• Hello all! The forum staff have introduced a new rule set. We've reduced the number of rules, made trick language easier to understand, and have hopefully simplified the rules to make understanding them easier. Please have a read over the new forum rules here.
  • Hey guys! Have you heard? We now have popup
    Yes, Popups!
    messages for your forum posts. Learn more about it here!
  • Hey everyone, if you hadn't heard, information about Sword and Shield has been leaking. Outside of the designated threads in our Current Events section, please keep all unrevealed Pokemon, names, or any other information in spoiler tags. This policy will be in effect until January 3rd. This is an exciting time for Pokémon fans, enjoy yourselves!
  • Recently, some of our fellow Pokémon fan sites have received legal requests to take down leaked Sword and Shield images. We have not received one of these requests yet, but we are taking some preemptive measures to stay on the safe side. We ask that from now until the games release (November 15th) that you do not post any new leaked images anywhere on the forums.

    For more information, see this thread

Space World 1997 demo for Pokemon Gold leaked

Here to ride the rumor train.
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
5,474
Reaction score
19,347
You're forgetting about version mascots. What did the titles mean initially? Ho-Oh was used for the title screen in Gold, and I believe even Silver. That's odd.
Aaaaah you do have a point... perhaps Lugia was always intended but its design took longer to be finalized? That could have influenced its diminished role in the plot, too.
 
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
5,812
Reaction score
7,969
Maybe it was because shiny Ho-oh is gold and silver? I guess we will only know if the Silver demo gets leaked.
 
Here to ride the rumor train.
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
5,474
Reaction score
19,347
Maybe it was because shiny Ho-oh is gold and silver? I guess we will only know if the Silver demo gets leaked.
I doubt it's due to shinies, since I'm pretty sure the project started before Gameboy Color. Plus they have ROMs for both the Silver and Gold demos.
 
Borderland Sword
Joined
Mar 19, 2013
Messages
3,441
Reaction score
1,481
The original Cyndaquil was so much cuter, and this coming from someone who loves TF out of Cyndaquil
 
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
5,812
Reaction score
7,969
I didn't know Silver was leaked too! The border looks... colorful. Is it me or the wild Pokémon battle theme is the one the final games use with the gym leaders.
 
Last edited:
Bulbapædist
Joined
Jan 31, 2004
Messages
7,789
Reaction score
713
Aaaaah you do have a point... perhaps Lugia was always intended but its design took longer to be finalized? That could have influenced its diminished role in the plot, too.
I don't know how true this is, but people are saying that Lugia was designed either exclusively by or in collaboration with the anime staff for the second movie.

The same might also be true of Togepi which is why his butt is hanging out among the Legendaries.
 
Stuck
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
17,982
Reaction score
11,274
I had assumed that Lugia was re-designed to be aquatic for the movie. But it didn't exist as of the demo, which was only 4 months ahead of the planned release date.

Proto Sneasel and Leafeon are also among the legendaries. That may not mean anything.

Here's a neat translation I found on /vp/ of an early game event:

>Silver: Hey, I gotta tell you something. You see, Professor Oak, you know, the famous one, just sent me an e-mail!
>Huh? You got one too? Peh! I can't believe it!
>...Hmph! Alright, alright... You see...
>What do you call your mom?
[pick ママ/Mama]
>Silver: Whaaaa? That's uncool! Calling her something that childish is hilarious!
>Ahah... Anyway, I'm heading off to Oak's!
I enter Silver's house, and his mom is there.
>I saw a Pidgey with strange colors a while ago.
I leave and enter Oak's Lab.
>Silver: Oh, hey, Ethan! I thought it was weird coming here to begin with. Looks like nobody's here...

