Starter Discussion

[Dr. Buni]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I think society's view of ninjas has been changed by pop culture lately. Real ninjas used poison, disguise, and other forms of "dirty fighting" in order to assassinate their targets. While I still think Froakie will evolve into fighting type, since I'm not seeing any indication of Dark in his design, I have to agree that Dark would make as much sense coming from a ninja.

There is no indication of Dark in Chespin's design either.

Honestly, I also think that Fighting doesn't suit a ninja at all and Dark (or even Poison) would be more suitable types, but this is Pokémon we are talking about, in the end that could be a reason for Froakie being a Water/Fighting ninja. Or not, after all, Samurott isn't Water/Fighting and I still don't understand why Game Freak didn't give this type to the samurai. On other hand, I can see a Kendo practitioner being either Grass/Dark or Grass/Fighting, but Fighting would totally fit the theme better.

If Chespin evolves into a Knight and not into a Kendo practitioner, I will be so sad ;_; Knights are meh.

 

[Mitchman]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Eh, with the spikes being so prominent in its design, I think dark would fit it honestly. It has no other way to attack, and it resorts to using them in tricky ways.

 

[Zeb]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Well as you said Zeb, ninjas in the modern eye have changed greatly in how they're portrayed. Nowadays you have more heroic ninjas like the TMNT who fight for the good of the people and despite their more dirty tactics they're still good characters underneath that. So with that in mind, it depends on how they want to portray Froakie, as the original, more darker ninja or the modern heroic one so it can go either way.P

That was Enzap that said that. But I agree that both Fighting and Dark would fit; my point was that saying Dark wouldn't fit a ninja is wrong. A kendo-based evolution for Chespin makes me think of Fighting (or Steel) waaaay more than a Dark-type, which, given the leaks, then left Water/Dark for Froakie that also fits a ninja. So it all pieced together. I'm just a bit blind to understanding a Grass/Dark kendo theme when Fighting works better (but yeah, Water/Fight fits a ninja fine too). Maybe I'm thinking along the lines of things being too obvious (then again we look to be getting another supernatural fox), and a Grass/Dark kendo theme can be done well.

 

[Bayushiyojiro]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

water/poison could fit..... as poison IS weak to psychic... the issue would be complting the trio there, chespin would have to be grass/something neutral to poison but beat psychic... so.. umm dark? could be refreshing to see a water/poison type id consider using (sorry tentcool/qwilfish :-/)

 

[robfan09]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I think they're attempting a balancing act with this gen of starters. Water starter has to beat the grass starter, grass has to beat the fire, and fire has to beat the water. They can only do this by adding a second type to each.

So here are my thoughts:
Many people (myself included) think Froakie is going to evolve into Water/Fighting. Keep that in mind for Chespin, whom Froakie will have to knock out. Keeping my "balance" theory in mind, Froakie's second type would have to be super effective against Chespin's second type. If Froakie's second type is fighting, it'd be beneficial over a Normal, Rock, Steel, Ice or Dark type. And I'm pretty sure it'd be safe to rule out Normal as Chespin's secondary type. So... That's all in the air for Chespin's typing.

Fennekin's eyes look completely psychic-type to me, and was shown in gameplay demos to learn Psybeam, so I'm hoping and feel fairly confident that that's what will follow through. This follows my "balance" theory, because a Fire/Psychic type would be able to take out a Water/Fighting type like Froakie. So I'm pretty satisfied with my current thoughts for Fennekin and Froakie.

As other posts have stated, Chespin's name breaks down into "chestnut" and "porcupine". So, like a lot of you, I'm picturing some kind of porcupine-like final stage. Chespin's second type would have to be strong against Psychic or Fire, and weak against Water or Fighting. Chespin is really the only starter in the air for me. I'm really hoping for Grass/Dark because I want something different, but I'm doubting it. Chespin was also shown to know Rollout in demos, so I'm feeling like Grass/Rock is going to be it. And that'd complete the "balance" theory I have.

Circling back to my opening paragraph: Water/Fighting balances Grass/Rock. Grass/Rock balances Fire/Psychic. Fire/Psychic balances Water/Fighting. A big fat happy double-circle.

We know the first gym in XY uses Bug types, so tossing Chespin a type advantage is GameFreak's typical way of being nice, just like giving Charmander Metal Claw in FireRed/LeafGreen.

Let me know your thoughts.

 

[Mermaid]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I think they're attempting a balancing act with this gen of starters. Water starter has to beat the grass starter, grass has to beat the fire, and fire has to beat the water. They can only do this by adding a second type to each.

