Mafia ZD X BMG 2019 Link’s Awakening Hydra Mafia Crossover Game Thread

[Chillian]

Heading to bed, but loving what Leetic is doing, and gummy is doing as expected and actually contributing now. Good to have you back friend
I'm not gonna be so quick to read T&H. They didn't strike me as particularly scummy yesterday, so we'll see what happens.
I'll put them on my next read list, but my first priority atm is getting my other head off her ass and into this thread. When that's done I'll look into suspicions.

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

sorry if you already answered this but i couldn't see it. why was your vote left on sunspear? if i r correctly you were around by EOD, why did you leave your vote on a wagon that surely wasn't going anywhere?

I was not around at EOD but my other head was. He apparently felt it best to keep the vote I placed on Sunspear. I possibly would’ve changed it to ZMS if I were around, but there’s no point arguing that either way and I still don’t care for Sunspear’s behavior regardless.

correct me if i'm wrong but i'm pretty sure the chillian bit was a joke? but you never took the vote off of sunspear. i think it's pretty suspicious that you left your vote here, on a wagon clearly no one was going to join, and didn't really take a stance on the two most popular wagons who have both now flipped.

If the Chillian bit was a joke, then Sunspear did a shit job of conveying such clearly. And see above for the other part of my response to this.

is it because u are scum and they were not in ur scum team???????

Allow me to say that I have legit no clue what my other head was thinking when he posted that bit. Your conclusion is incorrect but I can see how you’d draw it from that post.

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

i meant to address this earlier but i am a large idiot and said something else when i quoted this post of yours earlier. i couldn't find the context for this? what made S&N lean town? did you mean the wagon on them made them look town to you?

The bit you’re replying to is also from my other head, so I actually can’t explain the reasoning but I can provide you the context. He was replying to the below post by MNH, who was responding to his, err, secret reason for Townreading S&N I guess.

If this was the case, why didn't you do more to try to save them in D1 when S&N was in real danger for most of it? Instead of leaving a throwaway vote on a player who was very unlikely to be lynched, you could have joined an opposing wagon.

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

Actually, my partner has refreshed my memory, and part of his Townread on S&N was a reason we’re not allowed to discuss ^^;

 

[Aflame]

Actually, my partner has refreshed my memory, and part of his Townread on S&N was a reason we’re not allowed to discuss ^^;

that's eh... convenient?




Here is my day 2 read list!



gRAdUATed ScUM
ZMS - so proud of you

scummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Tommy and Hal - completely ignored the ZMS lynch; ignored requests to give opinions on either ZMS or S&N but did jump in at the last moment to vote for S&N. Enough has been said about this case. You deserve my vote but I'm not willing to risk an early hammer yet.

thesunspear - I wasn't scumreading thesunspear until this morning. LatB showed in a very interesting post that they had quite resisted the ZMS lynch. Furthermore, their immediate attack on DDI without ANY arguments was off. Especially, as I mentioned in a previous post, because I could imagine DDI (if they are town) to have been the ideal miss lynch on day 2. Attacking them would've been the safest move for maffia this morning. Thirdly, I found thesunspear's reaction to the Aflame/T&H confrontation peculiar. Claiming this morning that "Aflame didn't really have a case and was just kinda spewing nonsense". Sure, you may or may not have seen the argument against T&H in the same degree of severity, but "nonsense", after ZMS actually flipped scum (and not just scum, but as some super-godfather), comes across as denial. thesunspear's subsequent mentioning that Aflame does look a bit better now because he was an early ZMS voter seems a bit stating-the-obvious backtracking after having just thrown some unnecessary shade on Aflame.
In thesunspear's defense though. One thing about them DOES look townish. They referred back to an old potential soft claim. Why would mafia openly mention that? Why not just keep it for yourself and kill them in the night (if you believe that the softclaim was truthful though). Anyhow, it seemed strange for mafia to refer back to that.

