Traditional games put on hold?

[Archaic]

I knew in advance that only a limited number of readers would pay respect by contributing to the discussion I started, but never did I imagine they would not come from Bulbagarden. Forgive me if this offends anyone, but I do believe I have earned my right of criticism.

You most certainly have. I'm quite frankly amazed that such a discussion could happen on SPPf (And I do have to wonder why that person isn't registered here), and only wish that I'd had the time to properly respond to your article here, so that we might have had a similar discussion.

 

[Silktree]

You most certainly have. I'm quite frankly amazed that such a discussion could happen on SPPf (And I do have to wonder why that person isn't registered here), and only wish that I'd had the time to properly respond to your article here, so that we might have had a similar discussion.

Which person? There are five posters other than Kein (who I hope you realize is my alternate user name). My thread has generated a lot of views, but only so many replies by the same group of members.

I cannot provide you an answer as to why these posters are not registered here. But you speak of it as though it were too late; I only published my editorial slightly over a week ago, and my claims have yet to be refuted.

Truthfully, the editorial and complementary excessively long posts are meant for the narrow-minded. If you do not view the idea of a third game as preposterous, can see how Game Freak would have had the time to develop it, and why Nintendo may now allow its release - you can freely move onto the bulk of the discussion.

I am particularly interested in your input, being a temporary resident of Japan who was exposed to the Joyspot service in its glory. Additionally, perhaps you can shed light on how feasible it is to develop a GBA game with further use on the Nintendo DS, as done with the non-Japanese version of Yellow for the Game Boy Color.

 

[Archaic]

I was referring to Eszett.

What specific points would you like my input on? Sadly, I'm not really sure how much more I can really say, that you haven't already brought up.

On the issue of the feasibility of a GBA game with extended usage on a DS, ala Gameboy Colour games....while it's certainly feasible, I think we'd be more likely to see a new split game akin to Mysterious Dungeon, than just one game with enhanced DS functionality. More likely would be a new game which comes out only on DS. Nintendo are simply too focused at this point in time on broadening the install base of the DS console, for them to release a portable game which won't increase demand there.
Certainly though, I don't see another game in the path series as being impossible. A game based on Contests, Pokémon Breeding, or even a Nintendogs like Pokémon game (Pokémon Channel anyone?) would all be quite possible, the last of these especially.

 

[GreatLiver]

A game merging all three of the suggestions Archaic gave is plausible. You would be able to interact with you pokemon and by using toys you could make routines for your pokemon to do while in the contest. Also you might have to breed two pokemon who are good at contests for a pokemon that would be very good at contests. You would also have to use common breeder knowledge by making pokeblocks and keeping its appearence nice.

 

[Archaic]

Ehhh....I was actually thinking a game based on one concept or the other....though I suppose Nintendogs itself did do contests and everything, didn't it? ^^;;

The issue there would be, can you trade these Pokémon to and from Diamond/Pearl or not, or would the game just be totally independant.

 

[Eszett]

Stop the presses, I'm here. ;o

Anyways, as much as the desire for GF to make any more third-gen games may be, I'm not expecting that they will be able to fit it into their schedule at this point in time. Considering that Diamond and Pearl will need to be released on schedule lest the fanbase get antsy to the point of anger, the developers can't cut out a chunk of time to focus on another project. If I recall correctly, as I said at SPPf, removing focus on either game will either lead to D/P or this game being disproportionately more enjoyable than the other game, or otherwise both games will be good, but not to the level of greatness that we expect from Gamefreak.

The only way I could see them developing such a game is if Gamefreak finishes D/P ahead of schedule and can manage to finalize a strong product before the expected release date, allowing them time to work on a quick endeavor that would be the last stretch in The Path to Diamond and Pearl. I wouldn't be too opposed to this, actually; it could provide a glimpse of what we should expect in D/P and its Pokemon through a facility similar to Bonsly's use in Diamond and Pearl, plus it could re-emphasize the connectivity that will be present between the third-generation games and D/P.

However, I would rather them focus on making D/P a quality game before they consider to extend the third generation any more.

 

[Nomekop Oen]

I don't think angering the fanbase is something they should worry about.It's diminishing interest that's the real problem.Which is why revealing some big stuff at E3 may not be such a bad idea.They need to create some kind of buzz for this game,especially during this huge of a news drought.Really,how much people actually know about D/P other than the initiated?



