Preview SM120: Suiren Fishes a Kyogre!?

[UxieLover1994]

We've had Brandon use the Regis during AG and DP, a Nurse Joy use a Latias in an episode that will never be dubbed, an unnamed trainer use a Heatran, and Tobias use a Latios. Unless the Legendary is outright stated to be one-of-a-kind or a major key to stability, there's no harm in catching it. And it's the anime, guys. The same anime that showed multiple Lugia on the same screen at the same time, and implied even the Beast trio are not unique.

The chances of Lana catching Kyogre is bordering on nil, especially if her Brionne evolves (at last), but given we've got the Tapus and three Mythical Pokémon as recurring characters, we could see Kyogre be a recurring Pokémon for the rest of the SM series as well. But that's a bit of a stretch.

 

[L-05308]

Brionne’s evolution seems like a complete afterthought, the preview revealed it like it didn’t matter.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

Why is Lana riding a Primarina in the preview? Could it be that Lana's Brionne evolved into it?

What else could it be?

 

[Pulsaro23]

Not any like Kyogre and Groudon or Dialga and Palkia. We have never seen a trainer who has caught a legendary like them. We have only seen trainers with legendaries that ruled over lesser domains like nightmares and have been confirmed in anime to have multiple of the species existing at the same time.

First of all, Darkrai is a Mythical, not a Legendary. Big difference there, since with Mythicals, it is generally established that there are multiple of one species. Second of all, we have seen a trainer with a Heatran, who's basically a smaller-scale Groudon (since instead of being the master of the land, it's just the ruler of volcanos). And we also see Ben capture a Heatran in episode DP169. Now, I don't know about you, but to me, catching the beings who create and control volcanos would be far more damaging to the ecosystem of the planet (since who knows what kind of damage an out of control volcano could do). Yet, that is never brought up and them being caught doesn't seem to affect the ecosystem in anyway (not to mention that, if it did, the Pokémon Rangers wouldn't send someone to catch it), so you can rule the ecosystem argument out.

Plus, the Creation trio being one of a kind kinda make sense from an in-univers point of view, since having multiple Pokémon that are the gods of time and space would be a recipe for chaos. But with Kyogre and Groudon, there are multiple land masses and oceans in the world, so there could theoretically be multiple of them. And besides, there's nothing in the anime that suggests that Groudon and Kyogre are one of a kind. In fact, the Jirachi movie (with the Groudon fossil) and the terrible Hoopa movie (where two Gorudon and two Kyogre appear) prove the contrary.

 

[DarkraiKnight]

First of all, Darkrai is a Mythical, not a Legendary. Big difference there, since with Mythicals, it is generally established that there are multiple of one species. Second of all, we have seen a trainer with a Heatran, who's basically a smaller-scale Groudon (since instead of being the master of the land, it's just the ruler of volcanos). And we also see Ben capture a Heatran in episode DP169. Now, I don't know about you, but to me, catching the beings who create and control volcanos would be far more damaging to the ecosystem of the planet (since who knows what kind of damage an out of control volcano could do). Yet, that is never brought up and them being caught doesn't seem to affect the ecosystem in anyway (not to mention that, if it did, the Pokémon Rangers wouldn't send someone to catch it), so you can rule the ecosystem argument out.

Plus, the Creation trio being one of a kind kinda make sense from an in-univers point of view, since having multiple Pokémon that are the gods of time and space would be a recipe for chaos. But with Kyogre and Groudon, there are multiple land masses and oceans in the world, so there could theoretically be multiple of them. And besides, there's nothing in the anime that suggests that Groudon and Kyogre are one of a kind. In fact, the Jirachi movie (with the Groudon fossil) and the terrible Hoopa movie (where two Gorudon and two Kyogre appear) prove the contrary.

Actually, it's never been stated that Heatran create or control volcanoes. Heatran has never been given a designated "role" within the Pokemon universe; it always just seems to be there. (My personal theory is that Arceus created the Heatran species from the leftovers of the Earth's core.)

Secondly, the Weather trio could be one of a kind. The "Groudon fossil" in the Jirachi movie wasn't an entire skeleton; it was only a scale, meaning it could have fallen off of Groudon at some point in the distant past and was fossilized. Not only that, but Hoopa's rings can pull stuff from across time and space, so it's quite likely that the Weather trio it summoned (and the other Legendaries as well) were actually from parallel universes.

