Controversial opinions

[marshiyanmisuta]

It was mistake to evolve Jimeleon, as funny as its evolved form's "cool guy" act, its personality as Jimeleon had so much more story potential.

 

[Jewel the Quaxly]

This isn't controversial anymore, I feel, but I'll put it here anyway in case anyone disagrees: I never liked Ash's team for Journeys. Even in their capture episodes, while everyone else was excited over the prospect of Ash catching fan-favorites and fully evolved pokemon, I didn't see the appeal or fully understand all the hype. It's just, their stories felt really lackluster to me and I honestly couldn't get invested in them even from the very beginning.

Dragonite felt like it was going to go somewhere, and honestly felt more unique and interesting to me...but they solved it all within one episode and I lost all investment instantly. Literally, why haven't they mentioned the island Dragonite came from ever since? Not even a flashback?

Gengar had the stereotypical abandoned pokemon story and a mischievous personality, which felt like it was going to go somewhere, but once again, this is solved within the capture episode and is never mentioned ever again. Gengar's "bond" with Ash honestly didn't even feel genuine. Like, if I were to compare this with the likes of say, Corphish, than you'll see a clear difference here. Ash never got actual time to bond with Gengar after the capture episode to solidify the pokemon's placement on the cast. Corphish got an entire episode dedicated to its personality right after its capture, meeting the team after having fought with them, saving the group from Team Rocket, butting heads with May and everyone else, starting a rivalry with Treeco, and more. Literally two episodes and I already don't want Corphish to ever leave the cast. But with Gengar? I honestly couldn't care less if he did.

Lucario...did it even have a story? Seriously, its episode was dedicated to how mysterious its egg was and the "mystery of pokemon eggs" and its weird aura connection with Ash-which they also hinted at way back in Episode 2 as foreshadowing-yet this is never mentioned again? For god's sake, we had build-up for once!

Sirfetch'd...never interested me. It also didn't feel like it had a genuine bond with Ash and didn't have anything else to make up for it. He evolved into a Sirfetch'd and became stronger...that's it, I guess? Buizel is more interesting despite not even having a dedicated character arc. It had interesting interactions with his teammates, an episode dedicated to its personality affecting the team and his friendship with Pikachu(which was kind of rushed imo, but it was still better than this...) during an actually emotionally investing gym match, and formed bonds with Dawn and Ash respectively.

Dracovish literally has one character trait. Seriously. I honestly don't understand what is so appealing about this pokemon. If it was a trait that was used in some sort of interesting way, like with Ash's Pidgeot, then I would probably be fine with it only having that one trait-as long as it was put to use. But all this pokemon has done is battle.

Pikachu bothered me from the very beginning in that he just felt...so whiny? And also largely incapable of being independent which was even more weird? And a whole bunch of other traits that just make me scratch my head and go "wtf is happening". There's nothing interesting about Pikachu this saga either. But wait, Kangaskhan! Yeah, just like Dragonite, Gengar, and Lucario...this was never mentioned again. I think it showed up like once in a flashback, but that was like in the first twenty episodes. It hasn't appeared or been even mentioned since.

Sure, this all could be solved by more episodes given to these pokemon and more clear characterization, but it feels far too late now and honestly never felt like it was going to present in the first place.

 

[Alola]

So, I've been thinking about one of the recent conversation topics here in the section - the one about Starters, and who should get them. The main two arguments seem to be that either Ash should get all three or the Starters should be split up between the party. After some thought, my opinion is a third option - that Ash should get two while the female companion gets one.

The DP saga introduced this setup and, Torterra's unfortunate fate aside, I think it provided the best amount of screen time and usage for everyone. Turtwig and Chimchar got to participate in at least three Gym Battles each (which allowed us to see them battle, uses moves, etc.), had development outside of their battles, worked on personal aspects such as Turtwig's increased weight by evolution or Chimchar's trauma and Blaze, and both to fully evolved to their final forms. And we all know just how prominent Piplup was, becoming the number #2 mascot right after Pikachu with plenty of spotlight and development. All three Starters also learned new moves and battle techniques over the saga.

Sun & Moon somewhat repeated this, with Ash having Rowlet and Litten (again, the Grass and Fire Starters) while Lana had Popplio. Given the direction SM went, these Starters were not as developed as their aforementioned predecessors (in my opinion), but they still had very notable interactions; Rowlet & its adopted family along with its large amount of screen time, Litten & its adopted father along with its rivalry with Kukui's Incineroar, and Popplio, who was the first of the trio to fully evolve to her final form; Primarina was the only one of the three to use its specific Z-Move, too. Again, two of the Starters fully evolved while one did not, with this grouping; also, again, everyone learned new moves by the saga's end.