And is it possible that the reason they're taking so long with D/P is that they are structuring some huge online community for this game? Would something like that take a long time to develop?

 

[Archaic]

The only way I could see them developing such a game is if Gamefreak finishes D/P ahead of schedule and can manage to finalize a strong product before the expected release date, allowing them time to work on a quick endeavor that would be the last stretch in The Path to Diamond and Pearl. I wouldn't be too opposed to this, actually; it could provide a glimpse of what we should expect in D/P and its Pokemon through a facility similar to Bonsly's use in Diamond and Pearl, plus it could re-emphasize the connectivity that will be present between the third-generation games and D/P.

However, I would rather them focus on making D/P a quality game before they consider to extend the third generation any more.

What we rather they will do, and what they will do in search of profits, are two totally different things.

Don't forget either, there are more development studios than just Game Freak which have worked on the Pokémon franchise. Genius Sonority for instance. Especially with a take off of Nintendogs, where the basic engine for the game is already in existance, it would not be difficult at all to bring the game all the way from development to release in Japan within a 6 month time frame. Hell, they already did it once before, this generation even, with Fire Red and Leaf Green.

 

[GreatLiver]

And is it possible that the reason they're taking so long with D/P is that they are structuring some huge online community for this game? Would something like that take a long time to develop?

I think it's more that they're having trouble developing all the new pokemon they want to have

 

[Doctor Oak]

I think it's more that they're having trouble developing all the new pokemon they want to have

The Pokemon would have been one of the first things concreted years ago. Whilst finalising moves, some designs and even what Pokemon to include may well last right until the game goes Gold, they are by far the least problematic feature of the games thanks to the heavy development period they have.

Including an online feature and global infra-structure HAS delayed other DS games. Specifically, Metroid Hunters - gaining a 6 month delay to include the feature. It is entirely possible that taking the games online was a finalised desicion not made until the WiFi Connection launched and just what could be done with it was made clear. Afterall, the devlopers of Hunters claimed that they didn't think the game would be able to work online until they had the chance to test it and that's why they delayed to include it.

With the WiFi Connection only being available to developers since last summer, it would make some sense that D/P has been pulled back a little since then to either include the feature or take greater advantage of it. The announcement that the games would miss the previous estimation of the end of last year and slip into sometime this year does fit into that period of time where they would be in a position to make the choice.

I don't think angering the fanbase is something they should worry about.It's diminishing interest that's the real problem.

The delay of Diamond and Pearl is no problem whatsoever. Whilst we all would like to learn what this game is actually about, it makes NO difference whether we learn it tommorow or 3 months from now. Our reaction will be the same and the games will be a typical success, both financially and as a boost to the franchise (and the DS).

Gamefreak can do what they wish over the coverage of the games. They don't have to answer to what the english fans want in that respect. They only have to make a game that Pokemon fans globally will enjoy and how much we know of the run-up to it is meaningless.

Which is why revealing some big stuff at E3 may not be such a bad idea

E3 is not a Japanese trade-show. It's an American one. Whilst it's impossible to rule out Diamond and Pearl premiering at E3, it's a good 99% more likely that the english versions of Ranger and Mysterious Dungeon will be there for Pokemon instead - as they're the ones that will involve the American/Western press most. If Diamond and Pearl are to make an appearence at a trade-show, it'll be the Japanese equivilent a little under 3 months later.

They need to create some kind of buzz for this game

A) Don't you think the buzz already here is sufficient for now? Afterall, we, like you said, know next-to-nothing about the games and yet they're all people talk about.
B) The buzz will not be started off in the West. The western world may not even get these games this year depending on the scheudles so really, worrying about what the ickle American fans want is a pointless venture for Gamefreak.

 

[Jukain]

I checked the numbers, and without another main game inbetween, we are possibly looking at the longest gap between main games since Crystal and Ru/Sa. (1y 11m 7d) We just didn't know about the development of Ru/Sa for as long as we've known this one, which has taken a turn akin to G/S. We assume this gap is because they could be working on something else, but it could also be that like G/S, they goofed, and it will indeed take them longer to make the necessary modifications. (I know it isn't exactly the same, but it's close enough) We know that not too much is being done to the pokemon data itself, because all of the third gen can transfer to D/P. Is it really that complicated to include all of the DS's features in a pokemon game? It could be, but I would need a precedent if there is one. Right now, it could be either possibility, and both have just about an equal chance of happening, whether it's a secret game or they discovered something truly interesting they can do with the DS and they wanted to include it.

