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Why Females (Girls, & Women) cannot win Pokemon League?

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They had a chance with Iris. Instead, they made her an annoying character who always calls Ash a little kid. If she won the League on top of that and became Champion like in the games, the backlash would have been so huge...
 
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Well, it looks like that from the games of SM then the SM will not take more than 80 episodes, to 100 episodes, and so for this reason then I have feeling that that's it, this season is the final, even if I want that they do my pokemon season story

They had a chance with Iris. Instead, they made her an annoying character who always calls Ash a little kid. If she won the League on top of that and became Champion like in the games, the backlash would have been so huge...
About iris, then she should be outside the entire anime completely
 
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I've never really had a problem with none of the winners of Leagues being boys. I don't think that a female trainer never winning a League is in itself an issue considering that fans would want to see Ash win more than anyone else. I do think it's an issue when there are few female trainers even shown in a League. All of Ash's prominent rivals have been male trainers and the only female rival he ever had was Bianca, who was basically a less competent and less entertaining female version of Barry. She lost pretty quickly in the Unova League and it didn't even phase her after the initial reaction. The only female characters I recall being shown to be strong trainers in previous Leagues were Katie in the Hoenn League and possibly the trainer who defeated Richie in the Indigo League given that I think the closing ceremony implied that she made the top three. There have been other female trainers in Leagues like Bianca and Astrid, but I wouldn't say that they were shown to be strong. Astrid was basically there to showcase more Mega Pokemon and for Hawlucha to win after losing at the beginning of the Diancie movie. I find that to be more problematic than never seeing a female trainer winning a League on screen.

This probably wouldn't be too bad if we still had female characters with battle active goals in the main cast though. While Contests were clearly made to appeal to girls, they weren't treated as something less than Gyms or a League. If anything, they made getting to the Grand Festival look significantly more difficult than getting to a League since you couldn't just do the same Contest over again if you lost it on the first try. You had to go to another Contest and there were only a certain number of Contests available before a Grand Festival started. And at the end of the day, Contest battles were still real battles. They were obviously different from regular battles and you could win without knocking out your opponent's Pokemon, but you still needed to be a good battler in order to do well in them. Plus, it wasn't limited just to girls either. We saw a good number of male Coordinators throughout both AG and DP. May's main two rivals were Drew and Harley, most of the one shot rivals she dealt with were male and Dawn's secondary rival was Kenny. It wasn't the same as Gym battles, but I always thought that it was good representation of female characters. Both May and Dawn showed that you can be into more traditionally feminine things like shopping and clothes, but still be into battling and they actually became better battlers as their series continued. It didn't have to be one or the other.

Without something like Contest, it does feel like something is missing in terms of female representation on the show, despite how long it has been since they featured them. I don't think it could have been fixed with Iris going after Gym battles to see her become the Champion, mainly because we'd have to sit through the same Gym battles at least twice before moving on. That's why I was never into the idea of another traveling companion going after the League right along with Ash. Showcases definitely didn't fix the void given that they're just glorified Contest appeals minus all of the aspects that made the goal challenging and interesting. Not to mention they're sexist as heck with the emphasis being on more traditionally feminine things like baking and looking pretty and they were exclusive to female trainers for some reason. They were basically like a Pokemon version of a beauty pageant and they tried so hard to make it seem like they worked hard to get those three keys when it looked like the easily goal introduced thus far to me. They might not be Kalos Queen material, but getting three keys never seemed like nearly as much of a challenge as the show made it out to be. This wouldn't be a problem if there were other prominent battle active female trainers in the cast during XY's run, but when Serena is really the prime representation for girls during the series, Showcases have pretty blatant sexist undertones and she leaves by telling Ash that his her goal and that she'll become more beautiful for him, it doesn't give the best message to girls watching the show. Granted, I probably wouldn't be picking up on that if I was in the target audience, or at least not this much, they might not have intended to give that kind of message and I could be just reading too much into it, but it does seem to be a problem in of itself.

