[SPOILERS] How would you modify/create the new starters movesets if You could?

[Matleo]

And why the fuck would it become Fire/Fairy? It's a heel wrestler. There's nothing 'fairy' about him

totally change of motive like it was done with Charizard and others, from wrestler into for 4 legged fast tiger that could battle dragons? its only a idea. I also like the wrestler motive if it would get Circle Throw.

 

[Envoy]

totally change of motive like it was done with Charizard and others, from wrestler into for 4 legged fast tiger that could battle dragons? its only a idea. I also like the wrestler motive if it would get Circle Throw.

Charizard's motif was never changed. It was always a Dragon. X forme just acknowledged that. And I still don't see where the Fairy type would come in even if Inci lost its wrestler motif and became four-legged.

I get that you like Inci, but really, why do you keep trying to turn it into something it's not?

 

[Matleo]

I get that you like Inci, but really, why do you keep trying to turn it into something it's not?

Shijin (Shishin) - Four legendary Chinese creatures protecting the four compass directions
Shijin (Shishin) - Four legendary Chinese creatures protecting the four compass directions
Dawon - Wikipedia
White Tiger (China) - Wikipedia

I't could posibily become ghost, but with fairy would change it immunity and allow it to take 0,5x from fighting damage.(for a mega this would be pretty cool or not? I only want it to be more seperate in future from Houndoom and to be a good rival to Charizard and others)
Why do you fear type changes? If it could learn Burn UP???

 

[Envoy]

Shijin (Shishin) - Four legendary Chinese creatures protecting the four compass directions
Shijin (Shishin) - Four legendary Chinese creatures protecting the four compass directions
Dawon - Wikipedia
White Tiger (China) - Wikipedia

I't could posibily become ghost, but with fairy would change it immunity and allow it to take 0,5x from fighting damage.(for a mega this would be pretty cool or not? I only want it to be more seperate in future from Houndoom and to be a good rival to Charizard and others)
Why do you fear type changes? If it could learn Burn UP???

It's not about the type changes. It just doesn't make any fucking sense for this particular Pokemon. Again, it's based on a Heel wrestler, not a mythical beast. And since we've established that Charizard didn't actually change motifs, then I see no reason why Inci should. Also, it's a little funny that both the types you suggested (Fairy and Ghost) just happen to be the secondary types of its fellow Alola Starters.

Also, it's distinct enough from Houndoom already. Inci is a primarily physical attacker while Houndoom excels in special attacks. Houndy can dabble in mixed attacking, but it will never be a physical threat like Inci is. The two are already distinct enough. I also don't really see why Inci has to be a good rival to Charizard and others. On the contrary, it should be trying to set itself apart from them.

 

[Matleo]

good rival to Charizard

maybe you have in some point right?
but apart don't states that it should not have a chance to beat them or weaken them badly?

Fake Out +Dragon Claw/Dragon Tail/Ice Fang/Play Rough

can also be good if it would learn them...

 

[Arceus the Dragon]

Keep Incineroar Fire/Dark. It is better with that type.

 

[Guzma]

Decidueye swapping it's Att with the Speed stats.

All Grass/Ghost are physical attacker. I wanted a change. Didn't happened sadly. But the major reason behind this was the shitty speed of 70 base of it now.

Most of Deci's moves, including Spirit Shackle (a base 80 BP move with an awesome effect) are physical, so this would be a terrible idea. If anything, Deci should have his HP and defenses lowered and his speed raised.

 

[Envoy]

Deci can swap its special attack with its speed since its special movepool is ass anyway (Energy and Shadow Balls are the only things worth writing home about.)

I actually really like its movepool even if Nasty Plot is a waste. If you look at Deci as a support or utility mon instead of an offensive one, then things start looking a lot better for it. Spirit Shackle for trapping, access to Defog, Baton Pass, Swords Dance/Nasty Plot, immune to sleep (powder moves are the only sleep moves worth talking about,) access to Sucker Punch, reliable recovery in Roost and Synthesis...

Still, I'd like for it to gain access to Will-o-Wisp and Leech Seed. That special defense is workable with all these support moves.

Otoh, switch out its Sp. def and speed stats and give it access to good special moves like Giga Drain, Heat Wave, and Focus Blast and you got yourself a pretty solid physical, special, and mixed attacker there. Get some use out of Nasty Plot too.

