Worst Way Ash Has Lost The Pokemon League?

[CrashBash]

I've only seen Ash's losses in Kanto and Hoenn....I never had the "luxury" of seeing his Unova loss, although I came close. So I can only go by what those two showed.

Obviously, between the two, I have to pick Kanto, because it pretty much sums up how desperate/insistent they were to make Ash completely suck in this series, and literally have EVERYTHING handed to him on a silver platter (including most of his Gym Badges). And the worst part was that he was actually quite competent in his earlier battles...it was as if the writers finally allowed him to LEARN something.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I'm just not a fan of the Kanto saga's "Route to the League" (I.E. Gyms and League itself) in general.

 

[JacobYBM]

The Kantou and Jouto Leagues met with some pretty boring and bland endings, I remember. At the very least Hazuki was older than Satoshi, so his victory felt like it should have been. Kantou takes the cake for being a real anti-climax, though. I wish Satoshi had simply lost to an experienced trainer. Oh, well, that eventually happens, at least.

The Hou'en League was okay. I like the idea of Satoshi losing to older trainers. If he has to stay ten then he ought to at least lose to someone older than him. The Shin'ou League had the best possible ending, though. Having Satoshi battle a trainer not only older than him but capable of wielding Legendary Pokemon was a great way to end things. Satoshi even managed to defeat two of them! I hope Takuto returns to defeat Satoshi in a League someday.

The Isshu League is hilarious. It's so clear that there was a "no, Satoshi can't win" rule in place so Tomioka Atsuhiro and Sutou Norihiko said "fuck it" and made the most over-the-top joke ending possible. Tomioka didn't even write any of the League episodes himself, he passed the buck to Fujita Shinzou for the last episode. Fujita got repaid for this, at least, as the scripts for the first Kalos gym battle with Viola were actually pretty good.

 

[CynthiaLover]

Like many others, I say Unova. I don't really need to elaborate, now do I? Everyone else who I agree with pretty much said everything that I would say, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

[R!ck]

Nothing will ever top the disaster that was the Unova so-called league, ugh.

 

[Life]

This thread got me thinking a bit, and so I decided to re-watch Ash's battle with Cameron to see the specific parts that made the battle so bad. Figured I would share my list:

Spoiler

> To start, the match is between Cameron (a trainer who thought he only needed 7 badges to enter the league) and Ash (an experienced trainer who placed in the top 8+ for the past three leagues). Let's just keep that in mind.
> Cameron immediately starts things off with his secret weapon, which we can assume is his most powerful pokémon. Just my opinion, but that's a horrible strategy.
> As the battle between Hydreigon and Boldore goes on, we can see that clearly the staff didn't care about type match-ups, and that not very effective hits seem to be doing a lot of damage.
> Even though Ash has already lost two pokémon against Cameron, the two of them are going back and forth about how much fun they're having...
> There is no strategy used; both trainers are just yelling out attacks one after the other... and somehow it took Ash three turns to defeat Hydreigon.
> Cameron sends out a Ferrothorn.... against Pignite. I'm not sure whether that was a bad choice or not, considering how type match-ups clearly weren't a thing that battle.
> Ash keeps a clearly exhausted Pignite in against a Samurott...
> Samurott is somehow able to deflect electric-type attacks with Razor Shell, a water-type attack...
> Cameron sends in Swanna after Samurott loses to Pikachu, thinking that would somehow be a good move. Again, I can't tell if it mattered or not, since again, "type match-ups".
> Cameron seems surprised when Ash recalls Pikachu. Given how he was battling it's pretty obvious that he never even considered type match-ups or letting his pokémon take a break.
> Cameron realizes that a full battle consists of 6 pokémon, not 5... Seriously, do they just give trainer cards and pokédexes to anyone?
> Riolu evolves mid-battle... I can't tell whether that made me mad or not, since it seems like sweet revenge considering the Unova gym battles Ash won by his pokémon evolving.
> Lucario is apparently stronger than three of Ash's pokemon, beating Unfezant, Snivy, and Pikachu...
> Ash doesn't seem sad that he lost and even down to the last minute, Cameron and him were going back and forth about how much fun they were having. Good sportsmanship, I guess.......?
> Overall, there was absolutely no strategy in the battle and each trainer just called attacks one after another.
> In the next round, we see Cameron lose 3 to 0..... Virgil had his pokémon use double team and Cameron could, surprisingly, not think of anything to counter it, just going to show how battle-smart Cameron was.
> In multiple other leagues, Ash lost to the person who won the entire thing. But in this one, he lost to a person who came in the top 8...

So yeah, those were what I thought were the bad parts. All of that definitely tops everything else, in my opinion.

 

[dman_dustin]

I'm going to have to disagree with some of you in regards to the Unova league. No, I will agree it was arguably the worst league.

What I'm disagreeing with you is calling Ash stupid during that match up. I don't see it. I mean sure Ash wasn't himself during that battle, treating the battle like it didn't mean anything at all to him. But I wouldn't say Ash was being stupid.

