Well of course, his Charizard, Squirtle, and Bulbasaur are WAY stronger than any of Ash's pokemon on hand (excluding Pikachu).
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Review DP132: Full Battle! Shinji VS Satoshi!! -Part 2-
- Thread starter Dogasu
- Start date
Well of course, his Charizard, Squirtle, and Bulbasaur are WAY stronger than any of Ash's pokemon on hand (excluding Pikachu).
Its hard to believe Paul is so strong in this battle when he got creamed by both Cynthia and Brandon previously. This battle made Paul look stronger than most Gym leaders.
It's like the writers suddenly gave all of Paul's Pokemon a massive power boost just to make Ash look pathetic in comparison.
It's like the writers suddenly gave all of Paul's Pokemon a massive power boost just to make Ash look pathetic in comparison.
dragonite24
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This was really a over the top win for paul.
A lot of strong pokemon from ash got knocked out fast, and Paul is the one getting deux ex machina in spades.
And Ash is supposed to beat him at the league?
Yeah right.
Monferno looks good , blaze kicked in to, surprised it did't do much.
A lot of strong pokemon from ash got knocked out fast, and Paul is the one getting deux ex machina in spades.
And Ash is supposed to beat him at the league?
Yeah right.
Monferno looks good , blaze kicked in to, surprised it did't do much.
the producers do that stuff with Ash's pokes all the time (especially the surviving super effective moves), its about time someone pulls in on him instead.
He is stronger than most gym leaders, he beat them all as far as we know on his first try and some of them without breaking a sweat (like that fighting one).
Queen Cynthia
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Judging from what I've read, I can't describe how disappointed and depressed I'm feeling right now.
This could almost be another "ash_forever-goes-nuts-because-the-writers-degraded-Ash-once-more"- moment.
So...Ash failed MISERABLY against "invincible Paul" ONCE AGAIN???!! ("invincible" applies to battles against "normal" trainers) That's so absolutely humiliating for me as an passionate Ash-Fan...so humiliating
:banghead::saiyan:
I don't care whether it may have been a good battle. A 2-6 is by no means a good battle unless you're using a very weird definition of "good":dizzy:
At the moment, I can hardly describe my feelings, a mixture of anger and disappointment...
Ash has always been my outstanding hero, but I guess what we've been witnessing since the very first Sinnoh episode is the steady degradation (and maybe even fall??) of our beloved protagonist. Why, tell me, why does all this remind me of Shakepeare's tragedies with an inevitable catastrophe at the end?:bawling:
Don't get me wrong but I just don't get this paradoxical situation: On the one hand, the Sinnoh episodes are getting better and better and certainly surpass all the previous adventures, but on the other hand, Ash's reputation as a trainer is getting worse and worse. The successful gym battles? Well they were quite nice, but not that special because we know that you can take for granted that Ash will of course win all badges in every region. The Anime wouldn't work otherwise.
In contrast to those already expected gym victories, such decisive battles like for example this one against Paul are the battles that REALLY count. As long as Ash keeps failing in these showdowns he'll stay the little unexperienced boy from the very first episode...and ordinary trainer...Sorry, I know that all this sounds terribly hard, but I'm just trying to convey in words what is torturing my mind right now...
We've waited so deperately and so terribly long for Chimchar to evolve...and all we get is the same as before(and perhaps even worse)?!
All our hopes ...in vain! All our dreams with regard to Chimchar's glorious future...shattered!:banghead:
Folks, I don't understand you:
A Pokemon's design or awesomeness doesn't win battles or even leagues...It may contribute to the Pokemon's overall appearance at the most... I don't care if Monferno looks creepy, awesome, or whatever...all this is USELESS unless its power and its skills evolve as well!
Oh man I just can't stand the thought that maybe another one of Ash's Pokemon will be messed up...
I wished my curiosity wouldn't have tempted me to look up the result of this sad battle. Oh Ash...:-|
This could almost be another "ash_forever-goes-nuts-because-the-writers-degraded-Ash-once-more"- moment.
So...Ash failed MISERABLY against "invincible Paul" ONCE AGAIN???!! ("invincible" applies to battles against "normal" trainers) That's so absolutely humiliating for me as an passionate Ash-Fan...so humiliating
:banghead::saiyan:
I don't care whether it may have been a good battle. A 2-6 is by no means a good battle unless you're using a very weird definition of "good":dizzy:
At the moment, I can hardly describe my feelings, a mixture of anger and disappointment...
