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Stars of Generation V

The star of Gen V? the thing's ubers now, and just speed boost does not make it epic, it's contending with things like mewtwo, arceus, palkia, pokemon with attacking or special attacking stats of over 150 while still having defensive stats of 90+.

If it was OU then yes, it would be a star, but as it's in ubers tier, it gets defeated easily by pokemon such as kyogre, rayquaza, palkia, groudon, mewtwo, lugia, in fact almost all ubers, because it does not have the power to KO any of them, and even though it is getting some use now, it is simply because of the excitment of speed boost, it will not be a star of the ubers metagame.


However, i agree about Ferrothorn, i hate the thing and personally have no problems against it, however it seems to single handedly changed the metagame from the rampaging speed and attack freaks of Gen IV to a much bulkier and stall filled metagame.
 
This thread is titled "Stars of Generation V"; as in, the generation in general, not just one tier. In that respect, Blaziken is this generation's star. There's also the fact that it has more than just Speed Boost. It has an awesome Attack stat, Swords Dance to raise said awesome Attack stat, a ridiculously powerful Hi Jump Kick, and so much more. I think it'll do fine up there; after a Swords Dance, it should take out things like Mewtwo with one Shadow Claw.

And if you ask me, Ferrothorn stands as this generation's contrarian. Sublime, myself, and many others thought stall was effectively dead because of the big power creep. We were all dead wrong.
 
And if you ask me, Ferrothorn stands as this generation's contrarian. Sublime, myself, and many others thought stall was effectively dead because of the big power creep. We were all dead wrong.

I was particularly pleased about Ferrothorn because it is a great Starmie counter that isn't a pink blob.
 
Let's be honest about the real stars of the metagame though, it's Rain and Sandstorm. Sucks to be you if you don't run either.

couldn't agree with this more. It's brutal when out of 10 battles, 6 of them run either Rain Dance or Sandstorm.
 
Weather is just turning into just the standard in pokemon battles. However i think that the very best teams are ones that arn't weather teams, and are engineered to work well in sun and rain, but also on their own. Including pokemon like Kingdra, volcorana, heatran, zapdos, vaporeon, on teams where you don't have to waste a valuable spot on a ninetales or politoed, and can simply feed of the weather on others.

Sorry, i've got a bit off topic, my point is that the best stars in terms of pokemon, are ones that feed off incredibly well from weather boosts, such as the above mentioned.
 
Weather is really running rampant this gen. I tried to create an Anti-Weather team, and whilst ok and decent enough, it really is too hard with all the counters.

However, Blaziken = the Kentucky-Fighting-Chicken, has provided me with no problems so far. I've used a Speed Boost Sharpedo with Focus Sash, and it has always been a definate counter on the PO simulators. Defensively bulky Calm Mind Suicune and Choice Band Azumarill have been two other counters as well.
 
How can anything with a focus sash be called definate. Entry hazard or random attacks on the switch in screw you over.
 
Blaziken can also pack Double Kick and Quick Attack, should anybody consider them worthwhile. Focus Sash definetly doesn't make any pokemon a counter, unless something like Magic Guard Alakazam dons it. (That is also an answer to the question in the post above.)
I dont get the lack of mention of Voltos and virizion. Both wreck havoc, one versus rain the other versus Sandstorm.
My list on page two generally excluded Thundurus. I'm not crazy about Virizion.
...

Whimsicott is screwed over by magic bounce completely. Also, hitting it on the switch in and not letting set up is a good idea. It may wreck stall, but it stinks against offense. Not really a star.

...

Zoroak, having used him, is over rated. Hes UU for a reason. That doesnt make him a star. Team preview screws him over, and once he takes damage you can tell what he is compared to the other last pokemon.

Chandulure doesnt check excadrill. It is dominated by excadrill, who outspeeds and KOs without boost using Earthquake. If it uses a balloon, use Rock slide. The KO isnt garunteed but at +2 it is, which means its not a counter. Limited move pool, ghost typing, and bad defenses hold it down. I prefer Heatran.

Haxorus has 3 moves it can use, and is easily stopped. Base 99 speed means its outsped by base 100s and above. Outrage is excadrill set up bait. Brick break is set up bait for ghosts (and egyptian bird thing), and EQ is stopped by Flyers and balloon pokemon. Without a choice item its outsped and KO'd. Its not good at all, and wont be since Dnite, Mence, Garchomp, and even sazandora are better. And dont say they will be banned. The only one even close is Chomp, thanks to Sand Veil.

Darmanitan is kind of a star, since its CB Flare Blitz hits like a truck WITHOUT the sun. Its a scuicide bomber though, kinda like volt tackle pikachu but stronger.

...
Eh, if Zoroark isn't a star in OU, it will at least always be used in OU. The ability is just too tricky and novel to not be used. And I guess Darmanitan is potent--I'm still hesitant to designate him a the star. Regarding Chandelure, reread my post--it doesn't say what you think it does. Whimsicott, despite generally having one or two absolute counters, is still a 5th Gen Star I'd say.

Per the replies on page 2, I know the typing of Scrafty very well. My exact words were "has fantastic offensive and defensive typing for a dragon." Scrafty generally operates as one, has the two best Dragon moves (not just Dragon Dance, but also Dragon Tail), and is in the Dragon egg group.
 
