BDSP The Gyms and the League - DP Style or Pt Style?

[Almonds]

This is related to the thread about the Pokedex. What do you think the gym leader and Pokemon league challenge would look like?

 

[Esserise]

While I'm pretty comfortable predicting that the games won't use the DP Dex, this is something I waffle on a bit more.

On the one hand, there's the straightforward argument that the original sequence and puzzles would be more "nostalgic" (and frankly, I actually prefer Gardenia's DP Gym layout).

On the other, shifting Fantina to act as the third Gym Leader is so much more intuitive compared to DP that it hurts. And one of the reasons why they started making games after Gen 4 more linear is because of young players getting turned around and confused due to all of the backtracking in Sinnoh. So going with the sequence from Platinum would probably make the progression smoother for young players. But I suppose they could also just have an NPC teleport you back to Hearthome when it's time to get the fifth Badge.

 

[Sakuraa]

I'd prefer Platinum's since it had more variety, but tbh I'd be fine with either.

 

[Alola]

I would prefer Platinum Gyms - they were tougher, had authentic teams to the type, and were more enjoyable in my opinion. As long as they don't go the ORAS route and nerf several Leaders, I will be content.

Aside from team lineups, the biggest question is will they follow D/P's 3/4/5 or Platinum's 3/4/5 challenge order. Given the series' emphasis on handholding, and focus on the originals rather than Platinum, I would imagine they will make Maylene the 3rd, Wake the 4th, and Fantina the 5th. Either they have you stop at Fantina's en route to Celestic Town or they'll just warp you back to Hearthome after you conclude your business in Celestic.

 

[SlowGinFizzzz]

I much prefer the Platinum teams and gym layouts, but I think the order of gyms from the original Diamondl/Pearl works better. Third gym just feels too early for a ghost-type Gym Leader, in my opinion.

 

[SeanWheeler]

They gotta use Platinum's teams, at least for Flint. Flint only had two Pokémon of his specialized type in Diamond and Pearl, while Platinum's expanded Dex let him have a Fire-type team.

 

[Yami-no-Game]

These are specifically stated to be faithful remakes so I'm expecting maybe around 90% of the game to be D/P exactly and the other 10% to be a few minor changes that include both Platinum and new features. And that's being generous.

 

[DarkraiKnight]

I’d say to just do what Platinum did, but if they’re determined to stay faithful to DP, then can they at LEAST use Fantina’s Gym Puzzle from Platinum? I swear, if I see a single math problem in Hearthome Gym, these remakes can kiss my money goodbye.

 

[prog rocker]

I just hope they Platinum's order. I keep forgetting what I did to trigger Fantina's battle in the original DP.

 

[Johnny Boy]

They gotta use Platinum's teams, at least for Flint. Flint only had two Pokémon of his specialized type in Diamond and Pearl, while Platinum's expanded Dex let him have a Fire-type team.

Flint is why I won’t accept anything less than the Platinum Dex. How are you a Fire type trainer and only have two Fire types on you’re team? Lmao.

 

[RileyXY1]

Flint is why I won’t accept anything less than the Platinum Dex. How are you a Fire type trainer and only have two Fire types on you’re team? Lmao.

Same with Bertha, Volkner, Candice, and Aaron to an extent.

 

[NinjutsuSen]

I am certain that they'll use the Platinum team and not the DP team. Like I can't see the leaders having Pokemon not of their specialized types anymore. Lets Go was an exception because they limited the Pokemon to the original 151 + Meltan but even then they replaced Pokemon of gym leaders with better fitting one like replacing Sabrina's Venomoth with Slowbro.

A lot of the Sinnoh Pokemon are missing in the DP dex which was one of the reason why the leaders lacked Pokemon of their gym type. We have already seen Porygon-Z and the Platinum feature in Floaroma so I expect them to have looked what Platinum have changed and use the better Platinum teams.

 

[SeanWheeler]

Flint is why I won’t accept anything less than the Platinum Dex. How are you a Fire type trainer and only have two Fire types on you’re team? Lmao.

IKR? We gotta have a Pokédex that allows a type specialist to use their types. Not much of a Fire specialist with Steelix, Lopunny and Drifblim. Especially when Lopunny's tie to the Fire-type is a Playboy pun, Steelix needs thorough reading of it's Pokédex for it's ties to heat, and Drifblim is there because it's a hot air balloon. Okay, maybe Drifloon's justification is better than the others. But it's still a ghost and flying type, and Lopunny really doesn't belong on a Fire team in a game for younger players.

 

[Daenerys]

I'm pretty sure they'll go with the 'faithful' D/P route and give the gym leaders their D/P rosters. Maybe a couple of roster changes will happen like Volkner being given 2 Pachirisu instead of Octillery and Ambipom; I never understood why the heck his team didn't have at least 1 Pachirisu in the originals to begin with. :/

Maybe they'll give Flint an extra Rapidash and 2 Monferno to make his team more Fire-like. Or they can just keep his D/P roster I honestly don't even care about him.

 

[Alola]

Pretty sure Gym Leader rosters will be an exception to the statement; Volkner and Flint are not going to be fought with only two Pokémon of their type specialty in 2021.

 

[Johnny Boy]

Also I’d like for the elite four members to have full teams when you rematch them. Rotom Oven would make for a good final team member for Flint.

 

[BlueWaves]

Pretty sure Gym Leader rosters will be an exception to the statement; Volkner and Flint are not going to be fought with only two Pokémon of their type specialty in 2021.

Don’t forget Candice.

Anyway, I wonder if they are going to keep it the Diamond and Pearl style of Maylene, Crasher Wake, and the Fantina, or the Platinum style of Fantina, Maylene, and then Crasher Wake? Some players preferred the latter because the pacing and backtracked was considered a slog in Diamond and Pearl, but I wouldn’t mind if Fantina was the 5th gym again: In Platinum, her Mismatch was my version of Whitney’s Miltank.