Ash was the unfortunate victim of over-glorifying Cameron during that battle. Not only does Cameron conveniently have a Hydreigon that takes out Boldore and Oshawott, but his Riolu evolves into Lucario in the stupidest way just to beat Snivy (as if anyone could believe Riolu was struggling during that battle) and then it ends up curbstomping Pikachu, and to make matters worse Cameron only had 5 Pokemon, and only Pikachu and Pignite got wins. It was complete and utter crap, to the point they clearly hated Ash so much and wrote it like that.

The entire league except the battle with Stephan was battled badly to begin with. I mean seriously Pikachu should have lost to Serperior, by pure basis of how the battle was written and animated, but somehow Pikachu ends up getting a full revive and beating Serperior. And this is coming from a huge Ash fan that can usually defend his ridiculous (by other people) wins.

However despite all that, I'd still say Ash vs Cameron was still a battle. The so called battle against Ritchie wasn't even a battle to begin with, it was some horribly rushed animation just for the sole purpose of having Ash lose to a clearly inferior trainer.

But yes Unova was worse, because Cameron was incompetent and inferior and only won because he was completely overpowered. At least Ritchie was at least competent and did not have an overpowered team, even if he should have never had the realistic shot of beating Ash and only beat Ash in a very ridiculous way.

 

[Litten]

Him vs. Ritchie. While I hold TR somewhat accountable, the main culprit was Charizard since it refused to battle, though I suppose Ash was also at fault for not gaining his respect earlier in the saga and letting Charizard disobey him.

 

[garrison-san]

I have no issue with Ash losing his first league because Charizard wouldn't co-operate. Ash lost because of his then-current failings as a trainer, which were preventing him from accessing the major powerhouse on his team. Some may deem it an anti-climax, but I could almost accept that as being precisely the point.

I do have issues, however, with just about everything else in that battle:

1) Ritchie was billed as this amazing trainer who'd won all his prior league matches without losing any pokemon. Yet when Ash faced off against him he had pretty much no presence as a trainer whatsoever. Most of the battle consisted of the pokemon attacking one another without either of their trainers actually calling out any commands. Sending out his pokemon and telling Butterfree to use Sleep Powder was about the full sum of Ritchie's input.

2) Butterfree's Sleep Powder victory over Squirtle was highly questionable, and cheap as hell. It was fairly typical for the original series, however.

3) Maybe I'm overthinking things, but why didn't Ash just try to get the battle rescheduled on the grounds that the day's unexpected turn of events had put Ritchie at an unfair advantage? One would hope that being abducted and having to wear out one's pokemon in the process of escaping would be legitimate grounds for rescheduling. Team Rocket had been causing trouble earlier in the league and Ash even arrived at the stadium on their balloon, so surely it's not a matter of Ash not thinking that his story would be believed?

4) Why didn't Ash have Kingler or Muk with him at the time? It's not like he had anything to lose by keeping a full party on him during the League. What was the point of that empty slot?

 

[DracoMan]

Maybe we should have a poll for this. Sinnoh and Unova seem to be the front-runners for "worst Pokémon League loss," while hardly anybody's complaining about Johto or Hoenn.

I do agree that Ash's losses are getting progressively dumber, plus the overall "here we go again" factor that I've complained about so often that I'm actually getting sick of complaining. And since I don't have anything else to say that hasn't already been said, I'll shut up now.

 

[Boots2@sses]

For me it has to be sinnoh league even though the league itself was awesome the finale was unfairly bullshit, it took so long for ash to get to the level he was at the SL and when we think nothing can stop him now here comes a guy with F***ing legendaries at his disposal tearing the entire region apart out of literally nowhere. I was so furious at that moment that threw the remote at my TV.

 

[JacobYBM]

For me it has to be sinnoh league even though the league itself was awesome the finale was unfairly bullshit, it took so long for ash to get to the level he was at the SL and when we think nothing can stop him now here comes a guy with F***ing legendaries at his disposal tearing the entire region apart out of literally nowhere. I was so furious at that moment that threw the remote at my TV.

Satoshi would have still lost even without the Legendary Pokemon. It was already decided ahead of time that he was not allowed to win the League. It doesn't matter if Takuto had used Pokemon of Legend or not, either, because Takuto still clearly deserved to win. There's no way a ten year old like Satoshi should win a Pokemon League, especially when older trainers are likely to enter. Instead Satoshi got to defeat two Pokemon of Legend. That's a Hell of a way to end the series. Darkrai and Latios were there to give Satoshi an incredible final battle, not to point and laugh at the viewer. It's not a personal attack, step back and learn to think logically.

 

[dman_dustin]

For me it has to be sinnoh league even though the league itself was awesome the finale was unfairly bullshit, it took so long for ash to get to the level he was at the SL and when we think nothing can stop him now here comes a guy with F***ing legendaries at his disposal tearing the entire region apart out of literally nowhere. I was so furious at that moment that threw the remote at my TV.

