Mafia Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Mafia - Endgame (Looking Stupid Joker!)

[HumanDawn]

@HumanDawn for the sake of not quoting that huge wall and looking messy - what currently is happening with #638? Is that just a dump for you to go through/add to later?

yes because i just got hit with a bout of exhaustion

i think the last scum is in TheCapsFan/Kaiveran/Reiji and oh boy there is definitely theater, just gotta try weeding it out

 

[TheCapsFan]

Okay, now that Soulmaster flipped Town what do you make of the other two?

This is kind of moot now that there is an uncc'd cop claim with a redcheck on Neo, but in the context without that info, my thought process was headed towards that their reluctance to discuss Soulmaster is less alignment indicative since Soulmaster is town; however I would have still put them in the scum category because of their late vote on Soulmaster when it didn't really matter. Kai is still in the PoE imo, they were in the same category as Neo for me in terms of keeping under the radar but posting well enough to avoid suspicion, and had a similar weird vote late into the day yesterday, and they gave an odd townread to Neo in their most recent readslist during the night, which doesn't look good in hindsight either.

What would I have to gain by fakeclaiming here, especially with faking a soft D1?

It's not that I think you're lying about being an independent, but moreso concerned over you hiding your win condition. Not something to care about right now, as you're likely a survivor, rather we need to figure out who Neopest's partner might be, assuming they flip scum.

Nothing new to add at this point, really, the PoE is myself/Reiji/HD/Kai. DW will be able to confirm one of us tomorrow and then we should be able to win regardless.

Off the top of my head, I'd sooner lynch HD or Kai over Reiji. Kai hardly interacted with neopest yesterday and gave them a townread in their latest readslist, despite this. HD had a similar progression to me wrt the Soulmaster lynch, yet he is not getting any shade for that (I will go into this later). There are also posts from him talking about how every time he's thought of them as scum, they post something that makes him reconsider Neo's alignment, which is a subtle defense.

I also want to answer Kaiveran's ISO on me, just a reminder for myself

 

[Kaiveran]

 

[Kaiveran]

Hi can I have that read on me I've been promised and now don't have :'(. Also, what do you mean by not CCing unless necessary?

Ehh you're okay I guess (lean town)

Read up on your ISO and there's not much of a change from what I liked about the bulk of your D1, plus you're working within the room you got

(Also yes I am missing a lot of the important stuff because life has sucked. I will pick it up on the occasion I am more able)

I believe DawningWinds is Town, so I’m okay going with this. Any cc’s still welcome. Hyper majority isn’t in effect btw.

leetic! being Independent I can believe. Another player I’m happy to safely cut off the list of being non-scum (unless this is a mega plan to indirectly tell the Independent that they are Mafia and let them take the credit, but if so then it was definitely pre-planned)

[VOTE]: Neopest

I'll address the questions directed at me later, but I was planning on going this route after yesterday anyway, so this is good.

I am always wary of 3Ps - leetic claiming independent right after the cop outed with a redcheck does not look good IMO.

(These concerns were also in Reiji's post but I snipped them)

I mean I totally understand the concerns given in these posts, but do we really think this is a claim he can coast to victory on as either wolf or 3P?
We hit neo-scum today, that puts us at 1:1:3 the next day, barring any shenanigans. Knowing that we'll still lose if we ML, leetic is now on the spot as as a fallback vote for guaranteed town survival should we not have any good leads on neo's partner. If he's lying, he flips wolf, and we either joint win with the real 3P OR confirm they're hostile and hunt for them next. If he's telling the truth, well, he loses in a kinda sucky way, but we live to scumhunt another day.

 

[Elementar]

Votals

Spoiler: Mentions

@DawningWinds
@Kaiveran
@TheCapsFan
@leetic!
@Reiji
@neopest
@HumanDawn
@ReturnofMCH
@Snowy

neopest - 6 (DawningWinds, leetic!, HumanDawn, Kaiveran, Reiji, TheCapsFan)
DawningWinds - 1 (neopest)

There are 22.5 hours left in the phase.

Furthermore, since everyone has voted, I'm asking whether you'd like the phase to be hammered or not. If/once at least 4 people respond with the request to hammer, I will hammer the phase. If you would like to hammer, please mention me in your post.

 

[Kaiveran]

In point of fact, the most prominent doubt in my mind is in regards to DawningWinds.