EDIT: I type really slow and Doctor Oak answered for me.

 

[FabuVinny]

I can see Diamond and Pearl getting some mention if future plans for WiFi are mentioned but the main emphasis for Nintendo will be the Revolution and as we know that there will be no concrete plans for a Pokémon game there until after revelations at E3, Mysterious Dungeon/Ranger will be the main showing for Pokémon.

The run-up started with Munchlax, who is even a regular character in the dub of the anime now. Another eight Pokémon later and we know a few things already, even if nothing is known about the actual gameplay.

The Path games went to GBA with Mysterious Dungeon Red and so we aren't missing anything. The only thing making me wonder about another game is the release of Ranger in March creating a large gap between it and D/P.

 

[Jukain]

Path has been quite deceptive. All games involved with it came out really close together. MD was about a month from Trozei. Ranger was about 4 months after that. Trozei itself came out a bit over a year after Emerald. We have not included them because Gamefreak had nothing to do with any of them. Creatures was involved in Ranger, but that's it. I don't even know what their role is. Anyway, there is definitely room for another game in there, but it would be so close to D/P that there would be little purpose to it. It is an 8 month gap, so who knows.

 

[Eszett]

What we rather they will do, and what they will do in search of profits, are two totally different things.

Considering how much people want to have Diamond and Pearl and also considering that practically everybody who wants a third-gen game has one, I'd surmise that developing Diamond and Pearl would be more advantageous for GF right now than working on another project simulaneously.

Don't forget either, there are more development studios than just Game Freak which have worked on the Pokémon franchise. Genius Sonority for instance. Especially with a take off of Nintendogs, where the basic engine for the game is already in existance, it would not be difficult at all to bring the game all the way from development to release in Japan within a 6 month time frame. Hell, they already did it once before, this generation even, with Fire Red and Leaf Green.

True, these companies could easily develop games which is essentially the entirety of Path, but as I see it now Unown Lord seems to emphasize that this game would come from GF. I certainly don't think Nintendo would commission any other company to make a component of the handheld RPG aspect of these games which have remained this franchise's enduring legacy, but they would instantly transfer any other project related to Pokemon to another company, especially at a critical time such as this one. When the fans what what the company is willing to do for profit, only a fool would fail to make an endeavor by capitalizing on the demand.

Path has been quite deceptive. All games involved with it came out really close together. MD was about a month from Trozei. Ranger was about 4 months after that. Trozei itself came out a bit over a year after Emerald. We have not included them because Gamefreak had nothing to do with any of them. Creatures was involved in Ranger, but that's it. I don't even know what their role is. Anyway, there is definitely room for another game in there, but it would be so close to D/P that there would be little purpose to it. It is an 8 month gap, so who knows.

It is a long gap to wait for the next installments of the main RPGs, but as you mentioned how long the gap was between Crystal and Ru/Sa, the community has shown that they are willing to wait however long it must - within reason, of course - for the delivery of a good game rather than a rushed, ho-hum game. Despite the lack of focus towards Diamond and Pearl, we are constantly being reminded of its imminent arrival, what with Munchlax's, and later, Bonsly's ubiquitous presence in the anime to the featuring of Manyula, Manene, and Lucario in the eighth movie. Now, as we approach the ninth movie, we have knowledge on four more Pokemon, and a while after that we have learned about a new move within the game, Meteoric Swarm.

My point is that even with little hints such as this and the occasional press inquiries on the subject, Gamefreak has been putting considerable forethought into this project to make it the best they can possibly make it. Despite the lack of word from them, I trust that they are aware just how much these games mean to the DS, which has had very few games for it that have truly throttled its proliferation. They don't have the resources to be diverting their monetary, temporal, and creative energy into a project that won't generate much of a stir or a profit.

For those skeptics out there, just keep in mind that if anyone releases too much information on D/P, people aren't going to be quite as enthusiastic to see what the game promises. We're getting modest reports at best by now, but we have seen in the past that these get more exciting as time progresses. Hold on tight, you're in for the time of your life.

