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Mafia: The War Room Awards '18 Mafia: Endgame

MegaPod

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Really? I summon you back here and this is all you have to say?
I see a lot of posts from you, but many of them are simple fluff.
It’s the fishiest thing that caught my eye when I came back to the game, so...pretty much.

And that “slip” looks like it could be a setup, but I think it’s wise to let Elieson speak his part on the matter.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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I tend to think not, Podster. That very same thing has nearly happened to me half a dozen times already. It’s difficult to keep track of what you’re copying and what you’re pasting sometimes.
 

AussieEevee

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@Elieson

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@Magnificent Entertainer trying to kill the host? Because that's not scummy :p
 

AussieEevee

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What are your thoughts on the game thus far?
Too much code. It is impossible to get a read on most players.

Max is still sheeping and should be lynched.

jd doesn't look much better.

I still feel worse than my avatar looks.

Jinjo's arguments about kill placement in the FT makes a little bit of sense from their perspective, but I agree that it depends on the host.

Well, that wasn’t an ideal lynch.

Honestly, I really don’t like Ereshkigal’s baseless accusation that Robbie was intentionally orchestrating Town deaths. Also, something bugs me about this post:



Specifically, that first sentence. I know it’s supposed to be taken as a joke, but in the context of a Lie Detector scan, why only Elieson specifically and not Cheff? It seems like possible avoidance to me.
At first sneeze, this post by Megapod seems like CWAC... but they might also have a point about eresh.

The Caps lynch was unnecessary, and I'm not even sure why caps got lynched.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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Honestly, not a bad line of thoughts, AE. I don't agree with some of them, but your assessments definitely are valid.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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Too much code. It is impossible to get a read on most players.
While I agree with the first bit, in relation to your later point about us relying too much on Elie, I disagree that it is impossible to get a read on "most" players.

Max is still sheeping and should be lynched.
This was already explained to be a bad idea, as Max's sheeping is kinda just what he does, regardless of alignment, and he is playing much more like his town self this game than in games like PvD Mafia.

Jinjo's arguments about kill placement in the FT makes a little bit of sense from their perspective, but I agree that it depends on the host.
I don't think Jinjo's argument about kill placement makes any sense whatsoever, and it feels like she's deliberately ignoring actual ongoing content in the game in favor of analyzing the flavor. Usually a scum indicator.

I'm not even sure why caps got lynched.
Again, this was not actually something discussed in length between Elie and I, but I do understand why he was lynched. a) our confirmed town member said he was the best lynch candidate for the day, and b) part of the reason for that, at least from what I can guess, I explain here.
 

AussieEevee

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While I agree with the first bit, in relation to your later point about us relying too much on Elie, I disagree that it is impossible to get a read on "most" players.
Most communication has been in code. The only things not in code is a few things you've said, and random tidbits here and there from other players.

This was already explained to be a bad idea, as Max's sheeping is kinda just what he does, regardless of alignment, and he is playing much more like his town self this game than in games like PvD Mafia.
If you follow that logic to the end point, It would be very easy for max to hide as scum and no one would think twice about his sheeping.

*insert Mido and @Zexy's argument about meta here*

I don't think Jinjo's argument about kill placement makes any sense whatsoever, and it feels like she's deliberately ignoring actual ongoing content in the game in favor of analyzing the flavor. Usually a scum indicator.
I did say from their perspective.

But I've given up trying to understand Jinjo. None of their votes over the past several games I've played with her has made any sense.
Again, this was not actually something discussed in length between Elie and I, but I do understand why he was lynched. a) our confirmed town member said he was the best lynch candidate for the day, and b) part of the reason for that, at least from what I can guess, I explain here.
Ugh. Wall of text! My eyes! How could you do this?!

If I read that correctly - with a large dose of pain killers - Caps was killed because he was non-communicative.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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Most communication has been in code. The only things not in code is a few things you've said, and random tidbits here and there from other players.
There's enough stuff coming in from other players now to get basic readings on a decent number of them.

If you follow that logic to the end point, It would be very easy for max to hide as scum and no one would think twice about his sheeping.

*insert Mido and @Zexy's argument about meta here*
Yes, but that would require a certain level of deviousness that, quite frankly, Max does not have...at least at this time.

I did say from their perspective.

But I've given up trying to understand Jinjo. None of their votes over the past several games I've played with her has made any sense.
I have no idea what kind of warped perspective is necessary for that to be the case, though I was assuming Jinjo to be decent, given her award of Best New Player for last season. I have never played in a game with her until now. I am confused and slightly amused.

Ugh. Wall of text! My eyes! How could you do this?!

If I read that correctly - with a large dose of pain killers - Caps was killed because he was non-communicative.
Again, it's my best guess as to why Elie requested the votes be switched from jd to Caps. I do not know why Elie believes that one of the two of them must be non-Town in the first place, but he does, and he is a confirmed town member...albeit a dead town member.
 

Ereshkigal

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Well, about my joke earlier, they can also test this statement:

I did not kill Elieson or CheffOfGames.

And, here's the key thing: I don't think ME was intentionally leading town deaths. But intent doesn't matter when you've still proven a greater danger than the Mafia through your actions. I nearly got lynched in a past game for doing something similar with only a single kill, and it would have been utterly justified. So, yes, I'm suspicious and questioning, but I also made it a point to bring it up to ME directly and get my questions answered. I may not like the answers, but I can't fault the logic in them.