Now I wouldn't mind if they did show a female trainer winning the League once. I don't really might Ash losing nearly as much as other fans do. My main issue with the Kalos League had more to Alain being an overpowered Gary Stu winning yet again than Ash losing again per say, especially when Alain winning didn't really seem to matter all that much in the grand scheme of things by the end of the series. A female trainer winning for once would be kind of interesting in a way. What they could really do to help with this issue would be to give Ash a strong female rival. They could just make her a secondary rival if they still wanted a male trainer for the main rivalry, but just show her to be a strong competent trainer against Ash and other trainers both before and during the League. It wouldn't have to be amazing, but just something to show more prominent female trainers in the anime's cast being strong battlers. There are female Gym Leaders and Elite 4 members, but since they're usually only around for a couple of episodes at most, I'm not sure if that would count for too much in this situation.
 
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Well, it looks like that from the games of SM then the SM will not take more than 80 episodes, to 100 episodes, and so for this reason then I have feeling that that's it, this season is the final, even if I want that they do my pokemon season story



About iris, then she should be outside the entire anime completely
I doubt this will be the last series.
As for the games, I think Game Freak should give us a third version or a remake for this generation, because SM ends quickly.
 
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I doubt this will be the last series.
As for the games, I think Game Freak should give us a third version or a remake for this generation, because SM ends quickly.
That's right, I do want to see a remake for SM, or third version, but SM is ends so quickly; so remake for SM, or third version will not have a lot of stories. And because SM ends quickly; so I did say that that SM will not take more than 80 episodes to 100 episodes. But still that doesn't mean that the Anime surely will finish after SM
 
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I've never really had a problem with none of the winners of Leagues being boys. I don't think that a female trainer never winning a League is in itself an issue considering that fans would want to see Ash win more than anyone else. I do think it's an issue when there are few female trainers even shown in a League. All of Ash's prominent rivals have been male trainers and the only female rival he ever had was Bianca, who was basically a less competent and less entertaining female version of Barry. She lost pretty quickly in the Unova League and it didn't even phase her after the initial reaction. The only female characters I recall being shown to be strong trainers in previous Leagues were Katie in the Hoenn League and possibly the trainer who defeated Richie in the Indigo League given that I think the closing ceremony implied that she made the top three. There have been other female trainers in Leagues like Bianca and Astrid, but I wouldn't say that they were shown to be strong. Astrid was basically there to showcase more Mega Pokemon and for Hawlucha to win after losing at the beginning of the Diancie movie. I find that to be more problematic than never seeing a female trainer winning a League on screen.
I agree that is more of the issue of the question being asked. With so many participants in the League, it is easier to make several female trainers take on the League rather than answering the forbidden question of the winner. I wouldn't say though that Astrid wasn't strong. She has beaten Ash before, decisively may I say.

There are female Gym Leaders and Elite 4 members, but since they're usually only around for a couple of episodes at most, I'm not sure if that would count for too much in this situation.
Considering that many of them are reoccurring, such as Cynthia and Korrina, I think they count given that you would only see rivals in a couple of episodes as well, Zoey comes into mind. To have a more recurring strong female battler would require her to be part of the main cast with a battle-oriented goal in mind. And it has to be something that Ash himself could not partaken as easy as the Leagues.

You know, the irony is that the Best Wishes series did in fact established a better method to incorporate more female battlers, complete with female winners. The Club Battle tournament comes to mind, and everyone can participate. When you think about it, why do you need Gym Badges to partake in the League tournaments? Sure, it makes sure that only qualified trainers can participate, but nowadays it's really a handicap considering that the audience does not want to see two battles of the same Gym Leader over again in a consecutive manner (only exception being rematch), and thus the female companion cannot partake the League finals along with Ash.
 
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That's right, I do want to see a remake for SM, or third version, but SM is ends so quickly; so remake for SM, or third version will not have a lot of stories. And because SM ends quickly; so I did say that that SM will not take more than 80 episodes to 100 episodes. But still that doesn't mean that the Anime surely will finish after SM
Maybe Ash could go to another region, like Sinnoh.
 
