Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation III

[Articwolf10]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

Go to your room. See that clock on the wall? Run by the internal battery. Runs the Berries and Shoal Cave. There's not even the slightest reason for them not having the visible day-night cycle, days of the week, or otherwise except for the fact that they either couldn't make it look good or just got lazy.



That's Gen IV. And it's almost 14 feet tall, thanks.

No a full day/night cycle would have drained the batteries what do you think happened with the GenII games? The clock and berries aren't as draining. The Day/Night thing was fixed in GenIV because th eDS had an internal clock which the GBA didn't

 

[TM2-Megatron]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

No a full day/night cycle would have drained the batteries what do you think happened with the GenII games? The clock and berries aren't as draining.

I don't think so. Both the Gen II and III cartridges had built-in real-time-clocks... in order to keep accurate track of time, RTCs need a battery to provide constant power for when the game isn't being played. In the Gen II cartridges, the game's saved data was stored on SRAM, which also needs a constant source of power to preserve its data... so both the clock and SRAM used the same battery; basically doubling the drain on it.

Gen III cartridges saved data to a non-volatile flash memory area, which doesn't require constant power. So the battery only needed to power the clock, which is why it lasts longer.

 

[Miles Prower]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

First off, the people who Critisize Hoenn is very low to me, considering Emerald was the one that started it all to me.

It had a great plot, better than the Team Rocket and Sinnoh(Which I think was the second best plot). I mean, the interaction you have between both Magma and Aqua makes you feel like your an Inside man on for each side. Seeing thier perspectives against each other and for the pokemon is a perfect story. And when they awakened Groudon and Kyogre, it was the most Epic Battle Scene ive seen in a pokemon game. When it had Groudon and Kyogre in animated form, battling each other was priceless. Then when you awakened Rayquaza, that was true Animation there. The details they gave Rayquaza was brilliant, with him flying through the air, and Decending down onto Sootopolis(I believe is its name).

Of course, afer the new pokemon, everyone was used to seeing Rattata and Pidgey, instead of Zigzagoon and Poochyeana. Whike I respect that, the pokemon were actaully better than Gen I and II(Although they are my second favorite set, with Cyndaquil, and the others).

In summary, the third gen was a well done piece to the Pokemon Era....and I do believe, gen. III was the starting point of every pokemon fan in the mid-early 21st century. Although I could have gotten started on Firered and Leafgreen if I knew of them at the time, but however...anyone who critisizes Gen. III must be true, old time pokemon fans; or just crazy people...in my opinion.

 

[Orion-Sama]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

But consider Dark-type moves. The main reason Dark was introduced was to help balance Psychic, and since it was Psychic Pokemon themselves that were the problem, as long as there were accessible Dark-type moves then the plan would work--and with the frequency of Pokemon that could learn Bite or had Pursuit added to their learnset, that was no problem.

Fair enough, but I wonder why the hell they didn't showcase both the Moves and the Pokémon. What would be the problem?

Plus, each of the new types had a Trainer challenge dedicated to them--a gym for Steel and an Elite Four member for Dark. Even if you didn't use the new Pokemon, you still had to think about them, which is arguably better because that lets you start using them with foreknowledge of what does/doesn't beat them.

A Type is made of strengths and weaknesses. We only had a proper insight in their weaknesses, as they were introduced as foes, not as allies. To me, that's bad design.

You can argue Generation 1 gave poor emphasis to Ghost and Dragon, but I digress. Those Types were always scarce until Generation 3. Even then, they're often treated as such nowadays. Ghost is still not that common nowadays (Misdreavus is often Version exclusive, if not available later into the game. Shedinja is something you could not even get if you're not aware of how to get it. Shuppet and Duskull are mid-to-late additions most of the time. Drifloon is secluded to a single day of the week. Spiritomb involves a requirement you might not even get to do. Rotom is a one-off, and only found post-game in Diamond/Pearl. Only Gastly is "common", but it's often either found only in certain areas, and/or at certain times.), but Dragon remains elusive (The pseudo-legendary Dragons are only accesible until mid to late game. Platinum's the only exception. Even then, Gible is ridiculously rare. Every other non-Legendary Dragon is a middle/final Stage of an initially non-Dragon Pokémon). Plus, in the same vein, Ghost and Dragon got an Elite Four Member, too. Let's not forget the awfully low Move quantity such Types had originally.

Generation 2 added two new Types, but despite making them more numerous than Ghost and Dragon themselves at the same point in time, were pretty much nowhere to be seen. I dunno about you, but I'd rather be able to be properly introduced to these new Types and their new Pokémon, meaning, making me capable of catching and raising them, instead of only being able to fight against them.