Leaving Silent Hills:
>Waidasec! Stop! St-op, I said!
Blue shows up.
>Blue: You don't know a damn thing! Wild Pokemon attack in the grass! You can fight if you had a Pokemon of your own... Hold on... You... Come with me!
We go back to Oak's Lab.
>Blue: Gramps! I brought him here!
>Oak: Thank you, Blue!
>Silver: Professor Oak's this grandpa...? Ack, sorry! I mean, this old man? It's the first time I've ever seen him!
>Oak: Correct! I am Professor Oak! And don't call me grandpa! I was the one who called you two here! Would you hear my speech?
[YES]
>Oak: One year ago, in Kanto, I gave two children, just like you two, a Pokedex to help with my research. They've done a wonderful job! They found 150 kinds of Pokemon, and succeeded!*
>but...
>sadly...
>the world is vast, and among other places, new Pokemon have been spotted like wildfires! As such, I moved from Kanto to Silent Hill to study in different areas, so that I may find new Pokemon. ...
>To further my research, my son, and assistants have helped out. But it's still not enough! Ethan! Silver! Lend me your strength, so we can further our Pokemon Research!
>Silver: This is starting to sound fun, Ethan!
>Oak: Follow me, you two!
The three of us walk to the inner part of the lab
>Oak: Over on the desk are three Pokemon. Ho ho! I will give you one of these fellows! Now choose!
>Silver: Hey! Me too! Old man, please give me one too!
>Oak: So restless, Silver! You can also choose whoever you want!
[Pick Happa]
>Oak: Oh! So you want the grass Pokemon, Happa?
[YES]
>Oak: This Pokemon is very energetic!
>Silver: Then I'll use this!
Silver gets Honoguma.
>Blue: Back then, I was also a Pokemon Trainer. You kind of remind me of the kid who taught me to stop being so egotistical. Thanks to him, I've learned to love Pokemon and help gramps with his research. ...Anyway, here's the Pokedex!
Notice how mellow Silver and Blue are here. The latter was still condescending in GS, despite his character development.

I assume that Oak mentioning his son is an error. Blue is the one helping him.

(Ethan/Hibiki is probably not a default name.)
 
Last edited:
Tail Slap
Joined
Jun 10, 2012
Messages
400
Reaction score
269
I had assumed that Lugia was re-designed to be aquatic for the movie. But it didn't exist as of the demo, which was only 4 months ahead of the planned release date.
The fact that Ho-Oh was used for both the Gold and Silver demo intros tells me there was some information either scrubbed or yet to be added. I don't know what out of the original 100 could've substituted Lugia and if so, why it wasn't in the Silver intro.
 
Post By The Mad Man
Joined
Jun 28, 2013
Messages
820
Reaction score
173
I have been looking at the Google Docs file, and it is very interesting, such as Snubbulll was to be female only and no evolution, and obviously Pinsir's evolution is interesting and it is one evolution we deserved. I even read that Ditto was to get an evolution as well. There were even type-changes, as Umbreon was originally going to be a Poison-type and not a Dark-type. Hopefully we'll get a Poison-type Eeveelution in Generation VIII.
 
Formerly GTT
Joined
Jul 5, 2009
Messages
2,994
Reaction score
694
The fact that Ho-Oh was used for both the Gold and Silver demo intros tells me there was some information either scrubbed or yet to be added. I don't know what out of the original 100 could've substituted Lugia and if so, why it wasn't in the Silver intro.
Maybe Ho-Oh was originally meant to be more of a Mewtwo figure to be shared with both versions and the version mascots were originally intended to be other Pokemon? Perhaps Meganium and Tyhplosion (to mirror Green and Red) or Typhlosion and Feraligatr (to mirror Red and Blue?)
 
Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
1,657
Reaction score
1,652
Its funny how some of those sprites have been inspiration for later mons by the looks of it.

Qwilfish evolution: Stunfisk (Look at the tail). Water starter base stage - Popplio, while the last stage is Samurott. The Anchorshark can be 2 mons, Sharpedo and Dhelmise, while the mon after the Anchorshark was a likely inspiration for the Wailmer line, look at his belly. Then the Weepinbell evolution can be overhauled into Carnivine. And there are others as well: The Black cats into Purrloin line, while Farfetch'd evolution could have been inspiration for the Ducklett line, while that Voodoo doll could be inspiration for Cacnea line, since its a Cacturne body structure look somewhat similair. Same can be said about the tiger being inspiration for the Litten line, but also for Dedenne, based on the stripes. Then the furry wolf thing could have been inspiration for Snover and Abomasnow.
 
