Preview JN125: The Semifinals IV: "Impact"

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

Where did you get that information from? Do you have a source?
It looks to me some people are up for clickbaiting and are thus posting dubious fake news videos on youtube. But you never know for sure these days.

If this was true, it would be the most terrible decision the writers ever made. Making Cynthia weaker on purpose so that Ash can shine... That would be outrageous! God forbid! No!

Spoiler

 

[DuskAstral]

Spoiler

However, such sources are also not entirely reliable. I have already come across 3 cases that turned out to be wrong.

 

[Chilon]

I think they put the highlight not to Gaburias and Sirfetch'd. Togekiss vs Lucario will be cool but... nah it is so stuck when its big and cant move! That would makes the fight an horror for me.

 

[Imtnt]

Sirfetch'd bstter start learning a Z move

 

[Queen Cynthia]

Apart from the fact that I stil don't believe those "leaks" (or fake news?) about Cynthia not mega-evolving Garchomp, there's one very intriguing aspect about it.
Here's the thing:
If Cynthia having to lose to Ash is inevitable and if those rumors about Dynamax Togekiss should really be true, we Cynthia fans can always claim that our Queen would never have lost if the writers had allowed her to use Mega-Garchomp. As simple as that! So even despite those sad recent developments (Cynthia having to retire and having to be defeated by Ash, probably by some Ash-pull victory), we can always comfort ourselves by saying that Cynthia just wasn't allowed to go full power at Ash. I mean under normal circumstances Lucario wouldn't stand a chance against Mega-Garchomp, even if they made his plot armor Aura Sphere as big as planet Earth itself.
I for one will definitely use that argument whenever possible.

 

[Kurolegacy]

Apart from the fact that I stil don't believe those "leaks" (or fake news?) about Cynthia not mega-evolving Garchomp, there's one very intriguing aspect about it.
Here's the thing:
If Cynthia having to lose to Ash is inevitable and if those rumors about Dynamax Togekiss should really be true, we Cynthia fans can always claim that our Queen would never have lost if the writers had allowed her to use Mega-Garchomp. As simple as that! So even despite those sad recent developments (Cynthia having to retire and having to be defeated by Ash, probably by some Ash-pull victory), we can always comfort ourselves by saying that Cynthia just wasn't allowed to go full power at Ash. I mean under normal circumstances Lucario wouldn't stand a chance against Mega-Garchomp, even if they made his plot armor Aura Sphere as big as planet Earth itself.
I for one will definitely use that argument whenever possible.

Even if the rumor is fake, I’m sure that that sentiment will still exist especially considering that Cynthia is sitting on a Kommo-o that she didn’t use in favor of a modified Platinum team (really raises the question of what the point was in that bit of Masters promotion was if she would never use it again. At least they could’ve had her use it against Iris).

 

[Daren]

we can always comfort ourselves by saying that Cynthia just wasn't allowed to go full power at Ash.

I mean Ash isn't allowed to go full power either, he has several Legendary-busters sitting on the sidelines.
Edit: Even if the leak is true it's not necessarily a mistake--I generally consider Dynamax much more powerful than Mega Evolution.

 

[Imtnt]

Maybe a tie?

 

[Nicolas721]

I can think of two (out-of-universe) reasons of why Cynthia wouldn't Megaevolve Garchomp (besides "Haha we're so unpredictable" bragging rights):

1. A reference to the metagame, If I recall correctly, Mega Garchomp was somewhat unpopular and most agreed Life Orb Garchomp was better.

2. To make Cynthia fans feel satisfied. Sounds hard but even the writers know Ash should have more trouble with these opponents.

 

[Queen Cynthia]

I can think of two (out-of-universe) reasons of why Cynthia wouldn't Megaevolve Garchomp (besides "Haha we're so unpredictable" bragging rights):

1. A reference to the metagame, If I recall correctly, Mega Garchomp was somewhat unpopular and most agreed Life Orb Garchomp was better.

2. To make Cynthia fans feel satisfied. Sounds hard but even the writers know Ash should have more trouble with these opponents.

Your second point reveals the fundamental flaw Journeys and the PWC is suffering from: It's too early.
Ash being capable of reaching the Hyper Class would be understandable and logical I guess. But defeating the three strongest trainers in the world with Pokemon that have only been around for 100 episodes or so and haven't really been trained as long as, say, Cynthia's Pokemon, is overdoing it if you ask me.

 

[KrspaceT]

I feel like I could make the rumored battle style work and build off part 1...but I’m also a fanfic writer who doesn’t have a budgetir executive expectations

 

[Him1612]

Your second point reveals the fundamental flaw Journeys and the PWC is suffering from: It's too early.
Ash being capable of reaching the Hyper Class would be understandable and logical I guess. But defeating the three strongest trainers in the world with Pokemon that have only been around for 100 episodes or so and haven't really been trained as long as, say, Cynthia's Pokemon, is overdoing it if you ask me.