And I don't see how you can say that Gen II Pokemon weren't properly focused on until Gen III when the Hoenn Pokedex was almost entirely dedicated to new Pokemon.

I forgot to mention this referred to the Game Cube "Spin-Offs", Colosseum and XD. Of course, this talks even more of how much did Generation 2 games fail in this regard. Even side games did a much better job introducing and showcasing the creatures Gold/Silver were supposed to introduce. These games play exactly like your main series game, and can even connect with them. As far as I'm concerned, they count. It wasn't until these games that I could finally try out some 2nd Generation Pokémon, instead of getting shoved with Pokémon I already knew about.

The series makes a point of adding new creatures each Generation. What's the point of doing this if you're going to put them in the sidelines and make the older monsters dominant even in the new area? Personally, Generation 3 did things right, and finally moved old stuff away from the limelight.

Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike the Gen III games, but I feel that until HGSS, the Gen II games were the best there were when taken in context of what they were building on.

Please explain this to me. As far as I'm concerned, everyone has their idea of what they like in a Pokémon game, or what they believe has to be focused on in said games. Developers have their own ideas as well, but I fail to see how Generation 2 did it better. Recycling the same villain group and adding the same old Region instead of making the new one bigger and better, let alone making the same old Pokémon more common than the new ones don't really go into my idea of what a Pokémon game is about. Doesn't even goes into my idea of what makes a good game.

I, for one, think the change of direction was needed. That is, if they wanted this series to remain alive and keep on cashing the money. I would have left the series had it not been for Generation 3 completely refreshing it and coming after what I consider a lowest point in terms of overall game design.

 

[Underscore]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

I love the III Generation! I grew up with it! I have nostalgia fromm RUby, Sapphire, and Emerald!

 

[Kyoto Tushoni]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

I love the Second generation games and with the new things from 3rd and 4th in my Soul Silver I can't be happier with Pokemon at this moment in time!

Gen 1 was gen 1 and was great. Gen 2 had what Gen 1 had plus sooo many new things and started to really show a story of sorts...which picked up after what you (Red) did in 1st gen.
Gen 3 felt like a new game that didn't stray off the path too much, nice graphics and awesome speed compared to the 3D counterparts. Some of my favorite Pokemon in this generation. It game me the Macro and Acro bikes. So many people that were challenging me and were my "rivals"....if I could just run on the treetops of Fortree...Secret Bases!? Who did not love them? They were a great ploy that me and all my friends enjoyed a lot!

However don't get me started on Gen 4...the pokemon are jokes...Tangrowth? Really? WTF? Lazy much...I drew these kinda things in Elementary school...they call them doodles! I know it has good stats but C'mon! The designs were lazy, I hate how I can't heatbut trees but I can, put honey on them? Oh god...and not having access to any good pokemon or any fire pokemon until after the elite four...and really the only vareity of pokemon were like between 8 different pokemon and their evolutions? I mean...ones I can actually use. If any games should be under revision it should be generation 4. All I got out of it were destictions between Physical and Special Attacks. Which SHOULD have started on gen 2's clock.

Summary
Gen 1 :crush:
Gen 2 :yahoo:
Gen 3 :banana:
Gen 1 remakes :birthday:
Gen 4 :banghead::banghead::banghead:
Gen 2 remakes :7up:

 

[Ranger Jack Walker]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

No matter what anyone says, they cannot ignore the fact that the Gen II Gym Leaders lacked Gen II Pokemon. Take a look:

Falkner: Pidgey, Pidgeotto.
Easily could have used Hoothoot and Noctowl.

Bugsy: Metapod, Kakuna, Scyther.
Again, he should have used Pokemon like Ledian and Ariados.

Whitney: Clefairy, Miltank.
We have to wait till the 3rd gym to see the leader use one of the new Pokemon. Very Sad. Could have used Furret instead of Clefairy.

Morty: Ghastly, Haunter, Gengar, Haunter.
This has got to be the worst team. Why is there no Misdreavus?

Chuck: Primeape, Poliwrath.
Missed the oppurtunity to showcase Hitmontop.

Jasmine: Magnemite, Magnemite, Steelix.
Nothing too bad here though one skarmory instead of 2 magnemite would have been preferable.

Pryce: Seel, Dewgong, Piloswine.
Fail. Really, really should have used Delibird and Sneasel instead of the Seel family.

