Writers' Workshop General Chat Thread

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I'm kind of mixed on slow burn anything. While I can enjoy the ride if I like the characters, it often ends up feeling rushed at the end. Watch Fullmetal Alchemist (2003) to see what I mean. Or just watch it in general if you can tolerate dark stuff, both physical and emotional.

I'm also the opposite of you; I'll probably read a few paragraphs, at least, of any fanfic with an interesting premise, but it's harder for me to stay interested. I only read ongoing fanfics that already have a lot of chapters if I'm craving a particular genre, though.
 
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Man, chat was on fire for a few days, and then it slowly burned out.

Guess I gotta propose a chat topic. Um, I'm getting a kitten! Probably. A relative of mine is getting a kitten, but I'm going to be catsitting. This relative also owns guinea pigs. This may lead to problems.
 
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Don't expect to see this any time soon, but I've been thinking up a video essay based on our discussion about the stagnation of Pokémon. It's just about the games because I haven't followed the anime in years. Here's the ideas:

Part 1: the main series
The theme of Gen 6 is spectacle. Gen 1 marketing didn't prioritise cute/cool Pokémon nearly as much as the nostalgia for it does, at least in North America. The problems everyone has with Sword and Shield have existed for a while. My first impression of Let's Go was that it was insulting to children's intelligence.

Part 2: spinoffs
As Snuggles(?) said, Pokémon used to have something for everyone, but now everything is mobile games. They used to have in-depth stories with artistic integrity, but now they're all cutesy. The corporate mandates were always there, but it seems like they've gotten stricter. I used to feel like PSMD had symptoms all of these other problems, and I still don't like it, but now I've realised that it only has the "spectacle" problem and I'm glad it exists. Detective Pikachu is a blessing in disguise.

I'd appreciate help with this. I have other things to get through first, like finishing THE DOG Island and making a video essay about people in spandex hitting people in motocross gear.
 
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Hope your catsitting goes well, @Snuggle Tier List! Make sure the guinea pigs stay in their cage. :p I'd love to have a kitten/cat. I'd especially like one that can hunt for itself and spends time outside, but still likes to spend time with me and cuddle regularly. I feel like those traits kind of oppose each other though.

About slow-burn media: I usually don't care how long it will take to read something, as long as it holds my interest properly throughout the course of the story. So it really depends on how good the plot is at filling all that time.

@Nitro Indigo
Yes, I've been thinking about this topic as well, especially while writing my review of XY. You can talk about it with me if you want. I'm not really familiar with the spinoff games, although I think the "Pokemon had something for everyone; now it's homogenised" point applies well to the main series too, which is what I've been planning to write about.

I believe the overall easiness of the new games, lack of extra content like the Contests and Battle Frontier, and the introduction of gimmicks like Megas is an effort to really push Pokemon as something specifically for kids, as opposed to the earlier philosophy of a "game that everyone can enjoy". The mistake the new games make is underestimating the intelligence and tenacity of children. Pokemon is a game generally played by older kids anyway - 7/8 year olds and up, not three year olds.
 
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@Lumilite I've never actually played Let's Go, but I saw in a let's play that the language selector asks you to ask a parent for help and it made me so annoyed. (Which raises the question of why modern, main Pokémon games don't just default to the system's language like every other game in existence, including Gens 4 and 5. I don't think any internationally-released Nintendo consoles have Chinese as a system language, but still...)

I got burned out on Pokémon in 2017 because I felt like I'd "seen it all" and had nothing new to learn, and that's partly because Pokémon reviewers tend to take the franchise for granted and analyse Pokémon games as "Pokémon games", as opposed to "video games in general". It's the same with My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. I'm not trying to diss anyone, it's just a thing I've noticed, and that's why I appreciate reviewers like ExoParadigmGamer, Tamashii Hiroka, and Snuggles, who "step back" and look at the games they're reviewing as part of a bigger picture as well as parts of their respective franchises.
 
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@Nitro Indigo Might be before your time, but tracking the slow creep of story into the core series could give some answers. Perfect example is the cutscene in Ilix Forest in HG/SS that serves no purpose and wasn't present in the original G/S/C, or the Kimono Girl's summoning ritual of Ho-oh/Lugia that again wasn't present in the originals. You could trace it all the way back to the original R/S/E, where we had our first end-of-the-world plot (as threadbare as it was).