That's where game logic applied. ( regional champion defeated by 10 year old kid, just trained for few days)

What we saw is Ash's current team had less experience than old ones. I totally agree with that. But current team bit different from other region team. What I thought is "current team pokémons are bit older than old ones.
Like dragonite - we don't know how much time it's spend in dragonair form ( her friend already evolved)
Gengar - it spend so many months alone after abandoned, we don't know before abandoned time. (maybe training)
Sirfetch - farfetch also battle continuesly
Lucario - we don't know how much it spend in egg before hatch. Waiting for right person like froakie..

Writers did not give information about past and some intermediate training sessions by Ash.

Still I agree Ash does not win against Cynthia without plot armor.
And only Pikachu can defeat Leon's charizard, or maybe Ash's charizard too. Otherwise it's totally asspull..

 

[Ghost Diplocaulus]

Edit: Even if the leak is true it's not necessarily a mistake--I generally consider Dynamax much more powerful than Mega Evolution.

I agree that this is very much true for the games, but in the show I feel that Mega Evolution has an edge, as unlike Dynamax it doesn't have to deal with compromised mobility and is also a permanent boost as opposed to Dyna being temporary. The fact that Max Moves aren't surefire hits in the anime also helps, since it means a Dynamax can be more reliably stalled out than in the games.

Tbh, I think the main problem with having Togekiss be Cynthia's gimmick user this battle instead of Garchomp is that the latter is her ace, and while Mega Garchomp is indeed considered worse than the base in most cases (from what I've heard, the only times you'd want to use Mega Garchomp over the base is either as a mixed attacker on a sand team or if you're running Scale Shot as your main Dragon STAB), in the anime Mega Evolution has been consistently depicted as superior to the base form for any Pokemon that gets it. Remember, we're watching a show where a Pikachu of all things is in a World Championship team when in reality the species has next to no viability and the true World Champion of the Electric Rodents is Pachirisu. Compared to that, Mega Garchomp being better than base Garchomp is small potatoes as far as artistic lisence goes.

Anyway, I got kinda sidetracked back there, but the main point is that if Cynthia chooses not to use Mega Garchomp, then we'll never hear the end of it from her fanbase as they'll go clamoring to the high heavens for years to come that she would have won if she'd used Mega Garchomp. And I don't think I want to deal with that, as there's been way too many complaints about Cynthia not being the best in the world, and Ash beating Garchomp at her strongest would prove the most that the results still would've been the same if she'd powered up another Pokemon instead.

 

[Daren]

Remember, we're watching a show where a Pikachu of all things is in a World Championship team when in reality the species has next to no viability and the true Wold Champion of the Electric Rodents is Pachirisu

Counterpoint; the anime is realtime and not turn based, and what was the first game where Pikachu could fight in real time?
The original Smash Bros, where he's S-tier.
In fact a quick look suggests Pika has always been in the upper half or so of the Smash tier list, and is consistently stronger than Gandondorf. She really, Pikachu's anime performance makes sense if he's officially a better fighter than the Great King of Evil.

Anyway, I got kinda sidetracked back there, but the main point is that if Cynthia chooses not to use Mega Garchomp, then we'll never hear the end of it from her fanbase as they'll go clamoring to the high heavens for years to come that she would have won if she'd used Mega Garchomp. And I don't think I want to deal with that, as there's been way too many complaints about Cynthia not being the best in the world, and Ash beating Garchomp at her strongest would prove the most that the results still would've been the same if she'd powered up another Pokemon instead.

To be fair I saw people on youtube and twitter already calling "plot armour" before we even saw the first part of the battle; a vocal part of the fanbase are just never going to accept Ash--who has been memed into an absolutely failure of a trainer by portions of the fanbase--defeating Cynthia.

Edit: Don't get me wrong I'd prefer Mega Garchomp myself (though the people using game logic to argue Ash is a weak trainer should also be using game logic to say Dynamax is the better choice).

 

[Ghost Diplocaulus]

Counterpoint; the anime is realtime and not turn based, and what was the first game where Pikachu could fight in real time?
The original Smash Bros, where he's S-tier.
In fact a quick look suggests Pika has always been in the upper half or so of the Smash tier list, and is consistently stronger than Gandondorf. She really, Pikachu's anime performance makes sense if he's officially a better fighter than the Great King of Evil.