Clair: Dragonair, Dragonair, Dragonair, Kingdra.
Well, Clair has an excuse seeing that there are only 2 Dragon type families in Gen II but 3 Dragonair?

There are absolutely no excuses for this major flaw.(Something the Gen III corrected to a great extent) Out of the 23 Pokemon used by 8 Gym Leaders, only 4 are 'new' Pokemon that we haven't seen before. As Gym Leaders of the new region, they are supposed to showcase the new Pokemon while still providing a decent challenge at the least. Gen III may have had its flaws but this one single flaw of Gen II is bigger than all the of Gen III's flaws.

Again, there are no excuses for this flaw.

 

[siburke939]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

i now know exactly why i hated G3 at the time...

after putting several hours into red, blue, yellow, gold, silver & crystal i was more than a bit pissed that i couldn't transfer any pokemon over to ruby/sapphire

i hope they make something that allows you to transfer pokemon (like the palpark) if they ever totally change the game structure again - why couldn't they create a simple program that stripped all EV's & levels off a pokemon & adjusted it to the new style when transferred??? epic let down

i got over it (by about emerald time) but wow ruby/sapphire left a nasty taste in my mouth at the time

 

[GreatLiver]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

The inability for gen II and III to connect was entirely necessary, and I really didn't mind it.

If anything, I would definitely say that Gen II was by far the worst generation. The games were terrible, and the only reason people actually like them was because they could go back to a shitty Kanto. The trainers were weak and low leveled so that pokemon wouldn't be overpowered by the time they got to Kanto. This lead to a lack of evolutions and move learning when it would have been nice. When all you've got on something is Water Gun at like the 4th gym because it's still at level 19 is crap, and was really really annoying.

 

[VeggiePopper]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

The inability for gen II and III to connect was entirely necessary, and I really didn't mind it.

If anything, I would definitely say that Gen II was by far the worst generation. The games were terrible, and the only reason people actually like them was because they could go back to a shitty Kanto. The trainers were weak and low leveled so that pokemon wouldn't be overpowered by the time they got to Kanto. This lead to a lack of evolutions and move learning when it would have been nice. When all you've got on something is Water Gun at like the 4th gym because it's still at level 19 is crap, and was really really annoying.

You're wrong. I loved GSC because:
-It was a true sequel, even without Kanto.
-It introduced breeding, which allowed for more than one starter, hitmon and eeveelution.
-Two new types! Whatever the reason was, it's the only generation that intruduced new types. Plus, it balanced the type chart.
-Ampharos is DA SHIT.
-It had Ho-oh and Lugia, the best Legendary version mascots in my opinion; and you can get both.
-Crystal was the first game where you could choose your character's gender.
-Crystal introduced the Battle Tower.

"Pokémon wouldn't be overpowered"? Well then why my Typhlosion from my Gold version was my first legitimate Lv. 100 Pokémon?

You're just too biased, those games weren't terrible. Instead, they are the ones which introduced more staple features for the series. While some of those features (Battle Tower, Dark types, reginal dex) were barebones, they were first used here.

 

[Absur'd]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

In my opinion; 2, 4, 3, 1. :|
Though with HG/SS, 4 pushes further ahead of 2 like beating a dead horse.
The 3rd gen took one step forward and two steps backwards. No time clock, lack of multi-region, really shitty plot and really shitty villains, disgusting Pokemon design (Shiftry? Surskit? Medicham? Really?), and some other stuff I can't be assed to list.
While it does have a lot of advancement, the game itself felt a lot lacking compared to the previous set of games.

To be honest I hate Kanto the most. Each region had something memorable to me, except for Kanto which was just a cesspool of boring.
Gold was the first game I got and I bought Blue to try to see why everyone loved R/B so much...I HATED playing it.


Also, I like how people criticize G/S for being too low leveled, when in actuality the gyms in Johto are the biggest pains in the ass BECAUSE of the low leveled 'mons.

High level =/= more challenge.

I breezed through Platinum like a blazing knife through steak because the levels were just handed to me via VS seeker.

 

[UnownUnknown]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

In my opinion; 2, 4, 3, 1. :|
Though with HG/SS, 4 pushes further ahead of 2 like beating a dead horse.
The 3rd gen took one step forward and two steps backwards. No time clock, lack of multi-region, really shitty plot and really shitty villains, disgusting Pokemon design (Shiftry? Surskit? Medicham? Really?), and some other stuff I can't be assed to list.
While it does have a lot of advancement, the game itself felt a lot lacking compared to the previous set of games.