So here are my thoughts:
Many people (myself included) think Froakie is going to evolve into Water/Fighting. Keep that in mind for Chespin, whom Froakie will have to knock out. Keeping my "balance" theory in mind, Froakie's second type would have to be super effective against Chespin's second type. If Froakie's second type is fighting, it'd be beneficial over a Normal, Rock, Steel, Ice or Dark type. And I'm pretty sure it'd be safe to rule out Normal as Chespin's secondary type. So... That's all in the air for Chespin's typing.

Fennekin's eyes look completely psychic-type to me, and was shown in gameplay demos to learn Psybeam, so I'm hoping and feel fairly confident that that's what will follow through. This follows my "balance" theory, because a Fire/Psychic type would be able to take out a Water/Fighting type like Froakie. So I'm pretty satisfied with my current thoughts for Fennekin and Froakie.

As other posts have stated, Chespin's name breaks down into "chestnut" and "porcupine". So, like a lot of you, I'm picturing some kind of porcupine-like final stage. Chespin's second type would have to be strong against Psychic or Fire, and weak against Water or Fighting. Chespin is really the only starter in the air for me. I'm really hoping for Grass/Dark because I want something different, but I'm doubting it. Chespin was also shown to know Rollout in demos, so I'm feeling like Grass/Rock is going to be it. And that'd complete the "balance" theory I have.

Circling back to my opening paragraph: Water/Fighting balances Grass/Rock. Grass/Rock balances Fire/Psychic. Fire/Psychic balances Water/Fighting. A big fat happy double-circle.

We know the first gym in XY uses Bug types, so tossing Chespin a type advantage is GameFreak's typical way of being nice, just like giving Charmander Metal Claw in FireRed/LeafGreen.

Let me know your thoughts.

While I can understand why people want balanced typings, that doesn't mean that Gamefreak is going to do this, especially when their's precedence that they don't do that in regard to second typings (Gen 3 and 4 are good examples). I would prefer a typing that fits the theme of the pokemon, instead of forcing a typing for "balance."

 

[robfan09]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

While I can understand why people want balanced typings, that doesn't mean that Gamefreak is going to do this, especially when their's precedence that they don't do that in regard to second typings (Gen 3 and 4 are good examples). I would prefer a typing that fits the theme of the pokemon, instead of forcing a typing for "balance."

Gen 4 did.
Grass/Ground, Fire/Fighting, Water/Steel..?

 

[Mermaid]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

While I can understand why people want balanced typings, that doesn't mean that Gamefreak is going to do this, especially when their's precedence that they don't do that in regard to second typings (Gen 3 and 4 are good examples). I would prefer a typing that fits the theme of the pokemon, instead of forcing a typing for "balance."

Gen 4 did.
Grass/Ground, Fire/Fighting, Water/Steel..?

What I mean is that people want gen 6 starters to have secondary typings to make a similar triangle to the Grass-Water-Fire. The secondary typings of previous gen starters didn't do this. They didn't following a pattern.

 

[robfan09]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

What I mean is that people want gen 6 starters to have secondary typings to make a similar triangle to the Grass-Water-Fire. The secondary typings of previous gen starters didn't do this. They didn't following a pattern.

Oh. Bahahaha, that'd be pointless.

 

[Zweilous]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Well as you said Zeb, ninjas in the modern eye have changed greatly in how they're portrayed. Nowadays you have more heroic ninjas like the TMNT who fight for the good of the people and despite their more dirty tactics they're still good characters underneath that. So with that in mind, it depends on how they want to portray Froakie, as the original, more darker ninja or the modern heroic one so it can go either way.P

That was Enzap that said that. But I agree that both Fighting and Dark would fit; my point was that saying Dark wouldn't fit a ninja is wrong. A kendo-based evolution for Chespin makes me think of Fighting (or Steel) waaaay more than a Dark-type, which, given the leaks, then left Water/Dark for Froakie that also fits a ninja. So it all pieced together. I'm just a bit blind to understanding a Grass/Dark kendo theme when Fighting works better (but yeah, Water/Fight fits a ninja fine too). Maybe I'm thinking along the lines of things being too obvious (then again we look to be getting another supernatural fox), and a Grass/Dark kendo theme can be done well.

I apologize for mixing you up like that, same with not getting what your point was.

I do agree, I also think Kendo fits better as a Grass/Fighting then a Grass/Dark, but yeah, maybe they have something up their sleeves that will surprise us once we see Chespin's evolved form in action. So it'll be fun to see what they bring to the table with it.