 

[Guzma]

Decidueye adds: Air Cutter (if Deci sacrificed bulk for speed and kept spec. attack, this'd be good), Drill Peck (if Piplup can learn it with its tiny beak, so can Deci), Leaf Storm (t wouldn't be that good on it, but still), Bullet Seed (it's a ranged attack for a Grass-type, it's perfect even if it'd be useless), Magical Leaf (it's whole thing is that it's an archer, it should have another always accurate move), Shadow Sneak (Deci needs priority, dammit), Ominous Wind (terrible move, but still), Phantom Force (because this is the BEST Fly variant), Night Slash (if he can learn Sucker Punch...), Thief (he's an archer, it'd work great with the theme)

Incineroar adds: Night Slash (because why the hell not), Assurance (again, Dark), Beat Up (if friggin' Charmander can learn it...), Hone Claws (it's not like it needs to boost its attack, but still), Parting Shot (would be decent on it and fits), Sucker Punch (because how the hell doesn't it get this), Knock Off (it'll probably get it from the move tutor in the next games), Counter (because it's slow and could get some good use out of it), Circle Throw (it's a frigging wrestler), Drain Punch (because it's a good move and it'll hopefully get it from a move tutor), Low Kick (it fits its "fighting dirty" theme), Low Sweep (again, it's sort of dirty), Mach Punch (it needs priority, dammit), Superpower (it's probably getting this from the move tutor in the future), Rock Slide (it learns Earthquake, so why the hell not), Rock Tomb (same deal), Blaze Kick (because duh), Inferno (it'd be shitty on it, but still)

Primarina adds: Draining Kiss (hopefully it's been buffed), Moonlight (since it sings in the moonlight), Fairy Wind (again, Fairy), Bubble (how the HELL doesn't the Popplio line have this?!), Water Pulse (solely to be annoying), Psyshock (Sylveon learns it), Ice Fang (it'd be useless on her, but it does have fangs), Aurora Beam (it just fits its design)

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

Low Sweep (again, it's sort of dirty)

Incineroar already gets low sweep via TM

 

[Guzma]

Incineroar already gets low sweep via TM

I must have missed that while looking at the Smogon thread for Tiger Mask. Its movepool, typing and bulk are all pretty good, TBH. I still think Prima's gonna be the champ of the starters this gen, but Inci might give it competition and Deci seems like a decent utility Pokemon.

 

[Matleo]

a Tiger , a Heel wrestler that dont learns Flying Press and Bounce?
I know there is Fake Out but ... you know.
Its slower then all fire/fighting and Delphox learns Dazzlin Glam for sakes.


Decidueyes speed is based on its stats(good defences), movesets(Brave Bird(next to Blaziken) and flying type moves), immunities(normal,fighting) and resistance (resists bug and poison), it is slower then Venusaur and has exact speed like Blaziken.
If it gets Detect , Shadow Sneak , Tailwind and Phantom Force that would be nice.
Thousand Arrows, its a Archer for sake, would make perfect sense and it would be lame to waste this kind of chance. I know Zygarde, but it got 3 signature moves now, from them 2 that could be given to some other pokemon. Thousand Waves could be given to Torterra?(it learns Smack Down???)
This would be a nice way to make it a little good against flying types in a good way.

Fly maybe to powerfull but Bounce ?(90 and 85, are these moves to similar and too strong? maybe?


Where is Extreem Speed on a starter? (Invineroar???)

Primarina? maybe a little too big special attack? would have switched that with special defence but , maybe they have a bigger picture in future(generation) for her and new pokemon. But nice that we got a 126 stats, maybe in future we will get a poke with similar sp.defence on a fire type starter?
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I have a feeling that in future we will get a grass/ghost special oriented legendary???

 

[Alola]

Decidueye adds: Ominous Wind (terrible move, but still),

The Rowlet line gets that already as an egg move.

But I agree that Decidueye should have had Shadow Sneak and Phantom Force, as well as Bubble for Popplio.

 

[Envoy]

a Tiger , a Heel wrestler that dont learns Flying Press and Bounce?
I know there is Fake Out but ... you know.
Its slower then all fire/fighting and Delphox learns Dazzlin Glam for sakes.


Decidueyes speed is based on its stats(good defences), movesets(Brave Bird(next to Blaziken) and flying type moves), immunities(normal,fighting) and resistance (resists bug and poison), it is slower then Venusaur and has exact speed like Blaziken.
If it gets Detect , Shadow Sneak , Tailwind and Phantom Force that would be nice.
Thousand Arrows, its a Archer for sake, would make perfect sense and it would be lame to waste this kind of chance. I know Zygarde, but it got 3 signature moves now, from them 2 that could be given to some other pokemon. Thousand Waves could be given to Torterra?(it learns Smack Down???)
This would be a nice way to make it a little good against flying types in a good way.

Fly maybe to powerfull but Bounce ?(90 and 85, are these moves to similar and too strong? maybe?


Where is Extreem Speed on a starter? (Invineroar???)

Primarina? maybe a little too big special attack? would have switched that with special defence but , maybe they have a bigger picture in future(generation) for her and new pokemon. But nice that we got a 126 stats, maybe in future we will get a poke with similar sp.defence on a fire type starter?
________________________________________________________________________________
I have a feeling that in future we will get a grass/ghost special oriented legendary???

Decidueye's base Speed is 70. Blaziken's is 80.

Delphox's Dazzling Gleam doesn't matter because Fire resists Fairy, which means Incineroar is neutral to Fairy.

Why would Incineroar learn Extreme Speed? What about this Pokemon looks capable of moving at extreme speeds? If any Pokemon deserves priority moves, it's Decidueye, hands down the sleekest of the three. Quick Attack, Shadow Sneak, and Extreme Speed all make some level of sense for Deci.