Ash has always been my outstanding hero, but I guess what we've been witnessing since the very first Sinnoh episode is the steady degradation (and maybe even fall??) of our beloved protagonist. Why, tell me, why does all this remind me of Shakepeare's tragedies with an inevitable catastrophe at the end?:bawling:
Don't get me wrong but I just don't get this paradoxical situation: On the one hand, the Sinnoh episodes are getting better and better and certainly surpass all the previous adventures, but on the other hand, Ash's reputation as a trainer is getting worse and worse. The successful gym battles? Well they were quite nice, but not that special because we know that you can take for granted that Ash will of course win all badges in every region. The Anime wouldn't work otherwise.
In contrast to those already expected gym victories, such decisive battles like for example this one against Paul are the battles that REALLY count. As long as Ash keeps failing in these showdowns he'll stay the little unexperienced boy from the very first episode...and ordinary trainer...Sorry, I know that all this sounds terribly hard, but I'm just trying to convey in words what is torturing my mind right now...
Monferno couldn't knock out Electabuzz but this piece of news knocked out me...The worst part of the whole episode.
We've waited so deperately and so terribly long for Chimchar to evolve...and all we get is the same as before(and perhaps even worse)?!
All our hopes ...in vain! All our dreams with regard to Chimchar's glorious future...shattered!:banghead:
Folks, I don't understand you:
A Pokemon's design or awesomeness doesn't win battles or even leagues...It may contribute to the Pokemon's overall appearance at the most... I don't care if Monferno looks creepy, awesome, or whatever...all this is USELESS unless its power and its skills evolve as well!
Oh man I just can't stand the thought that maybe another one of Ash's Pokemon will be messed up...
I wished my curiosity wouldn't have tempted me to look up the result of this sad battle. Oh Ash...:-|
ZoraJolteon
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POINTLESS SPECULATION TIME! Given how a lot was made of how Paul frequently switches Pokémon, and Paul's battles tend to incorperate strategies used in in game competitive battling, might Ash be inspired to teach one of his Pokémon an entry hazard move before their next encounter? Presumably Stealth Rock for either Gliscor or Grotle.
TeddiUrsa
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Why am I NOT surprised to see Ash_forever´s post?
Ranting like crazy without seeing one of the best battles and episodes in the whole episode was too predictable...just like Satoshi´s loss.
Anyway, like I said, a VERY good, thrilling two-parter. Even though I knew the outcome I was at the edge of my seat when I watched this 2-parter. And believe me, this doesn´t happen very often to me ( the last time I was THIS thrilled was Haruka´s Kanto GF battle against Shuu).
Glion´s battle in part 1 was very entertaining and stunning, I felt its quick breakdown in part 2 was a bit forced in order to reduce Satoshi´s team down to Hiko...
But my favourite´s of Satoshi´s team got pretty good screentime anyway, even when they were loosing so I won´t complain. The battles in general were very intense, especially in part 2.
Monferno is awesome and I can´t wait to see more of it. One of my favourite scenes? when it punched the air into Shinji´s face after evolving. Great! ^-^
I´m really looking forward to the league now.
Ranting like crazy without seeing one of the best battles and episodes in the whole episode was too predictable...just like Satoshi´s loss.
Anyway, like I said, a VERY good, thrilling two-parter. Even though I knew the outcome I was at the edge of my seat when I watched this 2-parter. And believe me, this doesn´t happen very often to me ( the last time I was THIS thrilled was Haruka´s Kanto GF battle against Shuu).
Glion´s battle in part 1 was very entertaining and stunning, I felt its quick breakdown in part 2 was a bit forced in order to reduce Satoshi´s team down to Hiko...
But my favourite´s of Satoshi´s team got pretty good screentime anyway, even when they were loosing so I won´t complain. The battles in general were very intense, especially in part 2.
Monferno is awesome and I can´t wait to see more of it. One of my favourite scenes? when it punched the air into Shinji´s face after evolving. Great! ^-^
I´m really looking forward to the league now.
shadowblack
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Out of curiosity: Does Ash have ANY pokemon that can learn Mean Look (or Block)?
The Stealth Rock move ZoraJolteon mentioned is a very good idea, especially since Ash has 3 pokemon on his team that can learn it: Grotle/Torterra, Monferno/Infernape and Gliscor.
The Stealth Rock move ZoraJolteon mentioned is a very good idea, especially since Ash has 3 pokemon on his team that can learn it: Grotle/Torterra, Monferno/Infernape and Gliscor.
ii kanji
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They seemed to be - they were definitely rooting (as always) for Hiko/Mouka and they looked quite sad at the end.
Me thinketh so
Anyway, this is probably my favourite battle of all time. I just loved it.
Idon'tcare
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After seeing Satoshi losing to Shinji in this episode, we will definitely see Satoshi beat him in Shinou League. I'm sort of glad Satoshi lost, because it might have made a battle in the Shinou League seem pointless if he had already finally beaten his rival.
