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[SPOILERS] The story of Sun&Moon

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The term "universe" is being used because of the "multiverse" theory so I don't know why you have a problem with it. The Pokemon multiverse split into:

Gen III - Gen V

Gen VI - Gen VII

And yes, you could consider Gen I-II to be it's own universe, but in my opinion it's irrelevant since it appears that unlike the Gen I-II universe, the Gen III-V and Gen VI-VII universe have many similarities and evidently have people from them passing through to the other one.

Within those you could call each independent version a timeline variation, the same can be said for RSE, DPPl, BW, etc. Although the most "relevant" of these timelines will always be those that include a third version. It's hardly a problem anymore since we haven't had a third version since Platinum, so you could say there's just two timelines now, I like to think of them as "Red" timelines and "Blue" timelines, so AS -> X -> Moon could be considered as one, OR -> Y -> Sun could be considered another, using the red-colored games together and the blue-colored games together. Of course, there's nothing to say these can't be mix-matched into their own timeline as well, it's just the simplest way of looking at it, in my opinion.
I never said I have a problem with it. It's just my personal preference for differentiating terminology that separates Gen III-V from VI-VII and Black from White, OR from AS, X from Y, etc. That term makes sense to me since typically, the term "dimension" is more so used for a different reality that still exists in the hyperplane (which is pretty much what versions are in Pokemon) while a different universe is more fitting for a separate timeline, the way I see it.

I actually do agree with you on that point of separate dimensions in Pokemon being linear rather than branched out with all versions being canonical (like, starting with Ruby, which could lead to either Diamond or Pearl, and each leading to Black or White, too complicated for my comfort). But my theory on how this would work here is how version exclusives are carried over from one gen to the next and to top it off, they don't get tangled in the process. For example, OR has the version exclusives, legendaries and non-legendaries, for Pearl, HG and Black while AS is the same with Diamond, SS and White. This even stays mostly consistent down the line as Black has the version-exclusives for HG, Pearl, FR and Ruby and vice-versa for White and etc. (The only exceptions I noticed were the Eon duo in HGSS and Throh/Sawk but in the latter's case it is more an issue of being common in one version and rare in the other.) Unless I'm mistaken, this could indicate a timeline continuum of versions that go FR/R/OR --> Pearl/HG --> Black --> B2/Y for one and LG/S/AS --> Diamond/SS --> White --> W2/X (which is consistent with your color version theory, huh). Idk, I feel that in some cases like Hoenn and Sinnoh, the version mascot of the opposite version was never referenced as a reality, kinda like it ceased to exist at some point (thus why Hoopa's rings only bought one legendary at the Eon spots). I won't bother including third versions in this timeline theory, don't want to complicate things even more.

As for the original-original universe of Gen I-II, I'm still confident that its newfound compatibility with Sun/Moon brings it back to the present canon. Idk, maybe we'll see an Easter egg in Sun/Moon with something like "We may have identified a third universe, one even more unknown/primitive than the one of the Fallers". As for Pokemon being Fallers, technically they were brought over PokeBank and not Ultra wormholes so they wouldn't be engulfed with the energy that comes from the wormholes.
 
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As for Pokemon being Fallers, technically they were brought over PokeBank and not Ultra wormholes so they wouldn't be engulfed with the energy that comes from the wormholes.
Although, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the Memory Girl say that transferred Pokémon have a hard time recalling their memories?

Now, I'm not saying that they should be considered Fallers, but it is an interesting similarity.
 
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I never said I have a problem with it. It's just my personal preference for differentiating terminology that separates Gen III-V from VI-VII and Black from White, OR from AS, X from Y, etc. That term makes sense to me since typically, the term "dimension" is more so used for a different reality that still exists in the hyperplane (which is pretty much what versions are in Pokemon) while a different universe is more fitting for a separate timeline, the way I see it.

