Why do fans like Serena so much?

[L-05308]

I’ve always thought Serena was disgustingly overated!

She made me appreciate Iris and is the main reason I can’t say XY was better than Diamond and pearl.

 

[CrystaI]

Firstly, let me introduce this video, as I think this is utterly important to explain my strange feeling towards Serena:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMbch47oz2c


I can kind of understand why people like Serena so much, due to her being...... the most generic personification of this classic romance trope. Romance is fascinating, the mere existence of it in a story attracts audience. Follow along hundreds of year of literature history, romance is still one of the hottest topic to talk and write about. Also accounts how the nowadays community view romance in general: It is mysterious, it is fantastic, it is amazing, looking for someone whom you may called "true love" is set to be a lifetime goal of one's life, hence it is important, and feels triumphant shall one finds a girl(or boy if you are female) that will follow you through ups and downs of life, for better or for worse til death. Romance, isn't it just exciting?

And for the exact same reason, that's why I dislike Serena. Not for the existence of romance in Pokemon Anime, but more of the problem of badly executed romance trope. Watch the video, and one shall realize every single story-writing problem revolved around romance trope were applicable to Serena's case. I'm bad in explanation, and in any case, the video explain better than I am, so I'll leave it to it.

BTW, one thing I need to clarify. Am I object against romance in Pokemon Anime? Not at all! Tropes are tools for story-writing, it all depends on the ability of author or screenwriter to utilize it in his/her work. Hence that's why, it really annoys me seeing tropes are being misused or utilized in the wrong way, such that even general casual audience that has no knowledge about story-writing can feel something is wrong in the end-product that came out on TV-screen.
Although I do acknowledge Pokemon Anime is no sophisticated literature, but the fact of targeting at preteens doesn't give the screenwriters any excuse to misuse the trope and mistreat the character. This is something I hope screenwriters of Pokemon Anime had learned their lesson after XY&Z (......But, I guess my wish doesn't come true, because as far as I I had observed until now, this time in SM they are misusing other tropes. I'll leave this discussion for now).

 

[Shadao]

It all changed with Serena. There is a sizable amount of art depicting Serena wearing Moon's clothes and numerous online petitions to bring Serena to the Sun & Moon series. Serena's fans act like they were betrayed and they have this feeling that her departure is unreasonable, unjustified. Of course not all people are the same, and not every fan of Serena thinks that way, but there is a vocal part of her fans that think she should be a part of the main cast forever and do not accept the fact she left. What made Serena popular was the shipping factor, and fans of AmourShipping think she is destined to be with Ash forever, so to them it makes no sense that she left his side.

I did recall fans did the same with Dawn in Hilda's outfit back in 2010:

Spoiler: Dawn in Hilda Outfit BW 2010 Fan Art

And I do recall people insisting that Dawn should have gone to Unova instead of Ash. Something to do with her promoted status as co-protagonist in DP (they actually changed the opening lines from Satoshi to Satoshi and Hikari).

In terms of petitions to bring back Serena or dressing her up as Moon, I personally believe that there were two factors involved:

1) Resolution to the Amour subplot. Regardless of what you feel, I felt that bringing up a romance subplot to a character who has never been given a romance subplot (not since arguably Misty) was going to require resolution in some form. The explicit nature of Serena's crush has to either be resolved in order for her to leave peacefully from the series (since a good chunk of the "Bring Misty Back" crowd during AG felt that Misty's feelings for Ash were not conclusively resolved by the end of OS) or by her going with Ash to Alola to finish that arc there. And I recall many Amourshippers felt that there is a risk of bringing Serena to Alola (namely the romance could turn sour) and most would prefer Ash to leave with her instead of her with Ash. Keep in mind that Serena kissing Ash was in the very last episode and was mostly a complete surprise given that nobody at the time thought the writers would actually go that far. And from my experience, that satisfied the Amourshippers' hunger. Although there are fan arts and stories of Serena being with Ash in Alola, they are no different from fan works of other Pokégirls visiting Ash in different regions such as Misty and Dawn.

2) Serena's second design lends itself to Moon's short hair and optional blond hair design very well. More so than Dawn with Hilda. Thus it is not surprising to see Moon being re-contextualized as Serena. Heck, some of the non-serious fans joked about Serena being a Yandere who silently killed Moon and took her place to be Ash. Of course, that was moot considering that Moon didn't even appear in the series at all.