Satoshi would have still lost even without the Legendary Pokemon. It was already decided ahead of time that he was not allowed to win the League. It doesn't matter if Takuto had used Pokemon of Legend or not, either, because Takuto still clearly deserved to win. There's no way a ten year old like Satoshi should win a Pokemon League, especially when older trainers are likely to enter. Instead Satoshi got to defeat two Pokemon of Legend. That's a Hell of a way to end the series. Darkrai and Latios were there to give Satoshi an incredible final battle, not to point and laugh at the viewer. It's not a personal attack, step back and learn to think logically.

Yeah I don't get it. Tobias was actually competent and actually deserved to beat Ash, and hell we got Ash's Sceptile beating an unbeatable Darkrai out of it.

What the hell was gained by having Ash losing to an incompetent trainer who didn't deserve to beat him in the first place, and just shoving Pikachu and Pignite focus down our throats just like against Roxie.

I mean the way the entire Sinnoh league was set up, and finished, Ash was clearly the 2nd best trainer in the entire league, that's the way it was portrayed, but they didn't want Ash with a runner-up because that would've been more episodes they didn't have, so they settled with it being clear, had Ash not battled Tobias at that moment, he would've been runner up as opposed to Top 4

In Unova, the writers said "F*** all to Ash" and had him lose in such a ridiculous stupid manner, that there was no way Ash was going to get far in that league at all. Because no way in hell apparently would Ash be able to do well against Virgil, since Cameron beat Ash in a stupid way, Cameron was clearly superior to Ash, that Virgil would've beat Ash 6-3, most likely. That was the biggest insult to Ash's character.

We can all excuse Kanto, because.....1st generation.....so they are allowed to make mistakes. Tobias was actually a competent trainer that actually caught legendaries and Ash did VERY well against said trainer, I don't think ANYONE would have done quite as well as Ash and no one did apparently and at least Tobias actually won the league. But Unova, has to be the generation where the writers or executive producers decided to not give a crap, and produce the worst league ever. The only decent well written battle was against Stephan. Don't know why they went from that to utter bullcrap, it was already bad enough we had a filler in the league revolving around Axew of all Pokemon as well as the atrocity crap of Ash beating Trip in an illogical way, not only that Cameron lost the very next battle, which is even more salt in the wound.

 

[Hidden Mew]

Okay, I just had to do a major clean-up in this thread. Do not threat the writers or insult other people for their opinions. Neither behavior is going to be tolerated here or anyone where else on the site. If this happens, infractions will be handed out. Please resume with a more respectful and productive discussion. Thank you.

 

[Harris]

Him vs. Ritchie. While I hold TR somewhat accountable, the main culprit was Charizard since it refused to battle, though I suppose Ash was also at fault for not gaining his respect earlier in the saga and letting Charizard disobey him.

Yeah Charizard sunk Ash's chances of winning back then lol

 

[Almonds]

Vs Cameron was an insult to Ash. The biggest disgrace imo.

 

[ManUtd22]

Vs Cameron was an insult to Ash. The biggest disgrace imo.

Insult to Ash, to Anime

As I said : "I can accept ash losing in champions, however losing to this guys the thing that i can't accept"

 

[Litten]

Vs Cameron was an insult to Ash. The biggest disgrace imo.

How come? All Cameron did was forget his sixth Pokemon, though he still won anyway with just five.

 

[Aura7541]

Kanto - It was unfortunate that Ash lost because he was busy fighting Team Rocket off prior to his match with Ritchie. However, for his first crack at a Pokemon league, Top 16 is nothing to sniff at.

Johto - Not really much to complain here. It was a very close match between his Charizard and Harrison's Blaziken and while Ash's Charizard lost, he finished in the Top 8.

Hoenn - Similar to Johto. While Ash didn't progress ranking-wise, he still battled well and Tyson's Meowth is one-of-a-kind.

Sinnoh - It's kinda annoying how Ash got eliminated. I mean how often do you end up facing a trainer with multiple legendaries? Regardless, he managed to beat Darkrai, which no other trainer has ever done. On top of that, he set the bar even higher by beating Latios in a double KO.

Unova - By far the worst Pokemon league loss. I would not consider Cameron to be a competent trainer as he didn't know he needed 8 badges to qualify, was reliant on slapping his forehead with his headband in tense situations, and went into the quarterfinals with only 5 Pokemon. In addition, the match was bereft of strategy and instead was predominately tit-for-tat.

 

[The Phantom Thief]

The Unova League and it's not even close.

 

[Almonds]

Vs Cameron was an insult to Ash. The biggest disgrace imo.

How come? All Cameron did was forget his sixth Pokemon, though he still won anyway with just five.

Bringing only 5 pokemon when the League rules state 6-on-6 full battle should have been enough to get him disqualified, yet they let Cameron battle anyways. He killed off two of his pokemon by sending them out against Ash's Pignite and Pikachu when they have clear 4x weaknesses and he STILL won.

When you think it's Ash, who defeated two legendary pokemons in the Sinnoh League... the Unova League was an insult to Ash's career.