Sure, wolf!DW claiming a fake redcheck is hella risky and it'll be immediately exposed as a lie when neo flips, but it doesn't matter if you're exposed if you're driving down the game winning vote

However, considering that neopest seems to be capital-F FuhROZEN right now, I might be getting ahead of myself.

p-edit: I think I'll leave the hammer decision up to y'all.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

I'm mostly fine with hammering, but there may be a couple things I want to do before the phase is over.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

In point of fact, the most prominent doubt in my mind is in regards to DawningWinds.

Sure, wolf!DW claiming a fake redcheck is hella risky and it'll be immediately exposed as a lie when neo flips, but it doesn't matter if you're exposed if you're driving down the game winning vote

However, considering that neopest seems to be capital-F FuhROZEN right now, I might be getting ahead of myself.

p-edit: I think I'll leave the hammer decision up to y'all.

Of course, the one problem with that is that they would've had to risk a CC, and considering that a Tracker flipped, town seems to be pretty powerful so fakeclaiming Cop would be risky

I'm a little disappointed in NP, she was a lot more defiant when she was mechanically outed last time

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Let's take a look through NP's ISO to see if there's anything illuminating

Level 1 read is that leetic being this eager for the game to get started is rand v

Level 0 read is that FinalArcadia forcing reads on page 3 of a game is rand w

Level -1 read is that I'm a wolf for calling FinalArcadia a wolf when we made the exact same read on leetic (I'll see myself out now)

Vote: FinalArcadia

Her entrance is a vote on flipped town for a weak reason, and she kinda tunneled from there.

I have no meta on anyone here except for leetic and HumanDawn so I'll be playing without that in mind unless someone can point to specific tells. Makes the game a bit harder but I like a challenge : p

Also I do have to say that DawningWinds opening was pretty hedgey in almost all aspects. I would've liked them to have put some pressure on just about anyone and the fact that they haven't really said anything in that post besides leetic town is a small strike against them considering they mentioned 4 other players and specifically talked about 2 of them.

DW is “hefty". This doesn't really feel different from her treatment of FA

I don't hate the motivation behind these posts even though I don't really agree with the practice. I think it's much more beneficial to pressure people who are actually here and playing the game, but I do understand the line of thought here.

Talking about Kai, and it's a lot more softcore than her points on FA or DW - it looks like it could be a planned w/w interaction.

Also would be hilarious if Caps/HD are the team.

The only reason I have to suspect this is that HD's suspicion on Caps doesn't really make sense to me in an almost TMI way from how he's been discussing it, so yeah don't mind me... just gonna be tinfoiling over here in my corner.

Kinda a weak read that doesn't really commit to anything, I could see either as a partner. If one is scum, she may be trying to associate the other if they flip.

With that being said, my most likely "targets" that fit that description would probably be SM, Kaiveran, and FinalArcadia. I'm actually feeling a bit better about DawningWind now that I've seen their reads posts mostly because the progression looks good in a way that basically boils down to: "scum often feel pressured to make reads in order to blend in but DawningWind refused to do that for multiple pages and then actually outed their own reads list on their own time and the reads list sounded decent/natural."

Two of these flipped town, so if she snuck a partner in that salad it would be Kai. The one thing that would confuse me about a NP/Kai team would be why they both felt the need to join an inevitable misvote wagon at the last minute, though.

To be continued

 

[DawningWinds]

Off the top of my head, I'd sooner lynch HD or Kai over Reiji. Kai hardly interacted with neopest yesterday and gave them a townread in their latest readslist, despite this. HD had a similar progression to me wrt the Soulmaster lynch, yet he is not getting any shade for that (I will go into this later). There are also posts from him talking about how every time he's thought of them as scum, they post something that makes him reconsider Neo's alignment, which is a subtle defense.

I agree that these are good points that link both of them to neo and why haven't people been shading HD for doing the basically the same thing as you in regards to Soulmaster? The only post where there's any sense that he thought Soulmaster might not be town prior to his vote that I see is when he commented on leetic's analysis of SM's reads.
But I have to point out: Reiji broke the vote tie between SM and neo (and Kai but less relevant). And you tried to break the tie, posting within about a minute of him if I recall.
Since my interactions with him yesterday, I agree Reiji is overall pretty towny, but I feel like it'd be a mistake to ignore that he did that. Like I pointed out of your attempted tie breaker last Night, Reiji's vote could well have been placed to protect neo. While yeah having defended neo isn't great right now I'd say making a vote that swayed the lynch away from her is less great. Again same with your vote given that you clearly did not see Reiji's post before making it and between the two of you (probably of all of the PoE people actually) I would lean towards you.