 

[CaptainBuggles]

I don't really have any profound, intelligent reason to like Serena, I'm just personally a sucker for the childhood friends trope

And in general, out of all friend/companion girls, I prefer the nicer ones.

But I definitely can't sit here and claim she was amazingly well-written or anything, she actually comes off as really simple and honestly kinda lazily done to me.

Like, there's nothing wrong with being a girly girl, as Dawn proves pretty well imo, but you still need depth and balance too. When it feels like most of your purpose is just being "the girl" with not all that much beyond just being "the girl", it's a whole different story. Really, really doesn't help that Showcases are by far the most girly major goal, on top of not seeming nearly as hard or important as Ash's goal.

Still, I overall like her just because I didn't have high expectations to start with, so the flaws don't really sting as much as they would otherwise.

 

[Greninjaman]

I think people like Serena because of the crush. Honestly, I thought she was kind of boring. I enjoyed clement because he had that gag with his inventions. Heck it got to the point where, as soon as he pulls it out, you know something will happen.

 

[MarshiyanMisutaa]

And for the exact same reason, that's why I dislike Serena. Not for the existence of romance in Pokemon Anime, but more of the problem of badly executed romance trope. Watch the video, and one shall realize every single story-writing problem revolved around romance trope were applicable to Serena's case.

I can't see much similarity between Serena's crush and tropes the video tals about. Most of stuff the video lists are about romantic sub-plots between two characters, amourshipping is still mostly one-sided and there is almost no action from the side of Satoshi.

These characters no longer promote everything.

I'm talking about storyline based reasons, not the writers reasons to end their role.

It was because she wanted to return a handkerchief to Ash. She wasn't trying to escape her mother, she was hoping to meet Ash after seeing him on TV.

I think "trying to escape her mother her destiny to become a Rhyhorn racer" is a very big part of her reason to leave home. Not to mention she supposed to leave home already like many of her age. Seeing him on the TV was a catalyst for her to finally found her will to start her journey as a trainer.

Uh no. This series has a problem in showing male characters crying. They will usually have males displaying vulnerability through anger (see Paul's entire existence for reference) or the need to be alone. Ash lost that Full Battle against Paul in Lake Acuity and what did he do? He lied on a grass field with his hat covering 90% of his face.

Anger is a very masculine response to being sad/disappointed and because of that it's treated different from other emotions.

Crying scenes are reserved for girls. May was shown crying after her loss to Solidad in the semifinals of the Kanto Grand Festival. And Dawn had a fair share of moments in which she was shown crying over upsetting events. Serena was breaking no barriers.

Yes, but the show treated their crying as a sign of weakness. That's why Dawn's mother chastised her about it.

A person can only cry the way Serena cried when they deeply care about something. Serena was crying for a thing she didn't know existed a few episodes prior to that moment. There's no way on Earth she could be that depressed.

Because it wasn't for the loss. Serena cried because of her failure as a pokemon trainer and person. Till that moment she tried to find a goal fir himself and yet didn't find it, As you said before, Serena was doing nothing, she had no goals in life. She didn't want to be a Rhyhorn racer, yet she found no alternative. Her childhood crush turned out to be forgotten her. After all this, she finally found a goal she likes to do, and her first try turned out to a disappointed. It was Serena's lowest time on the show.

 

[CrystaI]

I can't see much similarity between Serena's crush and tropes the video tals about. Most of stuff the video lists are about romantic sub-plots between two characters, amourshipping is still mostly one-sided and there is almost no action from the side of Satoshi.

Well you answered the question yourself. Because it is one-sided, hence the PokemonXY(&Z) romance subtrope is a failure. But still, the staffs managed to stuff it down our throat, and that is the problem.

 

[MarshiyanMisutaa]

Well you answered the question yourself. Because it is one-sided, hence the PokemonXY(&Z) romance subtrope is a failure. But still, the staffs managed to stuff it down our throat, and that is the problem.

It's a failure because Satoshi didn't fell in love with her and marry a childhood friend he hardly remembers? I assume opposite would be a success? Interesting... Not to mention it has nothing to do with the video you posted.

 

[Antiyonder]

Like, there's nothing wrong with being a girly girl, as Dawn proves pretty well imo, but you still need depth and balance too. When it feels like most of your purpose is just being "the girl" with not all that much beyond just being "the girl", it's a whole different story.

Especially if said story doesn't let the intended couple get together until the end or at all. Even if it's gender reversed, a character being frequently present, but not serving a purpose beyond future love interest doesn't make for an entertaining character.

