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[SPOILERS] The story of Sun&Moon

Actually Your Boy Guzma
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Then again, I don't think there's any reason the believe that the blast would have made him invulnerable as well as immortal, so under all those rocks, he'd probably be a mangled mess of bones and sinew at best, or a puddle at worst... and I suspect (I can't confirm, but I suspect) that consciousness doesn't make it past that point. :p
Good point. Also, ew.

where do people get this from? Xerneas and Yveltal were simply used as a massive battery (over the multiple-Pokemon battery when originally fired) for the Ultimate Weapon.
He said something along the lines of "Let's see how you like LIVING FOREVER!" before he fired it.
 
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I thought Lysandre suffered the same fate as AZ for both versions.
Depends on how you read into it, really. In Y, all he says before activating the weapon is that he'll "show you what its remaining power can do," which just feels like a case of Never Say "Die". Given that the weapon is fueled by Yveltal in that game, there's little room to doubt that he just straight-up dies.

However, in X, it's a bit different. Before firing the weapon, he says to you and the rivals, "Let us live forever! I'll give you the pain of endlessly waiting for a beautiful world to finally be built!" Which implies that he's going to use Xerneas's power to render himself and the protagonists immortal. The protagonists escape, but he probably doesn't - so is he alive under there? Personally, I doubt it, because despite being biologically immortal, I don't think he'd be invincible, and would therefore still be liable to being crushed by the rubble.

(over the multiple-Pokemon battery when originally fired)
It's actually suggested that you need both power sources, and that both were used in either instance. Team Flare use Xerneas/Yveltal in conjunction with the Pokémon that they captured using the stolen Poké Balls - that's why they block off Route 10, because they're attaching those Pokémon to the stones in order to feed the weapon. And while they don't outright say that AZ used Xerneas/Yveltal, Sycamore theorizes in the post-game that there were indeed a component of the weapon 3000 years ago, and that it's their energy, having been channeled through the beam, that created Kalos's Mega Stones.
 
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hm, guess i need to double-down on my XY lore. oh well.
I like the Aether-Skull alliance (if it'd just been Aether, I worry that it'd have been a bit too Plasma-ey), but it's dropped on us all of a sudden when we're storming Aether Paradise and from there it's not really explored.
tbf the Aether-Skull alliance seems very twist for the sake of a twist. there's virtually no (if not actually no) references to it until the alliance being made public and it strikes me as a bit odd that Gladion would defect from Aether-- or really just his mother, i suppose-- only to end up working for a group that works for Lusamine anyways. seems to me that Lusamine reached out to Skull to get them to hijack Cosmog (and Lillie) and they just ended up sticking around a little longer because Guzma was interested in the Ultra Beasts.
 
Destroyer of Fairy, Steel and Ice types.
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I kind of wanted the Aether group to be the first good guys group but the way they are in SM is good too.
 
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hm, guess i need to double-down on my XY lore. oh well.
Surely there are better ways to spend your time. Not that it'd take a lot of time, but... :p

tbf the Aether-Skull alliance seems very twist for the sake of a twist. there's virtually no (if not actually no) references to it until the alliance being made public and it strikes me as a bit odd that Gladion would defect from Aether-- or really just his mother, i suppose-- only to end up working for a group that works for Lusamine anyways. seems to me that Lusamine reached out to Skull to get them to hijack Cosmog (and Lillie) and they just ended up sticking around a little longer because Guzma was interested in the Ultra Beasts.
That's true - and what we know of Team Skull's origins (they formed out of the remnants of a group that organized around a previous kahuna and were struck down by the tapu) doesn't make it sound as though they were associated with Lusamine from their inception. So yeah I think you're probably right; they've probably only been working for her since Lillie took Cosmog, but then Guzma liked being praised so he started hanging around Lusamine more.

I kind of wanted the Aether group to be the first good guys group but the way they are in SM is good too.
Well, really, they are good guys, for the most part. They started out as a legit Pokémon conservation group founded by Lusamine's father, and continue to operate in that capacity under Gladion's leadership after the main game. It's just that there were some bad apples like Lusamine and Faba who were taking advantage of their resources.
 
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So I've finished SM last night and I am not sure how I should rate the story.

