SwSh There are petitions about Gamefreak fixing the 'Galar Pokedex' thing

[TheElderKing]

I wish there’ll be something in the games they choose to focus on instead of bringing back the whole dex, but the possibility that they took this decision to use it in the future, for when they’ll decide to improve in a deeper way on models and animation, or maybe for when the number of Pokémon will be truly daunting, is not unrealistic.

This way they’d take the bulk of the criticism now, and if there won’t be any tangible effect on the sales (even more so if the games turn out to be good), they’ll apply the same mindset for the future. Criticism on a limited number of Pokémon available will always be present, but it won’t be the same as it is right now.

If the reason is limited to some problems in development or rushing to get the game out, they wouldn’t have been so adamant in stating that this is their approach for the future.

 

[Tsutsayosdi]

Guess what? They are gonna sell 15 million copies (if not more).
They chose to ignore this protest and (even more irritating) they didn't even bother to justify the cut properly. TPCi is huge, if this is how they chose to handle their games, there's really nothing you can do. They know the games will sell no matter what. They just know and the way they are ignoring the biggest protest in their history is proof they feel safe.

They've been ignoring the protest so far, and yes, I know that means they feel secure that they're decision won't hit them hard enough to justify overturning their decision in future. I'm positive that they'll sell millions of copies. But we don't have global sale numbers yet, and if they sell even that 1 million less than Sun and Moon did(SuMo sold over 16 million copies to date), that's still a hit that they'll feel. The market solution can only be so effective, but things add up until the company course corrects, or collapses from repeated failure to do so.

As upset as I am at the loss of the full roster, it's not enough for me to give up on buying the games yet, but for everyone that does feel that strongly, I advise them to hold fast to that and I support their decision to do so.

 

[Poke Dragon]

A big part of the problem is the fact that TPC is now relying on mobile games because of microtransactions, thus they aren't relying primarily on Game Freak anymore. This is a big problem for the Pokemon series as this could be partly why Game Freak isn't putting effort into their Pokemon games anymore. I do feel like Town has some part of harming the Pokemon games' potential because that has their A team while the B team worked on Pokemon.

This is why banning microtransactions will be a good thing not only for Pokemon, but for video-games in general. Many crappy practices like releasing an unfinished game just to sell the rest of the content to the player are why companies like EA have such a bad reputation. DLC should be an optional addition to the game, not a needed part to make the game complete.

 

[Joker901]

They've been ignoring the protest so far, and yes, I know that means they feel secure that they're decision won't hit them hard enough to justify overturning their decision in future. I'm positive that they'll sell millions of copies. But we don't have global sale numbers yet, and if they sell even that 1 million less than Sun and Moon did(SuMo sold over 16 million copies to date), that's still a hit that they'll feel. The market solution can only be so effective, but things add up until the company course corrects, or collapses from repeated failure to do so.

As upset as I am at the loss of the full roster, it's not enough for me to give up on buying the games yet, but for everyone that does feel that strongly, I advise them to hold fast to that and I support their decision to do so.

They will still earn more money than any other previous game. Remember that these games cost 60 dollars. For instance, if sw/sh "only" sell 10.5 milions copies they will reach the same earnings of s/m. If they sell 15 milions copies (which is the most likely number) they'll earn 250 milions more than s/m (a total of 900 milions).
They know they can win easly. And not just that, I mean, are we even sure the budget for these games is higher than s/m? Cause it doesn't seem the case. So no matter what, they will earn tons of money with the same effort.
Let's go games sold 10 milions copies (almost the same amount of total earnings of s/m). And you know, Let's go is not exactly the game of the decade.

 

[TheElderKing]

Wasn’t it already stated that the translation about the A and B team was partially wrong? From what I gathered (and I thought Joe Merrick mentioned that) is more about letting some of their developers experiment on Town to build experience on other fields, and bring that experience back to Pokémon, and not about Town’s team being the ‘best’ team.

 

[Tsutsayosdi]

They will still earn more money than any other previous game. Remember that these games cost 60 dollars. For instance, if sw/sh "only" sell 10.5 milions copies they will reach the same earnings of s/m. If they sell 15 milions copies (which is the most likely number) they'll earn 250 milions more than s/m (a total of 900 milions).
They know they can win easly. And not just that, I mean, are we even sure the budget for these games is higher than s/m? Cause it doesn't seem the case. So no matter what, they will earn tons of money with the same effort.
Let's go games sold 10 milions copies (almost the same amount of total earnings of s/m). And you know, Let's go is not exactly the game of the decade.