To be honest I hate Kanto the most. Each region had something memorable to me, except for Kanto which was just a cesspool of boring.
Gold was the first game I got and I bought Blue to try to see why everyone loved R/B so much...I HATED playing it.

I agree with ya.

 

[Sombra29]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

Shiftry? Surskit? Medicham? Really?

You just listed three of some of the(many) memorable Hoenn pokemon.Take your nostalgia goggles out,please.Shiftry is a badass tengu,Surskit is an adorable Water strider(I dare you to say it isn't cute!) and medicham is a nice change of pace from the usual fighting-types we had at the moment.

And you don't really have any arguments to say they are lame,at last not any of the "stock" arguments usually used.

"I miss when I could tell what a pokemon was just by lookin!"

Its easy to tell what they are(even if you are not Japanese,its obvious shiftry is some kind of forest monster or hermit,I dont know how incult someone would have to be to not be able to tell what surskit is,and medicham is a warrior that meditates,probably oriental, and its just as easy as it is to tell that hitmonchan is a boxer.)

"They have so many marks they look like digimons!"

No,just no.They are fairly simple.And the only markings they have are no more unnecessary than any Jotho pokemon(just to name an example).

 

[ASH117]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

Gen two did make you have to train more often due to lack of powerful trainers. I liked the remakes of red and blue the best.

 

[thisimmortalsoul]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

The reason I didn't really like Generation III was (what I considered) the lack of memorable Pokemon. I also felt it introduced the concept of meaningless legendaries which became all too prevalent in Gen IV.

 

[Morru]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

In order, i rank the generations(based on the pokémon):
GenIV
GenI
GenIII
GenII
Yes, i hate johto. I think its only achievement was dark types (like Houndoom) and porygon2. Oh, and Quilfish.

 

[Absur'd]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

You just listed three of some of the(many) memorable Hoenn pokemon.Take your nostalgia goggles out,please.Shiftry is a badass tengu,Surskit is an adorable Water strider(I dare you to say it isn't cute!) and medicham is a nice change of pace from the usual fighting-types we had at the moment.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha using the nostalgia goggles argument against me ha ha ha ha ha ha hah ahahahaha ah ah aha ha ha hah aha hh ah a hah ah ah h a hah ah ah ha h ah a hah ah a h ha ha ha ha h ha ha hah a ha ha ha hh ah ah ah hah ah a ha ha h ha.

No.

I LOVED some of the Hoenn pokemon. Marshtomp, Ludicolo, Flygon, and Altaria come to mind. I just found that a lot of the designs looked so outlandish and ridiculous even for me. We're all entitled to opinions, aren't we?

D/P's Pokemon were a lot more ridiculous than R/S' but D/P put a lot of past Pokemon in the wild, which absorbed the blow of the new ones. And I liked Sinnoh way better than Hoenn, though I say that because I love winter compared to summer.


To be honest, I found a lot of Gen 1 Pokemon to be boring and generic.

 

[fullmetalwooper]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

I love gen. III. I still play emerald regularly. And seriously, where would we be without Ralts? Although I wish trapinch was easier to get, especially in other games.

 

[Kyoto Tushoni]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

i now know exactly why i hated G3 at the time...

after putting several hours into red, blue, yellow, gold, silver & crystal i was more than a bit pissed that i couldn't transfer any pokemon over to ruby/sapphire

i hope they make something that allows you to transfer pokemon (like the palpark) if they ever totally change the game structure again - why couldn't they create a simple program that stripped all EV's & levels off a pokemon & adjusted it to the new style when transferred??? epic let down

i got over it (by about emerald time) but wow ruby/sapphire left a nasty taste in my mouth at the time

See I think this is the real reason people hated on Gen3. And this is sooo much tolerable than complaining about some of the lax character designs of Gen 3, because Gen 4 was a lot worse. I do think Game Freak Learned about this, and will be adding something that allows you to trade up from now on.

However, I also think they will be using a lot of other things like the Pokewalker to make games a little different and sell more. I highly doubt Gen V will have anything like the Pokewalker and it will primarily try to use to 3DS to get its fame (PS-Not looking forward to the 3DS :\ )

 

[TM2-Megatron]

Re: Generation III: Criticized too often?: Fan's response in defense of Generation II

and it will primarily try to use to 3DS to get its fame (PS-Not looking forward to the 3DS :\ )

They're sure going about it in a weird way, then, considering the first two Gen V games won't even be for the 3DS; and there'll probably be no added benefit in playing them on one (unless GF sticks in a very small, 3DS-enhanced area).