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I agree that is more of the issue of the question being asked. With so many participants in the League, it is easier to make several female trainers take on the League rather than answering the forbidden question of the winner. I wouldn't say though that Astrid wasn't strong. She has beaten Ash before, decisively may I say.
She did beat Ash in the Dianice movie, but I don't think that alone is enough to make her strength noteworthy compared to someone like Katie. She was a one shot character, but she had a pretty good battle against Ash in the Hoenn League that showed off her skills. Astrid on the other hand didn't get that kind of treatment in the Kalos League. She barely had any presence in the series and being included in the Kalos League was more of a nod to the Mega Evolution Specials and the Diancie movie more than anything else.

Shadao said:
Considering that many of them are reoccurring, such as Cynthia and Korrina, I think they count given that you would only see rivals in a couple of episodes as well, Zoey comes into mind. To have a more recurring strong female battler would require her to be part of the main cast with a battle-oriented goal in mind. And it has to be something that Ash himself could not partaken as easy as the Leagues.
Rivals can potentially show up more often than just a couple of episodes and they tend to have a more lasting impact on the characters than reoccuring Gym Leaders or Elite 4 members. Zoey appeared in more than a couple of episodes and she did have a bigger impact on Dawn's journey than Cynthia could have. It is still good to see them using some characters from the games to nice effect in the show, but they can still have a more recurring female battler among the main or supporting cast even with them in mind.

Shadao said:
You know, the irony is that the Best Wishes series did in fact established a better method to incorporate more female battlers, complete with female winners. The Club Battle tournament comes to mind, and everyone can participate. When you think about it, why do you need Gym Badges to partake in the League tournaments? Sure, it makes sure that only qualified trainers can participate, but nowadays it's really a handicap considering that the audience does not want to see two battles of the same Gym Leader over again in a consecutive manner (only exception being rematch), and thus the female companion cannot partake the League finals along with Ash.
The Club Battle tournament could have helped with that, but the tournaments felt too minor to work as a long running goal for Iris and Ash would be participating in them too. With some changes, they potentially could have made Iris go after Club Battle tournaments in order to give Axew more experience and become a better Dragon Trainer, which would have been at least an improvement over what did happen. The Gym badges are important for showcasing a trainer's journey and progress in a region. Plus, it would be so unsatisfying if Ash could just jump right into a League when he first gets to a new region. I'm not sure why you think that the Gym badges are a handicap nowadays. That's always been the issue with the Gym battle format as far as the anime is concerned. Neither the writers or the audience would want to sit through eight Gym battles at least twice in order for Ash and a female character to get badges. It might be cool at first, but I imagine that it would have lost its novelty by the time we got to the third or fourth Gym. Misty couldn't participate in the Indigo League any more than Iris could have, so I'm not sure why badges are suddenly now considered a handicap in this regard.
 
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She did beat Ash in the Dianice movie, but I don't think that alone is enough to make her strength noteworthy compared to someone like Katie. She was a one shot character, but she had a pretty good battle against Ash in the Hoenn League that showed off her skills. Astrid on the other hand didn't get that kind of treatment in the Kalos League. She barely had any presence in the series and being included in the Kalos League was more of a nod to the Mega Evolution Specials and the Diancie movie more than anything else.
Given how fast it was going and that the series was apparently on a tight schedule, I'm not surprised they skimmed her over just like Trevor and Remo. When looking at the battles shown in the League, the time where Astrid would be viable to display for a full battle is Sawyer vs Tierno, but that would require one of the recurring characters to be dropped out in favor of her. However, I would not say that she isn't strong. The only two opponents she had faced on-screen were the ones who made it into the final round.

