
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
6,194
Reaction score
7,066
Of course, this will change in the Sinnoh remakes, because of Dexit.
 
New Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2020
Messages
15
Reaction score
16
I personally don't think DP should've had all the Gen 4 Pokemon from the start because that would've ruined one of Platinum's gimmicks and selling points which was that the remaining Gen 4 Pokemon were available in the main storyline in that game.
That's the problem a lot of people have with third versions in general though. Ruby & Sapphire and Diamond & Pearl felt like they were outclassed by Emerald and Platinum respectively because Game Freak kept things in the first two versions, only to be added later.
Personally I think Diamond and Pearl could have still had the full Gen 4 Pokémon and Platinum would still be worth it for the Distortion world, Winter tone and Battle Frontier. Also Platinum included more than just Sinnoh Pokémon, e.g. Swablu, Houndoom and Scyther
 
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
5,085
Reaction score
3,325
That group of Pokémon has always intrigued me because of their mostly monstrous appearance. Maybe they were an early idea for Mega evolution (one of them is even called Megayanma in Japanese) and Game Freak was iffy about adding them into the game?

Another theory is that they were just a Pal Park bonus so people who bought the GBA games bought a DS, but Game Freak also backtracked on that and added postgame appearances for most of them.

Or maybe they just wanted to stop the Regional Dex at 151 so the completely new Pokémon had more visibility.
 
Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
There was no need to force the Sinnoh Dex to have the same number as Kanto. But I'm guessing they left new Pokémon out to promote the National Dex gimmick. Maybe the remakes would include all the Diamond and Pearl Pokémon because of Dexit, or maybe the National Dex would be brought back for the fans who complained about Dexit. Or maybe they would have a bit of both with the Sinnoh Dex having all the D/P Pokémon and the National Dex coming as a reward for completing the Sinnoh Dex.
 
Young Battle Trainer
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
6,194
Reaction score
7,066
There was no need to force the Sinnoh Dex to have the same number as Kanto. But I'm guessing they left new Pokémon out to promote the National Dex gimmick. Maybe the remakes would include all the Diamond and Pearl Pokémon because of Dexit, or maybe the National Dex would be brought back for the fans who complained about Dexit. Or maybe they would have a bit of both with the Sinnoh Dex having all the D/P Pokémon and the National Dex coming as a reward for completing the Sinnoh Dex.
The National Dex is never coming back.
 
Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
The National Dex is never coming back.
Don't be so sure. Removing the National Dex from Sword and Shield was the worst PR decision Game Freak made. They'd want to make up for it. And besides, Pokémon HOME has the National Dex, and all of the Galar Pokémon have National Dex numbers. They won't get rid of the National Dex that easily.
 
Young at Heart
Joined
Dec 15, 2009
Messages
362
Reaction score
55
So in Diamond and Pearl, Professor Rowan gives you the Sinnoh Pokédex with a mission to fill it just by seeing all the Pokémon (you don't have to catch them). You battle every trainer in Sinnoh on your way to the Elite Four to have seen a total of 149 Pokémon. Then you find the picture of the opposite version's legendary to complete your Sinnoh Dex. You show it to Professor Rowan and then Professor Oak comes in and upgrades it to the National Mode. You look through your new Pokédex that now starts with #025 Pikachu and has a lot of blanks for the Pokémon that weren't in the Sinnoh Dex, which you find to be normal, until you scroll down to the Sinnoh section and see it all filled except for 18 blanks between Weavile and Uxie. And then you battle new legendaries, to discover that there are more Pokémon beyond Palkia. How can you have missed so many Sinnoh Pokémon if you got the National Dex as a reward for seeing them all? Because there are Sinnoh Pokémon that aren't in the Sinnoh Dex. The blanks between Weavile and Uxie include 17 new evolutions of Pokémon not in Sinnoh, plus Rotom. Platinum improves the Sinnoh Dex by adding those missing evolution families to the Dex along with Rotom and Giratina. But there's still no Heatran, Regigigas, Cresselia, Phione, Darkrai, Shaymin or Arceus in Platinum's Sinnoh Pokédex. So the Sinnoh Pokédex is still not complete. And they are the only Pokémon that's not in any regional Pokédex. Other regional Pokédexes always included all the Pokémon introduced with that region. Don't you think all those Pokémon that were introduced in Sinnoh should have been in the Sinnoh Dex? All the Sinnoh Legendaries and Mythicals? Wouldn't it be cool to start the National Dex with the Gen IV section completely filled out from #387 Turtwig to #493 Arceus?
I made a revised version of the Sinnoh Pokedex the other day, which you might find interesting:

Sinnoh Remake - Revised Pokedex

Pokemon highlighted in blue are from the Platinum expansion, and Pokemon highlighted in red are my own additions. I added Ditto and the Regis because you need them to get Phione and Regigigas, respectively. I'm not completely happy with the order - I could have distributed the Platinum Pokemon a bit more evenly - but all the Gen 4 Pokemon are there. I kept the order the same up until Spiritomb so that it would still be #108, a number that's significant to that Pokemon.

One idea I had is that only the first 210 Pokemon, up to Palkia, are required to complete the Pokedex, as that would mean the rest of the legendaries could still be saved for the postgame. I would absolutely love to be able to catch more Mythical Pokemon without downloadable events - that's one of my favourite things about ORAS and also the Virtual Console version of Crystal.

Unless there's a National Pokedex in the remake, I think there will have to be at least some changes made to the Sinnoh Pokedex. I'm looking forward to seeing how they decide to handle it.
 
Last edited:
Active Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
663
Reaction score
224
Well, I would have wanted the order to remain the same as Platinum with a whole bunch of additional Pokémon still coming after Manaphy and all the newly added Pokémon coming after Giratina. But newly added evolutions like Sylveon makes things complicated. Should I try to fit them in with their evolution families and disrupt the numbering, put them after Giratina or just omit them from the Pokédex and only let them evolve after the National Dex? Well, there are only two Pokémon: Sylveon and Mr. Ryme. Mr. Ryme evolves from a Galarian Mr. Mime, so maybe it shouldn't have to be in the Sinnoh Dex? And Eevee's evolution into Sylveon has changed from Affectionate ratings to friendship, so maybe it can change again to require the National Dex or just remove Baby-Doll Eyes and Charm from Eevee's moveset and put move tutors in the post-game area? But I'm also thinking of padding the Pokédex to 250 with Pokémon that help balance the types out. There's not enough Fire-types and Darmanitan is one of those Pokémon I would add to the Sinnoh Dex, so if I'm going to put post-Sinnoh Pokémon in anyway, should Sylveon and Mr. Ryme be in too?
 
Top