Restless_Ridge - There is quite a gap between thesunspear and RR. But I became a bit wary of them after yesterday's lynch. They mentioned to not wanting this lynch to end with a coinflip, yet abstained from choosing a side till the end. Mentioned that he found the ZMS lynch peculiar because there was too little opposition and kept voting for an irrelevant wagon (LW) till the end. I'm weighing their behaviour a bit harsher than others because they both were very active at the time of the lynch and in my eyes took quite a "town leader" role upond them, guiding the discussions. After taking such an active and leading role, their final indecisive leadership at the end was a bit of an anti-climax. Was it just safe play, an honest confusion about what to do, or a low-key attempt to not get ZMS killed?
I disagree with LatB's analysis of RR. I think he portrays him in a too positive light.

Neutral
Hydreigon & Shelgon GX - keeping their votes on thesunspear till EOD day 1 despite this obviously being an irrelevant wagon was a bit edgy. Also strange that they hardly commented on the ZMS case (as LatB pointed out). Yet, they early town-readed DDI, which I don't get if they would be mafia (for DDI would've been the perfect lynch this morning).

Chillian - stayed under the radar pretty well so far, technically a good place to hide for scum. LatB's analysis showed nothing overly scummy nor townish. I would like to see a bit more daring behaviour from them.
@Chillian, can you guys share with us a list of your reads?

Aspiring town
dum dum idiots - I know both of you very well. In the beginning I found your guys' level of contribution odd, you still posted but in a very cautious way. But after that you became more and more inactive. I started to feel more and more like your guys' behaviour was just due to your inactivity, probably since the start of the game. I still kept up my pressure on you guys by not mentioning this gut feeling before because I was of the opinion that it was first your guys' turn to show something positive. You did, today. You guys became more active and currently play exactly as I would expect you guys to play as a town DDI hydra. So you gained a lot more town credit in my eyes since this morning. However, aside from contributing seriously and me reading your meta's in a positive light, there isn't much substantial yet to back it up.

Lone Wolf - We can't rule out that their vote for ZMS wasn't an attempt to bus them, but as I described recently, I doubt that is realistic. There were multiple other strategies they could have used without sacrificing their godfather+roleblocker for some meagre amount of town-credit. There is no reason to doubt LW's allegiance at this point in the game. There are plenty of players with a far weaker alibi.

town
Mafia Nursing Home - has been part of my townlist since the start of the game. Last day's lynch further convinced me in this. They were the 4th to vote for ZMS. I consider this townish because the votes between S&N and ZMS were tied at that time. It could've gone either way. MNH pushed it in the direction of ZMS. Would they also have done that if they were in cahoots with ZMS? I doubt it, the battle certainly wasn't lost yet.

leetic and the band - Also moved up the town-ladder. I very much enjoyed your latest reads. Very comprehensive and I found the analyses very thorough. At this point in the game, providing reads itself is not a towntell (isn't the most perfect killer the detective himself? Selectively analysing the case in a way that suits you), but this was a very helpful analysis, made me very happy. Probably town.

 

[Mafia Nursing Home]

I don't really like your agrument here, you are simultaneously saying it is scummy to change your vote off an irrelevant wagon and saying it is scummy to leave it on. Now you will probably say it is because I changed too late that you think it is scummy, but I think that is a bit unfair. Having a euro timezone sometimes leaves me behind in games, I can't be online in the middle of the night when some Americans are for me.

Essentially you are relegating me to being auto scummy, because if I change when I wake up I changed too late. If I stay on a dead wagon, that's bad too. You need to decide which is scummy and stick with it. @Aflame made a similar post to this also, so this also applies to them. You can choose two opposite behaviours and shade them both if you want to effectively solve. Though, again idt aflame is trying to solve since they are probably scum.

I don't know if my other head responded to this or not yet, but for the sake of transparency in what could have been a very subtle move, you've quoted us as saying something we never said. Aflame said this, not us. Though it might just be a formatting error, it's a huuuuge ping for me.

 

[Mafia Nursing Home]

@Aflame Restless_Ridge included themselves with thesunspear in a town circle early on in the game. Do you think they would do that as scum partners?

 

[Aflame]

I don't know if my other head responded to this or not yet, but for the sake of transparency in what could have been a very subtle move, you've quoted us as saying something we never said. Aflame said this, not us. Though it might just be a formatting error, it's a huuuuge ping for me.