Rivals can potentially show up more often than just a couple of episodes and they tend to have a more lasting impact on the characters than reoccuring Gym Leaders or Elite 4 members. Zoey appeared in more than a couple of episodes and she did have a bigger impact on Dawn's journey than Cynthia could have. It is still good to see them using some characters from the games to nice effect in the show, but they can still have a more recurring female battler among the main or supporting cast even with them in mind.
That I agree to an extend, but I wouldn't cast out the impact of reoccurring Gym Leaders and Elite Four Members. Despite not appearing as much as Zoey, Cynthia still has an influence over the show. When she appears, you know you're dealing with a champion. And she become somewhat of a goal for Ash during the DP series. In his fantasies, Ash always imagine himself fighting Cynthia, be it in the Mismagius episode or the last episode where Flint fights Cynthia. Compare that to the other champions, such as Lance or Stevens, they don't have same impact on Ash as her.

The Club Battle tournament could have helped with that, but the tournaments felt too minor to work as a long running goal for Iris and Ash would be participating in them too. With some changes, they potentially could have made Iris go after Club Battle tournaments in order to give Axew more experience and become a better Dragon Trainer, which would have been at least an improvement over what did happen. The Gym badges are important for showcasing a trainer's journey and progress in a region. Plus, it would be so unsatisfying if Ash could just jump right into a League when he first gets to a new region. I'm not sure why you think that the Gym badges are a handicap nowadays. That's always been the issue with the Gym battle format as far as the anime is concerned. Neither the writers or the audience would want to sit through eight Gym battles at least twice in order for Ash and a female character to get badges. It might be cool at first, but I imagine that it would have lost its novelty by the time we got to the third or fourth Gym. Misty couldn't participate in the Indigo League any more than Iris could have, so I'm not sure why badges are suddenly now considered a handicap in this regard.
I wouldn't say it's perfect, but it does set up a means to get a female battler something to do without causing a repetition of Ash's Gym Battles. I just find it funny that the tournament is just a smaller scale of the League, and it makes me wonder what's so special about the League tournament itself.

I feel that maybe, just maybe they should have used the badges as they were intended for the games: Access to the Elite Four and Champion. And let the League tournament be something else entirely, being accessible to Ash's companions. I mean, there are other ways making the Badge collections important but different from the League tournament of the Indigo Plateau. It's not like the anime is following the League format faithfully, so they can play around with the basic formula. I just feel that the League Conferences could have been as important, but not just exclusive to Ash.
 
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She did beat Ash in the Dianice movie, but I don't think that alone is enough to make her strength noteworthy compared to someone like Katie. She was a one shot character, but she had a pretty good battle against Ash in the Hoenn League that showed off her skills. Astrid on the other hand didn't get that kind of treatment in the Kalos League. She barely had any presence in the series and being included in the Kalos League was more of a nod to the Mega Evolution Specials and the Diancie movie more than anything else.



Rivals can potentially show up more often than just a couple of episodes and they tend to have a more lasting impact on the characters than reoccuring Gym Leaders or Elite 4 members. Zoey appeared in more than a couple of episodes and she did have a bigger impact on Dawn's journey than Cynthia could have. It is still good to see them using some characters from the games to nice effect in the show, but they can still have a more recurring female battler among the main or supporting cast even with them in mind.



The Club Battle tournament could have helped with that, but the tournaments felt too minor to work as a long running goal for Iris and Ash would be participating in them too. With some changes, they potentially could have made Iris go after Club Battle tournaments in order to give Axew more experience and become a better Dragon Trainer, which would have been at least an improvement over what did happen. The Gym badges are important for showcasing a trainer's journey and progress in a region. Plus, it would be so unsatisfying if Ash could just jump right into a League when he first gets to a new region. I'm not sure why you think that the Gym badges are a handicap nowadays. That's always been the issue with the Gym battle format as far as the anime is concerned. Neither the writers or the audience would want to sit through eight Gym battles at least twice in order for Ash and a female character to get badges. It might be cool at first, but I imagine that it would have lost its novelty by the time we got to the third or fourth Gym. Misty couldn't participate in the Indigo League any more than Iris could have, so I'm not sure why badges are suddenly now considered a handicap in this regard.
Or Iris could have sought to become a member of the E4, which probably requires being a Gym Leader.
You don't need 8 Gym Badges for that, and as an E4, you can challenge the Champion whenever you want, no need for Badges in that case.