But if you compare the other Starter distributions that gave the Pokémon to all three party members instead, one of the Starters ended up getting screwed regarding focus & development. For Hoenn, that was poor Mudkip. I don't think Brock ever used it in a straight, proper battle, during his time in Hoenn. Did you also know it learned no other moves aside from Water Gun? Until it evolved into a Marshstomp, in Kanto? That's right - the writers had the poor Starter Pokémon only use Water Gun during the entire Hoenn saga; that's pretty much all it was called out for - to do a double Water Gun alongside Lombre, or occasionally use its fin to locate others when the group was spread out for whatever reason. Which is a crying shame given the line's proclivity for earthen moves such as Rock Slide or Earthquake; you would think Brock would have at least taught it Rock Tomb or something. Mudkip also lacked a discernible personality, or even a quirk; it was introduced as the dependable-sort akin to Bulbasaur, but that quickly became a bland aspect that was never elaborated on. It didn't grow or advance in its home region at any point. I say home, because Kanto finally gave it the evolution it should have had a region ago, as well as a new move - then they had to give it Protect and Tackle when they realized Water Gun and Mud Shot wouldn't be enough to serve as a Contest opponent for May. Then it faded back into obscurity, and couldn't even fully evolve into a Swampert like its peers got to do with their evolutionary stages. That's what happens when you give the male companion in a party, a Starter.

Especially as this repeated with Chespin & Clemont (who, at the beginning, was going to abandon his newly-obtained Pokémon due to a misunderstanding, mind you). Like Mudkip, there was no development in personality or even move-set (which was a shame as the Chespin-line has one of the most diverse movepools among Grass Starters); no evolutions either - just disappointing all around. All Chespin was was a glutton and eventually Pancham's best friend, with the latter relationship being noticeable because they eventually became "those two guys" of the team, making you question why was Chespin not given to Serena? It loves her Poke Puffs and would have actually gotten to do something, rather than whatever the heck Clemont was using it for (which was nothing). Chespin couldn't even get a slot in for Clemont's Gym Battle with Ash, who chose his actual Electric-types and Bunnelby instead (because we all needed to see a rematch). And speaking of battling, I don't think Chespin ever had a clear battle, like Mudkip before him, with him being the victor - the fight with Delphox was inconclusive and it largely supported Pikachu during the Triple Battle at the camp; I guess you can count the Xerosic fight, but Clemont needed to win that regardless for plot reasons and the way he defeated the scientist was akin to how Ash & friends routinely defeat TR. It was just relegated to plucky comic-relief, its effectiveness at that arguable, with no other notable qualities; Clemont didn't even teach it Thunder Punch, as his mark of being owned by an Electric-specialist.

So when they spread out the Starters, if it goes to a male companion, who is already a support character by virtue (until that status quo is changed), they are doomed to a lack of focus in comparison to their peers. Then there are the cases where Ash owns all of the Starters - admittedly, I prefer this much over everyone getting one, but not the 2 for Ash and 1 for the female model, because at least everyone gets to do something or is at least seen to some extent. However, I really enjoyed May's Torchic, Dawn's Piplup, and Serena's Fennekin - I think partnering the female player character, or a player character in general, with one of the Starters is better for narrative, development, and advertisement purposes; it also gives Ash an extra slot to use another Pokémon instead, which increases that species visibility.

 

[Unireon]

I think partnering the female player character, or a player character in general, with one of the Starters is better for narrative, development, and advertisement purposes; it also gives Ash an extra slot to use another Pokémon instead, which increases that species visibility.

I would have liked to see a male player character in the main anime, or better as a companion.

The worst distribution ever is what Journeys did with the Galar Starters.

 

[Audino1008]

Unlike most people I've seen on this site, I actually like the concept of Journeys much more than I like the concept of just a Sword and Shield anime. Now, I still think that Galar deserves a lot more attention, and I totally agree with the idea that Cerise Lab should've been located at Galar. And I'm not kidding when I say that there is a TON I would rewrite in Journeys if I could. But I still like the idea of traveling around the world much more than just a Galar series. And it doesn't even has to do anything with me disliking SwSh, even if the games were good, I just think those gym journeys are way overdone in the anime and I appreciate how SM broke the formula, in the games too.