And as I've already stated, there's a good chance of that, or something close. But that's the point of utilizing social capital. Being pessimistic and just caving into fatalistic attitude does nothingSpread the message. Convince people to boycott (It doesn't even have to be a unilateral or permanent boycott, it could be a concerted effort to not buy the games for long as 2 months after release to get the point across. Express your dissatisfaction and get others to join the cause. And if not enough people mobilize in time for Sword and Shield, keep building and try again next release. Start a proletariat revolution. They can't stop/ignore all of us.

Wasn’t it already stated that the translation about the A and B team was partially wrong? From what I gathered (and I thought Joe Merrick mentioned that) is more about letting some of their developers experiment on Town to build experience on other fields, and bring that experience back to Pokémon, and not about Town’s team being the ‘best’ team.

It wasn't even a mistranslation from what I read. Just a conclusion people jumped to that ended up horribly wrong. Town isn't taking away from Pokemon's quality,because devs work on it either outside of their part in the Pokemon development cycle, or for small periods before returning with fresh eyes for Pokemon. It's been well-researched an established that these kinds of breaks are good for morale and productivity. And there's no A team of good developers, and B team of bad developers working on different games. There are two teams staggering workloads to share in the burden, but who's on what team is in flux.

 

[Knightwolf09]

Got a bit bored so let me throw my 2 cents in. I still believe that boycotting solves nothing in this regard. Not only because they're being admant on this decision, but there's too many people that flat out don't care about not every pokemon being in or don't let this decision effect them as badly as others say it does. My point being pokemon won't lose because the fandom is apparently so divided in what they like and enjoy about the games. And while one side thinks the other is settling for less, the other feels the opposite and are just overall excited. So because either side won't agree with the other, one side boycotting or outrage doesn't effect them or the franchise in the grand scheme of things. Best thing the negative side can do, is simply not buy the game and just skip rather than just sitting, pounting, and arguing with others about. Nobody in the fanbase has ever had a problem with skipping games before. So my argument isn't the Pokemon's too big to fail, but pokemon will always have success from people who tolerate flaws.

 

[Joker901]

And as I've already stated, there's a good chance of that, or something close. But that's the point of utilizing social capital. Being pessimistic and just caving into fatalistic attitude does nothingSpread the message. Convince people to boycott (It doesn't even have to be a unilateral or permanent boycott, it could be a concerted effort to not buy the games for long as 2 months after release to get the point across. Express your dissatisfaction and get others to join the cause. And if not enough people mobilize in time for Sword and Shield, keep building and try again next release. Start a proletariat revolution. They can't stop/ignore all of us.

What you don't take in consideration is that those who you are asking to boycott the games are not Tpci target audience. I mean, isn't It obvious that they are desperately trying to appeal to a new and younger audience?
They want kids, because at the TPCi they are the first ones to think pokemon is for kids. This is why most of the features that old fans want are being cut from the games, this is because the games are easier year after year, this is why having 900 pokemon in a game is a problem, this is why competitive player after 23 years still have to restart the game any time in a new season they need a legend with a different nature.
Kids don't care about graphics, models, protests or hashtags. They want a handheld console to catch pokemon and battle friends. And this is what GF is delivering...

 

[TechSkylander1518]

Best thing the negative side can do, is simply not buy the game and just skip rather than just sitting, pounting, and arguing with others about.

What's so bad about people expressing their opinion online? You opened up your post with this:

Got a bit bored so let me throw my 2 cents in.

If you can express your opinion just because you're bored, what's wrong with other people expressing their opinion because they're frustrated or unsatisfied?

Best thing the negative side can do, is simply not buy the game and just skip

I still believe that boycotting solves nothing in this regard.

Do you know what boycotting means?

 

[Poke Dragon]

Don't silence me when I have a complaint, I have the right to complain online all I want, just like everyone else who are dissatisfied with Game Freak as of late.

 

[Silktree]

Knightwolf09 probably thinks of boycott as the more in-your-face expression of it on social media. But yes, for most people it's just the decision to avoid buying a product.

I think that the best thing to do is create a page that lists all the missing Pokemon (hopefully we'll know them before the release thanks to a demo) and simply explains that there is no telling when those Pokemon will come back. Then spread the word via social media and hope that other fans get the message; it's their decision beyond that.