But the Iris of the anime wasn't very popular,.

Shadao Shadao the Conference makes it easier to make Ash lose.
 
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Given how fast it was going and that the series was apparently on a tight schedule, I'm not surprised they skimmed her over just like Trevor and Remo. When looking at the battles shown in the League, the time where Astrid would be viable to display for a full battle is Sawyer vs Tierno, but that would require one of the recurring characters to be dropped out in favor of her. However, I would not say that she isn't strong. The only two opponents she had faced on-screen were the ones who made it into the final round.
I wasn't trying to say that she wasn't strong, but just that I don't find Astrid's strength particularly noteworthy. She was basically a glorified cameo character. I'm not even sure if she had that many lines of dialogue.

Shadao said:
That I agree to an extend, but I wouldn't cast out the impact of reoccurring Gym Leaders and Elite Four Members. Despite not appearing as much as Zoey, Cynthia still has an influence over the show. When she appears, you know you're dealing with a champion. And she become somewhat of a goal for Ash during the DP series. In his fantasies, Ash always imagine himself fighting Cynthia, be it in the Mismagius episode or the last episode where Flint fights Cynthia. Compare that to the other champions, such as Lance or Stevens, they don't have same impact on Ash as her.
That's a fair point and I did forget about Ash imagining battling Cynthia those couple of times. I wasn't trying to dismiss the impact of reoccurring Gym Leaders and Elite 4 characters. That can be good in terms of the characters' storylines and representation for people watching the show, but I just find it less significant compared to a main/supporting character appearing more often.

Shadao said:
I wouldn't say it's perfect, but it does set up a means to get a female battler something to do without causing a repetition of Ash's Gym Battles. I just find it funny that the tournament is just a smaller scale of the League, and it makes me wonder what's so special about the League tournament itself.
Yeah, I can see the appeal in that regard and honestly, even if that wasn't Iris' main goal, it still could have been something to fill the void of Contests. It would have given the characters more chances to battle and provided something else to focus on besides Ash's battles. As for what's so special about the League tournament, they have more skilled trainers involved with more Pokemon battling each other. The Club Battle tournaments were a smaller scale of the League, but that also made them much less impressive by comparison. It's really not that hard to win a tournament full of one on one battles where anyone can enter. It's much more of a noteworthy accomplishment to win a League where only other trainers with eight badges can compete in IT and the battles range from three on three to full battles. That's one reason why I don't think that Club Battle tournaments worked. One on one battles for a whole mini tournament gets old fast and winning such a small tournament doesn't really make a trainer look significantly strong like winning a League. It still could have provided something for the other characters with some reworks and better writing for the battles in general.

Shadao said:
I feel that maybe, just maybe they should have used the badges as they were intended for the games: Access to the Elite Four and Champion. And let the League tournament be something else entirely, being accessible to Ash's companions. I mean, there are other ways making the Badge collections important but different from the League tournament of the Indigo Plateau. It's not like the anime is following the League format faithfully, so they can play around with the basic formula. I just feel that the League Conferences could have been as important, but not just exclusive to Ash.
That could have been one way to help keep all of the characters involved in the League instead of making it exclusive to Ash's goal, but I can see why they didn't go that route. There aren't that many of Ash's teams at the end of a journey that could go up against the Elite 4 in a believable manner. Either he would have been crushed or any victories he could have gotten would have felt forced, especially if he went up against the Elite 4 in the original series. Plus, I think it's more fitting for Ash to be traveling with characters who have different goals. They've done that with all of the traveling groups and it does potentially give the writers something else to do besides Gym battles.

Or Iris could have sought to become a member of the E4, which probably requires being a Gym Leader.
You don't need 8 Gym Badges for that, and as an E4, you can challenge the Champion whenever you want, no need for Badges in that case.