I actually do agree with you on that point of separate dimensions in Pokemon being linear rather than branched out with all versions being canonical (like, starting with Ruby, which could lead to either Diamond or Pearl, and each leading to Black or White, too complicated for my comfort). But my theory on how this would work here is how version exclusives are carried over from one gen to the next and to top it off, they don't get tangled in the process. For example, OR has the version exclusives, legendaries and non-legendaries, for Pearl, HG and Black while AS is the same with Diamond, SS and White. This even stays mostly consistent down the line as Black has the version-exclusives for HG, Pearl, FR and Ruby and vice-versa for White and etc. (The only exceptions I noticed were the Eon duo in HGSS and Throh/Sawk but in the latter's case it is more an issue of being common in one version and rare in the other.) Unless I'm mistaken, this could indicate a timeline continuum of versions that go FR/R/OR --> Pearl/HG --> Black --> B2/Y for one and LG/S/AS --> Diamond/SS --> White --> W2/X (which is consistent with your color version theory, huh). Idk, I feel that in some cases like Hoenn and Sinnoh, the version mascot of the opposite version was never referenced as a reality, kinda like it ceased to exist at some point (thus why Hoopa's rings only bought one legendary at the Eon spots). I won't bother including third versions in this timeline theory, don't want to complicate things even more.

As for the original-original universe of Gen I-II, I'm still confident that its newfound compatibility with Sun/Moon brings it back to the present canon. Idk, maybe we'll see an Easter egg in Sun/Moon with something like "We may have identified a third universe, one even more unknown/primitive than the one of the Fallers". As for Pokemon being Fallers, technically they were brought over PokeBank and not Ultra wormholes so they wouldn't be engulfed with the energy that comes from the wormholes.
EDIT: Something that just came to mind that could potentially give more clarity with third versions carrying over to future generations more so than the original paired ones. When Zinnia and Mr. Stone were discussing transporting the meteoroid to the alternate non-mega universe, wouldn't they have been talking about Ruby in OR and Sapphire in AS..? Remember the line that other than the absence of mega evolutions, the two worlds are supposed to be identical for the most part. While this wouldn't be perfect when regarding how the Magma/Aqua admins have interchanged roles a little, all events that are independent of mega evolution in ORAS (AKA events that were there since the original Hoenn games) are based off of Ruby/Sapphire and not Emerald (like the gym leader teams).

So if we are to assume that the above statements are true, then Ruby/Sapphire are canonical (as in, not replaced in the actual overall canon by Emerald) when still considering ORAS. But ORAS is dependent on XY, which is dependent in turn with tracing back to Platinum due to the presence of Looker.

Then could another indication of the appearance of Faller Looker in ORAS (assuming he came from the Ruby/Sapphire timeline) be the in-game reason why Looker was absent in the original Diamond/Pearl? Potentially meaning Ruby/Sapphire leads to Diamond/Pearl (and the Pokemon storyline is wrapped up within that timeline) while Emerald leads to Platinum, which leads to Black/White and then finally B2W2 (and thus ends the final timeline of the non-mega universe). But now continues the mega-universe. Idk, one possible evidence that original paired versions still remain canonical...

Yeah, I know this is really long and contradictory at some points. But hopefully this gave potential insight to how original paired versions still exist in the canon, whether the events there continued onto future generations or not.
 
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EDIT: Something that just came to mind that could potentially give more clarity with third versions carrying over to future generations more so than the original paired ones. When Zinnia and Mr. Stone were discussing transporting the meteoroid to the alternate non-mega universe, wouldn't they have been talking about Ruby in OR and Sapphire in AS..? Remember the line that other than the absence of mega evolutions, the two worlds are supposed to be identical for the most part. While this wouldn't be perfect when regarding how the Magma/Aqua admins have interchanged roles a little, all events that are independent of mega evolution in ORAS (AKA events that were there since the original Hoenn games) are based off of Ruby/Sapphire and not Emerald (like the gym leader teams).

So if we are to assume that the above statements are true, then Ruby/Sapphire are canonical (as in, not replaced in the actual overall canon by Emerald) when still considering ORAS. But ORAS is dependent on XY, which is dependent in turn with tracing back to Platinum due to the presence of Looker.

Then could another indication of the appearance of Faller Looker in ORAS (assuming he came from the Ruby/Sapphire timeline) be the in-game reason why Looker was absent in the original Diamond/Pearl? Potentially meaning Ruby/Sapphire leads to Diamond/Pearl (and the Pokemon storyline is wrapped up within that timeline) while Emerald leads to Platinum, which leads to Black/White and then finally B2W2 (and thus ends the final timeline of the non-mega universe). But now continues the mega-universe. Idk, one possible evidence that original paired versions still remain canonical...