I don't particularly expect much more to happen this phase besides maybe debating neo's most likely scumbuddy which we should be perfectly able to do at night after she flips so I'll say hammering is probably okay. @Elementar @ReturnofMCH @Snowy

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Also my reads should be obvious from reading the thread. I'm feeling good about leetic and Reiji town (Reiji maybe a bit less so, but still strongly), DawningWind light town now after reviewing their posts and liking their reads list and I think I'm coming around to a HD town world because he does seem different from the games I've seen him wolf in. For a POE it's Kai/FA/SM/Caps and from those four I think Kai and FA are the scummiest.

This is her first real mention of RJ. Another salad, but with Caps thrown in. Her supposed scumreading of Kai but lack of any attempt to push em looks bad for em.

I believe there is a high chance the SM push is wolf-motivated and would not like to go there. I'll take a look again since this seems important to you, but I like my vote where it is right now.

Interesting observation. She's shading the leaders of the wagon, so maybe we should look at the followers.

@TheCapsFan

The reason I'd think you have the most wolf motivation to go after SM is that compared to most other people on the SM wagon I feel as though you are the person who has put forth the least amount of effort and visibility in pushing them. I think wolves being aggressively pushing someone is not out of the question, but if SM is town then I would say that wolves probably are trying to be a bit more considerate in pushing there and maintaining a more positive image which I think lines up more closely with how you've treated your suspicion on SM veruses someone like leetic for example.

Was possibly the only viable push between (me DW HD Caps) at that point. She would've known SM would flip town so this is a decent sign for Caps.

Also while I'm here @Reiji

I find your interpretation of me and FA going at each other a bit odd. The way you've phrased the read is that we could be wolf OR independent versus town. Do you not agree that a wolf would play differently from an independent? Personally I believe an independent would fall more towards playing in a town mindset than a wolf. Just wondering what lead you to that conclusion.

Kinda lame post, NP and RJ could be w/w

My mind has changed on HD because although I had some concerns with his opening I went back and read some of the wolf games he's played in previously and decided he has been pretty different this game. One thing I noticed that was different is that as scum HD tends to take a more relaxed approach to making posts whereas this game I feel as though he's made a big effort to up his energy and it comes off as performative but like... almost townie performative.

A post justifying being off of HD, it's kinda meh.

So far I'm feeling, in order of likelyhood, it's Kai, (RJ HD), Caps, DW, me

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Now time to did through Kai's ISO for interactions with NP

I don’t have meta on anyone here other than the aforementioned two players, nor do I know site culture, and I won’t have time to get into either of those because I’m working this weekend. So stuff like leetic vs. neopest is gonna go completely over my fluffy little head – sorry~!

Ignores NP at this point in the game

Thanks for the tip!

As for your next post...I'm assuming GTH implies I have to take a side? I've already given thoughts on DW, Soul and FA (all town), neopest I'd lean town at this point as well, although that's pretty low certainty...HD's eagerness can be either side, really, but I'd say wolf given they've been oddly absent since the game actually started.

Townreads NP, with reservations - similar to SM's "read" on her

neopest: I'm gonna trust you on the "pressure active players" tell. I guess I would slightly townlean neo at this point but I'll say again, I don't think limiting the scope of our engagement at this point really helps.

Whenever ey talked about NP in the first half of the phase, it was really hedgy.

Running Readsbook
leetic/neo/Reiji town
Caps/Soul/FA null
DW/HD scum

Town now, but not much justification beyond "towny moments"

@neopest re:235, I don't like getting into the dirt and directly scrapping with people, usually. Sure, it can be fun and/or illuminating in the right contexts, but it's usually not very useful to me specifically, and on D1 I'd prefer cooler heads to prevail lest too much wolf-hiding dust get kicked up

I believe this was eir response to NP saying ey was under the radar. I don't believe NP responded. It's an interaction that can be faked

I will stick to my guns on neo/leet being Tvt, even gover the most recent stuff it looks like they're townies that pinged each other but can't really find any smoking guns on each other no matter how hard they try

Doesn't go into more elaboration

@neopest has your mind changed on HD and why?

Another question, NP responded only after being prodded again.