Unfortunately the execution of Journeys is pretty damn mediocre.


Also, Koharu is fine with just Eevee, thank you very much. Even if the Galar Starters were spread out between the Main Characters, Koharu's character doesn't really need any Pokemon other than Eevee.

And, while I was one of the people who were very salty when Goh caught Grookey instead of Ash, nowdays I've changed my mind (even if the capture episode sucked), and I think Goh is completely fine with all 3 Galar Starters. You see, if it were up to me, I would have had Ash's Team consist purely of Gens 1-7 Pokemon to represent the interregional travel aspect of Journeys, and Goh's main Team would consist of Gen 8 Pokemon, and then Team Rocket can maybe get Gen 4 Pokemon for the Sinnoh games. I actually don't like the fact that Ash has Sirfetch'd and Dracovish in his team, even though I adore Dracovish's derpiness.

 

[SlyGecko]

I would have liked to see a male player character in the main anime, or better as a companion.

The worst distribution ever is what Journeys did with the Galar Starters.

I think the main reason why we never got the male playable character as a companion is because Ash is supposed to represent the male playable character.

 

[Neo Blaze]

I haven't been terribly impressed by the short anime series (I liked parts of Origins and I've liked most of PokéToons though), especially Twilight Wings I think is incredibly overrated. Also, while I fully admit the main Pokémon anime (and especially Journeys so far...) is flawed, I still vastly prefer the main anime over these short series (but I also think it's weird to compare two things that are so wildly different in the first place). I will say that the idea of short series in itself is good since it makes things more diverse and it leads to more creativity, I just personally think the execution has been mostly lacking so far. I'm kinda hoping Evolutions is the one short series that blows me away, but considering I didn't care much at all for Generations or Twilight Wings (and I'm assuming Evolutions will be similar to those), I'm struggling to get excited for it.

 

[Hidden Mew]

But if you compare the other Starter distributions that gave the Pokémon to all three party members instead, one of the Starters ended up getting screwed regarding focus & development. For Hoenn, that was poor Mudkip. I don't think Brock ever used it in a straight, proper battle, during his time in Hoenn. Did you also know it learned no other moves aside from Water Gun? Until it evolved into a Marshstomp, in Kanto? That's right - the writers had the poor Starter Pokémon only use Water Gun during the entire Hoenn saga; that's pretty much all it was called out for - to do a double Water Gun alongside Lombre, or occasionally use its fin to locate others when the group was spread out for whatever reason. Which is a crying shame given the line's proclivity for earthen moves such as Rock Slide or Earthquake; you would think Brock would have at least taught it Rock Tomb or something. Mudkip also lacked a discernible personality, or even a quirk; it was introduced as the dependable-sort akin to Bulbasaur, but that quickly became a bland aspect that was never elaborated on. It didn't grow or advance in its home region at any point. I say home, because Kanto finally gave it the evolution it should have had a region ago, as well as a new move - then they had to give it Protect and Tackle when they realized Water Gun and Mud Shot wouldn't be enough to serve as a Contest opponent for May. Then it faded back into obscurity, and couldn't even fully evolve into a Swampert like its peers got to do with their evolutionary stages. That's what happens when you give the male companion in a party, a Starter.

I think Mudkip had one non-Team Rocket battle in a filler episode during Hoenn, but that's about it. It's a shame that it was treated so poorly since it had a good capture episode and expanding more on its personality from its debut could have been interesting. It definitely felt like a waste to not make it into a Swampert just so that the cast could have the fully evolved starters of a generation for the first time.

Especially as this repeated with Chespin & Clemont (who, at the beginning, was going to abandon his newly-obtained Pokémon due to a misunderstanding, mind you). Like Mudkip, there was no development in personality or even move-set (which was a shame as the Chespin-line has one of the most diverse movepools among Grass Starters); no evolutions either - just disappointing all around. All Chespin was was a glutton and eventually Pancham's best friend, with the latter relationship being noticeable because they eventually became "those two guys" of the team, making you question why was Chespin not given to Serena? It loves her Poke Puffs and would have actually gotten to do something, rather than whatever the heck Clemont was using it for (which was nothing). Chespin couldn't even get a slot in for Clemont's Gym Battle with Ash, who chose his actual Electric-types and Bunnelby instead (because we all needed to see a rematch). And speaking of battling, I don't think Chespin ever had a clear battle, like Mudkip before him, with him being the victor - the fight with Delphox was inconclusive and it largely supported Pikachu during the Triple Battle at the camp; I guess you can count the Xerosic fight, but Clemont needed to win that regardless for plot reasons and the way he defeated the scientist was akin to how Ash & friends routinely defeat TR. It was just relegated to plucky comic-relief, its effectiveness at that arguable, with no other notable qualities; Clemont didn't even teach it Thunder Punch, as his mark of being owned by an Electric-specialist.

