Review XY133: The Shocking Zygarde VS Zygarde! The Collapsing World!!

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

I really hope they don't take it away for the dub. Especially when they played Lysandre's theme...for, well Lysandre.

Yeah there's no excuse for removing that piece of music.

 

[Pokefan19]

Having watched the Subbed version, it's beginning to look like there's little chance for the people who have clung onto Alain rematching Ash and Ash winning the Championship trophy. Ash himself said the past doesn't matter and that he believed in the Alain he knew rather then the guy who supposedly was helping cause the end of the World.

 

[Shadao]

Having watched the Subbed version, it's beginning to look like there's little chance for the people who have clung onto Alain rematching Ash and Ash winning the Championship trophy. Ash himself said the past doesn't matter and that he believed in the Alain he knew rather then the guy who supposedly was helping cause the end of the World.

Depending on how accurate the sub is though, especially at this early time. The past doesn't matter when the present is at stake. The issue with Alain here is that he went into "It's all my fault" phase and never actually bothers to help until Satoshi reminds him such. That said though, the past has consequences and in order to let go, he must unlearn everything he had learned under Team Flare and start anew.

The trophy and title is something that I still see Alain casting it into the winds, for it's a reminder of his old mentality of "Never losing" given how it's earned. For Alain, he would want one last rematch with Ash after all of this is said and down. If not a chance to give the trophy to someone who guided him in his darkest hour, then certainly a chance to rediscover his epiphany that he so ignored during the Kalos League finals.

 

[Pokefan19]

Depending on how accurate the sub is though, especially at this early time. The past doesn't matter when the present is at stake. The issue with Alain here is that he went into "It's all my fault" phase and never actually bothers to help until Satoshi reminds him such. That said though, the past has consequences and in order to let go, he must unlearn everything he had learned under Team Flare and start anew.

I very much trust Aeon's subs and the opening to the episode said that Ash was kidnapped along with Alain. Kind of like Alain was pegged as the underdog vs Ash in their league match. Meh, different strokes for different folks... not everyone needs to have the exact same mentality.

The trophy and title is something that I still see Alain casting it into the winds, for it's a reminder of his old mentality of "Never losing" given how it's earned. For Alain, he would want one last rematch with Ash after all of this is said and down. If not a chance to give the trophy to someone who guided him in his darkest hour, then certainly a chance to rediscover his epiphany that he so ignored during the Kalos League finals.

I don't quite understand the life lesson there... I understand you need to learn to lose, but Alain beat Ash fair and square. No one goes into a match outright stating losing is okay. Any other match Alain losing might have been alright, but when you think long and hard about it, having that winning mentally in the most important battle tournament of the Region is actually a good thing to have. Alain didn't participate in the league to help Flare (although it did help since he fought Mega Users), he went there to face Ash and to redeem himself for Mairin. He had no ill intent entering the league.... why should what's happening reflect on his win?

 

[Shadao]

I very much trust Aeon's subs and the opening to the episode said that Ash was kidnapped along with Alain. Kind of like Alain was pegged as the underdog vs Ash in their league match. Meh, different strokes for different folks... not everyone needs to have the exact same mentality.

I don't quite understand the life lesson there... I understand you need to learn to lose, but Alain beat Ash fair and square. No one goes into a match outright stating losing is okay. Any other match Alain losing might have been alright, but when you think long and hard about it, having that winning mentally in the most important battle tournament of the Region is actually a good thing to have. Alain didn't participate in the league to help Flare (although it did help since he fought Mega Users), he went there to face Ash and to redeem himself for Mairin. He had no ill intent entering the league.... why should what's happening reflect on his win?

The winning mentality is a dangerous one without accepting the possibility of losing. That's why I said "Never losing" mentality, not "Aim to be the best" mentality. No one can say Ash didn't wish to win, but no one could say he didn't accept the possibility of losing. That's what separates him from Alain in the finals. If Alain lost, he might not take it as well as Ash.

We know where he got that mentality from. Lysandre and Team Flare. We know he's been aiming to win in-spite of the fact he's only in the League to have another chance to fight Ash. Instead of interacting with Mairin or Sycamore, he spends most of his time training intensively. Instead of congratulating his opponents prior to Ash, he simply leaves as if they didn't matter. He has no ill intent, but doesn't mean his way of handling things is right.

What does the trophy mean to Alain now? After discovering that the people who encouraged him to be strongest in order to achieve his dreams are in fact deceivers who simply used him to destroy the Kalos Region and harm innocents? After seeing the magnitude of the destruction he helped create and yet has no real power to stop it?

And then Satoshi shows Alain where true strength and courage really comes from. Not from striving to be the strongest. Not from vowing to never lose. But from his heart, his love and passion for the world that Lysandre threatens to destroy. From his will to never give up in-spite of the odds stacked against him. That is something that Alain has to admire Ash for. That is something for Alain to realize a different path to the power of protecting those he cares about.