 

[UnovaCastaway]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Reading the past few posts, I was just reminded of the Arthurian legend of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. Gawain of the Round Table had to uphold chivalry while dealing with the Green Knight, who was a much shadier figure.

So a Dark-type green fighter could work if based on that.

 

[Rainbow]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I want Water/Dark and Grass/Fighting solely so that Chespin doesn't become part Dark

 

[Team Gaara]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Why are we thinking Chespin is a Kendo practitioner again? Just curious. I see Froakie's clearly a ninja, but what about Chespin is leading us to Kendo?

I also feel like I'm the only one who wants Grass/Dark and Water/Fighting. -3-

 

[Neptune's Disciple]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Why are we thinking Chespin is a Kendo practitioner again? Just curious. I see Froakie's clearly a ninja, but what about Chespin is leading us to Kendo?

I also feel like I'm the only one who wants Grass/Dark and Water/Fighting. -3-

Because of it's evolution's potential name in that list of leaked Japanese names that came out a while ago. It will be somewhere in this thread and in the rumour thread. By memory, it related to 'Urchin' (meaning hedgehog) and Kendo

I would absolutely love Grass/Dark and Water/Fighting. Particularly the latter as I'll be choosing Froakie.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Why are we thinking Chespin is a Kendo practitioner again? Just curious. I see Froakie's clearly a ninja, but what about Chespin is leading us to Kendo?

I also feel like I'm the only one who wants Grass/Dark and Water/Fighting. -3-

The Kendo practitioner speculation comes from Chespin's supposed evolution name, Haribōgu. Bōgu means "kendo equipment".

Bōgu - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't mind the types also.

 

[Stratelier]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Swampert has a 4x weakness against Sceptile and nobody really complains about that. Empoleon is also 4x weak against Torterra.

Empoleon doesn't have any 4x weaknesses. Even if you meant Empoleon is weak to both of Torterra's types that is not true either (Steel typing removes the weakness to Grass). Empoleon's weak points are Electric, Ground, and Fighting.

There is no indication of Dark in Chespin's design either.

No indication of Fighting-type in Torchic or Tepig's designs either, or Flying in Charmander.

...and Acrobatics is a move that allows a Pokemon in Triple Battles to even hit Pokemon the furthest away.

True, but that's hardly unique to Acrobatics -- all Flying-type attacks can strike non-adjacent opponents in Triple Battles.

 

[Garren]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I had an idea that Chespin's evolution could have it gain more and more kendo-like chestnut armor, to the point where you can barely see its actual body bar like its eyes peeking out withing a helmet...that'd certainly give off a dark vibe, a creature that's shut itself from the rest of the world and only thinks of fighting.

 

[TFerro]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

I had an idea that Chespin's evolution could have it gain more and more kendo-like chestnut armor, to the point where you can barely see its actual body bar like its eyes peeking out withing a helmet...that'd certainly give off a dark vibe, a creature that's shut itself from the rest of the world and only thinks of fighting.

Aw, that's so depressing for such a cheery little fella like Chespin.

I'm still hoping Grass/Dark rumors just aren't true. It's honestly a terrible typing. Currently it has 6 weaknesses, one being 4x to bug. And seeing as grass has a neutral relationship to Fairy, there's still a chance Fairy is going to add another weakness to the type by being SE against Dark.

Pokemon abilities/stats/move pools can make even poor types shine, but most starters just don't turn into very good pokemon.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

You know, I was thinking about how people were comparing Chespin to Oshawott, saying that the Grass-type starter is a "clone" of the Water-type one and well, the comparisons sort of make sense, they do have similar body shapes. Now, if Chespin really evolves into a Kendo practitioner, it will most likely have a sword and armor, right? Kinda like, you know... Samurott. Since they managed to make an amazingly designed Pokémon based on a samurai, without making it too "human-like", I have high hopes in regards of how Chespin's second evolution will look like. They can make it look like a Kendo practitioner and still look like an "animal", like Samurott does. I can't wait to see it and I am really hoping the "boogu" in "Haruboogu" means Kendo equipment and not something else.

 

[SirOni]

Re: Starter Discussion and Speculation

Although I'm really not for the typing a Grass/Dark Chespin evo could make sense with the current speculation about its design. As mentioned before there is a precedent of "dark knights" who have thrown away they vows and morals for power and prestige. As for the kendo/samurai part there are tales of samurai, usually ronin, who have lost there way for some reason or other. A sword-slinging Grass/Dark Chespin evo would naturally know Night Slash which would actually be very fitting considering the origin of that move. (Looking into this reminded me that samurai are basically Japanese knights which explains many things about these two classes and the Chespin speculation.)