• Bubapedia Error 503 Backend fetch failed

    Our technical staff are continuing to monitor the wiki to try and resolve these ongoing issues that are impacting page and image loading. We apologize for the inconvenience. We'll update as soon as we've got more information on this for you.

  • Excited about the recently announced new Pokémon games? Join us here for discussion and speculation.
  • Visit your account preferences to list your favourite Gen 9 Starter, and you'll get the appropriate badge added to your profile!
  • All members are allowed to express their opinions, no matter how unpopular, so long as they respect others and do not claim their opinion is the only valid opinion. While we understand that there is debate regarding Goh, someone posting an opinion you disagree with does not give you the right to attack them or report the content for trolling/baiting. This notice will serve as a 0-point warning and as such, Anime & Manga staff reserve the right to jump immediately to point warnings. For more information regarding our stance on arguments and debates, see this PSA.
  • If you are finding yourself unable to log in, you should be able to fix the issue by following the following process.
    1. Close all browser tabs with any part of Bulbagarden open.
    2. Delete all Bulbagarden.net cookies (and if possible, any cached site data for Bulbagarden) from your browser.
    3. Close and reopen your browser, open a new tab, and log into the forums on the new tab.
    If you've followed this process and are still having issues, please contact us via the "Contact us" link at the bottom of the forum.

Unpopular Thoughts about the Main Character's Pokemon?

Rainbow-Rain

LEADER OF THE INTELEON DEFENSE SQUAD
Joined
Jun 19, 2020
Messages
2,289
Reaction score
5,062
For every Protagonist who has ever been on this show, From Ash's Charizard to Goh's Grookey, almost everyone has at least one Pokemon that whether you love or hate them, you've probably got something to say about them.

So what are some of your most Unpopular Opinions on the some of the Main Character's (Ash and his Companions and Team Rocket's) Pokemon?


For example here are some of mine:

- As much as I love Ash's Sceptile, I feel like his win against Darkrai gets really overblown. A lot of people forget that other Pokemon like Swelled and Gible also played part in weakening Darkrai so it was easier for Sceptile to get that win against him

- Giving Misty Togepi was the biggest mistake of the OS as it started the trend of the Cutesy Shoulder/Lap Mon while also pushing Misty more and more into the background.

- I don't think Rowlet's battle against Decidueye was that bad. I dislike the way Hau was handled but the battle itself was fine. I didn't mind Rowlet's sleeping gag either

- James' Morpeko is by far the Worst Pokemon that has belonged to a main character thus far. It's just an unpleasant jerk with next to no redeeming qualities imo
 

Kurolegacy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Messages
2,055
Reaction score
6,598
For every Protagonist who has ever been on this show, From Ash's Charizard to Goh's Grookey, almost everyone has at least one Pokemon that whether you love or hate them, you've probably got something to say about them.

So what are some of your most Unpopular Opinions on the some of the Main Character's (Ash and his Companions and Team Rocket's) Pokemon?


For example here are some of mine:

- As much as I love Ash's Sceptile, I feel like his win against Darkrai gets really overblown. A lot of people forget that other Pokemon like Swelled and Gible also played part in weakening Darkrai so it was easier for Sceptile to get that win against him
I’d say that Sceptile’s is definitely deserved. While Heracross and Gible may have landed some hits on it, Darkrai had that deadly Dark Void/Dream Eater combo that it had used on Heracross and Sceptile so it would have drained their energy balancing out a good deal of the damage it took. So while Heracross and Gible did damage, Sceptile did the heavy lifting. Plus it overcame Darkrai’s signature attack by sheer force of will with its bond with Ash which is pretty impressive.
 

Ghost Diplocaulus

Detroit SMAAAASH! Eevee style.
Joined
Sep 22, 2020
Messages
2,364
Reaction score
8,246
Pronouns
she/her
Unfezant is seriously overhated. Sure, she was very poorly handled even by regional bird standards, but a lot of people blow her problems way out of proportion. No, this bird is nowhere near as bland as she's often made out to be: throughout the Unova saga, Unfezant proves herself to be kind, protective, caring, courageous, and averse to conflict unless absolutely necessary. That right there is quite a bit of personality. Maybe not the most unique, but it is there. And yes, she was overall fairly pathetic in battle, but that's the fault of the atrocious managing of the rotating Unova team, not Unfezant herself. Besides, the only times that she really did suck were in the second battle against Trip (where let's be real, of Ash's Pokemon only Snivy had an actually good showing anyway; sure, Pikachu beat Tranquill, but he still struggled way more than he realistically should have and then went on to lose to Trip's haxxed Servine again) and the battle against Cameron (which was packed to the brim with utterly ridiculous moments anyway). Her performance against Roxie's Koffing might have resulted in a loss, but Unfezant still actually got some good hits in and generally fought better than Boldore did, meaning she should arguably get more credit for softening Koffing enough for Leavanny to finish off so easily afterwards.