Yeah, I know this is really long and contradictory at some points. But hopefully this gave potential insight to how original paired versions still exist in the canon, whether the events there continued onto future generations or not.
Nothing that Zinnia says necessitates that the "other world" be the world of RS instead of the world of Emerald or vice-versa, although it ultimately doesn't matter, since it's really only talking about the RSE world in broad strokes.

Game Freak most likely don't pay an ounce of attention toward "canon."

But, for what it's worth - your idea that Ruby/Diamond and Sapphire/Pearl could form corresponding parallel worlds, and that Faller Looker may have come from one of those worlds rather than the Emerald/Platinum world, is quite clever, but I still have to agree with Silktree in that once we exceed having two main "universes," things become messy and less interesting.

Edit: But you know, I'm feeling a good 18-dimensional bean dip theory coming on at the moment, so just for fun, I'm going to run with this for a minute. What if there were three universes, but they were actually divided up as follows:

Universe 1 (three timelines)
1. Red Version > Gold Version > Ruby Version > Diamond Version
2. Blue Version > Silver Version > Sapphire Version > Pearl Version
3. Yellow Version > Crystal Version

Universe 2 (two timelines)
1. FireRed/Emerald > HeartGold/Platinum > Black > Black 2
2. LeafGreen/Emerald > SoulSilver/Platinum > White > White 2

Universe 3 (two timelines)
1. Omega Ruby > X > Sun
2. Alpha Sapphire > Y > Moon

What if, instead of breaking them up by generations (as in, Gens I and II can't transfer (which is no longer the case, necessarily, for Gen I and hopefully Gen II eventually), so oooooooobviously they're their own universe), and instead divided them up by whether they're the "enhanced" version of the story or not. Obviously the 3DS games have to occupy their own universe; that much is clear from the dialogue in those games. But the older games have more leeway in terms of how they can be grouped together.

What if Universe 1 is a "pure" universe, free of the chronological tricks and retcons that synced the Kanto and Hoenn stories together, and the Johto and Sinnoh stories together? Where instead, RS are proper sequels to GS, and DP are proper sequels to RS? Do note however that this isn't 100% mandatory, and you could still pair Red/Ruby and Gold/Diamond together and so forth, but I think it is nevertheless a neat possibility that leans on the obvious technological progression of the games themselves.

(I grouped Yellow and Crystal together, mostly because I didn't have anywhere else to put them. Maybe that's the universe in which Mt. Silver's Red actually did start with his Pikachu rather than catching one in Viridian Forest, and obtained his other Starters from the NPCs in Yellow instead of trading for them.)

Universe 2, then, is where the "enhanced" versions of the Japanese region stories take place, and they don't terminate as early. In those versions of reality, the Unova wars happened in the past, and lead to a whole new history in that region. Whereas in Universe 1, maybe Kyurem never split. Or maybe, it never formed at all. I actually have a blog post; unfortunately it's not accessible right now, but in it, I theorize that the king connected to the Abyssal Ruins was actually a worshiper of Arceus, and that his kingdom was destroyed when an attempt to summon Arceus went awry and created Kyurem. Maybe in Universe 1, that summoning ritual was never attempted, and "Unova" was never founded by the twin heroes.

Alternatively, maybe Kyurem did come into being and split in Universe 1, but its constituent parts were then abducted and transplanted into Universe 3 by Hoopa. The Legendary Beasts that Hoopa pulls would obviously be from Universe 1, but as you say, Dialga/Palkia could be too, since the opposite member of the pair is never mentioned in either game. Perhaps Diamond's Palkia was the one that appeared in Omega Ruby, and Pearl's Dialga got drafted into Alpha Sapphire.

And of course, Universe 3 has the Fairy type and the ultimate weapon shenanigans, which lead to a world with Mega Evolution. And it is now being exposed to the other universes, leading to the emergence of Fallers - Anabel from Universe 2, and Looker from Universe 1.
 
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Mm I would be very hesitant to put Ruby/Sapphire into the same continuity as the first two generations. I'm pretty sure the events that happened in Kanto within the Ruby/Sapphire timeline are depicted in FRLG, not RBY.

There's no need to be confused over the different universes (although the different dimensions with different versions would confuse anyone). I just think of it as three universes (I-II, III-V and VI-VII) and within each universe are the separate timelines/dimensions, with the latter being completely unconfirmed as Game Freak probably intended to.