 

[Arceus the Dragon]

Alain is not giving his trophy over. That is it. He and Ash might have a rematch but I doubt it. Alain won it fair and square. What happened after the league has happened after the league. The main thing is Alain finally realize the truth and error of his way which allowed him to turn on Lysandre.

 

[Alola]

A Youtuber summed up the rivals in this episode pretty nicely:

"Shauna: Hey Champ, can we team-up with you?
Diantha: But it's so dangerous!
Shauna: It's a risk we'll take!
Tierno: This is our last chance to do something useful and cool before we're dropped from the Show!
Trevor: Pretty pleeease?
Diantha:...Okay. I'm not comfortable with this...but you deserve it after the way the writers have screwed you over this saga.
Rivals: YAAAAYYY!!"

 

[Perpetual_Phoenix]

I wish they would divulge more of Lysandre's backstory. The flashback that was shown with him helping out all those people looks like a war zone. The damage that area took could have been caused by something entirely different, but it's interesting, nonetheless. At least that way the anime can confirm the Pokemon world isn't exactly a Utopian paradise.

 

[ii kanji]

Regarding Team Rocket, I am loving how they are doing things, BUT I am a bit disappointed they aren't doing more things! I know it is completely understandable and we should be patient, but I want action. I want them to take their disguises off and to show their Team Rocket uniforms

If they arrive in one piece at the Labs then I'm certain next week will be the one. Based on XY's internal continuity so far, I'm also expecting that Gojika's specific statement that they would play an important role will not go unfulfilled - I just hope it transpires into something substantial over the next 3 episodes because I'm super greedy

(I haven't checked it, but this is for sure the longest time we have seen Team Rocket without their uniforms, right? For the whole League and now for the Team Flare arc).

Ooooooooooh nice spot!
I think you're right, because extended costume events tend to be limited to league/GF type things (everything else always gets revealed sooner or later in the episode) and even Shinnou league was only 7 episodes, so at 9 so far this must be the longest streak! I've almost forgotten what they normally look like...

 

[Zygardereign]

This episode is really good. I do have a good feeling the Team Flare arc will alleviate what happened at the league, and be better than the other team arcs from the past. I really like how everyone has a role in this, even side characters such as Shota, Shuana, Trevor and Tierno are really helping out, and not just being there.

I especially liked Bonnie's interactions with Zygarde. She didn't just stood there and did nothing.I don't think I saw a greater bond between a legendary and a child than this. Her sensing what Squishy felt was odd at first, since she hasn't done that before, but if I recalled at ME act 4, when Mairin's Chespin went inside the Lysandre labs and found Squishy being used in an experiment, Squishy used the same "telepathic communication" on Chespie, making it able to sense where Squishy is at. And plus, Bonnie being with Squishy the whole time, I guess it was comfortable to share how it feels with a human being.

Though Zygarde sounding like Mothra, and had a bit of Palkia's cry during the first 40 seconds of the episode was weird, I really want to know how Bonnie's going to react when Perfect Zygarde comes, and how she'll be able to calm down Squishy since both cores seem to look normal when they're about to fuse into Perfect form from one of the previews. I don't think it'll sound anything monstrous due to it looking humanoid. But I hope it sounds different from Squishy and the blue core to fit it's kingly look, since both cores sound different, though I can see both of them talking at the same time...

 

[Torterrius]

I have rarely been moved to such strong emotion watching Pokemon as when Ash and Greninja fight off Lysandre's controlling beams by activating the bond phenomenon.

As disappointed as the League conclusion left me, hearing Ash scream "I like this world! There are Pokemon and people that I love; I will not let you hurt them!" and then bursting into Ash-Greninja mode left me with tingles down my spine. Truly an epic performance is on the horizon for us.

I guess, ultimately, the writers did what they were told, but in the end they're still doing a greater job than the Pokemon anime has ever seen to date. This is a movie quality storyline we're getting, and I can't help but be swept up into once again watching Ash do something amazing to save the world against all odds.

C'mon Ash, do it once more! For the fans!

 

[WatcherMark]

Alain is not giving his trophy over. That is it. He and Ash might have a rematch but I doubt it. Alain won it fair and square. What happened after the league has happened after the league. The main thing is Alain finally realize the truth and error of his way which allowed him to turn on Lysandre.

First of all, I'm pretty certain that trophy is smashed to pieces underneath the remains of the stadium right now.

Second, I also wish people would stop going on and on about the match because in the grand scheme of things its not important... stopping the destruction of the Pokemon world is the only thing that matters right now. I'm pretty certain that Satoshi and Alan haven't thought once about the match since the initial attack, and in the end I'm also pretty sure that Alan considers Satoshi his superior in every way which is really important.