Yes, I will say I read Max as town as well. Lynching him for sheeping is a mislynch simply because it's what he does. In this way, he is simply one of the better people to keep around since he's a warm body you can count on for a vote, which can be extremely useful in certain situations. I see no reason to kill him when we have better candidates.

JD I don't read as scum. I don't necessarily read him as town, either; I kinda suspect he's an indep laying low and praying no one kills him.

Arthas, I'm pretty certain you're town too.

And, well, I'm at least 2% positive Elieson is town. Call it a hunch :p

What I can't figure out is why Cheff died. And more importantly, how did the mafia know to kill the universal back-up? Leaving him alive meant any important role that got eliminated first would still be around; killing him made any of us with unique abilities or roles irreplaceable. So how did they know what he was? Because the Mafia knowing is the only way I can figure they decided to target him.
 

Ereshkigal

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Unless the Mafia didn't kill Cheff, in which case I have to wonder what the hell was going on last night.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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JD I don't read as scum. I don't necessarily read him as town, either; I kinda suspect he's an indep laying low and praying no one kills him.
So you think jd is the serial killer that Elie was talking about earlier?
In that case, it was likely jd who killed Elie.
What I can't figure out is why Cheff died. And more importantly, how did the mafia know to kill the universal back-up? Leaving him alive meant any important role that got eliminated first would still be around; killing him made any of us with unique abilities or roles irreplaceable. So how did they know what he was? Because the Mafia knowing is the only way I can figure they decided to target him.
Again, I think you're overthinking this. On night one, Mafia has two options.
Option A: go for the power players and hope to Arceus that that aren't being protected by the Doctor. I've already explained why Mafia didn't off Elie. As for me, I'm guessing they assumed that, with Elie deliberately asking to not be protected, I would be the next logical choice for protection. Most mafia teams stay away from this option because of the possibility of getting kill blocked which, this early in the game, could be problematic.
Option 2: go for a low protection priority target and hope to generate confusion with the kill or hit a power role. All in all, this isn't a terrible strategy, because sometimes the players who are the most silent are power roles trying to hide, and it pretty much guarantees a "safe" kill. Cheff had done little to nothing in the game before getting killed, ergo nobody would even think about protecting him, unless he happened to be the Doctor, and, even then, it was possible that he'd think he avoided detection enough to protect someone "more valuable."

So, no, the mafia had no clue about the universal backup. All they knew was that Cheff was a very low priority for Doc protection, and therefore was a "safe" kill. That is why they chose to target him.
 

Kyriaki

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@Klavier Gavin okay, I like your post above, but can you form a conclusion or final thoughts summary?

Seems like you find jd’s votes simple but with good reasoning and some of his posts mildly suspicious.
Aside from the slightly scummy posts, I don't think jdthebud is an immediate threat to town.

So, no, the mafia had no clue about the universal backup. All they knew was that Cheff was a very low priority for Doc protection, and therefore was a "safe" kill. That is why they chose to target him.
Reading this makes me want to vote for you because you know so much about the psychology of the mafia side.
 

AussieEevee

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There's enough stuff coming in from other players now to get basic readings on a decent number of them.
Maybe I'm just not seeing it then.

Yes, but that would require a certain level of deviousness that, quite frankly, Max does not have...at least at this time.
I would have said the same thing about you prior to Build It mafia.

I have no idea what kind of warped perspective is necessary for that to be the case, though I was assuming Jinjo to be decent, given her award of Best New Player for last season. I have never played in a game with her until now. I am confused and slightly amused.
Let's put it this way. Last game she voted me for no reason, simply because I didn't respond to a claim by the person I was voting.

Now, in her favour, I was the godfather that game... but that lynch bandwagon still makes no sense.

Again, it's my best guess as to why Elie requested the votes be switched from jd to Caps. I do not know why Elie believes that one of the two of them must be non-Town in the first place, but he does, and he is a confirmed town member...albeit a dead town member.
Yes, I will say I read Max as town as well. Lynching him for sheeping is a mislynch simply because it's what he does. In this way, he is simply one of the better people to keep around since he's a warm body you can count on for a vote, which can be extremely useful in certain situations. I see no reason to kill him when we have better candidates.
Dismissing him for meta is an equally bad thing to do.

Arthas, I'm pretty certain you're town too.
Why?

No, seriously. I know I'm town, but why are you certain I am?

I have to wonder what the hell was going on last night.
I've been wondering that all day.
 

Magnificent Entertainer

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Aside from the slightly scummy posts, I don't think jdthebud is an immediate threat to town.
What about the theory Eresh had, that jd is a lurking Indep?


Reading this makes me want to vote for you because you know so much about the psychology of the mafia side.
Seriously? 1) it's basic Mafia 101, and b) even if it wasn't, it's simple strategy. I think like a strategist, hence why I am so good at this game.

I would have said the same thing about you prior to Build It mafia.
The difference between Max and I on this one is that I kept getting lynched or killed on D1/N1 for no good reasons whatsoever. Either bad luck, joke votes, or something else of that nature.
The skill was always there, as evidenced by Random Messages Mafia, my first time as Godfather (and Mafia in general), where I played D1 so flawlessly that a Jester looking to get lynched picked me to have a fake scumcheck on.
I was always good at blending in with Town.
Max...well, he's a work in progress. Given time and enough practice, he'll be just as devious as I am some day. Now is not that day.

Let's put it this way. Last game she voted me for no reason, simply because I didn't respond to a claim by the person I was voting.

Now, in her favour, I was the godfather that game... but that lynch bandwagon still makes no sense.
I see, so her play style is utter nonsense that somehow seems to work out randomly.
...sounds about right.
 
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