 

[Him1612]

Too bad Ash's torracat didn't not evolve yet...

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

(My personal theory is that Arceus created the Heatran species from the leftovers of the Earth's core.)

Heatran's Pokédex entries imply that it just kinda formed on its own from magma inside a volcano.

 

[Pulsaro23]

Actually, it's never been stated that Heatran create or control volcanoes. Heatran has never been given a designated "role" within the Pokemon universe; it always just seems to be there. (My personal theory is that Arceus created the Heatran species from the leftovers of the Earth's core.)

Well, Bulbapedia's description ("Without the power of the Magma Stone, Heatran would rampage and cause the volcanic crater where it dwells to erupt.") implies that they have some control over volcanos. And the fact that they generally live in active volcanos always made me think that they created the volcanos they live in.

Secondly, the Weather trio could be one of a kind. The "Groudon fossil" in the Jirachi movie wasn't an entire skeleton; it was only a scale, meaning it could have fallen off of Groudon at some point in the distant past and was fossilized.

That could be true. However, there's nothing official that proves your point, so you can't say that that's really the case. Granted, there's also nothing that suggests otherwise, so means that I'm the one who's wrong and there's only one Goudon in existence and Team Magma just wanted to clone it using one of it long lost scales. Still, unless they release more information about that detail (which obviously they won't, since lore and explanation of certain details don't seem to be as much of a priority to the anime as they are to other franchises (like Star Wars, for example)), we can't say for certain that either of us is right, so let's just agree to leave it at "it could go either way".

Not only that, but Hoopa's rings can pull stuff from across time and space, so it's quite likely that the Weather trio it summoned (and the other Legendaries as well) were actually from parallel universes.

I haven't watched the Hoopa movie (and I never intend to), so I could be wrong on this one, but was it ever stated in it that Hoopa has the power to drag Pokémon from parallel universes into the main one? Because if it isn't stated and if there's nothing that imply that, than your statement is just baseless speculation. And it being able to teleport Dialga, Palkia and Giratina to Dahara isn't exactly proof, since they live in other dimensions, not other universes, and alternate dimension and parallel universes are two different things.

Also, here's a question for everybody: Is there something wrong with having multiple Legendaries of the same species? 'Cause I really don't get why some people are against the idea of this.

 

[KrspaceT]

Well, Bulbapedia's description ("Without the power of the Magma Stone, Heatran would rampage and cause the volcanic crater where it dwells to erupt.") implies that they have some control over volcanos. And the fact that they generally live in active volcanos always made me think that they created the volcanos they live in.


That could be true. However, there's nothing official that proves your point, so you can't say that that's really the case. Granted, there's also nothing that suggests otherwise, so means that I'm the one who's wrong and there's only one Goudon in existence and Team Magma just wanted to clone it using one of it long lost scales. Still, unless they release more information about that detail (which obviously they won't, since lore and explanation of certain details don't seem to be as much of a priority to the anime as they are to other franchises (like Star Wars, for example)), we can't say for certain that either of us is right, so let's just agree to leave it at "it could go either way".


I haven't watched the Hoopa movie (and I never intend to), so I could be wrong on this one, but was it ever stated in it that Hoopa has the power to drag Pokémon from parallel universes into the main one? Because if it isn't stated and if there's nothing that imply that, than your statement is just baseless speculation. And it being able to teleport Dialga, Palkia and Giratina to Dahara isn't exactly proof, since they live in other dimensions, not other universes, and alternate dimension and parallel universes are two different things.

Also, here's a question for everybody: Is there something wrong with having multiple Legendaries of the same species? 'Cause I really don't get why some people are against the idea of this.

Some people see them all as one of a kind beings, when really only some of them are really warranted to that status. They look at Arceus and think the same applies to X.

 

[KenzeyEevee]

Lana is the favorite of the writers it seems

 

[Silktree]

I very much doubt that this Kyogre is the one from AG, the Mega Evolution special or any of the movies. It's also clear that the mute Arceus from Movie 18 is not the one portrayed by a drag queen in Movie 12.