Lillie was a good character and I already miss her in the post game. She and Gladio to an degree were the best characters in the whole story. But my main problem here were the villains.

I was super dissapointed when I saw that TS never became good and that was a wasted opportunity to write them decently enough so I like them at the end. But no, their crappy behaviour stayed for the most part and Guzma role in the plot never was explained. His relationship with Lusamine was barely explained and at the end they were only there for the plot twist of Lusamine being the real villain of the story. He got a small bit of backstory in the post game and in Malie City. I hoped for TS to become good and helping to defeat Lusamine to apologize their behaviour to the main characters, including Lillie and especially Gladio. TS was underused in the whole plot and Guzma appeared way to late making them my least favourite evil team by instant.

Lusamine had a good character, but it lacked of explaination what she wanted to do with the UB's after releasing them into the real world and what she actually wanted to reach. Her relationship with Lillie and once more Gladio wasn't explained that well. Them not accepting her "love" as a reason to call the UB's was exaggeration to a point she became more crazy. I also hoped for some more backstory informations why and how Wicke helped Lillie to escape.

Really to me the main story about Skull and the Aether Foundationfelt more forced than really enjoyable. But a the end I had my fun with the story, but only bcause Lillie and Gladio saved the plot for me.
 
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Lusamine had a good character, but it lacked of explaination what she wanted to do with the UB's after releasing them into the real world and what she actually wanted to reach..
I'd say it was heavily implied that she didn't care about the real world and just wanted to stay in the Ultra Space with her Nihilego buddies. Gladion thinks that she was looking for Mohn, but she never says that herself.
 
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From Acerola's wiki page:

Despite Acerola referring to Island Kahuna Nanu as "uncle" they are not related as stated on page 174 of the Pokémon Sun & Pokémon Moon: The Official Strategy Guide. "Uncle" and "Aunty" are often used as a label of endearment and closeness of a person of non-familial ties in Hawaiʻi.

Figured as much (the Acerola - Nanu relationship) based on Japanese usage of familial terms also often being non-literal (Kukui's usage of "cousin" is almost certainly a term of affection rather than literal as well), but is this also in a Japanese source (like the booklet that came with the Japanese game soundtrack, or maybe an artbook)? Because overseas teams have been known to make up information on the spot (granted, this was mostly in early generations, but still).
 
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So I've been playing through the games and I'm at the Shady House and my thoughts so far:

1) Team Skull is played for laughs in the games, and we treat them as a joke irl as well...but they've managed to take over a small town and barricade themselves in. Sure there was a lot of apathy from Ula Ula's Kahuna but they still took over an entire town and held it.

2) What's with Alola's police being like "we don't have to worry about crime :D" but then they ignore an entire town's been taken over?

3) Tapu Bulu is upset over a convenience store being built on sacred grounds but is fine with the Pokemon League being built in Alola's most sacred site. Does Bulu just have something against poor people?

4) When exactly was Lusamine affected by Nihilego's toxins? Because her winning "worst parent of the series" hinges on that.
 
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3) Tapu Bulu is upset over a convenience store being built on sacred grounds but is fine with the Pokemon League being built in Alola's most sacred site. Does Bulu just have something against poor people?
Or Bulu is an anti-capitalist

4) When exactly was Lusamine affected by Nihilego's toxins? Because her winning "worst parent of the series" hinges on that.
When she fuses with it in the climax. The games never suggest that she was affected by toxins before then. Fans read a bit too much into things, I think.
 
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When she fuses with it in the climax. The games never suggest that she was affected by toxins before then. Fans read a bit too much into things, I think.
So I think she's a pretty good contender...especially when her apology is a backhanded compliment lol

"When did you...start becoming beautiful?"

Lillie and Gladion may forgive her (and technically N didn't really hold a personal grudge against Ghetsis) but damn she was a terrible parent even before the neurotoxins.

Not sure its appropriate to excuse her because she lost her husband...when Lille and Gladion turned out fine after losing both their parents basically...and also Silver with his father...

EDIT:
Also since Mohn is referred to as Professor Mohn in the Aether journals...that means Lusamine, Lillie, and Gladion's surnames are probably Mohn as well...