 

[SamurottMan]

First of all, I'm pretty certain that trophy is smashed to pieces underneath the remains of the stadium right now.

Second, I also wish people would stop going on and on about the match because in the grand scheme of things its not important... stopping the destruction of the Pokemon world is the only thing that matters right now. I'm pretty certain that Satoshi and Alan haven't thought once about the match since the initial attack, and in the end I'm also pretty sure that Alan considers Satoshi his superior in every way which is really important.

Yep, agreed. The league is over. Alan won. Done.

I can't believe there are still people in denial about this. Like WatcherMark said, the important thing now is saving Kalos and that'll probably end the XYZ series.

 

[Gengarzilla]

Yep, agreed. The league is over. Alan won. Done.

I can't believe there are still people in denial about this. Like WatcherMark said, the important thing now is saving Kalos and that'll probably end the XYZ series.

Yep. It may not have happened in the way we wanted, but Alain's been humbled now. Ash is doing phenomenally well here for a runner up.

 

[Silktree]

Alain being humbled by his mistakes doesn't mean that "Ash is his superior". Right now they're both fighting Lysandre and it is premature to call Ash the real hero. Zygarde is the one that will save the day, anyway.

 

[Arceus the Dragon]

First of all, I'm pretty certain that trophy is smashed to pieces underneath the remains of the stadium right now.

Second, I also wish people would stop going on and on about the match because in the grand scheme of things its not important... stopping the destruction of the Pokemon world is the only thing that matters right now. I'm pretty certain that Satoshi and Alan haven't thought once about the match since the initial attack, and in the end I'm also pretty sure that Alan considers Satoshi his superior in every way which is really important.

Actually no it didn't and Ash is not Alain superior. Alain is far better than Ash in terms of pokemon battles. If it is about right/wrong then Ash has the edge but Ash is far from superior.

 

[Shadao]

Actually no it didn't and Ash is not Alain superior. Alain is far better than Ash in terms of pokemon battles. If it is about right/wrong then Ash has the edge but Ash is far from superior.

There are people who are strong but foolish and people who are weak but wise. One has to look at Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars. He is considered to be potentially the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy, but his pride gets the better of him and he is defeated in single combat against his former mentor, Obi-Wan Kenobi. There was no doubt of who was the superior person.

In the context of this episode, Ash is the one who leads. Ash is the one who inspires and opens Alain's eyes to see the truth about strength. Due to that, there is no doubt of who is the superior and who is the learner.

 

[Arceus the Dragon]

There are people who are strong but foolish and people who are weak but wise. One has to look at Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars. He is considered to be potentially the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy, but his pride gets the better of him and he is defeated in single combat against his former mentor, Obi-Wan Kenobi. There was no doubt of who was the superior person.

In the context of this episode, Ash is the one who leads. Ash is the one who inspires and opens Alain's eyes to see the truth about strength. Due to that, there is no doubt of who is the superior and who is the learner.

There is no inferior/superior here. Ash maybe better in terms of moral beliefs and certain ways of raising pokemon but Alain is better in terms of strength and pokemon battles. Ash can never be superior especially as he now lost 6 leagues in a row (excluding orange islands league).

 

[Shadao]

There is no inferior/superior here. Ash maybe better in terms of moral beliefs and certain ways of raising pokemon but Alain is better in terms of strength and pokemon battles. Ash can never be superior especially as he now lost 6 leagues in a row (excluding orange islands league).

Considering how close the last battle was, how Ash and Greninja manages to break free of their bonds without anyone's help and the implication that Ash-Greninja is a lot stronger than previously realized, it's only a matter of time before that gap is closed (just like Sawyer close the gap between him and Ash in their third battle).

And really, superior doesn't translate into who is more powerful or who won more battles. Ritchie doesn't have powerful Pokémon like Ash does (looking at Charizard) in their League battle, but he is a superior in terms of responsibility and maturity (which Ash lacks and cost him the battle). Ash looks up to him as a result. And now it's Alain's turn in XYZ.

 

[Arceus the Dragon]

Considering how close the last battle was, how Ash and Greninja manages to break free of their bonds without anyone's help and the implication that Ash-Greninja is a lot stronger than previously realized, it's only a matter of time before that gap is closed (just like Sawyer close the gap between him and Ash in their third battle).

And really, superior doesn't translate into who is more powerful or who won more battles. Ritchie doesn't have powerful Pokémon like Ash does (looking at Charizard) in their League battle, but he is a superior in terms of responsibility and maturity (which Ash lacks and cost him the battle). Ash looks up to him as a result. And now it's Alain's turn in XYZ.

Still doesn't change the fact that Ash will never be superior to those stronger than him.