I wouldn't say that Clemont was going to abandon Chespin. He thought that it was happier with this old woman instead of being with him. Granted, it was still a huge mistake to not even check on how Chespin felt about the situation before making that decision, but I'm just not sure if I'd consider that abandonment exactly. The idea of Serena getting Chespin instead is interesting though. I'm not sure how much more active Chespin could have been, mainly due to how Showcases worked. Ideally it could have been used for some nice combinations instead of being primarily comedy relief, but Serena's other Pokemon rarely learned any new moves, so Chespin probably would have been stuck with its moveset. Still, it would have given her a fourth Pokemon. While I don't think Serena really needed more Pokemon exactly, a fourth one for Showcases could have worked and a Grass type would have been potentially interesting. I always thought that a Skiddo was better suited for her instead, but putting Chespin on center stage with the rest of her team could have better.

Personally, I didn't mind that it wasn't included in Clemont's Gym battle with Ash. By that point, Chespin was just the comedy relief Pokemon, so I don't think it would have work for their Gym battle. Bunnelby at least felt fitting given that was their first battle and connected to how they met. Teaching Chespin Thunder Punch would have been a nice shakeup for its moveset though.

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

I think Mudkip had one non-Team Rocket battle in a filler episode during Hoenn, but that's about it. It's a shame that it was treated so poorly since it had a good capture episode and expanding more on its personality from its debut could have been interesting. It definitely felt like a waste to not make it into a Swampert just so that the cast could have the fully evolved starters of a generation for the first time.

I wouldn't say that Clemont was going to abandon Chespin. He thought that it was happier with this old woman instead of being with him. Granted, it was still a huge mistake to not even check on how Chespin felt about the situation before making that decision, but I'm just not sure if I'd consider that abandonment exactly. The idea of Serena getting Chespin instead is interesting though. I'm not sure how much more active Chespin could have been, mainly due to how Showcases worked. Ideally it could have been used for some nice combinations instead of being primarily comedy relief, but Serena's other Pokemon rarely learned any new moves, so Chespin probably would have been stuck with its moveset. Still, it would have given her a fourth Pokemon. While I don't think Serena really needed more Pokemon exactly, a fourth one for Showcases could have worked and a Grass type would have been potentially interesting. I always thought that a Skiddo was better suited for her instead, but putting Chespin on center stage with the rest of her team could have better.

Personally, I didn't mind that it wasn't included in Clemont's Gym battle with Ash. By that point, Chespin was just the comedy relief Pokemon, so I don't think it would have work for their Gym battle. Bunnelby at least felt fitting given that was their first battle and connected to how they met. Teaching Chespin Thunder Punch would have been a nice shakeup for its moveset though.

MARSHTOMP DESERVED BETTER

AND TO MAKE MATTERS WORSE IT HASNT BEEN SEEN SINCE AG

 

[RetroPokeFan]

MARSHTOMP DESERVED BETTER

AND TO MAKE MATTERS WORSE IT HASNT BEEN SEEN SINCE AG

Ummm, did we all forget that rubbish segment in one episode of Journeys with those Marshtomps stuck in the ground?

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

Ummm, did we all forget that rubbish segment in one episode of Journeys with those Marshtomps stuck in the ground?

I think they mean Brock's Marshtomp, who had a good oppritunity to return when Brock did in Sun and Moon, though never did.

 

[Blob]

I wish that Journies introduced more than 2 Galar Gym Leaders. I know Ash isn't doing the badge thing, but I at least thought that all the Galar GLs would show up.
The Coronation finals also seem to mostly include champions from different regions. I also wish the finals had more than just 8 people participate and it was the top 20-30 instead, that way the other Galar Gym Leaders would have got a chance to show up.

