Mafia The War Room Awards '18 Mafia: Endgame

[Ereshkigal]

So you think jd is the serial killer that Elie was talking about earlier?
In that case, it was likely jd who killed Elie.

I don't think so. For one thing, I don't think there is a serial killer.

To be honest, Elieson was entirely too certain he was going to die N1. And afterwards, was entirely too happy about it. He was a bad choice for a serial killer for many of the same reasons he was a bad choice for the mafia.

I think Elieson was a vig kill. It was the only way he could prove himself utterly trustworthy to everyone in town, and the only way he would work as town leader is if everyone explicitly trusted him. Too many people people were skeptical of him as leader prior to his death, after all.

Cheff was a better choice both for scum and for an sk for the reasons you outlined for mafia. Unless both mafia and sk chose the same target, we only have two kill options to work with.

Again, I think you're overthinking this. On night one, Mafia has two options.
Option A: go for the power players and hope to Arceus that that aren't being protected by the Doctor. I've already explained why Mafia didn't off Elie. As for me, I'm guessing they assumed that, with Elie deliberately asking to not be protected, I would be the next logical choice for protection. Most mafia teams stay away from this option because of the possibility of getting kill blocked which, this early in the game, could be problematic.
Option 2: go for a low protection priority target and hope to generate confusion with the kill or hit a power role. All in all, this isn't a terrible strategy, because sometimes the players who are the most silent are power roles trying to hide, and it pretty much guarantees a "safe" kill. Cheff had done little to nothing in the game before getting killed, ergo nobody would even think about protecting him, unless he happened to be the Doctor, and, even then, it was possible that he'd think he avoided detection enough to protect someone "more valuable."

So, no, the mafia had no clue about the universal backup. All they knew was that Cheff was a very low priority for Doc protection, and therefore was a "safe" kill. That is why they chose to target him.

There are several people in this game this describes, including Jinjo. Cheff is active enough to at least be considered a possibility for saving for later, just in case. Personally, I would have gone for Jinjo or Pika.

Dismissing him for meta is an equally bad thing to do.

Max is, unfortunately, one of those players who you have to rely on meta for. His playstyle has very little variation from game to game, so what variation does exist is much more telling. He's also consistent in what that variation inevitably represents; if something is a scum habit in one game, it'll be a scum habit in all games.

From what I can see? Max has almost no variation at all from his standard playing method. For Max, that indicates solid town with a role that isn't powerful.

Why?

No, seriously. I know I'm town, but why are you certain I am?

The way you interacted throughout the game when I could read it, plus how you are scumhunting now. Not that you are, but how you're going about it.

That's really as in-depth as I can explain it. I've tried to get others to follow my logic on this before; it always confuses them how seemingly-unimportant things can indicate big aspects of someone. Like, sometimes, simply how someone words a statement can communicate far more than the statement itself was intended to.

It's far from infallible, of course. But face-to-face, it can be pretty difficult for someone to hide something from me, since I'll pick up on things from wording, tone, and body language they don't want to communicate.

I've been wondering that all day.

I think everyone will be until this is all over with.

 

[Jinjo]

I don't think so. For one thing, I don't think there is a serial killer.

To be honest, Elieson was entirely too certain he was going to die N1. And afterwards, was entirely too happy about it. He was a bad choice for a serial killer for many of the same reasons he was a bad choice for the mafia.

I think Elieson was a vig kill.

Elieson said he got a Psychiatrist claim and since you think there is no SK and think Elieson got killed by the Vig, then that would mean the Psychiatrist is a fake claim because this role only shows up when there is an SK or Cult Leader in game. On Day 2 Elieson was asking if there is a Vig and he wanted the Vig to shoot jd or Officer.

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

If there isn't a SK, it is quite possible that the Psychiatrist claim is bogus. Not 100% certain, though, since this is a bastard game. It would depend on if the role is a full Psychiatrist role or if it is part of a JOAT or otherwise "multi" role. For example, AE had a Poison Doctor shot in Ocarina of Time Mafia (one of the games that won an award, BTW) that was a dud, since there was no Poisoner in the game, but his Alarmist shot, and my full Alarmist role were not duds, as there was an actual Cult in the game.
The question becomes, if there is a SK, are they willing to work with Town?
Assuming that the SK off'd Elie on N1, I would say that they are.