It might also be useful to look at critical reception of the spin-offs, which generally weren't good. For instance, the Pokémon: Ranger series was mostly 7/10s, which on the 4-point scale is 1/4. Meanwhile, the core series always gets the biggest sales numbers and the highest scores. Diverting resources away from underperforming spinoffs towards the cash-cow centerpiece might seem like a good idea, but it's also all eggs in one basket.

And it's also worth looking into the copyright side of things. Copyright of Pokémon is shared between Nintendo, Game Freak, and Creatures Inc. They set up The Pokémon Company, who according to their own website "our business activities have expanded to overall management of the Pokémon brand." The language barrier will stop serious scrutiny, but it's important to.note Game Freak has copyrights while the studios developing spin-offs don't. Game Freak is guaranteed their game or they could theoretically withhold copyright of Pokémon. And if Game Freak needs more resources to compete on the ever-more-expensive AAA level, then those resources gotta come from somewhere. It's literally the core of the Pokémon brand; if the core falters, the brand becomes tarnished.

Though I will say; as Pokémon fans, we've been mighty spoiled. Major studios in general have been putting out less new IP and more "live services", where games are expected to generate revenue after the point of sale. We have Fallout: 76, Destiny 2, The Elder Scrolls: Blades, Diablo: Immortal, the upcoming Halo: Infinite, the slowdown of Assassin's Creed theatcritics tell me was honestly for the better but I wouldn't know. Even new IP struggle to get sequels, let alone spinoffs: Minecraft, Fortnight, Sea of Thieves, No Man's Sky. Regardless of the franchise, spin-offs don't happen unless they're obvious cash grabs (Minecraft: Story Mode, RIP Telltale). Nintendo, of all companies, at least still puts out games. Maybe not as frequently as before, but they do it. Pokémon might just be late to the party.

Hope this gives you some leads. No judgments on the quality of the games listed, by the way. I have played couch co-op of Minecraft many times when babysitting, and I've grown to adore that game, for instance. It's the trends behind the game industry in general that're worth investigating, as Pokémon is for better or worse part of that industry.
 
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@Snuggle Tier List I think magazines might be paid to give good reviews. Official Nintendo Magazine said Shadows of Almia was better than Diamond and Pearl, but gave it a lower rating. (85% and 91% respectively, I think?)

Is the Ilex Forest cutscene in question the one with the Kimono Girl? When ORAS came out, I loved how they upped the ante and came up with new ideas instead of being a straight remake, but now I think that they made the lore too convoluted.

Not to mention that Gen 6 was a legendary fest. You can almost see the trademark symbols whenever someone in Super Mystery Dungeon says Legendary Pokémon or Mythical Pokémon, and then Gen 7 came along and called an evolution who literally didn't exist in-universe until the games' events a legendary, because it's now a term used to make a Pokémon more marketable.
 
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I really resent the increasing trend of games trying to squeeze more money out of you once you've already bought them - in this sense I'm glad that the most I've ever 'had' to pay was a fiver a year for Pokémon Bank.

Coming back to "slow burn", it does depend partly on the genre. Journeyfics aren't as popular as they used to be (Especially here), but I remember how most tend to stampede past the first beats of the story as fast as they possibly can. And it was almost always:
  1. Today's the day I get my first pokémon!
  2. Mom's made me a delicious breakfast on this glorious day! Bye Mom!
  3. I get my very first Charmander pokémon!
  4. I am now on my journey!
The best journeyfics put some flesh on the bones. An abandoned story (Lucky Egg) somewhere here did this in several thousand words, actually building up a picture of the protagonist's life - giving us a reason to actually care about the character
 
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i can't directly say whether or not i like slow burn as i don't think i'm familiar enough with the concept, but i basically quit death note after the first episode because it felt so slow so that might mean i lean towards no
 
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I stopped watching Death Note after one episode too, but that was because I thought it was too depressing. I eventually realised that I wasn't an "anime fan" because the only anime I really liked at the time was Fullmetal Alchemist.
 