Eh there's not really a smoking gun here.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

I mean, there are two main arguments for Kai being bad

1. Ey was included in a couple of salads with flipped town
2. Despite supposedly being her biggest scumread beyond FA, NP never made any attempt to case em or put a significant push on them

One main argument against
1. The EoD would look really weird if Kai/NP were w/w, both would've had to join the same wagon at the same time with the same level of progression

And one thing that could go either way but should be kept in mind
1. Kai's treatment of NP wasn't really that different from flipped town SM

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Wow convenient, I have a role that's exactly the same oh my god!

I find it interesting that RJ soft cc'd me when I was insinuating I was a Granny or a Bomb. I'd like a follow through on that.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

1. Kai's treatment of NP wasn't really that different from flipped town SM

This could be because both were inactive rather than because both are town. Still, a case based only on Kai's treatment of NP would be unconvincing.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Alright, gonna dig through RJ's ISO next. A lot of their posts are wallposts that are hard for me to handle due to ADHD, but I'll see what I can do.

Yay, someone challenging a player trying to take control of the game! The first few posts I have kinda shelved for now, as they were mostly discussing meta or didn't really have anything that jumped out at me. Things got good for me when they were challenging leetic's reasoning for jumping on and voting them, the points made are completely valid they don't necessarily read in a way that screams OMGUS to me and well with no OMGUS vote etc, looks like a genuine Town defence. Thankfully it seemed to keep leetic in check too, I've no reason right now to question neo's part in this discussion right now.

The vote on DawningWinds feels OK to me - I can see why they would at that point in the game.

Naturally their following posts I'm going to thank for talking against the votes for me (yay!), however again the point about trying to pressure players that are in the game and get something to help right now (same with the follow-up post to leetic) feels Town to me. They could've easily slipped in suspicion akin to a vote on me and got away with it at this point in the game, however have tried to steer conversation in a generally beneificial way.

Townread currently.

She was a bit more prominent at the beginning of D1, though I feel this post misstates her prominence a bit. Also, his townread is based on her standing up to me? Most of this is fine but not clearing.

Would you be OK to expand a little on Kai and FA at all? Intrigued, especially as FA as I've not seen anything right now that makes me even really want to consider them, and want to see what wavelength we're operating on.

First interaction with NP, doesn't really tell me anything

Initial thoughts are I'm not really buying SM's responses, neither Kai's; HD I think has solidified themselves as Town a bit more and FA with this turn on NP has thrown me for six.

FA is being townread for going after NP, but this isn't really elaborated and NP's role in this is unclear.

With regards to Kai, I 100% agree. With FA, I 100% do not at the time of this post. If anything sticking your oar out and reading the game as FA has is definitely getting into the drama, just because they're not challenging/confronting others involved doesn't mean they're not part of it. Otherwise, it puts you I think in a similar at this point to them. Kai however I feel, as much as ey are a bit behind in the game, is definitely lacking that conviction in eir content.

More response to NP, tries to get a Kai wagon going. I feel FA's point about NP being as drama-evasive as those she mentioned should be kept in mind too.

A stance I generally agree on with scum (as I already mentioned to leetic), scum rn don't really want to be intercepting TOO hard lest it's just caught up during the next day phase. An interesting take on the HD/Caps situation and I think has kinda nailed what concerns I had about it - Caps especially IDK dealt with that in a way I didn't overly expect, but well it's worked as the votes currently don't lie with him.

I don't like how all of their thoughts on NP were hidden under a spoiler in one of their posts. This is a bit CWAC

Note Neo's change in attitude on their return as of this post ^. My thoughts however:

More challenge, yay! This is a concise yet strong post and I feel that this isn't a challenge against someone leading conversation like leetic done out of fear or anything, just that Neo is wanting to set things straight and I like that. The explanation makes sense (and tbh I agree that leetic I think is throwing around the word "hedgy" a lot in very different situations, almost like a buzzword) and I feel this would be an odd person and challenge for scum to make at this point in the game? This definitely bumps Neo up the town list for me.

More towniness because of "challenge". Since it's clear that I am not scum at this point, I don't see how challenging me is necessarily clearing. This looks almost like too easy a reason to townread someone.

As someone in the same situation as you, totally get it. Like I said earlier, I feel that you were both at a similar point during that phase of the game you were both interacting with the "drama" at a similar level, so I do find FA's response regarding this a little weird (more on that later), but I again have to disagree that FA has been lacking in content or pushes for that matter. BUUUUUT I do have to agree that some of the posts they deem as not game related simply aren't.