 

[Nomekop Oen]

A) Don't you think the buzz already here is sufficient for now? Afterall, we, like you said, know next-to-nothing about the games and yet they're all people talk about.

Well I know *we're* talking about them.Is anybody else talking is what I'm wondering about.When the subject of Nintendo comes up,people only mention the usual suspects.Zelda,Mario,Metroid,SSBM and the like.Pokemon rarely gets mentioned even though D/P is arguably the DS's biggest game.


So we may not get any info at E3,maybe.I'm still hoping we'll get some though,but I'm not expecting them to blow D/P wide open.Maybe a 20 second video of gameplay,or a montage of screenshots,or something.

 

[Silktree]

I have decided to refrain from analyzing Nintendo and Game Freak; although I have facts on my side, it seems to me that most readers adhere to their own perceptions irrespective of my efforts.

I am reviving this thread now that the E3 event is growing imminent. Without specifically referring to anyone, I am interested in witnessing the effect the false news of Diamond and Pearl's release date has had on you: Are you still convinced of the assertion that this excessively long period of news drought is not but a passing stage directed at Ranger? Do you not reckon news is well in order? What really prevents the Diamond and Pearl campaign from ensuing this month?

The majority of fans take Diamond and Pearl for granted. If those fans take a closer look, they are bound to see how disproportionate their zeal of the games is to Nintendo's acknowledgment of them. I mean no offense, but any discussion regarding these games could very easily be parodied, for the simple reason that is entirely derived from speculation. The nine Pokémon that have been showcased will almost certainly be viewed in drastically different terms by this time next year; their presence as of now is exaggerated in importance as far as the games are concerned.

My only wish is for anyone reading this to think outside the box - a mild risk given circumstances. I am of the opinion that the explanation behind Diamond and Pearl's delay will come in the form of another game, whose development has aided Game Freak to perfect the main entries marking the fourth generation. The game will serve to bring the third generation games back in play, pushing them to their potential. If you are only now realizing my point, I urge you to re-read my previous posts as to establish a better understanding with the main idea already in mind.

Having clarified the above, I also bear good news - I have finally retrieved the chunk of text indicating the extent of Mystery Gift features. This is relevant to the Wireless Communication section, which we now know can be utilized in conjunction with the Nintendo DS. Unfortunately, the text for the Friend section (which has been left almost completely untouched in Japan, and entirely outside it) still eludes me at the moment. I recommend that you complement your knowledge with the following:

Thank you for using the STAMP CARD System. You have [] more to collect to fill your STAMP CARD.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. From the POKeMON CENTER we have a gift - a POKeMON EGG! Please raise it with love and kindness.

Oh, your party appears to be full. Please come see me after storing a POKeMON on a PC.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. By holding this WONDER CARD, you may take part in a survey at a POKeMON MART. Use these surveys to invite TRAINERS to the SEVII ISLANDS. ...Let me give you a secret password for a survey: "GIVE ME AWESOME TRAINER" Write that in on a survey and send it to the WIRELESS COMMUNICATION SYSTEM.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. A TRAINER has arrived in the SEVII ISLANDS looking for you. We hope you will enjoy battling the visiting TRAINER. You may invite other TRAINERS by entering other passwords. Try looking for other passwords that may work.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. Your BATTLE COUNT CARD keeps track of your battle record against TRAINERS with the same CARD. Look for and battle TRAINERS who have the same CARD as you. You may check the overall rankings by reading the NEWS. Please do give it a try!

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. Congratulations! You have won a prize for winning three battles! We hope you will be inspired to battle some more.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. You must be []. There is a ticket here for you.

It appears to be for use at the VERMILION CITY port. Why not give it a try and see what it is about?

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System.

Oh, I'm sorry, []. Your BAG's KEY ITEMS POCKET is full. Please store something on your PC, then come back for this.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. You must be []. There is a ticket here for you.

It appears to be for use at the VERMILION CITY port. Why not give it a try and see what it is about?

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System.

Oh, I'm sorry, []. Your BAG's KEY ITEMS POCKET is full. Please store something on your PC, then come back for this.

Thank you for using the MYSTERY GIFT System. Recently, there have been rumors of rare POKeMON appearances. The rumors are about ALTERING CAVE on OUTCAST ISLAND. Why not visit there and check if the rumors are indeed true?

You have collected all STAMPs! Want to input a CARD as a prize?