The thing that bugs me the most is the show can't decide what it wants to be. Does it want to bring back old characters? Does it want to focus on Goh? Does it want to focus on Ash as he raises through the ranks? Does it want to solve the mystery of Chloe's Eevee? Does it want to be a filler series?
In all of that, there's not even enough room for the Pokémon to develop and grow meaningfully. The series is all over the place and when most episodes are mediocre at best, it makes it hard to sit through.

 

[Blob]

MARSHTOMP DESERVED BETTER

AND TO MAKE MATTERS WORSE IT HASNT BEEN SEEN SINCE AG

Swampert should have been the Pokémon Brock Mega Evolved.

 

[Jewel the Quaxly]

Does it want to bring back old characters? Does it want to focus on Goh? Does it want to focus on Ash as he raises through the ranks? Does it want to solve the mystery of Chloe's Eevee? Does it want to be a filler series?

I feel like the problem with Journeys isn't that they can't decide which of these to do, but rather that they can't decide how to balance them properly. Technically speaking, they CAN do at least most of these things, but some just don't mix with each other. For instance, you can absolutely have a filler series that focuses on either Goh or Chloe's goal with companion returns as well. But Ash's goal is out of place, as unlike Goh or Chloe, who's progress is immeasurable this series, Ash has an actual set system to follow. Therein lies the huge problem everyone has with the PWC. It literally has no relevance to whatever narrative there actually is. It's not even helping Ash grow as a character, or helping others grow as characters, or adding to the world-building. It's just pointless other than to give Ash something to do.

 

[Alola]

I wouldn't say that Clemont was going to abandon Chespin. He thought that it was happier with this old woman instead of being with him. Granted, it was still a huge mistake to not even check on how Chespin felt about the situation before making that decision, but I'm just not sure if I'd consider that abandonment exactly.

While the people seemed nice from Clemont's brief observation and he meant well, it's still abandonment on his part and would be regarded as such in reality; he didn't even release Chespin formally, so as far as everyone would have known, it would have belonged to another, unknown Trainer. If I dropped my child off at someone else's house (strangers, mind you) because I felt it would be a better fit and had no intention of returning, and I haven't notified anyone of the involved people about this, that's abandonment regardless of my reasons. It would be the same if I left a pet/animal with someone else, with nary a word to anyone; it may be better for the pet yes, but I am still abandoning that pet given how I handled it. It would be different if I approached the people instead and asked if they would like my pet, thus transferring ownership the correct way - that wouldn't be abandoning. But that isn't what Clemont did.

Obviously, Clemont didn't see it through to completion and everyone emerged from the event happy by the day's end, but that doesn't negate what he explicitly was willing to do before his better judgment returned, which I felt the need to mention.

 

[Alola]

@Hidden Mew Know what I just realized? When Go essentially was going to do the same thing with Raboot (but arguably a bit worse since he was already on the train), he was criticized heavily for it. Yet, I don't recall similar outrage or concern for Clemont? Cough, double standards. cough

 

[Rockapheller]

I might have said it somewhere on the forums before, but Orange islands saga is my favorite era of the anime. The writing was just on point. There is no single episode that I dislike in that arc.

 

[Eitarou]

Swampert should have been the Pokémon Brock Mega Evolved.

Steelix is his first Pokemon. There is no other Pokemon deserving of that honor.

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

Oh yes, who can forget about his Kanto team, staying in their balls for 90 percent of Indigo league arc. How many episodes they've got? Not much I say.

I’m pretty sure Ash's Kanto starters alone have made more appearances than this entire JN team combined. It’s weird that you’re bringing up Pokémon staying in their balls as a problem for a series against JN, because JN has been the worst about it factually.

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

I’m pretty sure Ash's Kanto starters alone have made more appearances than this entire JN team combined. It’s weird that you’re bringing up Pokémon staying in their balls as a problem for a series against JN, because JN has been the worst about it factually.

Not a good comparison because in Kanto they only focused on Satoshi's pokémon while in JN they're focusing more on Gou's pokémon. And even after that, difference between their appearances is not that big if we compare first 79 episodes of each:

Spoiler

Pikachu 79/79
Butterfree 11/79
Pidgeotto 31/79
Bulbasaur 40/79
Charizard 25/79
Squirtle 33/79
Kingler 6/79
Primeape 2/79
Muk 5/79
Tauros 2/79

Pikachu 78/79
Dragonite 20/79
Gengar 17/79
Lucario 23/79
Sirfetch'd 13/79
Dracovish 3/79