But the Iris of the anime wasn't very popular,.
We don't know whether or not being a Gym Leader is a requirement to become a member of the Elite 4 though. There was Koga in the second generation games, as well as Wallace in Pokemon Emerald, but Flint told Ash a bit about when he won the Sinnoh League and the show never indicated that he was at one point a Gym Leader either. An Elite 4 member can seemingly challenge the Champion whenever they want if DP is any indication, but we don't really know how one gets to be an Elite 4 member in the anime. I imagine that Gym Leaders would still need to take part in the League and win it in order to challenge the Elite 4 at least in the anime. So even if Iris was trying to be one of the Elite 4 members, she'd most likely still have to compete in the Unova League for that. She wasn't popular, but I don't think that they were ever planning to go in that kind of direction for her character, which was for the best in my opinion.

QueenEevee said:
Shadao Shadao the Conference makes it easier to make Ash lose.
Ash could just lose to Elite 4 members just as easily, if not more so.
 
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Now I wouldn't mind if they did show a female trainer winning the League once. I don't really might Ash losing nearly as much as other fans do. My main issue with the Kalos League had more to Alain being an overpowered Gary Stu winning yet again than Ash losing again per say, especially when Alain winning didn't really seem to matter all that much in the grand scheme of things by the end of the series. A female trainer winning for once would be kind of interesting in a way. .
The internet nearly exploded when Ash lost at the Kalos league.

Also, I'm concerned that even if Ash had astrong female rival who won the league, it's likely she'll be labeled an overpowered Mary Sue making Ash lose. The Alain hate increased particularly after the league, and it is certainly possible any future female rival league winner would take all the hate.
 
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The internet nearly exploded when Ash lost at the Kalos league.

Also, I'm concerned that even if Ash had astrong female rival who won the league, it's likely she'll be labeled an overpowered Mary Sue making Ash lose. The Alain hate increased particularly after the league, and it is certainly possible any future female rival league winner would take all the hate.
There was indeed quite a bit of intense backlash after the Kalos League. And knowing how the Internet works, the chances are disturbingly excellent that a strong female trainer defeating Ash to win the League would result in more people hating her than even what happened with Alain. Alain was always pretty overpowered, but he was more traditionally cool and people liked that about him, as well as possibly his storyline. If he was a female trainer instead, I think people would have called her a Mary Sue way before the Kalos League even started and the hate for her would be more fierce than it was for Alain. There are a few reasons why the term Mary Sue tends to be thrown around way more often than the male equivalent Gary Stu term.
 
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I am really glad to see you all in my thread. Thank goodness

There was indeed quite a bit of intense backlash after the Kalos League. And knowing how the Internet works, the chances are disturbingly excellent that a strong female trainer defeating Ash to win the League would result in more people hating her than even what happened with Alain. Alain was always pretty overpowered, but he was more traditionally cool and people liked that about him, as well as possibly his storyline. If he was a female trainer instead, I think people would have called her a Mary Sue way before the Kalos League even started and the hate for her would be more fierce than it was for Alain. There are a few reasons why the term Mary Sue tends to be thrown around way more often than the male equivalent Gary Stu term.
Firstly glad to meet you in my thread. I did say that the Alain was too much overpowered even if I think that his Charizard wasn't unbeatable. I do not like Alain, but still I feel that he always like Ash, and recognized him; so that made me happy. About Mary Sue, no the girls not should be unbeatable, or must win the leauge.

When I did this thread, what I really want is to see nice opinions about how to make the girls more good, in battling contests, boys were so good in contests, and battling; so this what we want to see also from the girls. I did not like Paul when he didn't lose a single match because his brother was lost one match with Brandon. The talking from Brandon made him so unbeatable, and if he didn't match Cynthia, or Brandon, then he will not lose at all until the final of DP. Being a good rivals should be like Dawn with Ash. She always challenging, and learning from Ash, but also she always giving multi types of ways that Ash learnt also. We want a real good girl who do this.