 

[Tsutsayosdi]

Got a bit bored so let me throw my 2 cents in. I still believe that boycotting solves nothing in this regard. Not only because they're being admant on this decision, but there's too many people that flat out don't care about not every pokemon being in or don't let this decision effect them as badly as others say it does. My point being pokemon won't lose because the fandom is apparently so divided in what they like and enjoy about the games. And while one side thinks the other is settling for less, the other feels the opposite and are just overall excited. So because either side won't agree with the other, one side boycotting or outrage doesn't effect them or the franchise in the grand scheme of things. Best thing the negative side can do, is simply not buy the game and just skip rather than just sitting, pounting, and arguing with others about. Nobody in the fanbase has ever had a problem with skipping games before. So my argument isn't the Pokemon's too big to fail, but pokemon will always have success from people who tolerate flaws.

I know this is going to sound harsh, but I mean it with only matter-of-fact flatness that I don't want your 2 cents. You're pretty stuck in your opinion on this, and you manage sympathy but never empathy to the people who are more emotionally invested in the change. That's not worth anything to me. This isn't just about skipping a generation, and people aren't just sitting arms akimbo and pouting. Just that very description you gave is disingenuous and makes your attempts at placation feeble and hollow.

Skipping a generation is a boycott. I skipped generation 3 and almost skipped generation 5 because of time and money constraints (and also because RSE didn't have some of my favorites from generation 2). I almost didn't play generation 6 because at the time, I didn't think Mega Evolution was a good direction for the series, and I know someone who quit playing because Mega Evolution was "too Digimon".
People don't want to just skip a generation if the policy going forward is undesirable. Sure, you're right that the fanbase is divided but that's the whole point of bringing up social capital. If you want something out of society -or on a drastically smaller scope, a video game. You have to bring it up and make the attempt to convince people to either want the same thing or to convince people that helping you get the thing isn't inconvenient to them.

Like, I get it. Pokemon's a video game. It's not a social injustice that Pokemon have been cut from the roster and Pokemon are planned to be cut from every roster from now on, and the people who are upset do need to not apply the level of outrage that is only appropriate for actual injustices.
But it is something with emotional weight. It is a franchise with which people have developed strong parasocial relationships - both at the level of the franchise as a whole, and at the level of characters and Pokemon. There is a very real grief process involved with this. Social injustice or not, individuals have invested time and vested interests in playing Pokemon with the characters in the roster that they want to. They have a desire for the games that positively impacts them and does not inherently impact anyone negatively.

I know that I've pressed that I'm not so upset that I'm ready to leave the franchise; Pokemon has been a Special Interest of mine since I got Red version at age 7. I am sure that I am still going to have fun without the whole roster...
but I don't know if I can effectively communicate just how much of a blow it actually is to me that Pokemon are going to be cut every time new games are released. My service dog is named after a Pokemon, and it is emotionally fulfilling to represent her in my games as her namesake. No exaggeration, because she's so integral to my everyday function, I can almost consider that bond in the game the truest representation of me in the games - beyond any customization I can do to my avatar.
Now I have to wonder every time whether that Pokemon is going to be in the game. And if not, welp, Houndoom, guess you're not joining me on this adventure. I'll live but it's important to me and that makes me sad.

What you don't take in consideration is that those who you are asking to boycott the games are not Tpci target audience. I mean, isn't It obvious that they are desperately trying to appeal to a new and younger audience?
They want kids, because at the TPCi they are the first ones to think pokemon is for kids. This is why most of the features that old fans want are being cut from the games, this is because the games are easier year after year, this is why having 900 pokemon in a game is a problem, this is why competitive player after 23 years still have to restart the game any time in a new season they need a legend with a different nature.
Kids don't care about graphics, models, protests or hashtags. They want a handheld console to catch pokemon and battle friends. And this is what GF is delivering...

Game Freak's audience is the genera; they aren't after a specific demographic, they want kids and adults alike. That's something they have explicitly stated. Most 'cut' features are just refined into a new mechanic or feature, or are, as Knightwolf suggested, just a lot more divided on than you give credit for.
And kids are a very wide range of people. There are kids that are graphics snobs. There are kids who care about their favorite Pokemon not being in the next game. There are kids who absolutely care about protests. And it's a lot rarer that you'll find a kid who doesn't care about hashtags than finding one who does. Kids are a lot more diverse, aware, and capable than you, and Masuda san alike seem to believe.


TL;DR, the people who are upset about this deserve to make the continuous attempt to get Game Freak to overturn their policy going forward before eventually make the incredibly difficult decision of abandoning the franchise for good. And that includes voicing their opinions and reasonings and mobilization strategies to other people in the hopes of solidarity.