Here to ride the rumor train.
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
5,474
Reaction score
19,347
Maybe Ho-Oh was originally meant to be more of a Mewtwo figure to be shared with both versions and the version mascots were originally intended to be other Pokemon? Perhaps Meganium and Tyhplosion (to mirror Green and Red) or Typhlosion and Feraligatr (to mirror Red and Blue?)
Probably not Typhlosion and Feraligatr, since they replaced Honoguma and Kurusu's lines- in fact, maybe Honoguma and Kurusu's final evos were meant to be Gold and Silver. Dynabear does appear as if it may have possibly been a gold color and Aquaria might have been a silvery blue. Though who knows, with old sprite art being what it is.

Hard to say what the logic was without Game Freak coming out and telling us- what I wouldn't give for an interview on Gen 2's development with this leak out now. It is weird to have Ho-oh as the title character for both versions, given that Red, Blue, Green and Yellow featured at least the first stages of their box mascots before shuffling them out to other random pokemon beside the trainer.

ALTHOUGH! Lugia was commissioned for the 2nd movie, which didn't release until 1999. Since this was a 1997 demo and the movie was possibly in production, the Lugia title screen may not have been made yet for the movie's sake, keeping Lugia as a surprise for its eventual release. As for Lugia's minimal involvement in the plot, let's say that the original plans were to focus on Ho-oh, so they formed the story around Ho-oh (similarly to how Ho-oh apparently was created as a plot device for the anime) and Lugia's commission didn't come until later in the game's production process. Instead of reworking the story to fully incorporate its late addition, they gave it a minor role and kept the story more focused on Ho-oh.

As for Lugia's lack of presence in the demo... best guess I have is that its design wasn't finalized yet or they hadn't made the sprites for it, or they didn't include it in case it should show up by accident while playing the demo. Though recent years seems to prove that they haven't learned to not include secret info in the demos now, so it's hard to believe that they might have thought of it then.

It's possible that Lugia just simply did not exist at this stage and Ho-oh was expected to pull double duty as the box mascot for both versions- if we knew how long the second movie was in production and when Lugia was made, we might have more of an answer.

It is a curious question. I hope someone thinks to ask Game Freak about it. Though they're probably not too happy that this is turning out to be bigger news and more interesting to people than LGPE. XD
 
Last edited:
Stuck
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
17,982
Reaction score
11,274
There is no way the Lugia movie started production in 1997.

Here's an interview from before the demo. The most notable detail is:

Tajiri said:
We’re currently fine-tuning all the Pokémon we made. We designed more than 200 Pokémon for the first games, then whittled them down to 150. This game will exceed 200 Pokémon, but we already have over 350, which leaves me wondering which ones I should keep.
 
Last edited:
New Member
Joined
May 31, 2018
Messages
3
Reaction score
3
I'm sorry, but I don't buy it. I played the demo, those are the real colors, at least according to Visual Boy Advance.

EDIT: Sorry, if I sounded rude. I must calm down, after that demo got out I have been feeling kinda hyperactive.

EDIT 2: Here's a pic:
At the time of my response, the only sprite sheets on reddit were fannade. Accurately done, but still done manually as opposed to ripping them. Not sure if thats changed, but I’ve seen some accurate ones online so its fair to assume theres ripped ones now.

I get acting rude out of excitement; its very exciting for me too. I made a new account on here specifically to discuss it (I was very active here when hgss first came out but due to drama I left the site). My biggest passion is beta content and cheats like that, so this is like a gold mine to me.

TLDR no offense taken :)
 
Here to ride the rumor train.
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
5,474
Reaction score
19,347
There is no way the Lugia movie started production in 1997.
Are you sure? It released in 1999... production time for animated movies varies widely, depending on the quality and size of the team working on it.
 
