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SPOILERS: Story Discussion

grass princess
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Having recently finished Ultra Sun, I have to say I vastly preferred SM's original story. I feel like so much in USUM was missing - Lillie and the player traveling to Ultra Space, Lillie confronting Lusamine and really tearing into her about how she's a terrible mother, Lusamine fusing with Nihilego and being rescued, Lillie leaving in the end - that made SM's story so heartbreaking yet amazing. Even the credits this time around weren't as emotionally charged. I don't think the story being less emotional is necessarily a bad thing, but in this case I just think SM's story worked better. I also really don't like how Lusamine's behavior was never called out here, but I guess they were trying to make her a little more sympathetic this time around?? idk.

That's not to say I didn't find Ultra Sun enjoyable - I really like the updated trials and all the extra content, and I love that Lillie got to stick around this time. But story wise, Sun and Moon definitely win.
 
Pokémon: Gen 8.0 You Can (Not) Catch 'em All
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I also really don't like how Lusamine's behavior was never called out here, but I guess they were trying to make her a little more sympathetic this time around?? idk.
Yeah, I feel like no one really seemed to do anything about Lusamine keeping Pokemon in stasis for her macabre collection. Practically removed the context of that scene being a byproduct of how far she's fallen. Like they kept that seen from SM, but it didn't make as much sense, it doesn't jive with her current character and how the story wants to portray her, and it doesn't really go anywhere.
 
Am I getting dabbed on by a Stunfisk?
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Yeah, I feel like no one really seemed to do anything about Lusamine keeping Pokemon in stasis for her macabre collection.
Someone did do something; if you go to the secret labs in the post-game (in both SM and USUM), there is an employee who says that what Lusamine did was too much, even if it was intended as a sign of love, and says that she’ll work to eventually revive those Pokémon.

But that’s the only resolution it gets in both games.

Practically removed the context of that scene being a byproduct of how far she's fallen. Like they kept that seen from SM, but it didn't make as much sense, it doesn't jive with her current character and how the story wants to portray her, and it doesn't really go anywhere.
However, her character in USUM is the same up until the URS come in (and all they do is put Necrozma in her headlights), so logically she should still have the freezer collection.
 
Pokémon: Gen 8.0 You Can (Not) Catch 'em All
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However, her character in USUM is the same up until the URS come in (and all they do is put Necrozma in her headlights), so logically she should still have the freezer collection.
It logically makes sense, given that this is the same character as before. But it doesn't gel well with the narrative. In USUM, she's an extremist who wants to save the world, but cares not for those she hurts along the way; the end justifies the means. It still makes sense at to why she's so estranged from her children, because her past hasn't changed. But then they throw the frozen Pokemon into the mix, which doesn't fit her intended portrayal after this point, doesn't mesh well with her new motivation, and adds a bitter taste to her redemption later on because it's not really addressed by the main cast.

If you cut out the frozen Pokemon, I don't think it would hurt USUM's story. But keeping it just makes Lusamine look worse than intended, and it makes her redemption feel incomplete. And with the lack of focus on Lusamine's family drama and her growing insanity, a lot of the impact is taken away. Yeah, she thinks freezing Pokemon is protecting them, but it's not the same idea of protection and preservation she was in mind for USUM.
 
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Darth Ignis
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I think that "odd stone" that Looker got at Olivia's shop was the Audinite he had when he "fell" into Hoenn's postgame, thus probably the strongest link between Gen 6 and 7 I've seen besides the souvenir.
 
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Having recently finished Ultra Sun, I have to say I vastly preferred SM's original story. I feel like so much in USUM was missing - Lillie and the player traveling to Ultra Space, Lillie confronting Lusamine and really tearing into her about how she's a terrible mother, Lusamine fusing with Nihilego and being rescued, Lillie leaving in the end - that made SM's story so heartbreaking yet amazing. Even the credits this time around weren't as emotionally charged. I don't think the story being less emotional is necessarily a bad thing, but in this case I just think SM's story worked better. I also really don't like how Lusamine's behavior was never called out here, but I guess they were trying to make her a little more sympathetic this time around?? idk.

That's not to say I didn't find Ultra Sun enjoyable - I really like the updated trials and all the extra content, and I love that Lillie got to stick around this time. But story wise, Sun and Moon definitely win.
Thank you seriously so much endearing and cool moments missing....plus the fact that Lusamine got off very easy from her behavior to her kids was so jarring...
 
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I think that "odd stone" that Looker got at Olivia's shop was the Audinite he had when he "fell" into Hoenn's postgame, thus probably the strongest link between Gen 6 and 7 I've seen besides the souvenir.
Hmm, could you elaborate? I haven't played the game and this sounds very interesting
 
Nepgear is cute.
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It logically makes sense, given that this is the same character as before. But it doesn't gel well with the narrative. In USUM, she's an extremist who wants to save the world, but cares not for those she hurts along the way; the end justifies the means. It still makes sense at to why she's so estranged from her children, because her past hasn't changed. But then they throw the frozen Pokemon into the mix, which doesn't fit her intended portrayal after this point, doesn't mesh well with her new motivation, and adds a bitter taste to her redemption later on because it's not really addressed by the main cast.