 

[Knightwolf09]

What's so bad about people expressing their opinion online? You opened up your post with this:

Nothing, but holding, repeating, and sitting on those opinions for over a month is leaning on the obsessive side negativity. It's more than fine to express your displeasure, but most people just move forward from it with those feelings in tact.

If you can express your opinion just because you're bored, what's wrong with other people expressing their opinion because they're frustrated or unsatisfied?

Nothing wrong. I just kinda had nothing else to do so I chimed in is all

Do you know what boycotting means?

I'm pretty sure I do, but your making skipping games have a message behind it and stuff when people just originally skip the game cause it wasn't for them you know?

 

[Joker901]

I know this is going to sound harsh, but I mean it with only matter-of-fact flatness that I don't want your 2 cents. You're pretty stuck in your opinion on this, and you manage sympathy but never empathy to the people who are more emotionally invested in the change. That's not worth anything to me. This isn't just about skipping a generation, and people aren't just sitting arms akimbo and pouting. Just that very description you gave is disingenuous and makes your attempts at placation feeble and hollow.

Skipping a generation is a boycott. I skipped generation 3 and almost skipped generation 5 because of time and money constraints (and also because RSE didn't have some of my favorites from generation 2). I almost didn't play generation 6 because at the time, I didn't think Mega Evolution was a good direction for the series, and I know someone who quit playing because Mega Evolution was "too Digimon".
People don't want to just skip a generation if the policy going forward is undesirable. Sure, you're right that the fanbase is divided but that's the whole point of bringing up social capital. If you want something out of society -or on a drastically smaller scope, a video game. You have to bring it up and make the attempt to convince people to either want the same thing or to convince people that helping you get the thing isn't inconvenient to them.

Like, I get it. Pokemon's a video game. It's not a social injustice that Pokemon have been cut from the roster and Pokemon are planned to be cut from every roster from now on, and the people who are upset do need to not apply the level of outrage that is only appropriate for actual injustices.
But it is something with emotional weight. It is a franchise with which people have developed strong parasocial relationships - both at the level of the franchise as a whole, and at the level of characters and Pokemon. There is a very real grief process involved with this. Social injustice or not, individuals have invested time and vested interests in playing Pokemon with the characters in the roster that they want to. They have a desire for the games that positively impacts them and does not inherently impact anyone negatively.

I know that I've pressed that I'm not so upset that I'm ready to leave the franchise; Pokemon has been a Special Interest of mine since I got Red version at age 7. I am sure that I am still going to have fun without the whole roster...
but I don't know if I can effectively communicate just how much of a blow it actually is to me that Pokemon are going to be cut every time new games are released. My service dog is named after a Pokemon, and it is emotionally fulfilling to represent her in my games as her namesake. No exaggeration, because she's so integral to my everyday function, I can almost consider that bond in the game the truest representation of me in the games - beyond any customization I can do to my avatar.
Now I have to wonder every time whether that Pokemon is going to be in the game. And if not, welp, Houndoom, guess you're not joining me on this adventure. I'll live but it's important to me and that makes me sad.


Game Freak's audience is the genera; they aren't after a specific demographic, they want kids and adults alike. That's something they have explicitly stated. Most 'cut' features are just refined into a new mechanic or feature, or are, as Knightwolf suggested, just a lot more divided on than you give credit for.
And kids are a very wide range of people. There are kids that are graphics snobs. There are kids who care about their favorite Pokemon not being in the next game. There are kids who absolutely care about protests. And it's a lot rarer that you'll find a kid who doesn't care about hashtags than finding one who does. Kids are a lot more diverse, aware, and capable than you, and Masuda san alike seem to believe.


TL;DR, the people who are upset about this deserve to make the continuous attempt to get Game Freak to overturn their policy going forward before eventually make the incredibly difficult decision of abandoning the franchise for good. And that includes voicing their opinions and reasonings and mobilization strategies to other people in the hopes of solidarity.

They made surveys about sw/sh, stating they were interested in particular to kids from 8 to 15 years old. If you have no preference on the targets, you don't underline you are interested in kids opinion.

 

[TechSkylander1518]

Nothing, but holding, repeating, and sitting on those opinions for over a month is leaning on the obsessive side negativity. It's more than fine to express your displeasure, but most people just move forward from it with those feelings in tact.

You've also been repeating your opinion that the removal isn't that big a deal, and people shouldn't be criticizing it.