Counter-counterpoint; if we go by Smash rules then remember that Mewtwo has historically been mid to low-tier there (at one point even being considered worse than Pichu in Meelee), yet the anime still consistently depicts him on the same level as the Major Legendaries to the point that he destroyed Pikachu, Lucario, and Cinderace singlehanded and without breaking a sweat. So be the game canon Pokemon or Smash, the anime is still taking artistic liberties no matter what. Also, and to be fair, with the vast majority of Pokemon species not being playable in Smash we have no way of knowing exactly how accurate Pikachu's depiction is relative to every other Pokemon, so for all we know the Zeldaverse could be soloed by a Rattata

To be fair I saw people on youtube and twitter already calling "plot armour" before we even saw the first part of the battle; a vocal part of the fanbase are just never going to accept Ash--who has been memed into an absolutely failure of a trainer by portions of the fanbase--defeating Cynthia.

Edit: Don't get me wrong I'd prefer Mega Garchomp myself (though the people using game logic to argue Ash is a weak trainer should also be using game logic to say Dynamax is the better choice).

Oh yeah, Cynthia's fanbase is so big and devoted and Ash's reputation as a "bad trainer" has persisted for so long that there'll be mental gymnastics trying to discredit his win over Cynthia no matter what. And it'll be a million times worse if by some miracle Ash actually does beat Red in Masters.

Unfortunately, Ash's detractors are more than happy to turn against game logic when it happens to inconvenience their argument. I know this because a lot of them were quite happy to play the "not like the games" card to defend Pokemon Origins despite many of these same people spending years bashing the anime for contradicting game rules. So yeah, there's simply nothing Ash can do to appease the Pokemon fans who want him to remain the franchise's Yamcha.

 

[Lightning Flame Blast]

Unfortunately, Ash's detractors are more than happy to turn against game logic when it happens to inconvenience their argument. I know this because a lot of them were quite happy to play the "not like the games" card to defend Pokemon Origins despite many of these same people spending years bashing the anime for contradicting game rules. So yeah, there's simply nothing Ash can do to appease the Pokemon fans who want him to remain the franchise's Yamcha.

As all true fans know, bringing a Charizard and a Jolteon into a gym of rock and ground types will never be as egregious an offense as calling for a dodge.
/s

 

[Ghost Diplocaulus]

As all true fans know, bringing a Charizard and a Jolteon into a gym of rock and ground types will never be as egregious an offense as calling for a dodge.
/s

Also, if Ash's Squirtle gets one-shotted by a Fire-type attack it's because he's a terrible trainer and a hopeless idiot. But if Red's Jolteon gets one-shotted by an Electric-type attack it's because the opponent was just too powerful./s

 

[Queen Cynthia]

Anyway, I got kinda sidetracked back there, but the main point is that if Cynthia chooses not to use Mega Garchomp, then we'll never hear the end of it from her fanbase as they'll go clamoring to the high heavens for years to come that she would have won if she'd used Mega Garchomp.

You can count on that And as I already said, I will also be one of those using that argument because it's absolutely legit, reasonable and I can't see what's wrong with it.

One could object "You never know if Ash couldn't defeat Mega-Garchomp" Sure, but the same goes for the opposite. Considering all facts, it's just highly unlikely that Ash would be able to defeat Cynthia's ace in her mega-evolved form.

And this leads me to the second part:

. And I don't think I want to deal with that, as there's been way too many complaints about Cynthia not being the best in the world, and Ash beating Garchomp at her strongest would prove the most that the results still would've been the same if she'd powered up another Pokemon instead.

Because typically such important Ash "victories" only work because of plot armor and suspension of disbelief but not because our 10-year old boy from Pallet Town was actually capable of defeating Cynthia.

 

[Daren]

You can count on that And as I already said, I will also be one of those using that argument because it's absolutely legit, reasonable and I can't see what's wrong with it.

Let's be honest; if she used Megachomp we'd have people saying she only lost because she didn't use Dynamax instead.

Because typically such important Ash "victories" only work because of plot armor and suspension of disbelief but not because our 10-year old boy from Pallet Town was actually capable of defeating Cynthia.

So if Ash wins a major victory it's plot armor and suspension of disbelief, but what about Cynthia's Garchomp taking a 4X effective STAB Blizzard to the face without even flinching?

 

[Imtnt]

You can count on that And as I already said, I will also be one of those using that argument because it's absolutely legit, reasonable and I can't see what's wrong with it.

One could object "You never know if Ash couldn't defeat Mega-Garchomp" Sure, but the same goes for the opposite. Considering all facts, it's just highly unlikely that Ash would be able to defeat Cynthia's ace in her mega-evolved form.

And this leads me to the second part:

Because typically such important Ash "victories" only work because of plot armor and suspension of disbelief but not because our 10-year old boy from Pallet Town was actually capable of defeating Cynthia.

You can't tell for sure.. but to be fair it is more likely if Ash got reserves he could beat Cynthia and get out of this mess.