Krookodile is a really cool dude, and I really do like him a lot, but I feel sometimes people overestimate his power level quite a bit due to how often he tends to be haphazardly thrown into "Ash's strongest potential team" lineups. Sure, he's indisputably the ace of the Unova team, but remember that that's still arguably the weakest team Ash has ever trained, meaning Krookodile is most likely only around the level of the strong non-ace mons of Ash's other teams such as Buizel, Bayleef, Staraptor, or Hawlucha. And might even actually be weaker than a few of the non-aces. "But he beat Iris's crazy OP inexpilacbly Ice-resistant Dragonite!" yes, he did, but remember that said Dragonite was having a tantrum at the time, which undoubtedly contributed to Krookodile's win. Not to mention that Iris's Dragonite's endurance was seriously all over the place, since for all his Ice-enduring tendencies, he seemed to get pummeled ricidulously easily by attacks that should ostensibly be less effective (most notably Dragon-type moves, which are impossible to have a quadruple weakness to, btw). Krookodile's performance against Stephan's Pokemon was also really good, but even that doesn't showcase any truly astounding feats: Krookodile nearly lost against a Liepard with a moveset that was quite frankly terrible (Hyper Beam was the only move that could actually damage Krookodile badly, since Shadow Ball and Shadow Claw were resisted and non-STAB, but Liepard mostly spammed the latter two), and while beating Stephan's Sawk was quite awesome, remember that the latter had been tired out considerably by Leavanny, so Krookodile can't take full credit for defeating him. Really, none of Krookodile's best feats can come anywhere close to the stuff that aces like Charizard, Sceptile, Infernape, Greninja, or most of the Journeys team have pulled. So yeah, while Krookodile is undoubtedly a good mon, to call him "one of Ash's strongest ever" feels like a big stretch to me. Honestly, I'd even argue that the second strongest Unova mon, Pignite, isn't really that far behind Krookodile in terms of power, and everyone generally agrees that Pignite doesn't come close to holding a candle to Ash's aces.

Lucario is nowhere near as much of a spotlight hogger as he's often made out to be. Yes, he does get better treatment than the rest of his team overall, but even he disappeared into the background for quite some time, so I wouldn't put him on par with Greninja, Infernape, or even Charizard in terms of spotlight hogging.
 

Weddingbells

Active Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2022
Messages
217
Reaction score
527
Pronouns
She/Her
Rowlet sleeping gag got annoying really quick for me.
Torracat battle with incineroar kinda made no sense. Battled him twice, lost both times, barely battles after that (fought a poacher , and sparred with kiawe) and the suddenly was able to beat him?
I thought it was really cute how sometimes staraptor would perch on grotle :>

The show needs to start interesting dynamics with a pokemon and it's evolution.Not the typical rivalry or admiration relationship. What about a Pokemon who regret evolving? Idk something else

I kinda want the show to focus on trainers who got abandoned by their pokemon. When the pokemon is abandoned, it showed as cruel and traumatic, due to the trainer thinking the pokemon is weak. But can you imagine it in reverse? You adore your starter pokemon and then it suddenly decides to leave you because it veiws you as a weak trainer. That has to hurt

They kinda got to stop treating pokemon as wild animals with no fault. The show has demonstrated countless times that pokemon are intelligent and sentient enough to know right and wrong. At least for most of them.

I hate when the pokemon becomes a carbon copy of their trainer. They sorta did this with Pikachu (but I think Pikachu still has a bit of distinct personality from ash)
 
Last edited:

Daren

Surprisingly well rehearsed
Joined
Sep 27, 2007
Messages
3,322
Reaction score
9,488
Maybe less unpopular here, but Swellow was easily an A-ranker in power after evolving and pretty much the ace of late Hoenn, but thanks to DP making them a jobber they always seem to get knocked down on those tier lists you see online and put in the "above average" category.
Edit: To elaborate; I think Tobias was the only time Swellow didn't get at least one KO and he had several multi KO battles...including knocking out two Pokémon used by a league winner, and he did well against the very powerful Frontier Brains.