I really don't like this reaction. My boy Inferenape, or Incineroar, or even my shiny Naganadel might not be in the game, but I'm not gonna ignore the game cause of that.

What's the point in buying the game then even if you could transfer all you pokemon. You game might as well be another bank?

Why aren't you just moving forward yourself if you think it's such a bad thing?

I also don't see how you can argue that "holding and sitting on those opinions for over a month is leaning on the obsessive side", but then say that "most people just move forward from it with those feelings intact". It's pretty contradictory to say "you shouldn't hold onto these opinions, you should just keep your feelings intact".

I'm pretty sure I do, but your making skipping games have a message behind it and stuff when people just originally skip the game cause it wasn't for them you know?

Isn't "I don't like this game" a message in itself?

 

[Tsutsayosdi]

They made surveys about sw/sh, stating they were interested in particular to kids from 8 to 15 years old. If you have no preference on the targets, you don't underline you are interested in kids opinion.

Or, Occam's Razor, they very clearly already had adult opinions and gave Japanese children a platform to voice their own.
Again, they've explicitly stated they want their games to be for the whole family. Also, LGPE had a marketing campaign for fathers. Competitive battling, in and of itself, is for late teens and adults who have thecognitive development to pursue the complex strategies and tactics associated with what makes teams effective or even meta.

 

[Joker901]

Or, Occam's Razor, they very clearly already had adult opinions and gave Japanese children a platform to voice their own.
Again, they've explicitly stated they want their games to be for the whole family. Also, LGPE had a marketing campaign for fathers. Competitive battling, in and of itself, is for late teens and adults who have thecognitive development to pursue the complex strategies and tactics associated with what makes teams effective or even meta.

Clearly they cannot say "we don't want adults to play pokemon", why should they cut possibilities themselves? What I'm saying is that children are their main target. Masuda said they had to cut things like the battle frontier because children have no that much time to dedicated to games; he said they had to reduce the difficulty level because children would feel frustrated. When is the last time you heard anyone from GF saying they made something because they thought older fans wanted it?
Please, don't use competitive as an example. Competitive players just don't exist for GF or they wouldn't force them to run with eggs for 5 hours to get a pokemon with the right nature and ivs. Do you realize that if Tapu Lele is played with a modest nature in next season rather than a timid, a competitive player who, legally, wants to use a Tapu lele, has to restart and replay the all game and soft-reset for 2 days (without being able to skip cut scenes) to get a good one with right ivs and nature?

 

[Knightwolf09]

You've also been repeating your opinion that the removal isn't that big a deal, and people shouldn't be criticizing it.

Never have I said or implied you shouldn't criticize man. Everyone's more than free. I just only believed people blow their displeasure more out of proportion than they intend. But that's personal opinion

Why aren't you just moving forward yourself if you think it's such a bad thing?

I did move forward. I already stated I was also a bit disappointed, but I don't let it dictate my feelings of excitement over that I still had, which is why I still plan to enjoy the game. It may be a flaw in the game but it's one I can live with. And I know many people have that ability to do as well. But the negativity spreads and cause everyone to argue and snap at one another. And I kinda want it to stop already cause it's been over a month now and we're still going at it.

I also don't see how you can argue that "holding and sitting on those opinions for over a month is leaning on the obsessive side", but then say that "most people just move forward from it with those feelings intact". It's pretty contradictory to say "you shouldn't hold onto these opinions, you should just keep your feelings intact".

Hmm maybe I didn't properly word what I meant. What I mean is that brooding over the negative opinion for such a long period, can lead to stress like it did me arguing to others over the issue. It's one thing to give an opinion but to be stuck on repeat, and mulling over it only makes you obsessed to get your point across, which leads to the arguing and more negativity spreading. I mean dude, you even pulled a quote of something i wrote days ago just to use against me, like you memorized it and saved it to use against me. That's a bit much for an argument

Isn't "I don't like this game" a message in itself?

That's not really a message. You guys are going for "We're not buying your game until you give us what we want" not "Nah this game isn't for me". You boycott to make a change, not just state opinion.

 

[Icy Wind]

How is this thread still going on lol.

Everyone is just repeating the same arguments over and over again.

 

[Knightwolf09]

How is this thread still going on lol.

Everyone is just repeating the same arguments over and over again.

Kinda my point exactly. Everyone's just on repeat over their issues, and I'm no less guilty cause all I do is argue back, and I believe that's what was leading to my stress