One of my bigger peeves with Detective Conan despite my enjoyment with it.

Really, really doesn't help that Showcases are by far the most girly major goal, on top of not seeming nearly as hard or important as Ash's goal.

Ehh, I'd say it's at least serviceable and at least giving her something to do. No I think the problem was was the middle portion between her introduction and finding her goal. No training her Pokémon just to keep them strong and healthy. No attempts to try out something and then declining to follow that path at the end. Just traveling for the most part.

 

[CaptainBuggles]

Especially if said story doesn't let the intended couple get together until the end or at all. Even if it's gender reversed, a character being frequently present, but not serving a purpose beyond future love interest doesn't make for an entertaining character.

One of my bigger peeves with Detective Conan despite my enjoyment with it.

I'd say she did have a bit more purpose than that, but even that was usually framed in an underwhelming way that still makes her just feel like "the girl".

It could've been salvaged by her issues with her mom, since that's obviously something that doesn't hinge on gender... But like others have said, that wasn't even handled super well, and the issues her mom had with her could've been given more concrete evidence.

They could've also improved her rivalries, since rivals done right tend to bring out more in a character

But as it stands... she's just not that deep, even for this show.

 

[Islander Princess]

I mean, I think everyone is entitled to like the characters that they do and for whatever reason they feel. From what I've seen, Serena seems to be popular amongst fans largely for her crush on Ash and the childhood connection, although I've also seen people who liked her storyline and character growth. I've also seen fans who just really like her because they think she has a nice character design.

I personally feel like all of those things (minus the character design, of course) were overall detrimental to her as a character. By no means do I think Serena is a bad character, but I do feel like she was poorly handled by the writers. I'm no supporter of Amourshipping, but didn't even mind it so much at first, especially when it seemed like her overall character arc was going to be seeing her grow as a person and a trainer and become more focused on herself and her goals than just following her childhood crush around (that little detail also felt really shoehorned and unnecessary to me, but regardless). I did enjoy seeing them growing her in that manner, and then it all got thrown out the window by the end of the series and I found that to be very disappointing. They could've really taken Serena's character in such a great direction, especially as a nice example for all the young girls watching (the idea that you can depend on yourself and be invested in your goals and keep on changing and evolving as a person) but the last episode of XY really badly burned me on Serena's character development as a whole (it was headed in that direction for a while, but that last episode...hoo boy).

I fully agree with everyone in this thread who has said they aren't against romantic themes in the anime...just poorly executed ones, which is what unfortunately, in my opinion, ended up dominating Serena's character. She certainly isn't the only character to suffer from terrible writing (hello Iris) and I'm sure she won't be the last. And like I said, I do see the reasons some fans really like her and fully believe that they are entitled to those opinions, even if others (including me) don't agree. It really only gets to be a problem when it leads to exhibitions of rabid, stan-like behavior.

 

[Natu? Natu!]

I like Serena. Not a lot, and not to the extent that I was disappointed when she left the show (after all other protagonist girls in previous seasons, I never expected her to stay after Kalos). Still, I like her. She was nice, and although her character development wasn't great compared to some other fictional characters, she has more character development than most Pokémon protagonists. I don't think that her romantic interest in Ash affected the storyline that much. What I mean is that it would be fairly easy to remove it from the anime altogether, and still have the anime be almost the same. Sure, she would have to be given a different motive for going on the journey, but no major plot changes would have to be made to do so.
While I don't think that her romantic interest in Ash was that big of a deal (defining it as how easy it would have been to remove it without having to make any major changes in the story), it is one of the ships that is most explicitly stated. Both Shauna and Miette notice and comment on her crush on Ash, and with Miette, it's a running theme whenever she is in the anime. Compare that to some other proposed shippings, where the arguments presented in support of them sometimes are on the level that "In one episode, character X says 'hi' to character Y" or "Character X and Y both have pokémon that know the move Z".
Ash's travel partners need to leave after each region in order to make room for new travel partners from the next game. I think it's that simple. It doesn't have to do with whether a certain partner could be developped in an interesting way. The main purpose of the anime is to get kids to buy the games. That means that whenever a new region is added, Ash has to travel there to meet people from that game, to promote game sales, and if you keep travel partners from previous games, it would be untenable.

 

[Neo Blaze]

Short answer: because people have different opinions

Longer answer: probably because she is a fun, positive character with a nice design who had a clear-cut arc and because of the Ash/Serena stuff. There's more than that obviously but that's what I'd gather.