About the Pokemon League, In my story Pokemon New Season, I am writing about doing a Pokemon League that not allowed less than 1000 Points, not even 999 points is allowed. You should do a tournements such as contest to get points; so this idea will help also the girls who are Ash companions to do the same type of Goal
 
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Mistreating your girlfriend (or any friend in general) is NOT okay under ANY circumstances. (It's basically about my Calem in said proposal.)
Do you know that this show is aimed at 10-year olds?

EDIT: I also think that this thread should be merged into gender representation one.
 
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I wasn't trying to say that she wasn't strong, but just that I don't find Astrid's strength particularly noteworthy. She was basically a glorified cameo character. I'm not even sure if she had that many lines of dialogue.



That's a fair point and I did forget about Ash imagining battling Cynthia those couple of times. I wasn't trying to dismiss the impact of reoccurring Gym Leaders and Elite 4 characters. That can be good in terms of the characters' storylines and representation for people watching the show, but I just find it less significant compared to a main/supporting character appearing more often.



Yeah, I can see the appeal in that regard and honestly, even if that wasn't Iris' main goal, it still could have been something to fill the void of Contests. It would have given the characters more chances to battle and provided something else to focus on besides Ash's battles. As for what's so special about the League tournament, they have more skilled trainers involved with more Pokemon battling each other. The Club Battle tournaments were a smaller scale of the League, but that also made them much less impressive by comparison. It's really not that hard to win a tournament full of one on one battles where anyone can enter. It's much more of a noteworthy accomplishment to win a League where only other trainers with eight badges can compete in IT and the battles range from three on three to full battles. That's one reason why I don't think that Club Battle tournaments worked. One on one battles for a whole mini tournament gets old fast and winning such a small tournament doesn't really make a trainer look significantly strong like winning a League. It still could have provided something for the other characters with some reworks and better writing for the battles in general.



That could have been one way to help keep all of the characters involved in the League instead of making it exclusive to Ash's goal, but I can see why they didn't go that route. There aren't that many of Ash's teams at the end of a journey that could go up against the Elite 4 in a believable manner. Either he would have been crushed or any victories he could have gotten would have felt forced, especially if he went up against the Elite 4 in the original series. Plus, I think it's more fitting for Ash to be traveling with characters who have different goals. They've done that with all of the traveling groups and it does potentially give the writers something else to do besides Gym battles.



We don't know whether or not being a Gym Leader is a requirement to become a member of the Elite 4 though. There was Koga in the second generation games, as well as Wallace in Pokemon Emerald, but Flint told Ash a bit about when he won the Sinnoh League and the show never indicated that he was at one point a Gym Leader either. An Elite 4 member can seemingly challenge the Champion whenever they want if DP is any indication, but we don't really know how one gets to be an Elite 4 member in the anime. I imagine that Gym Leaders would still need to take part in the League and win it in order to challenge the Elite 4 at least in the anime. So even if Iris was trying to be one of the Elite 4 members, she'd most likely still have to compete in the Unova League for that. She wasn't popular, but I don't think that they were ever planning to go in that kind of direction for her character, which was for the best in my opinion.



Ash could just lose to Elite 4 members just as easily, if not more so.
Misty sought to become an E4 member without caring about the Conference.

Pretty Sailor Moon Venus may-serena-dawn XY was sexist. They should have brought the Contests back. They had enough time to do so when they learned about ORAS.

Hidden Mew Hidden Mew I did some Contests in ORAS. I can tell you they are less predictable than Gym Battles. Then the anime added time-limited Contest battles, where you also need to show your Pokémon's cuteness and stuff. That's what Serena should have been given as a goal.

And yes, a female who beat Ash at the League would be ill-received on the Internet. I dunno how the target audience would have seen it, maybe they still don't care much about female representation.
 
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Misty sought to become an E4 member without caring about the Conference.

Pretty Sailor Moon Venus may-serena-dawn XY was sexist. They should have brought the Contests back. They had enough time to do so when they learned about ORAS.