Stuck
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
17,982
Reaction score
11,274
They're annual movies produced by the same staff. More to the point:

Dogasu said:
The bigwigs involved with Mewtwo Strikes Back were overjoyed with how successful it was but they still didn't like how dark and grim it was. The goal of the second movie was to make it a much more light-hearted adventure film.

The producers of the movie had trouble deciding which pokemon would be the main stars. Mew and Mewtwo had already been used in the first movie and Ho-Oh had been rumored to appear in some temple somewhere in the Gold & Silver games so the only legendary pokemon left for them to use were the legendary bird trio Fire, Freezer, and Thunder. Screenplay writer Shudou Takeshi asked the game designers if he could create a new pokemon to act as a fourth legendary who represents the deep sea currents and, much to his surprise, they said yes. Shudou Takeshi doesn't actually state on his blog that he was the one who designed or even named the pokemon but it seems like the overall idea of "legendary pokemon who represents the sea" did come from him.
For Pocket Monsters 2, I don't think it made sense to promote just one version mascot, but maybe they were waiting until the last minute to come up with a good design. As it happens, they bought themselves a lot more time to work on the games (almost starting from scratch) and Shudo gave them the idea they needed.

Make sure not to miss the interview link in my previous post.
 
Last edited:
Well-Known Member
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
5,812
Reaction score
7,969
Probably not Typhlosion and Feraligatr, since they replaced Honoguma and Kurusu's lines- in fact, maybe Honoguma and Kurusu's final evos were meant to be Gold and Silver. Dynabear does appear as if it may have possibly been a gold color and Aquaria might have been a silvery blue. Though who knows, with old sprite art being what it is.

Hard to say what the logic was without Game Freak coming out and telling us- what I wouldn't give for an interview on Gen 2's development with this leak out now. It is weird to have Ho-oh as the title character for both versions, given that Red, Blue, Green and Yellow featured at least the first stages of their box mascots before shuffling them out to other random pokemon beside the trainer.

ALTHOUGH! Lugia was commissioned for the 2nd movie, which didn't release until 1999. Since this was a 1997 demo and the movie was possibly in production, the Lugia title screen may not have been made yet for the movie's sake, keeping Lugia as a surprise for its eventual release. As for Lugia's minimal involvement in the plot, let's say that the original plans were to focus on Ho-oh, so they formed the story around Ho-oh (similarly to how Ho-oh apparently was created as a plot device for the anime) and Lugia's commission didn't come until later in the game's production process. Instead of reworking the story to fully incorporate its late addition, they gave it a minor role and kept the story more focused on Ho-oh.

As for Lugia's lack of presence in the demo... best guess I have is that its design wasn't finalized yet or they hadn't made the sprites for it, or they didn't include it in case it should show up by accident while playing the demo. Though recent years seems to prove that they haven't learned to not include secret info in the demos now, so it's hard to believe that they might have thought of it then.

It's possible that Lugia just simply did not exist at this stage and Ho-oh was expected to pull double duty as the box mascot for both versions- if we knew how long the second movie was in production and when Lugia was made, we might have more of an answer.

It is a curious question. I hope someone thinks to ask Game Freak about it. Though they're probably not too happy that this is turning out to be bigger news and more interesting to people than LGPE. XD
So, do you think this mean that if we got the games as they were originally planned, Lugia would be either the first anime-only Pokémon, or at least the first Gen III Pokémon?
I had assumed that Lugia was re-designed to be aquatic for the movie. But it didn't exist as of the demo, which was only 4 months ahead of the planned release date.

Proto Sneasel and Leafeon are also among the legendaries. That may not mean anything.

Here's a neat translation I found on /vp/ of an early game event:


Notice how mellow Silver and Blue are here. The latter was still condescending in GS, despite his character development.

I assume that Oak mentioning his son is an error. Blue is the one helping him.

(Ethan/Hibiki is probably not a default name.)
Were did you find about this event?
 
Stuck
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
17,982
Reaction score
11,274
As I said, it was on /vp/. People have access to the game and the early part is playable. I trust that GlitterBerri will translate the interesting text (possibly beyond Silent Hills) eventually.
 
Top