Yes, I also pointed that out before. But it isn't scummy because it was misquoted an sich (that is obviously just a mistake, not done on purpose), but because you are not likely to accuse someone of something they didn't write if you tried to analyse that person with an impartial mindset. If you already decided beforehand that that person is to blame and you're just looking for something to confirm that, you'd be much more likely to make such sloppy misquotes.

@Aflame Restless_Ridge included themselves with thesunspear in a town circle early on in the game. Do you think they would do that as scum partners?

I don't see why not. If people would assume that I wouldn't list my own scummates in my town circle at the start of the game, I would put every single one of them in there.
I think we can ignore that town circle thingy, it is just a WIFOM.

 

[Paul and the band]

finally iso'd tommy and hal. i stand by my earlier issue with them having a presence in the thread but not contributing a lot of content. i still think that's scummy

however, i don't think they could be partners with thesunspear. tommy and hal seemed to have the biggest issue with them and their banter doesn't look w/w. however, it seems that people are pegging thesunspear and tommy and hal as the most suspicious people. so, what i'm trying to say is i don't think the world that y'all are building checks out

 

[Paul and the band]

tommy and hal >>> sunspear as wolf imo, especially given their late vote on s&n after thinking they were "weak town" earlier in the phase. they were also the last person to vote s&n according to the vote count

Final Day 1 Vote Count

thesunspear- 1 (H&S)
Lone Wolf- 1 (RR)
Scumlords and Noobs- 5 (Chillian, ZMS, sunspear, LatB, T&H)
Zinn Mask Salesman- 6 (Aflame, BLC, S&N, MNH, ddi, LW)

i think the vote count is super important because the votes were so close yet the eod was pretty chill and disorganized. that's why i pegged lw as town since they made the deciding vote.

i don't understand why rr was on lone wolf at the end. they were talking about zms vs s&n a lot when it was getting close to eod.

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

that's eh... convenient?

Yeah, him bringing it up in the first place was not the best move, but I feel if I don’t at least tell you that much then you’ll keep prying for an explanation we can’t provide and we can have some semblance of closure on it. S&N is dead now, so it’s moot anyways.

gRAdUATed ScUM
ZMS - so proud of you

LOL, “Graduated Scum?” That’s pure gold xD

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

but this way* we can have some semblance of closure on it. S&N is dead now, so it’s moot anyways.

Me not do grammar good

 

[Hydreigon & Shelgon GX]

Hmm, interesting how Sunspear still hasn’t answered my question about why they said they didn’t want an investigation on S&N before the whole Miller revelation. (And tbh I’m getting slightly paranoid that their “we should kill that guy” about S&N after S&N claimed was actually about NK’ing and was meant for the scum chat, though there’s no way to prove this)

 

[Chillian]

I agree with you there. Can’t wait to see what they’ve got to say in their defense.

 

[thesunspear]

Spoiler: what's this

Twitch

Twitch is the world's leading video platform and community for gamers.

twitch.tv

 

[Chillian]

Man, today has been quiet
Not that I'm complaining.
Reads list for Deku will come when I get home, maybe two hours.

 

[Restless_Ridge]

Honestly, I'd expect both Dusk and Hal to bus someone if they thought they were going to be lynched

I'm also not sure why we were on LW, but I guess I'll ask at some point

also I don't particularly think casting the deciding vote is alignment indicative. But it certainly is WIFOM since there's pretty equal utility in saving a partner vs getting town cred from being the one to guarantee the lynch

 

[thesunspear]

Hmm, interesting how Sunspear still hasn’t answered my question about why they said they didn’t want an investigation on S&N before the whole Miller revelation. (And tbh I’m getting slightly paranoid that their “we should kill that guy” about S&N after S&N claimed was actually about NK’ing and was meant for the scum chat, though there’s no way to prove this)

Lmaoooooooooo

I would never, ever kill a killer claim if I'm a wolf are you crazy

 

[thesunspear]

Lmaoooooooooo

I would never, ever kill a killer claim if I'm a wolf are you crazy

Miller claim*

 

[thesunspear]

I dont think it was me that said that about investigating the zwelious, so I have told my partner that he should answer that question. Apologies that we missed it.