They kinda got to stop treating pokemon as wild animals with no fault. The show has demonstrated countless times that pokemon are intelligent and sentient enough to know right and wrong. At least for most of them.
This annoys me, too. We see them running bars, cooking, all the stuff Meowth gets up to, but sometimes they're just treated like a real world animal with superpowers.
 
Last edited:

A Wild Luxray

Hear me roar!
Joined
Jul 16, 2010
Messages
7,899
Reaction score
10,984
Lucario is nowhere near as much of a spotlight hogger as he's often made out to be. Yes, he does get better treatment than the rest of his team overall, but even he disappeared into the background for quite some time, so I wouldn't put him on par with Greninja, Infernape, or even Charizard in terms of spotlight hogging.
Thank you! I think Lucario's screentime hogging is very exaggerated and I'm so tired of him being called a "shillmon". He appeared often as a Riolu, but he's been out of focus quite a bit for certain periods of time since evolving. After that episode with Cinderace, Lucario was out of focus for at least 28 episodes before he was used in the battle against Volkner. 6 episodes later he got Mega Evolution and the battle with Bea, but he hasn't had a major focus episode or anything special since then. Since then, Dracovish, Sirfetch'd, Gengar, and Dragonite all got some time to shine. Lucario's only role since then was getting wrecked by Articuno with everyone else. I think its about 21 episodes since his victory over Bea and his upcoming teamup with Greninja. Its REALLY nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be. He's gotten it slightly better than others, but yeah, he hasn't had anywhere near as much of the focus Charizard, Infernape, and Greninja got.

Adding one more: Rowlet is really not as great as people make him out to be. I constantly see people talk about how Rowlet is a god, but he's really not that special. I don't like how he was handled really. He was really just a gag starter who could battle decently, only his major gag caused a fakeout loss that really wasn't funny at all.
 
Last edited:

FluffleFi

Zzzzappin'!
Joined
Aug 2, 2018
Messages
507
Reaction score
1,458
Even as a child, I don't think i've ever liked Ash's Charizard and I can't say I like some of the theories on why it stopped listening to him after evolving into a Charmeleon. First is the 'lack of badges' which some people follow but don't make sense in the context of the anime since A: I'm pretty sure such a thing was never established and B: Even after getting all eight badges it refused to listen. Then there's that Paris episode where Ash tried to get Charmeleon to throw a battle which, like the badge theory, I never follow.

All I see was a jackass who got too hyped up by his own power, as someone shouldn't have to save your life again to earn your respect back.

---

On a side note, and i'm not sure if this is unpopular, I think I preferred Pikachu back when he had a bit of mischief to his character like back in OS, instead of whatever the hell Journey's doing to him.
 

Weddingbells

Active Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2022
Messages
217
Reaction score
527
Pronouns
She/Her
Even as a child, I don't think i've ever liked Ash's Charizard and I can't say I like some of the theories on why it stopped listening to him after evolving into a Charmeleon. First is the 'lack of badges' which some people follow but don't make sense in the context of the anime since A: I'm pretty sure such a thing was never established and B: Even after getting all eight badges it refused to listen. Then there's that Paris episode where Ash tried to get Charmeleon to throw a battle which, like the badge theory, I never follow.

All I see was a jackass who got too hyped up by his own power, as someone shouldn't have to save your life again to earn your respect back.

---

On a side note, and i'm not sure if this is unpopular, I think I preferred Pikachu back when he had a bit of mischief to his character like back in OS, instead of whatever the hell Journey's doing to him.
Yeah I miss when Pikachu had a personality that was distinct from ash. Now he is basically ash for the most part.
And also ash getting 8 badges wasn't the point,if I remember, he clearly got most of them for pity/without battling
 

Audino1008

Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2021
Messages
240
Reaction score
450
Pronouns
He/Him
I don't care what anyone says, Rowlet's sleeping gag is hillarious.
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2022
Messages
32
Reaction score
117
maxresdefault.jpg
This one is quite old - someone even mentioned this in current thread. Given how whole Charizard's disobedience was handled in original series, it is hard to blame anyone not to particularly like him as a character and seeing him more like a jerk.
That view is completely reasonable, but my unpopular opinion is that we have visual clues that Charizard's jerkiness was much more purposeful, controlled and had reasonable limits to overall harm. He had clear rules and limits in mind. Which adds layers to character, even though the most important bit of being little spoiled, definitely over-confident and arrogant with lacking true self-love and self-respect remains.