There is definitely an OMGUS tint to your reasonings behind the FA vote so I think perhaps things have been blown out of proportion a bit, but I can understand and appreciate why you have done so.

Last part of the spoiler. It's pretty eh, is more about FA and although it hints at similarities in their behavior it doesn't really explore this very deeply.

Neo - They swing so wildly for me. We go from a very good and solid viewpoint of analysing the game, challenging people where scum definitely would not, to this bizarre level of aggression when finally under some pressure. The relationship between Neo and FA right now is key, but out of the two I have to say Neo looks weaker as Town. Rebuttals compared to FA really do pale.

Now that we are out of the spoiler, the posts become more hedgy. This doesn't really say anything committal, mostly tries to use FA's alignment to solve NP.

If I keep progressing like I have previously where I caution every one of my reads, it's not going to get me anywhere. Right now this is something I am feeling a little more certain on, that the interaction is between a Town member and a non-Town member and therefore I need to be sticking to that/pushing if needed. If nothing else, answering it either way will help me with other reads etc. I have in the game and I think will help with others' too.

Right now therefore, I think considering a T/T in this scenario is detrimental for me. If someone else thinks it isn't and wants to highlight to me why, please be my guest.

With this response, seems to strongly insinuate that there's one scum in FA/NP. That would be pretty weird if they're partners, especially since FA was the first kill (although scum may have been planning to kill me before I threatened them).

Moving on to HD

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

i like you

you showed leetic!!!!!!!!!!!

First interaction with NP.

leetic
neopest
Kaiveran

Apparently this is enough to put NP in the towncore.

"made before actually thinking about why Caps might be Mafia"

I assure you, there was thought in "Caps might be Mafia intentionally avoiding the thread despite being online". Mafia have a harder time to enter threads and contribute and it takes skill to start interacting with the thread naturally as you go on.

These three posts are the only NP interactions in the first half of HD's ISO. Mainly a response to her supposed HD/Caps suspicion. It's meh.

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

Second half of HD's ISO

i like both of these posts, and not just because my ego is being stroked by being called town

When I read the first post I was like "wait where are your suspects of less involved people!!! name names my friend!!" but then i saw the next post and felt a sense of relief. The only thing I could fault it is not having a vote placed on any of them, but I could chalk that on not having decided yet and still thinking it through and still trying to naturally think of who to end up on than any malicious shading to set up any mislynch target.

This almost feels like TMI, naming NP's reasons while NP's stated reasons ran counter to that.

Do you think NP deserves more scrutiny for it? I can see how it can ping you because I have had difficulties leaving the gamethread with a vote as Mafia in my Championship games, but I chalk it up to needing more time to think and not having the time to engage with the thread (but I will concede that it is not what Neopest claimed when saying it was because the suspects weren't around).

The neopest case here... not feeling it, I believe I have already explained my opinion on the slot's voting earlier.

Judging by these two posts, his explanation for NP's voting is doing a lot of heavy lifting for defending NP

Hmm... I'm not getting malicious vibes from this, I can understand why you'd be thrown off. My biggest issue with FinalArcadia's vote is that she ended up unvoting Soulmaster for meh reasoning and voted you for meh reasoning. If Soulmaster flips Town I would actually get a bit paranoid on FA solely because her weak reasoning would make sense from a scum perspective to get off a Town wagon and also simultaneously set up the potential next mislynch target!

Talking to her about FA, post seems like it's cooperating with her read. Though NP/FA would be another team that would've probably originally targeted me rather than FA before I threatened them

FinalArcadia & Neopest - Surprisingly lower Town feeling than a lot of other players?? I don't feel anything that screams out "scum" to me, but then again despite Towny posts I didn't end up feeling as good compared to other players. I have the nagging paranoid feeling that at least one of them is Mafia even if I don't think there's too strong of a reason to suspect them. I would actually say that this is an amusing read because leetic! got to this through Soulmaster's reads on both of them from potentially faking them, and I got it by going through my Town -> Mafia reads, so maybe there is actually a lot more merit on that? I'm conflicted on both to the point I can't pick who would be scum from them considering their position, but that could also be that somebody from my stronger Town reads is actually Mafia :M. I don't think they're w/w at least.