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i got the feeling i needed to watch death note because it was mentioned in so many reviews i got on hunter, haunted but it just didn't click with me. i have a weird preference where i like dark stuff but not depressing stuff. that's actually a niche jojo really fits in, as best proven by the torture dance scene
 
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I like Fullmetal Alchemist because from the premise (brothers try to resurrect mother, almost die and create a mutant zombie, then the older one becomes a child soldier), you'd think it would be all doom and gloom, but it isn't. I had no idea what the actual plot would be going into 2003, only who some of the characters were, so I sometimes crave to be intrigued and surprised like that again. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to, so I stopped valuing my preconceptions.
 
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i got the feeling i needed to watch death note because it was mentioned in so many reviews i got on hunter, haunted but it just didn't click with me. i have a weird preference where i like dark stuff but not depressing stuff. that's actually a niche jojo really fits in, as best proven by the torture dance scene
Me too. It's hard to find stuff which matches that description though.
 
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i got the feeling i needed to watch death note because it was mentioned in so many reviews i got on hunter, haunted but it just didn't click with me. i have a weird preference where i like dark stuff but not depressing stuff. that's actually a niche jojo really fits in, as best proven by the torture dance scene
!!! people who think death note is underrated unite?

no but actually if I hear one more analysis about how a kid going from a well-intentioned slacker to a mass murderer over the course of five minutes is a good example of well-paced character development I’m gonna eat a potato chip
 
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!!! people who think death note is underrated unite?

no but actually if I hear one more analysis about how a kid going from a well-intentioned slacker to a mass murderer over the course of five minutes is a good example of well-paced character development I’m gonna eat a potato chip
i don't know how it managed to feel both too slow and too fast

(and did you mean to type overrated or did i misunderstand)
 
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I really resent the increasing trend of games trying to squeeze more money out of you once you've already bought them - in this sense I'm glad that the most I've ever 'had' to pay was a fiver a year for Pokémon Bank.

Coming back to "slow burn", it does depend partly on the genre. Journeyfics aren't as popular as they used to be (Especially here), but I remember how most tend to stampede past the first beats of the story as fast as they possibly can. And it was almost always:
  1. Today's the day I get my first pokémon!
  2. Mom's made me a delicious breakfast on this glorious day! Bye Mom!
  3. I get my very first Charmander pokémon!
  4. I am now on my journey!
The best journeyfics put some flesh on the bones. An abandoned story (Lucky Egg) somewhere here did this in several thousand words, actually building up a picture of the protagonist's life - giving us a reason to actually care about the character
I'll have to try this on some of my fics as well. I did try to read Lucky Egg but forgot about it. I better get back to it when I can.
 
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@canisaries @kintsugi - DN is definitely overrated as hell. All the "I know you know I know" stuff in particular. The fact that there are like two women in the whole franchise. Insane bullshit presented as clever plotting. Absurd characters, because the second premise besides the existence of death notes and shinigami is that there's a whole set of people with single-letter names with various specific vices who are really good at farcical mind games. And I'M GONNA TAKE THIS POTATO CHIP... AND EAT IT! I finished the whole manga because my former partner insisted on it and I don't think I liked or connected with a single character except for a superficial attachment to L because I, too, sat in stupid ways and ate many sweets.
 
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slav squats hello comrade yagami are you going to be doing the killing today

speaking of journey fics, i may actually dip into the genre as i was considering a short fic that'd go through some major events of the original TPP run to help me better flesh out my red's past and to help some readers get better context to the universe (both as TPP and a weird setting where almost all pokemon are sapience-capable but battling is still a thing). it'd also qualify to be posted to the TPP subreddit so i can achieve that crowd again, as my fics tend to be too far away from canon events to be relevant there
 
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I'll have to try this on some of my fics as well.
I seem to recall A Marvelous Journey takes a little more time than usual, partly because you're following the stations of the Johto plot - which demands a bit more time in getting the offical starter.

Death Note is one of those anime that can be over-recommended. It's almost always one of the first titles on a casual fan's lips, usually (And not without reason) used to dispel myths about anime essentially being little more than transforming robots and sailor suits
 
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