Don't get me wrong, I actually enjoy discussing this (despite my brain getting tangled over theories that will likely never be confirmed nor debunked) but still keep in mind that all this is up to the individual on what to think with different continuities. This was quite clever of Game Freak: first hint that there is not one version that is canonical over the other (from Gen V) and then succeed it with "oh, we didn't intend to throw the original Hoenn games out of canon, so now we will pull a Zelda and serve our fans with a multiverse" (c'mon, we all know this is true). At this point, Game Freak left us to think and predict what we want, I mean, what fun is it to theorize if this all gets confirmed/debunked later? ;)
 
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Does anyone feel like that Lillie is the one who should have ended up with Nebby (the mascot legendary)?

I know Lillie is not a trainer yet, but it feels so weird that after the close bond Lillie developed with Nebby and the game emphasizing their close bond, the story basically ended with 'Hey MC, Nebby wants you to catch it!'.

I mean, just look at the final image of the ending credits for Moon!!

I know that I'm bringing up and older post, but the reason Nebby went with the player character actually makes sense when you think about it. Regardless of how long Nebby was with Lillie, it was still a wild Pokémon. If it traveled to Kanto with her and combine that with Lillie not wanting to be a trainer at that point in time, there's a good chance some stranger is going to try and capture it. Not only would it never see Lillie again in such a scenario, but it also wouldn't know whether or not its new trainer would be kind or cruel to it. On the other hand, going with our character would mean it knows that it will have a trainer that it can trust, and will most likely be able to see Lillie again after she returns from Kanto. From an in-universe point of view, it's a win-win scenario to go with us!
 
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I know that I'm bringing up and older post, but the reason Nebby went with the player character actually makes sense when you think about it. Regardless of how long Nebby was with Lillie, it was still a wild Pokémon. If it traveled to Kanto with her and combine that with Lillie not wanting to be a trainer at that point in time, there's a good chance some stranger is going to try and capture it. Not only would it never see Lillie again in such a scenario, but it also wouldn't know whether or not its new trainer would be kind or cruel to it. On the other hand, going with our character would mean it knows that it will have a trainer that it can trust, and will most likely be able to see Lillie again after she returns from Kanto. From an in-universe point of view, it's a win-win scenario to go with us!
I see what you mean but...Lillie would IMMEDIATELY be able to get it upon becoming a trainer. I doubt it would take that long. Nebby could easily hide somewhere and appear to Lillie from time to time. I just find it ridiculous that the player character gets Nebby AND gets another Cosmog postgame that will eventually evolve into yet another Lunala where Lillie gets nothing.
 
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Mm I would be very hesitant to put Ruby/Sapphire into the same continuity as the first two generations. I'm pretty sure the events that happened in Kanto within the Ruby/Sapphire timeline are depicted in FRLG, not RBY.
Maybe now with FRLG in hindsight, but I'd like to raise the point that there was over a year where the only two options were to assume that Ruby/Sapphire were either in the same continuity as RBY/GSC, or were a reboot of the series altogether. And since Game Freak obviously did not intended for Ruby/Sapphire to be a (hard) reboot, that means that they, at the very least, were in continuity with RBY/GSC at some point.

My (informal, and purely for fun) theory simply revalidates that perception.
 
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AND gets another Cosmog postgame that will eventually evolve into yet another Lunala where Lillie gets nothing.
Maybe Lillie thought that she needed to become a trainer the old fashioned way rather than relying on Nebby's power. Or put another way, she thought she needed to become as strong as the player to deserve Nebby's partnership. She might get Nebby eventually. Leaving the player with the mindless copy that is Nebby2.

Esserise said:
Ruby/Sapphire were obviously not intended to be a reboot, which means that they, at the very least, were in continuity with RBY/GSC at some point.
That goes for XY, too. Let's face it: The main reason for the split is remakes.
 
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Maybe Lillie thought that she needed to become a trainer the old fashioned way rather than relying on Nebby's power.
It would have been perfect if she said that. But that is a headcanon I can accept.

Or put another way, she thought she needed to become as strong as the player to deserve Nebby's partnership. She might get Nebby eventually. Leaving the player with the mindless copy that is Nebby2.
And that is yet another headcanon I can really accept.
 