Despite everything, NP only ends up one above SM. He doesn't have her above FA despite what his previous post would suggest. FA and NP not w/w is an easy read.

Overall, Occam's Razor is pointing to HD right now, but I'll check Caps to be safe

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

One question: Besides me (who was too big a risk to kill because I insinuated I was a bomb) and FA, were there any other good targets for scum to shoot? DW may be one, though they were under a fair bit of scrutiny during the night. FA does seem like she'd be pretty low on the priority list of a couple of NP's potential partners, but if NP had full control of the kill, or if scum's attempts to throw suspicions on FA after SM's death didn't pan out, the FA target could still make sense

 

[Isaac the Investigator]

GTH they are all town.

NP GTH town

Hm, I disagree about FA on the engagement standpoint: though she hasn't had a feud with anyone (aside from the small HD matter), I would say that she's engaged with far more people in the thread than Kai. Furthermore she's put together a list of reads that goes over most of her thoughts on a lot of the "drama," so there's that as well.

First interaction with NP, is more about FA

Still haven't read Reiji's read on Kai, completely missed NP's read on Kai.

Would be interesting to not pay attention to your partner. The one thing is that this is about all the interaction with NP in the first half of the ISO, and considering NP's scumread on Caps you'd expect there'd be a little more

Neo - Has brought up valid concerns among scum sneaking by among lowposters/

Part of a trustfall. Interestingly, Caps didn't say that this was one of the harder ones to make despite this not being a very strong reason, especially considering that at least one of the lowposters was town

This is the most compelling part of your ISO. I want to add by saying I think it's particularly odd that Neo seemed to be scumreading HD through a possible partnership with me? If that's the case, I don't understand why HD would receive the primary attention and vote and not myself, since the HD read seems to be built on the assumption we are partners. Logically speaking, I would expect Neo to have scumread me first, yet, Neo never explicitly gave me a scumread; he called my approach on DawningWinds odd, but there was no explicit read.

I have not really considered Neo too much so far, and had written them off for today, but on a second look I do find this weird.

Pretty interesting, Caps is showcasing FA's case on NP

At a crossroads between Neo, Kai, and Soulmaster as to who to vote for to end the day. Gonna wait a bit longer before voting.

NP is a potential vote

NP vs FA: I was putting them in the same ~vibe~ as Kaiveran, where they were staying relatively under the radar, but providing genuine posts and reactions when they are around. I liked what Neo had to say about at least one scum staying away from the drama, but I thought FA had a good response when she called out Neo for doing the same, yet not putting themselves in that category. I forget Neo's response to that. I thought FA's ISO on NP was convincing and even added a bit to it myself.

NP's treatment of SM: I am just reading that now on page 20, and I think it's a little lacking. Looks like she kind of just shrugged it off when you asked her about his unprompted townread. I agreed with the post where you said there's more to say about SM than just including him in the PoE when necessary.

Isn't really taking NP's side here

It's not that they're doing less compared to everyone else; they've provided a full and "detailed" readslist on every player in the game, and I think the only other people to have done that are Reiji, FinalArcadia, and HumanDawn. Oh, and DawningWinds too. It's more that the stuff they are doing feels less genuine, less impactful, less thought-out than the same stuff done by other players. Furthermore, their thought progression with their vote and case on Kaiveran is just off.

@Kaiveran I agree with leetic, I would like to see more in depth regarding your vote on HD and why you find him scummy, and especially DW.


Who do you think shows the strongest wolf motivation for pushing SM: DawningWinds, HumanDawn, leetic, or myself?

Also, I see you addressed my question regarding why you think FA is scummier than SM in detail, apologies for asking you the same thing twice.

I would argue that the structure of the post was NAI, it seems like a post someone would make regardless of alignment - if that part is NAI, wouldn't it be logical to assess the rest of the read of the post based on the content, which you admit was lacking? There's some disconnect here with your read on Soulmaster that I can't quite pinpoint.

A few interactions with NP, these are pretty meh

Neo is the more interesting case than Kai in my opinion, and reads more scum to me than Kai. I think FA has brought up some good points against them, and I think their reluctance to discuss Soulmaster in more detail is odd. However, again, I think that we get more information on their alignment depending on Soulmaster's, so I'd rather convict the latter first.

Is going after Neo, but the one weird thing is the "information" from SM's flip. Caps probably thought they were likely partners, but what if SM flipped town?