Of course, that is a lot of assumptions, but, then again, I'm not in Elie's inner circle.

 

[Snowy]

Psychiatrist

Can someone clarify what this role does, please?

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

Psychiatrist turns a Serial Killer into a normal Vanilla Town member.

 

[Snowy]

In that case, I agree with you. Hosts sometimes like to throw curve balls, and this game IS bastard. I wouldn't put it past Darthwolf to just do something with the intention of trolling us like that.

That said, however, there was a second kill on N1... It could be a vig, or could be a SK, we don't know.

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

It is worth the speculation, to be sure, but whoever or whichever it was, they were allied, or at least willing to work with, Elieson. If it is a SK, and Elie knows a Psychiatrist, then the Serial Killer will become a Vanilla town member.
If it was a Vigilante, then they’re already a townie and don’t need to be worried about.

 

[Almonds]

What about the theory Eresh had, that jd is a lurking Indep?

Eh... idk. Gut feeling, but I'm not getting Indep vibes from jdthebud.

I think Elieson was a vig kill.

If it was a Vigilante, then they’re already a townie and don’t need to be worried about

Then we have a problem. Why would a Vig shoot Night 1, risk wasting their limited shot(s) when there hasn't been a confirmed or at least majority agreement about someone being mafia?

 

[DarthWolf]

I don't know what happened to all the burgers, but I promise you I will find my burgers AND I WILL EAT THEM ALL!! Drby euli

 

[jdthebud]

Glad to see a lot more readable discussion, lol.

Eh... idk. Gut feeling, but I'm not getting Indep vibes from jdthebud.

Then we have a problem. Why would a Vig shoot Night 1, risk wasting their limited shot(s) when there hasn't been a confirmed or at least majority agreement about someone being mafia?

I think it would have been a pretty big risk for a vig to claim to Elieson on day 1 - if Eliseon had been mafia then they are pretty much dead.

I'm actually kind of surprised that Elieson didn't get get himself lynched on Day 1 to ensure his death without forcing something like a vig shot.

The SK wouldn't risk teaming with town I don't think, since if the Psychiatrist dies, then the SK is going to get lynched.

@Elieson

Spoiler

usba tynfjmsgmls petgml ml pqtfps tmlgdft fmnbcujjy gt fbjns mut

 

[MegaPod]

Reading this makes me want to vote for you because you know so much about the psychology of the mafia side.

I realize that ME already answered this, but trying to understand how the scum is thinking isn’t scummy. And an experienced player should definitely know something about scum mentality if they’ve played as Mafia in the past, regardless of their current alignment. I didn’t agree about you with jd before, but I have to note that this is a weak argument.

 

[Ereshkigal]

Elieson said he got a Psychiatrist claim and since you think there is no SK and think Elieson got killed by the Vig, then that would mean the Psychiatrist is a fake claim because this role only shows up when there is an SK or Cult Leader in game. On Day 2 Elieson was asking if there is a Vig and he wanted the Vig to shoot jd or Officer.

It could be part of a JOAT. There are two who didn't entirely know what their abilities do. Maybe someone else has the option of becoming an SK or cult leader later on? That would fit the strangeness of this game.

Then we have a problem. Why would a Vig shoot Night 1, risk wasting their limited shot(s) when there hasn't been a confirmed or at least majority agreement about someone being mafia?

That would depend a lot on any OC discussion going on at the time. Remember, Elieson OCed with a lot of us.

I think it would have been a pretty big risk for a vig to claim to Elieson on day 1 - if Eliseon had been mafia then they are pretty much dead.

I'm actually kind of surprised that Elieson didn't get get himself lynched on Day 1 to ensure his death without forcing something like a vig shot.

I don't think it would have worked. Elieson didn't quite have enough leadership capacity, and Midorikawa made it pretty clear she was a jester. Elieson was facing a lot of suspicion, Midorikawa was also a target for some suspicion, and the fact he didn't even try to get himself lynched makes me think Elieson simply didn't have the cooperation from Town that he needed for such.

As such, it was easier to simply lead a lynch on Midorikawa to both gain an early indep victory, and then have the vig use a killshot on Elieson to prove to town that he was trustworthy and make certain the mafia wouldn't be able to do anything about him.

And from the weirdness of the doubling-up that Elieson mentioned, I am seriously wondering what abilities the mafia has and how many of them there are.