That aside, I wasn't a Serena fan myself. They took such a long time developing her goal and when it did happen it was a Contest ripoff that felt incredibly shallow (the whole female stereotypes thing and whatnot). I just did not like Showcases one bit and that didn't help in trying to enjoy Serena.

Plus I just found her to be kind of bland, especially in comparison to Clemont and Bonnie, but that's me. And the romance stuff with Ash felt forced to me most of the time.

Of course like most things, how you enjoy a character is incredibly subjective, so my problems with Serena hit a lot of people a completely different way, which is why she has so many fans.

 

[hotsushikun]

Obiviously, i like Serena and Ash as their shipping, because they we're childhood friends and she was the one who gave him a kiss at the end of the Pokemon SM anime, after all. Now that Ash is with Mallow, Lillie and Lana, i wonder what Serena would react to them, she might get really jealous about it!

(sorry for my poor English)

 

[Almonds]

The crush was huge to fans who wanted Ash to experience romance with someone. So even though it was Serena's crush, the crush subplot had to do more with Ash than Serena herself.

 

[SinnohEevee]

I should perhaps not judge her based on a fact i'm a person who haven't watched the whole XY series but I can say the reason I liked her was because she had a more "real" reason to like Ash.
What I mean is that most characters followed Ash because he inspired them through saving a Pokemon or something like that but Serena followed him because he saved her, and saved even way more- rather than being (IMO) hipocritical kid who won thanks to a portion of luck, he was a real savior.
Showing how much Serena adored Ash for the reason mentioned above made me like the relation beetwen them (and XY Ash) a bit more (but damn, I need to come back into watching XY again).

Who joined Ash for savng a Pokémon.
Misty joined for the bike, May because she wants to travel, Iris invited herself. Why did Dawn join him?

 

[Johtohfiller]

I did recall fans did the same with Dawn in Hilda's outfit back in 2010:

Spoiler: Dawn in Hilda Outfit BW 2010 Fan Art

And I do recall people insisting that Dawn should have gone to Unova instead of Ash. Something to do with her promoted status as co-protagonist in DP (they actually changed the opening lines from Satoshi to Satoshi and Hikari).

That would've been pretty cool and might have made for a better BW than what we got.

Though my headcanon version of BW involves both Ash and Dawn in Unova with Iris as a rival. Might make a post on that.

 

[LazySpy]

Who joined Ash for savng a Pokémon.
Misty joined for the bike, May because she wants to travel, Iris invited herself. Why did Dawn join him?

Using the word "follow" i didn't mean just "travel with him" I also meant "get inspired by him". (sorry for being misunderstandable, eniglish is not my native language)
I'm reffering to minor recurring characters like Thatcher from AG and a ton of characters of the day from minor filler episodes rather than his companions.

 

[EscLucy]

Using the word "follow" i didn't mean just "travel with him" I also meant "get inspired by him". (sorry for being misunderstandable, eniglish is not my native language)
I'm reffering to minor recurring characters like Thatcher from AG and a ton of characters of the day from minor filler episodes rather than his companions.

In their own ways, I'm pretty sure that all of Ash's travelling companions were inspired by his ethos. With Serena, the only thing that is new is the romance, mind you one-sided romance, and therefore I think that is the only reason she stands out and gets praise. In terms of character development and Showcases (they are so bad, imo), she is at the bottom for me.

 

[EscLucy]

Ummmm... Not just romance was new.
In OS especially most of Ash's victories were the ones with TRio.
In XY he faced more dangerous enemies and in gym battles he relied more on a strategy than luck.
He wasn't getting his apprasial from random person for beating TRio a hundreth time in a row nor for having heroic speeches, in XY he had to think more and fight stronger enemies.
Serena liked him for just that (also for the fact he helped her as a child, which also was new).
IMO it's better to make a character that loves him for dealing with bigger threats rather than for having some luck.
But like i said in my first post I don't have the full image of Serena so I comment her relationship with Ash rather than character development.

As I said previously, Serena was inspired by Ash's battling but so were all of the others even if they didn't admit it regularly. I don't think many of the characters cared whether the 'enemy' was strong or not, they still praised Ash for defeating them. Also, each female protagonist wouldn't know whether the previous series (or multiple series) had more dangerous enemies so it's hard to compare in that respect. I still maintain that the romance element was the biggest difference but I take your opinion on board.