...Lillie Mohn
 
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So I think she's a pretty good contender...especially when her apology is a backhanded compliment lol

"When did you...start becoming beautiful?"

Lillie and Gladion may forgive her (and technically N didn't really hold a personal grudge against Ghetsis) but damn she was a terrible parent even before the neurotoxins.

Not sure its appropriate to excuse her because she lost her husband...when Lille and Gladion turned out fine after losing both their parents basically...and also Silver with his father...
I probably need to correct myself slightly - it's possible that she was exposed to the neurotoxins during the time that she was in Ultra Space, and therefore her whole rant at Lillie in US would have been toxin-influenced, but the games don't actively suggest even that much. But it doesn't seem possible, contrary to what many seem to think, for her to have ever been exposed to its neurotoxins before then. One could maybe imagine a scenario in which she encountered a Nihilego some time prior to the story, but the games don't ever suggest that there was one, and it's hard to square that idea with certain things that are established (like that she's only just as recently as our first trip to Aether Paradise realized that Cosmog is the key to opening wormholes).

In what fairness I can exercise for her, people react to grief differently. Her husband vanished many years ago, and it's suggested that her obsession with Ultra Space and Ultra Beasts evolved out of her desperation to get him back. So we may envision that she's been pouring over this research for years with no success, and then both of her kids ended up running away. Her family slowly eroded around her to the point where all she really had left was the work she'd put into researching Ultra Space.

I wonder how old Gladion and Lillie even were when her husband disappeared? We're not given any particular timeframe for the incident other than "years ago."
 
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@Esserise based on how Gladion and Lillie were describing their childhood* she seemed pretty overbearing from the start and likely that great a parent.

*Gladion mentioned Lusamine was very controlling; Lillie mentioned sleeping in the bed where she and her mother slept. Obviously the latter part with Lillie isn't as nefarious as some fans would spin it but it shows a certain level of possessiveness and objectification which is highlighted in how easily she can cast them aside for "no longer loving her"

Also bad parenting aside...why does no one seem to talk about how Lusamine has an entire collection of frozen Pokemon--which she likely acquired from her "rescuing" Pokemon through her foundation? This is in a universe where you can keep Pokemon in stasis as data...completely unharmed, yet she chooses to freeze them in blocks of ice. None of that is at all related to finding her husband so she's pretty up there in terms of actual villainy.

There's like...a lot of things wrong with Lusamine that you can't really chalk up to "she lost her husband and clearly is going through emotional trauma" (and ignoring the casual sexism in attributing her actions as stemming from her emotionality). We don't even know if Mohn was any better before having his memory erased....
 
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Also bad parenting aside...why does no one seem to talk about how Lusamine has an entire collection of frozen Pokemon--which she likely acquired from her "rescuing" Pokemon through her foundation? This is in a universe where you can keep Pokemon in stasis as data...completely unharmed, yet she chooses to freeze them in blocks of ice. None of that is at all related to finding her husband so she's pretty up there in terms of actual villainy.
Beats me. That part seemed like it was thrown in just for the sake of making her seem more psychotic.

On a tangentially related note, though, I appreciated that there was an NPC in one of the Pokémon Centers who actively wondered about whether or not Pokémon in the PC are conscious.

There's like...a lot of things wrong with Lusamine that you can't really chalk up to "she lost her husband and clearly is going through emotional trauma" (and ignoring the casual sexism in attributing her actions as stemming from her emotionality). We don't even know if Mohn was any better before having his memory erased....
Well, the grief is largely just what put her in a position to be more deeply affected by later events. By the time we start our adventure, she's pretty much gone completely mental, and I think that was more directly a result of Gladion running away and stealing Type: Null, and then Lillie doing the same with Cosmog a year and a half later. Unfortunately, they don't really go into a lot of detail regarding her personality shift (that's partly why I hope we get Kanto sequels, where we could maybe see how she acts when in a healthier state).

Certainly it can be read that she likely had some pre-existing complexes. Although I didn't get the sense that Lillie sleeping in her bed was even a semi-regular thing - if I remember right, Lillie said that she let her sleep in her bed after they both got sick from being in the rain, which to me made it sound like Lillie requested to do so, as a child might do after having a nightmare, for example.
 
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