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

...guys, anybody wanna try figuring out who “the lost one” is and why they are obsessed with burgers?

 

[Ereshkigal]

...guys, anybody wanna try figuring out who “the lost one” is and why they are obsessed with burgers?

Wait, that was actually part of the thread? I thought that was...

Damn it.

Okay, I might be incognito until tomorrow. I need to send a mission cancelled message.

 

[DarthWolf]

Day 3 - Yes Captain!

Spoiler: Players

1. @MegaPod
2. @jdthebud
3. @Max1996
4. @Pika_pika42
5. @Jinjo
6. @Arthas Menethil (aka AussieEevee)
7. @Klavier Gavin (aka Kyriaki)
8. @Magnificent Entertainer
9. @Officer Snake
   
10. @Pikochu
11. @Ereshkigal
12. @Elieson

@SoaringDylan @CheffOfGames

"The other moderators can't do anything good on their own. Are you ready to stop this once and for all?" said a single voice.
"Yes captain!" the many voices echoed in the large room.
"Are you ready, knowing that you might die?"
"Yes captain!"
"Are you willing to accept every single order I give you, knowing that my commands are everything and will lead us to victory?"
"Yes captain!"
"Are you ready to give it everything you got and never surrender even when I, the great C. 'Elieson' O., will fall in battle?!"
"Yes captain!"

Elieson was readying a group of wannabe ME's that he was able to gather around the region, using them as tools for his great plan. All he needed to do was give them an order and they would carry it out without hesitation.
"These fools truly believe that they can meet the true Maniacal Engineer through me?.... No pun intended." Elieson thought.
"I will have to do all the hard work here, like usual. To be fair though, I am one of the best players around so a real life version of mafia shouldn't any different."

He looked up as he noticed his army of ME still standing there, looking at him as if they've seen a god.
"What are you guys doing? Get to work already!"
Before he could say anything else there was a sword piercing through his body from the back.
"I appreciate the effort my friend," said a mysterious voice, "but I'll be taking this lovely crowd from you."

Elieson fell on his knees.
The last thing he could hear was the crowd cheering.
"So this is how it end... In thunderous applause."

Max1996 died!

Spoiler: Max1996

Dear Max1996,

You are Elieson. Winner of the Most Entertaining Player, Most Strategic Player, Best Save, Most Entertaining Player (Non-Mafia), Most Sportsmanlike Conduct (Non-Mafia), Most Organized Host, Fair Hosting Award and Best Mafia Player awards.
A lot of awards, which funny enough can (for most of them) can be summarised under one word: OC. First off, your hosting awards were granted to you for you EEiM Mafia games. They require a lot of work and are super OC focussed which causes you to get overflown by private messages. You’re certainly used to seeing this and most certainly used to using it yourself. This brings us to your player awards. Whenever OC is allowed in a game, you bet that you are going to abuse it as much as possible in both smart and fun ways which granted you the award of Best Mafia Player.

Therefore, you are the OC Captain.
During the night, you can quote a message you posted in an OC chat into your role PM that was posted in that same night or in the previous day phase. It has to be a post in which you either ask, suggest, command etc. another player to target someone with their power. If you do so and the player does not target your suggested target then their action will be blocked. To use this power, post Captain’s Orders above your quoted post in your role PM.
You can only use this once per night. Factional powers and powers that cannot target are unaffected.

You are aligned with team Ocarina of Time and win when all opposing forces have been eliminated.

Spoiler: In short

Max1996 died, they were the OC Captain

It is now Day 3, this phase will end in roughly 48 hours.

 

[Snowy]

@Ereshkigal, who did you target night 1 and why?

 

[Pika_pika42]

Ok so it looks like the Vig killed Elieson unless the SK and Mafia both killed Max which looks like a rare possibility.

As of today I am OK for a Jd Lynch unless we get a better target to go for.

 

[Snowy]

Vote: Ereshkigal

At least until you answer my question.

 

[Almonds]

@Elieson

Spoiler

ky lfdes swm tmn tebti qbrujsr rhy hqsehr kblbsefj fr khcfh

 

[Ereshkigal]

@Ereshkigal, who did you target night 1 and why?

No one. I had only one charge of it.

Also, a special message for the guy who shot me last night:

Spoiler

@Elieson

fekfm eq smvk lki e hmqs jx qdms ma ythhcsnpmma hlqs kebds