Glion battled Dodaitoise again and Dodaitoise won. But in last weeks episode Glion put up a surprisingly good battle against Dodaitoise, even harming it a lot. I guess Glion has gotten more powerful if it could keep up with it as Dodaitoise should be way stronger than Glion.
Glion battled Dodaitoise again and Dodaitoise won. But in last weeks episode Glion put up a surprisingly good battle against Dodaitoise, even harming it a lot. I guess Glion has gotten more powerful if it could keep up with it as Dodaitoise should be way stronger than Glion.
And once again you jump to conclusions too quickly. Just like when you said Hikouzaru wouldn't evolve.
Ashfangirl22
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I'm glad Ash loss to now thinking it over, this makes me and more people want to cheer even more for him in the league.
Mitchman
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No but I did find it hilarious how the burn effect works in the show. Voom its the spontaneously combusting Pikachu!
Trainer'sInsomnia
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Great battle as far as the play out of individual match ups. You really had the feeling that an intense kind of war was going on, and not just your run-of-the-mill little back and forth tag matches. The exchanges were great, and I'm glad things made sense as far as the Pokemon dealing more damage winning and such. That may sound silly, but it's quite a nice thing to have.
I know a lot of people were shocked about Pikachu's fall, but as I watched it, I knew it would happen. It's like I always say, the anime sticks very closely to Pikachu's in game attributes and stats. Pikachu is very threatening as an attacker and speedster, so offensively its a gem. But its defense is very lousy, and is really the biggest flaw in Pikachu's otherwise strong set up. It seems like the primary times Pikachu loses is when his speed is reduced and his weak defense is exploited. It got tagged with fire here, and that's what happened.
Probably the biggest Pokemon disappointment here, for me, would be Buizel. Buizel's been such a powerhouse throughout Sinnoh and I really thought it would be able to make a lot of noise in this match as a result. I was massively disappointed when it had little to no real impact on the match. It's taking one of Ash's best from Sinnoh and snuffing it.
The real star of all this, of course, was Monferno. I got quite a laugh out of everyone speculating whether or not he would come around in this fight, because for some of us it was really obvious. That being said, it was still a great thing to see. After kicking Ursaring's ass and really stepping forward. I am a definite Monferno fan, and am glad that the Chimchar story has been taken a step further. You kind of had to feel bad for it though, as it pretty much had the weight of Ash's entire team on its shoulders. Still, it held up nicely, and should've beaten Electabuzz. That was utter nonsense.
In some way though, I can't hate the writers for how they handled the outcome of this battle. First of all, I have to say that Ash losing was apparent. Again, it was kind of funny when people were saying they didn't know the outcome, because basic story-telling 101 would tell us that Ash cannot triumph over his biggest rival before the big stage. If he did, it'd kind of take away the threat and suspense that is Paul. And he's not secondary like Barry, soooo.
So Ash losing was a gimme, and the real controversy at hand was the manner in which he lost. I can't hate the writers, because in a way, it's KIND OF realistic. Just a bit. Ash is using an entire Sinnoh-only team outside of Pikachu. His earliest Pokemon was a Starly that didn't reach stage 3 until a while ago. His Buizel is unevolved. Even his powerhouse, Monferno, took forever to evolve, implying that it still needed some pretty heavy experience. Meanwhile, Paul was rocking his starter, Torterra, as well as 2other Pokemon that he's had prior to Sinnoh in both Honchkrow and Weavile.
That being said, the above logic is kind of contradicted by the fact that Weavile was one of only 2 of Paul's Pokemon to be knocked out, despite its veteran status. It also doesn't help that Paul's Ursaring single-handedly smited--what, 3 of Ash's Pokemon? So I guess it's still all pretty ridiculous.
I wonder though, if this could somehow be setting up for something? I know it won't happen, but it'd be awesome to see Ash now turn to a couple of different vets for different matches in the League. it'd never happen, because of how hard his Sinnoh team has worked and all, but one can dream. Just once, I'd love to see him use Charizard, Bulbasaur, Snorlax, Donphan, etc.. on Paul to let him know where he really stands. I mean Paul's using 3(known) vets while Ash is only using Pikachu.
The one thing that I'm really hoping is that this marginal loss doesn't mean that Ash is merely going to "close the gap a little" should they meet in the League.
Lastly, I'm glad that they did Grotle vs Honchkrow and Torterra vs Staraptor, rather than the "obvious" alternative. How mundane and boring would it be to see another Bird or evo match? That's not how it usually works anyway.