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

I almost prefer to have the Gym Leaders as Diamond/Pearl style, since them having variety on their teams means I can’t crush them with a single crippling type weakness, as I did in my Platinum LP against Volkner and Flint.
But, what I care about the most is variety. If they’ve got a team with more different Pokémon families, that’s also important.
I also do find it unlikely that you’ll have Gym Leaders using Pokémon that aren’t of their type.

I do hope they keep the Fantina/Maylene/Wake order from Platinum, and have Gym Leader rematches.

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

I'm kinda hoping they use the Platinum teams. You have Flint and Volkner who only had like 2 Pokemon on their team of their type specialty.

 

[Kallyle]

I'm thinking they could do a bizarre hybrid of Platinum and DP teams for BDSP to 1) throw people off, 2) satisfy both the original DP vision and Platinum's improvements, and 3) give a little bit of a different experience for players to justify BDSP's purchase beyond nostalgia. For this hypothetical scenario, I'm going to assume ILCA will go with the Gym order from Diamond and Pearl. Here's the improvement's I'd make:

Spoiler: Gym Leaders

1. The first three Gyms have their Platinum teams.
2. Maylene and Crasher Wake have their DP teams due to the order of their gyms in the original DP.
3. I want Fantina to have a team that gives her a mix of what she had in DP and Platinum, with a Dusclops replacing Gengar. However, Duskull doesn't evolve until Level 37, so I think it's best to keep Fantina's DP team.
   • Give her Driftblim a different moveset: Shadow Ball (since Ominous Wind got removed), Acrobatics, Astonish, and Minimize.
4. Byron should have his Platinum team.
5. Candice should have her Platinum team with one exception to this rule: replace her Sneasel with her Medicham from DP and replace Bulk Up with Psychic in order to further combat her Fighting-type weakness.
6. Volkner should have his Platinum team with the following changes:
   • Jolteon will be replaced with his DP Octillery (this time holding an Expert Belt) to help combat his team's Ground-type weakness.
   • His ace is his Luxray (w/ Platinum's moveset and holding an Assault Vest), which swaps levels with his Electivire.

Spoiler: Elite Four and Champion

Aaron has his Platinum team with the following changes:

1. The levels of his team should be like it was in DP, with Yanmega and Scizor both inheriting the level 53 status that Beautify and Dustox had in DP.
2. Scizor should be given the Adrenaline Orb to keep up with his team's speedy nature.
3. Vespiquen needs Heal Order replaced with Leech Life and the Leftovers held item to make up for the move's removal.

Bertha has her Platinum team with the following changes:

1. Level scaling is similar to DP.
   1. Whiscash and Golem are at Level 55.
   2. Gliscor and Rhyperior are at Level 56.
   3. Hippowdon is at Level 59, making it her ace like in DP.
2. Whiscash, Golem, and Hippowdon will be holding the Smooth Rock for the Sandstorm weather condition.

Flint has his Platinum team on him with the following changes:

1. Level scaling is similar to DP.
   1. Houndoom and Flareon are both Level 57.
   2. Rapidash and Magmortar are both Level 58.
   3. Infernape is Level 59, making it his ace like in DP.
2. Houndoom and Rapidash both hold Heat Rocks for the harsh sunlight weather condition.
3. Flareon gets a Focus Sash as the weakest link on the team.
4. Infernape has its Sitrus Berry swapped with an Assault Vest.

Lucian will have his Platinum team with the following changes:

1. Level scaling is similar to DP.
   1. Mr. Mime and Espeon are at Level 59.
   2. Gallade and Alakazam are at Level 60.
   3. Bronzong is at Level 63, making it his ace like in DP.
2. Mr. Mime will have Thunderbolt replaced by Dazzling Gleam to take advantage of its Fairy-type to cover his team's Dark-type weakness.
3. Because of Signal Beam's removal, Espeon will have Future Sight to make up for it.

Cynthia gets her Platinum team with changes suitable for the modern era of Pokémon:

1. Her team's levels match their DP ones.
2. Spiritomb get an overhaul:
   1. Holds a Roseli Berry to compensate for Spiritomb's Fairy-type weakness that didn't exist back in Gen 4.
   2. Has its hidden ability of Infiltrator.
   3. This is Spritomb's moveset to give it better synergy with the rest of her team: Dark Pulse, Facade, Will-O-Wisp, and Hex.
3. Roselia is readjusted:
   1. Holds the Black Sludge item.
   2. Retains its Natural Cure ability.
   3. This is Roselia's new moveset: Energy Ball, Venoshock, Shadow Ball, and Toxic.
4. Togekiss gets a little overhaul:
   1. Holds the Pixie Plate item, referencing Cynthia's interest in Sinnoh's folklore and the fact that the Fairy-type has been added since the time DP first came out.
   2. Has its hidden ability of Super Luck.
   3. This is Togekiss's new moveset: Air Slash, Dazzling Gleam, Mystic Fire, and Psychic.
5. Lucario is remains the same with one exception: it now holds a Petaya Berry.
6. Milotic remains the same with one exception: it now holds a Wacan Berry.
7. Garchomp is touched up:
   1. Holds the Adrenaline Orb.
   2. Retains its Sand Veil ability.
   3. This is Garchomp's new moveset: Dragon Rush, Earthquake, Brick Break, and Iron Head.

The held items part probably won't happen for most of these, but I think having a Pokémon League that incorporates some of Platinum's adjustments and a few examples pulling from the DP roster (and the aces) would be a nice balance between the different Sinnoh iterations while modernizing it at the same time.