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It would have been perfect if she said that.
Well, she didn't say it because she didn't make the decision to become a Trainer until after she'd bequeathed Nebby to the player. Which she chose to do because she herself wasn't a Trainer. But by the time she'd chosen to go to Kanto to become a Trainer, it'd have been bad form to say to the player, "Um yeah so about what I said, I take it back."

Personally, I'm not sure where I stand on the issue of her handing over Nebby. It does feel somewhat awkward, although I do think it's an improvement over N gifting his dragon to Nate/Rosa, who were complete strangers to him. The protagonist of SM at least had an existing bond with Nebby and was instrumental in bringing about its evolution. Plus, I love Lillie's decision to become a Trainer in Kanto, but I feel like that only works if she starts from the ground-up, and not with a 680 BST sweep machine. Her journey will presumably mirror the SM protagonist's, and the iconic moment at the beginning of any Trainer's journey is obviously the Starter choice.
 
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I wonder if Lillie will get a Kanto starter or something special. I'd say Eevee, but Hau already uses one and giving her a species not native to Alola would make more sense.
 
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I wonder if Lillie will get a Kanto starter or something special. I'd say Eevee, but Hau already uses one and giving her a species not native to Alola would make more sense.
IF Kano sequels are the next Gen VII games (and that's a big if) I'd imagine that Necrozma would be central to the story and Lillie would play a major role, so maybe she'd simply get the starter that triangles well against yours.
 
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I wonder if Lillie will get a Kanto starter or something special. I'd say Eevee, but Hau already uses one and giving her a species not native to Alola would make more sense.
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As much as I want to believe in multi-universe in pokemon games, there is not enough evidence for me to believe it. Zinnia is not someone to trust after being apart of team magma/aqua and her involvement in awakening Groudon/Kyogre which nearly ended the world.

Unless we get to go to an alternate universe or at least see a portal to it then I can't buy that theory for a second. I do believe in the multiverse in the real world though.
 
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Well, she didn't say it because she didn't make the decision to become a Trainer until after she'd bequeathed Nebby to the player. Which she chose to do because she herself wasn't a Trainer. But by the time she'd chosen to go to Kanto to become a Trainer, it'd have been bad form to say to the player, "Um yeah so about what I said, I take it back."

Personally, I'm not sure where I stand on the issue of her handing over Nebby. It does feel somewhat awkward, although I do think it's an improvement over N gifting his dragon to Nate/Rosa, who were complete strangers to him. The protagonist of SM at least had an existing bond with Nebby and was instrumental in bringing about its evolution. Plus, I love Lillie's decision to become a Trainer in Kanto, but I feel like that only works if she starts from the ground-up, and not with a 680 BST sweep machine. Her journey will presumably mirror the SM protagonist's, and the iconic moment at the beginning of any Trainer's journey is obviously the Starter choice.
I'd like to pretend that at some point in the future, Lillie comes back and the player character willingly gives back Nebby. If there were Kanto sequels, she could allude to that--that she's training so that she can be worthy of her friend (ambiguously phrased so we can have fandom discourse on whether she means the PC or Nebby)

and the player's cosmog turns into the opposite box legendary
 
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Although, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the Memory Girl say that transferred Pokémon have a hard time recalling their memories?
Yes, she does. If you bring a Pokemon that came from the previous Gens, she'll say that it had a good memory but can't quite recall it. I remember that pretty darned well because I felt a little sad that my Golurk couldn't remember everything we'd been through while in Unova. (And we went through a lot together. Riser was and will always be my team's captain.)
Now, I'm not saying that they should be considered Fallers, but it is an interesting similarity.
That... could make for some interesting fanfics, now that I think about it.
 
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I wonder if Lillie will get a Kanto starter or something special. I'd say Eevee, but Hau already uses one and giving her a species not native to Alola would make more sense.
Maybe Lillie could start out with Clefairy. It would be a callback to the fact that it was originally going to be the franchise mascot, and it could lead her to start a cosmic Pokémon them team. It would be fitting since the first Pokémon she bonded with had a space theme, so there's a chance she'd naturally be drawn to them.
 
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Maybe Lillie could start out with Clefairy. It would be a callback to the fact that it was originally going to be the franchise mascot, and it could lead her to start a cosmic Pokémon them team. It would be fitting since the first Pokémon she bonded with had a space theme, so there's a chance she'd naturally be drawn to them.
Plus her mom used a Clefable
 
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