I know a lot of people were shocked about Pikachu's fall, but as I watched it, I knew it would happen. It's like I always say, the anime sticks very closely to Pikachu's in game attributes and stats. Pikachu is very threatening as an attacker and speedster, so offensively its a gem. But its defense is very lousy, and is really the biggest flaw in Pikachu's otherwise strong set up. It seems like the primary times Pikachu loses is when his speed is reduced and his weak defense is exploited. It got tagged with fire here, and that's what happened.
Probably the biggest Pokemon disappointment here, for me, would be Buizel. Buizel's been such a powerhouse throughout Sinnoh and I really thought it would be able to make a lot of noise in this match as a result. I was massively disappointed when it had little to no real impact on the match. It's taking one of Ash's best from Sinnoh and snuffing it.
The real star of all this, of course, was Monferno. I got quite a laugh out of everyone speculating whether or not he would come around in this fight, because for some of us it was really obvious. That being said, it was still a great thing to see. After kicking Ursaring's ass and really stepping forward. I am a definite Monferno fan, and am glad that the Chimchar story has been taken a step further. You kind of had to feel bad for it though, as it pretty much had the weight of Ash's entire team on its shoulders. Still, it held up nicely, and should've beaten Electabuzz. That was utter nonsense.
In some way though, I can't hate the writers for how they handled the outcome of this battle. First of all, I have to say that Ash losing was apparent. Again, it was kind of funny when people were saying they didn't know the outcome, because basic story-telling 101 would tell us that Ash cannot triumph over his biggest rival before the big stage. If he did, it'd kind of take away the threat and suspense that is Paul. And he's not secondary like Barry, soooo.
So Ash losing was a gimme, and the real controversy at hand was the manner in which he lost. I can't hate the writers, because in a way, it's KIND OF realistic. Just a bit. Ash is using an entire Sinnoh-only team outside of Pikachu. His earliest Pokemon was a Starly that didn't reach stage 3 until a while ago. His Buizel is unevolved. Even his powerhouse, Monferno, took forever to evolve, implying that it still needed some pretty heavy experience. Meanwhile, Paul was rocking his starter, Torterra, as well as 2other Pokemon that he's had prior to Sinnoh in both Honchkrow and Weavile.
That being said, the above logic is kind of contradicted by the fact that Weavile was one of only 2 of Paul's Pokemon to be knocked out, despite its veteran status. It also doesn't help that Paul's Ursaring single-handedly smited--what, 3 of Ash's Pokemon? So I guess it's still all pretty ridiculous.
I wonder though, if this could somehow be setting up for something? I know it won't happen, but it'd be awesome to see Ash now turn to a couple of different vets for different matches in the League. it'd never happen, because of how hard his Sinnoh team has worked and all, but one can dream. Just once, I'd love to see him use Charizard, Bulbasaur, Snorlax, Donphan, etc.. on Paul to let him know where he really stands. I mean Paul's using 3(known) vets while Ash is only using Pikachu.
The one thing that I'm really hoping is that this marginal loss doesn't mean that Ash is merely going to "close the gap a little" should they meet in the League.
Lastly, I'm glad that they did Grotle vs Honchkrow and Torterra vs Staraptor, rather than the "obvious" alternative. How mundane and boring would it be to see another Bird or evo match? That's not how it usually works anyway.
MasterTrainer
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Awesome episode!
I'd say it: Paul is officially a better rival than Gary!
However this match wasn't as good as Ash vs Gary at the Silver Conference!
Too bad this is probably going to be the only mind-blowing battle until the Sinnoh League...then we'd get battles as good as Charizard vs Blaziken!
I'd say it: Paul is officially a better rival than Gary!
However this match wasn't as good as Ash vs Gary at the Silver Conference!
Too bad this is probably going to be the only mind-blowing battle until the Sinnoh League...then we'd get battles as good as Charizard vs Blaziken!
Mitchman
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Or(dare I say it?) possibly even better then Blastoise VS Charizard in the league.
Queen Cynthia
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Maybe...but, Don, you also have to admit that your argument wasn't completely consistent either:
In the same way as you argue that my assumption concerning Monferno's power is far-fetched, I can also assert that there's been absolutely no evidence so far that Ash will beat Paul in the Sinnoh League. Especially your "definitely" is without foundation.
ii kanji
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Rubbish. We don't need foundations as in solid evidence. The experience of having watched this show for 12 years gives support enough to this theory.
My favourite bit of this ep is Mouka's Mach Punch in the direction of Shinji, and then his face and his hair got swept by the wind >D You show him fire monkey!
And Satoshi was so cute when he was all optimistic and like "All his other pokes have taken damage so we've got a chance!" I felt so awful, knowing what the outcome would be. I hope he comes out of this stronger and more fiercely sticking to his guns about friendship .etc.
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