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Writers' Workshop General Chat Thread

So something's been bugging me regarding writing, but I guess it applies to everything. Someone has a question about how to do something, and a common answer I see is 'You can do it this way, but you shouldn't because it's been done before'. My question is, who cares if it's been done before? If it works, do it. The point of writing is to tell a story, not break new ground with every word you put down on the page.

Does that bug anyone else like it does me?
 
I certainly agree. I think there is a lot of stigma around 'cliches' and having to always take a bold new direction with every character choice. I think it is fine to use a few typical ways to get your characters out of something if you have to, as long as the entire story is drowning in them then there should be no issue.
 
Whenever I catch myself saying "it's been done before," I always try to follow up with "but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it."

Everything's been done before. Cliches are actually a great place to start when designing characters and plots, and there's no real loss if some (or all) of them slip in to the final product. I actually really like reading certain cliches, even if they're cheesy.
 
Mostly what everyone else said. Just because it's been done before doesn't make it bad; it's more of how you do it in this particular iteration of doing whatever, and even more of why you do it in this particular iteration of doing whatever. Most R/B/Y journeyfics involve the "omg magikarp salesman -> GIANT GYARADOS I'MMA FIRIN' MY LAZOR," but there are great ways to twist that without playing it straight and starting with the whole "omg magikarp use your almighty splash techniquez!!!!" thing.

Rambling here. I guess, two things. The "how" is usually defined (to me) by what is contextually around said cliche. If you play the cliche straight and do it with the exact same context/background events as everyone else does the cliche, yeah, it's something that everyone else has done, which isn't exactly great (but not necessarily bad, as everyone says).

The "why" is defined far more vaguely, but also has to do with how the cliche integrates with your story. Why do you feel the need for [cliche]? If it's something along the lines of "I think that this particular arc/section of storytelling/way of developing a character really ties in to my story/themes/characters/whatever," yeah, that's phenomenal and you shouldn't feel worried at all.
 
What's happening everyone? Sorry for the unintended long break. What's new around these parts of the internet?
 
AetherX said:
Whenever I catch myself saying "it's been done before," I always try to follow up with "but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it."

Everything's been done before. Cliches are actually a great place to start when designing characters and plots, and there's no real loss if some (or all) of them slip in to the final product. I actually really like reading certain cliches, even if they're cheesy.
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Yeah, there are cliches I like a lot too! Like a romance story where a common guy gets with a princess! This is a reason I ship Ike x Elincia as much as I do for Fire Emblem. :p

@AceTrainer14; Ah, yeah, you're right. ONE nomination for someone else's work is hardly enough. :( I would've nominated more than that, but as I said before, I'm not much of a reader here since I'm not big on Pokemon fanfiction...
 
A good way to look at it, I think, is that a cliche is a cliche because it's a good idea. Clearly it was popular enough to catch on at some point, in order to reach the stage of not only being used a lot, but also to be well-known and genuinely popular. I do think it's generally important to put one's own spin on cliches - even if the general concept has been done before a million times, it can still feel fresh if you get it right.

Kelleo said:
Yeah, there are cliches I like a lot too! Like a romance story where a common guy gets with a princess! This is a reason I ship Ike x Elincia as much as I do for Fire Emblem. :p
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Oh, I love Ike x Elincia! They were so sweet in Path of Radiance, and it bothers me how little interaction they got in Radiant Dawn. And they never got their own ending. Honestly, why can Elincia get married to Geoffrey, they were raised as siblings! Sure they're not actually related by blood, but that doesn't matter. It's creepy.

But to stop ranting for a second, yeah, I'm agreed with you here.
 
Lord Kyuubi said:
Oh, I love Ike x Elincia! They were so sweet in Path of Radiance, and it bothers me how little interaction they got in Radiant Dawn. And they never got their own ending. Honestly, why can Elincia get married to Geoffrey, they were raised as siblings! Sure they're not actually related by blood, but that doesn't matter. It's creepy.

But to stop ranting for a second, yeah, I'm agreed with you here.
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Yeah, I know, right? Some people argue that Elincia only sees Lucia as her sibling, not Geoffrey, but come on, she grew up with BOTH of them. Geoffrey implies this in his support with Callil, says he used to chase the girls around the royal villa and stuff. And Elincia seems to treat Geoffrey like that overprotective older brother. She's all "back off and stop protecting me!" and such. Although some of the Ike x Elincia teasing was done by the NoA localization only, things like that final PoR cutscene still exist no matter which version of the game you play. So yeah, all that being thrown out the window in RD was messed up :( The only reason I can think of that Elincia would marry Geoffrey is that so she could get a husband and produce an heir without those stuffy nobles pestering her about it. Renning is still around, but he's much older than her and it's always good to have a "backup" around when it comes to royalty business. And Geoffrey is the only guy not named Ike that I can see Elincia choosing to wed. So yeah, I really think Elincia just "settled" for him, though understandably so, since Ike just up and left for who knows why (I hated this too...).

I have Ike x Elincia stuff in Dawn of Darkness, though, Kyuubi! :)
 
A more formal announcement that is non-awards related (though there is news on that front in its thread nugenudgewinkwink).
In case you haven't seen the floating global announcement, the forums are facing a bit of a spam bot attack at the moment. It hasn't struck us here yet much, but in case it does, make sure you read that announcement if you haven't yet and report any spam the second you see it. It'll help us keep things under control. Thanks!
 
You know what I've come to realize as I write One Big Conspiracy more? I like the word "immediately." A lot. A looooot. Remind me to use words like "instantly" or even "instantaneously" more, so the narrative doesn't get redundant. And I am starting to have a lot of fun with Flannery and Gengar's characters. oh and I'm up to chapta sixteen so ya should prob'ly go check dat out
 
I always use some of the same words. The only thing my characters love to do more than blow things up and not get shaken up by the horrors they experience is raise their eyebrows, hiss and let their eyes flicker around the room.

A typical GVerse paragraph would be something along the lines of:

"I don't give a fucking shit about all the fucking shit I've been through!" Alaska hissed back at Sandy, eyebrows raised indignantly at her friend. Her eyes flickered around the burning battlefield, wondering what implausible scenario would happen next.
 
AetherX said:
I update so rarely my typical paragraph doesn't exist.
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ye


AceTrainer14 said:
"I don't give a fucking shit about all the fucking shit I've been through!" Alaska hissed back at Sandy, eyebrows raised indignantly at her friend. Her eyes flickered around the burning battlefield, wondering what implausible scenario would happen next.
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Ace, did you just summarize How to Conquer Kanto in Eight Easy Steps in one sentence?


Well, I have a bad habit of writing run-on sentences more than anything . . . my vision just sort of pours out, and given the scene and the characters, I end up unconsciously weaving together the sudden flow of words into some nice-sounding sentence and tuck it into the narrative as a vaguely poetic moment, very similarly to the one you are reading now.

Then I call myself an idiot and go back to edit. Aaugh!
 
I'll have to steal some of these words and phrases, since I tend to be fairly verbally/grammarly challenged with my writing as well.
 
I use words such as "the," "he," she," "a," and "an" an awful lot. A LOT.
 
Odd drinking game that I'd never actually do because reasons, but reading through srbs and taking a shot at:
="dying sunlight"
="[dialogue]. Pause. [dialogue]"
="I gritted my teeth"
="[some variation of this sucks/I'm so dead/well this is bad news bears]"
="I sighed."

will actually get you killed.
...I'm working on it, I swear.
 
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