The only priority I see Inci getting is Sucker Punch if he doesn't have it already.

Prima with Ice Shard would be a waste, what with her shit Attack stat and all, but it wouldn't not make sense for her.

 

[Matleo]

Decidueye's base Speed is 70. Blaziken's is 80.

sorry, then we have a real problem between those two.
Would it survive any of Blazikens attacks? instant Brave Bird out take?

ok. right fire/dark, forgot fire resists fairy.

Yes Decidueys needs it, then why didnt it get Fly, Phantom Force? They didnt wanted to overpower them or see what fans really want?

Incineroar has Fake Out, but right more priority would be a good way, Sucker Punch?
Decidueyes got that alreeady? Decidueye is weak to dark remember.
maybe First Impression? it has Leech Life.

Prima with Vacuum Wave or something in that kind? or also First Impression?

 

[Envoy]

sorry, then we have a real problem between those two.
Would it survive any of Blazikens attacks? instant Brave Bird out take?

ok. right fire/dark, forgot fire resists fairy.

Yes Decidueys needs it, then why didnt it get Fly, Phantom Force? They didnt wanted to overpower them or see what fans really want?

Incineroar has Fake Out, but right more priority would be a good way, Sucker Punch?
Decidueyes got that alreeady? Decidueye is weak to dark remember.
maybe First Impression? it has Leech Life.

Prima with Vacuum Wave or something in that kind? or also First Impression?

Fly is not exactly a good move, so no big loss there. Phantom Force is alright, I guess. First turn use gives the opponent a chance to freely switch into a Normal type and laugh in Deci's face though. You could make a case for Spirit Shackle + Phantom Force, but that's already half your moves spent on Ghost type STAB when it would much rather use those move slots on things like Roost, U-Turn, Defog, Leaf Blade, and Swords Dance.

So what if Deci already gets Sucker Punch? Is there a rule that says Starters can't ever share moves ever? If so, then you should probably tell Venusaur, Charizard, and Blastoise that only one of them is allowed to have Earthquake. They'll have to fight for it.

What's the logic behind Primarina getting Vacuum Wave? I mean, I get it. Special priority. But it doesn't make any sense for the Pokemon itself because it adds nothing to her whole motif.

 

[Matleo]

Yes you have right with Sucker Punch, yes Decidueye could use a other non harming move in that turn.

Vacuum Wave? though about clapping her hands. Motif is one thing usefullnes is the other. Would be nice to counter steel a little. It's hard to tell what would be good it's a Sirene.
Theoretically "Shore Up" for her would good her whole motif?
Clanging Scales could also be posibble it is part fish(sirene) and has scales or not?
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Incineroar with Burn Up? a yes or no? and reason for yes/no.

-yes:
would change typing in middle of battle and force oponent to change strategy.
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Deciduey with Dual Chop and Twister(this one should have become a priority move till now)?
or Dragon Claw for Incerioar and Deci.
Dragon Rush for Decidueye posibble but maybe not exactly good motif and maybe to OP?
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why do starters not get Disable? maybe becuse of needed support?
Primarina or Decidueye would deserve something like this, or maybe in future we will get moves that do damage and disable the foes move.(30% chance)
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how would it affect the game if Mimikyus Disquise ability
would be placed on a pokemon like Decidueye?
(I would hope better for a (mega)Chesanught with Disquise in it's armor but it is a interesting though)

 

[NinjutsuSen]

Most of Deci's moves, including Spirit Shackle (a base 80 BP move with an awesome effect) are physical, so this would be a terrible idea. If anything, Deci should have his HP and defenses lowered and his speed raised.

The typing is more effective on the special side. That's why I really wanted it to have a special orientated moveset. That's the thing behind my idea. There are simply to many better grass type and ghost type moves than many physical ones. I don't say that physical orientated is that much worse, but the typing is better for special attacks.

 

[Matleo]

the typing is better for special attacks.

We had only two physical attakers Chesnaught and Torterra in past , maybe thats why?
Plus its a good tyng also for a legendary, maybe thats why they made all 4 grass/ghosts to this day physical?

Taking that:
- it can't self get trapped(ghost),
- has acces to Omnious Wind and Curse,
- Long Reach ( immunity to Contact abilities, in future we may get Contact Freeze),
- has two immunities
- Sucker Punch (takes down most ghost and psychic pokes) and U-turn

I begin uderstand why they made it 70 speed only.

It needs only Tailwind, Shadow Snek, Fly, Bounce, Phantom Force to become a very frightening menace.

 

[Gengarzilla]

Otoh, switch out its Sp. def and speed stats and give it access to good special moves like Giga Drain, Heat Wave, and Focus Blast and you got yourself a pretty solid physical, special, and mixed attacker there. Get some use out of Nasty Plot too.

Then it's basically Grass Infernape.

Not that I'm calling this a bad thing, it's just a little observation.