 

[DarkraiKnight]

Well, Bulbapedia's description ("Without the power of the Magma Stone, Heatran would rampage and cause the volcanic crater where it dwells to erupt.") implies that they have some control over volcanos. And the fact that they generally live in active volcanos always made me think that they created the volcanos they live in.

Really? Huh; I never realized that.

I haven't watched the Hoopa movie (and I never intend to), so I could be wrong on this one, but was it ever stated in it that Hoopa has the power to drag Pokémon from parallel universes into the main one? Because if it isn't stated and if there's nothing that imply that, than your statement is just baseless speculation. And it being able to teleport Dialga, Palkia and Giratina to Dahara isn't exactly proof, since they live in other dimensions, not other universes, and alternate dimension and parallel universes are two different things.

I thought that was pretty much confirmed. If I remember correctly, Hoopa’s rings can pull stuff from across time and space.

Also, here's a question for everybody: Is there something wrong with having multiple Legendaries of the same species? 'Cause I really don't get why some people are against the idea of this.

I can't speak for anyone, but I'm personally only against the idea of major Legendary Pokemon - such as the Weather trio, Creation trio, etc. Legendaries like the Birds and Beasts I can accept there being more than one of.

I very much doubt that this Kyogre is the one from AG, the Mega Evolution special or any of the movies. It's also clear that the mute Arceus from Movie 18 is not the one portrayed by a drag queen in Movie 12.

How would there be more than one Arceus?

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

I can't speak for anyone, but I'm personally only against the idea of major Legendary Pokemon - such as the Weather trio, Creation trio

I've been thinking the same way myself too.

 

[BigDocFan]

I've been thinking the same way myself too.

A feeling that I also share, Kyogre would be worse than Tobias's Darkrai and defeat every single opponent

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

Everyone who thinks Lana is catching this thing have obviously either missed or forgotten this:

Suiren uses a fishing rod rather than a monsterball to challenge this giant!

 

[Pulsaro23]

I thought that was pretty much confirmed. If I remember correctly, Hoopa’s rings can pull stuff from across time and space.

Pulling beings in from "across time and space" could mean that he can bring in beings from anywhere in the universe (including other dimensions) and from any time period. It doesn't necessarily mean that Hoopa can break into other universes and snatch Pokémon from there.

I can't speak for anyone, but I'm personally only against the idea of major Legendary Pokemon - such as the Weather trio, Creation trio, etc. Legendaries like the Birds and Beasts I can accept there being more than one of.

I partially agree that there shouldn't be multiples of certain Legendary trios (like the Palkia, Dialga, Giratina, whose power being could break the very fabric of the universe), but I don't think it should be applied to all "game mascot" trios. Again, as I've said, there are multiple land masses and oceans in the Pokémon world, so, for each of those, there could theoretically be multiple Groudon and Kyogre.

Plus, there is a precedent (or would it be more accurate to call it a succedent?) for this, since other important trios have either one of their members (in the case of Zygarde of the... Aura trio? (weird, considering the themes of2 of the members of the trio, I was expecting something like the "Life trio")) or all of their members (in the case of the Light trio) are actually just one of the many specimens of their species in the anime. So, theoretically, this could also be the case for the Weather trio.

 

[Silktree]

How would there be more than one Arceus?

There just is. The first one supposedly popped out of an egg, you know.

 

[Pulsaro23]

There just is. The first one supposedly popped out of an egg, you know.

But isn't Arceus supposed to be the god of the Pokémon world? You know, the creator of everything? Then, wouldn't it be weird (to say the least) to have more than one of them in the universe?

 

[RileyXY1]

Why is Lana riding a Primarina in the preview? Could it be that Lana's Brionne evolved into it?

It's already been confirmed that Lana is indeed evolving Brionne. She is also the second companion to ever own a fully evolved starter Pokemon, after May.

 

[Silktree]

@Pulsaro23 If it created multiple versions of Dialga, Palkia and Giratina, then it can also create a counterpart of itself. Or whatever mechanism created the Arceus egg can do it again.

Not to mention that you're referring to a myth that wasn't even reinforced by the anime. It was depicted as protecting the Pokemon world, much like Rayquaza. There is no doubt in mind that Movie 18 Arceus is a different individual; let's stop pretending that the anime staff even care that much.