If you cut out the frozen Pokemon, I don't think it would hurt USUM's story. But keeping it just makes Lusamine look worse than intended, and it makes her redemption feel incomplete. And with the lack of focus on Lusamine's family drama and her growing insanity, a lot of the impact is taken away. Yeah, she thinks freezing Pokemon is protecting them, but it's not the same idea of protection and preservation she was in mind for USUM.
I'm thinking that Lusamine's redemption only happened because she did do that fusion thing with Nihilego off-screen, but still got her ass kicked by Necrozma. Think about it for a second: when did Lusamine come to here senses in SM? After getting her ass kicked as the Mother Beast by the trainer and then a legendary. Necrozma is also a legendary. No one said that it had to be humans that caused her to change in the end; being brutally wrecked by a parasitic Psychic-type and possibly mind-raped works just as well.

I'll admit this would have worked better if we got to see Mother Beast vs Necrozma though.
 
Pokémon: Gen 8.0 You Can (Not) Catch 'em All
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I'm thinking that Lusamine's redemption only happened because she did do that fusion thing with Nihilego off-screen, but still got her ass kicked by Necrozma.
But that's never mentioned or implied to happen here. And wouldn't she be suffering from Nihelgo's toxins, which was why she and Lillie went to Kanto in the original games?
 
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Hmm, could you elaborate? I haven't played the game and this sounds very interesting
You run into looker once you leave Diglett's Cave (I think that's the location) on Akala island, be blabs about the birds and bees, and mentions an odd stone he found at Olivia's Shop, and then proceeds to give you a fire stone. If the fire stone is the odd stone, then well Looker hasn't been looking around too much in 20+ years of Pokemon games.

And in ORAS, you encounter Looker on that resort island that you go to in the postgame, and he mentions that he has no idea how he came to be in Hoenn (I think he also has no idea who he is), and he gives you the Audinite and mentions he has no idea how he got it.

Disclaimer: that's just an observation and I could potentially be off my rocker. Either way, Looker is annoying.
 
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But that's never mentioned or implied to happen here. And wouldn't she be suffering from Nihelgo's toxins, which was why she and Lillie went to Kanto in the original games?
Plus the only reason she defuse was because of Lillie commanding Nebby that made her and Nihilego forcefully separate.
 
Nepgear is cute.
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But that's never mentioned or implied to happen here. And wouldn't she be suffering from Nihelgo's toxins, which was why she and Lillie went to Kanto in the original games?
Plus the only reason she defuse was because of Lillie commanding Nebby that made her and Nihilego forcefully separate.
…You got me there.

Speaking of which, Lusamine apparently used a bunch of Z-Crystals after fusing with Nihilego to get that Mother Beast form in the first place, correct? Considering Necrozma had something similar happen when fusing with Nebby and has to hold to a Z-Crystal to regain its Ultra Necrozma self (at least while in the player's hands), is it safe to say that Mother Beast Nihilego is kind of an example of Ultra Burst? If so, I wonder how, or if, other Ultra Beasts would trigger such a transformation.
 
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Hey, remember when the datamine first came out and people were saying Ash might be a character in this game?

What was up with that?
 
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That "entrancing voice" thing has to be the wierdest compliment anyone has ever given Ash. Is he part Meloetta now or something?
I've seen people interpret it as a shout-out to his Japanese voice actress.
 
ᴛʜᴇ ɴᴀᴍᴇ'ꜱ ᴘᴏɴᴅ, ᴊᴀᴍᴇꜱ ᴘᴏɴᴅ
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I just finished the "Rescue Lillie" Arc, and have mixed feelings about USUM Lusamine...
 
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Lusamine not being evil any more seemed really weird to me. She suddenly a good guy who wants to save the world. Wot.

I guess trying to kill Nebby sucks but it was a "for the greater good" thing not a "I'm obsessed with UB screw all you guys" thing.

I've seen people interpret it as a shout-out to his Japanese voice actress.
Has no one taken other Pokemon to him? he says the same thing no matter what the OT is from what I saw.
 
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So in the scope of the Pokemon multiverse, can we say that the event that diverges the SM universe from the USUM universe is that Necrozma did not steal the light of Ultra Megalopolis, and thus the Ultra Recon Squad never arrived in Alola, in the SM universe?
 
Stuck
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Something like that. SM Necrozma has been asleep underground in Alola since ancient times, so it was obviously not sealed in Ultra Megalopolis. Why it is so passive is probably a plothole.
 
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