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Eh, if Zoroark isn't a star in OU, it will at least always be used in OU.

What's your point? Electivire and Ninjask, despite their near-total worthlessness, were always "used" by inexperienced players in Generation IV OU.

Defensively bulky Calm Mind Suicune and Choice Band Azumarill have been two other counters as well.

Technically, neither Suicune nor Azumarill could counter Speed Boost Blaziken because they could not safely switch into its Hi Jump Kick.
 
The only real SB Blaziken counter that I can think of is Gyarados. When Blaziken was popular in OU I just happened to be running a Gyarados that put a stop to it almost perfectly. Outside of that, though, the list of checks/counters must be pretty small.
 
The only real SB Blaziken counter that I can think of is Gyarados. When Blaziken was popular in OU I just happened to be running a Gyarados that put a stop to it almost perfectly. Outside of that, though, the list of checks/counters must be pretty small.

Slowbro also deserves a mention. +2 Shadow Claw doesn't OHKO IIRC.
 
Slowbro also deserves a mention. +2 Shadow Claw doesn't OHKO IIRC.

Oh yes, of course. Had that in my mind last night when I was pondering, but forgot about it. If you are facing one without the 3rd coverage move, you really can't go wrong with Gyarados or Slowbro.
 
Azumarrill works really well too, with STAB priority Aqua Jet, it can OHKO Blaziken. Still, Blaziken is definitely a star, dream world was very kind to it.
 
I'm not denying Blaziken is dangerous, but it seems that players often go for a for Sword Dance all the time. They don't predict the switch and CB Azumarill just Aqua Jet's away. I kinda take back Suicune, even if it is Defensively bulky.

Sorry, Sharpedo isn't a definate counter, but for me it seems to always work.
 
But Blazekin is Uber, it won't ever be battling against any of these pokemon. In ubers it is destroyed by Lugia and especially Giratina who can absorb high-jump-kick. What is the use of discussing the merits of it in relation to OU when it is Uber, it's like discussing the impact Wobbuffet had on the gen III OU metagame.....

Therefore i strongly think that Blazekin is not a star of the gen V metagame.
 
"The Gen V Metagame" = / = "Gen V OU"

What about stars of Gen V UU? Stars of Gen V Ubers? Hell, stars of Gen V NU? They're all stars, just in different tiers. The fact that Blaziken was able to make into Ubers in the first place, I think, demonstrates his rocket into stardom during this gen.

Moving on.

I've got a couple I can think of. Krookodile comes to mind, first and foremost. With Moxie and a Choice Scarf, that thing is an absolutely BEASTLY revenge killer. It may be UU, but it's an adaptable pokemon that fits well onto many teams, even without the scarf. It's got pretty good dual STABs, too - it's sort of like a frailer Excadrill without the steel typing.

And no mention of Hydreigon or Terrakion? For shame, people, for shame.

...Okay, because I love the thing to tiny little pieces, I've got to mention Sawsbuck. Again, it may be UU, but it's got a bunch of options. Leech Seed and Aromatherapy let it support the rest of the team, but in it's main role as an attacker, it's got most everything covered. STAB on Return is always nice, and Horn Leech can really wreck some things after a Swords Dance. It also gets Earthquake by virtue of Nature Power, which is always nice to have. Chlorophyll might be nice for sun teams, but Sap Sipper and Jump Kick make Ferrothorn setup fodder if they're not carrying Thunder Wave.
 
The idea is to discuss true stars of the metagame, influential pokemon that changed the face of the metagame, such as tyranitar in GSC, Metagross in RSC, and scizor in DPP. Blazekin has not changed the metagame, it does not require teams to create specific counters for it nor is it a near staple on all uber teams. I'm not saying it's not a star because it's in ubers not OU, i'm saying it's not a star because in the tier it is in it is near useless, it's 'rocket to stardom' was a result of it being too good for OU, not because it was of ubers standard.

IMO the main stars of this gen are Excadrill, Ferrothorn, Politoed and Ninetails. Each is a pokemon that teams have to create counters for, or have to be considered for their team. These pokemon are so influential to the gen V metagame that other pokemon are used or not used just on their ability to counter them.
 
Perhaps you didn't get me. *puts on modhat to make it more obvious* This is not to become a discussion about Blaziken's rise to Ubers because a bunch of neckbeards at Smogon thought it was too broken to use in OU. Or did you forget what OU was like before Blaziken was moved up, when teams DID have to create a counter for it lest they get swept?
 
Okay, i get your point, i just am certain Blazekin is by no means a star of the gen V metagame, and the 'neckbeards' an Smogon do happen to be the authority on pokemon battling, and it's tiers are, more often than not, transfered to the professional tournaments. IMO Blazekin has not influenced the metagame in the same was as the likes of Excadrill and Ferrothorn have.

Anyway, sorry for dragging this conversation on too far, i just feel strongly about this.

Moving on to a different pokemon, I agree with you about Terrakion, as a scarfed revenge killer it is epic, i run one and it gets 2kos on things like reunicules and conkeldur, even skarmory with stone edge. I would litterally eat my own hand for it to learn u-turn, but it is still a great addition to the metagame.
 
Please note: The thread is from 13 years ago.
Please take the age of this thread into consideration in writing your reply. Depending on what exactly you wanted to say, you may want to consider if it would be better to post a new thread instead.
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