And yes, a female who beat Ash at the League would be ill-received on the Internet. I dunno how the target audience would have seen it, maybe they still don't care much about female representation.
I really want to see a powerful girl that really rival to ash. it doesn't mean that she should win all the time. Doesn't mean that she should win the leauge. At least, provide the real strength that hidden inside Ash.

Look to what I write in up:-


"When I did this thread, what I really want is to see nice opinions about how to make the girls more good, in battling contests, boys were so good in contests, and battling; so this what we want to see also from the girls. I did not like Paul when he didn't lose a single match because his brother was lost one match with Brandon. The talking from Brandon made him so unbeatable, and if he didn't match Cynthia, or Brandon, then he will not lose at all until the final of DP. Being a good rivals should be like Dawn with Ash. She always challenging, and learning from Ash, but also she always giving multi types of ways that Ash learnt also. We want a real good girl who do this.


So, no problem if the contests back, at least they can provide a good strength for ash.

From my idea up, then also Ash Companion can also be a rivals for ash who have the same goal which is "Pokemon aster", and at the same time traveled with Ash as companion. If you looked to the Beyblade Metal fight, the friends of Ginga also with him, traveled with him to every place that he want to travel, but they also are a rivals in there dream, why do you think that? Because everyone who want to compete in the final competition, then they should reach the number of Points that the final competition asked you to reach. They also can do the same thing in pokemon, if the Pokemon League put that you should get these number of poke, In my story Pokemon New Season, I am writing about doing a Pokemon League that not allowed less than 1000 Points, not even 999 points is allowed. You should do a tournements such as contest to get points; so this idea will help also the girls who are Ash companions to do the same type of Goal. "

Well, Serena's new goal is to compete in contests; so they back it, but not in screen
 
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I really want to see a powerful girl that really rival to ash. it doesn't mean that she should win all the time. Doesn't mean that she should win the leauge. At least, provide the real strength that hidden inside Ash.

Look to what I write in up:-


"When I did this thread, what I really want is to see nice opinions about how to make the girls more good, in battling contests, boys were so good in contests, and battling; so this what we want to see also from the girls. I did not like Paul when he didn't lose a single match because his brother was lost one match with Brandon. The talking from Brandon made him so unbeatable, and if he didn't match Cynthia, or Brandon, then he will not lose at all until the final of DP. Being a good rivals should be like Dawn with Ash. She always challenging, and learning from Ash, but also she always giving multi types of ways that Ash learnt also. We want a real good girl who do this.


So, no problem if the contests back, at least they can provide a good strength for ash.

From my idea up, then also Ash Companion can also be a rivals for ash who have the same goal which is "Pokemon aster", and at the same time traveled with Ash as companion. If you looked to the Beyblade Metal fight, the friends of Ginga also with him, traveled with him to every place that he want to travel, but they also are a rivals in there dream, why do you think that? Because everyone who want to compete in the final competition, then they should reach the number of Points that the final competition asked you to reach. They also can do the same thing in pokemon, if the Pokemon League put that you should get these number of poke, In my story Pokemon New Season, I am writing about doing a Pokemon League that not allowed less than 1000 Points, not even 999 points is allowed. You should do a tournements such as contest to get points; so this idea will help also the girls who are Ash companions to do the same type of Goal. "

Well, Serena's new goal is to compete in contests; so they back it, but not in screen
Also, if you get Champion Ash, you can have a female E4 member trying to beat him. Then maybe she heard him and becomes Champion, and gave Ash train and beat her.
 
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Also, if you get Champion Ash, you can have a female E4 member trying to beat him. Then maybe she heard him and becomes Champion, and gave Ash train and beat her.
Well, This also a very well idea; so the reason of this thread, is to see you opinions about the girls in the Anime. What do you think of the Losing To Brandon made you unbeatable, and only lose to Cynthia, Brandon, or to Ash in the League. Also win 6-2./?
 
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