The defining moment
When Charizard evolves to face Aerodactyl, Ash is quickly (as we all remember) reminded of the fact that it was not because of saving him. But this also serves as sort of lampshading, because literally one minute later after Jigglypuff starts singing we see Charizard putting quite an effort to literally save Ash and succeeding.
Given whole aerial situation, this was obviously not an accidental outcome, not something that Charizard could have done just unintentionally.

This is not single occasion, because in Party Panic episode at the beginning of Orange Islands saga,similar thing happens, when Charizard is unwilling to save Pikachu at first, but being enraged by TRio after that, he not only destroys their baloon, but also saves Pikachu. And then wreaks havoc with Pikachu still on his back. :sneaky:

Remembering these episodes vividly when they aired, I was also baffled what to think about Charizard as character. He seemed more like narrative tool of displaying this Pokémon who was set as benchmark of coolness and power as deus ex machina. Will Ash dare to use him? When and why? What shenanigans will Charizard use this time? Will he ever start to listen? When that will be? Will Ash then finally win the league?

But those bits, since they are purposefully shown, but actually never commented on (if I remember correctly, Ash never comments on how Charizard in the end indeed saved his life), left many things to oversimplification. Because many people usually remember those scenes by accompanying dialogue.
This is a little bit of shame, because IMHO it is far more interesting to think about Charizard disobedience as something he has usually under the control and does not allow it to go to unreasonable or even horrifying outcomes.
The whole RESPECT problem is obviously there and is narrative theme of Charizard's character as CARE is for Infernape. But that does not mean, even Charizard having great problems with respect (in regards to Ash, even himself, other Pokémon too), that he absolutely does not care. He obviously does, at least little bit.


Another supporting bits for this view are listening to Ash in match against Magmar, crying in first movie after Ash's death, crucial help in Naval Manoeuvres episode (at least if you do not think that Charizard's flamethrower shapes ice into sledges by default) and finally in Charizard Chills, when he gives Ash mean look as his first battle against Pollywrath is no going well and that marks the first time his disobedience and jerkiness is not under the control, it has clearly different visual tone and turning point of him losing the match quickly follows. Which ultimately ends in him beginning to listen in said episode.
 

A Wild Luxray

Hear me roar!
Joined
Jul 16, 2010
Messages
7,899
Reaction score
10,984
I agree. It is the worst. I used to hate Dawn’s Piplup, but even Piplup isn’t as annoying as Morpeko.
I'd argue not even Oshawott was as annoying. And yeah, Oshawott was kind of annoying and the writers constantly made him out to be a joke by constantly getting zapped or losing in ridiculous ways.
 

Ghost Diplocaulus

Detroit SMAAAASH! Eevee style.
Joined
Sep 22, 2020
Messages
2,364
Reaction score
8,246
Pronouns
she/her
I'd argue not even Oshawott was as annoying. And yeah, Oshawott was kind of annoying and the writers constantly made him out to be a joke by constantly getting zapped or losing in ridiculous ways.
To me what made Oshawott annoying was his food stealing habit. Particularly because the one Oshawott tended to steal food from was Pignite, a Pokemon who when he first debuted was quite literally dying of starvation. Just... the sheer level of callousness Oshawott showed towards his own teammate who was also a victim of trauma cemented him as my least favorite comic relief mon to date.

Oh, sure, Rowlet's sleepling gag wore out its welcome especially during the match against Hau, but at least the Pokemon himself was never actively malicious.
 

Rainbow-Rain

LEADER OF THE INTELEON DEFENSE SQUAD
Joined
Jun 19, 2020
Messages
2,289
Reaction score
5,062
And ANOTHER THING!

Dont know if this unpopular but Inteleon and Grookey should've interacted.

First of all. If Goh and his Starters are allegedly supposed to resemble a family unit, then they are doing a piss poor job at by not even letting two of the "family members" even interact

Second, Grookey needs someone his hyperactive personality can bounce off from. Eevee and Cinderace are too similar in personality and Pikachu is just an enabler

Inteleon's calm maturity would be a perfect counterbalance to all of Grookey's childlike rambunctious personality (with Cinderace being somewhere in the middle)
 

PaperSplash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2021
Messages
503
Reaction score
1,088
Pronouns
He/him
I love Bulbasaur as much as the next guy, and I hope this isn't sacrilege to say on a site called Bulbagarden, but I've always wondered why Ash's stuck around for as long as it did during Johto, especially after Chikorita/Bayleef. Even Squirtle left much sooner to make way for Totodile in comparison. So its eventual departure in EP225 always came across to me as someone in the writing team going "Oh yeah, Bulbasaur exists. What's it still doing on Ash's team again? We gotta give it something else to do."
 
Top