Are There Any Pieces of Instrumental Dub Music You Actually Liked in the PokeAni International Dub (4Kids or TPCI)- NOT COUNTING INTROS OR ENDINGS!

[AgedVeteranofShow]

Just curious?

I prefer the original Japanese OST and OPs for pretty much every saga, sure-- but I actually liked this track from the 4Kids dub the most of all the dub instrumental cues the International dub ever used (it was used from EP001 all the way into AG136 in the old original Intl. dub: super repetitive, but also still really pleasant on the ears IMO). Someone remastered it on YouTube:

(Unofficial Remake) Pokémon Series Soundtrack - Spearow's Attack

I found this cue from Pokémon S01E01 "Pokémon! I Choose You!" that doesnt seem to appear on any official soundtrack. So I remade it to the best of my abillit...

www.youtube.com

The other piece I think was surprisingly good for a piece of dub music is Bruno's theme in the Puzzle League, was called "Under Water" and produced by Manny Corallo IIRC from what I saw back in the day.

I know TAJ/PUSA's dub of Seasons 9-10 (BF/DP Season 1) still kept some of the 4Kids' dub cues from the first 8 Seasons (such as the PokeDex theme, and IIRC it was either every other numbered ep then had 4Kids stock music at times, then TAJ had their own the other portion in the reverse cycling of those 104 or so episodes). It was also used in Ash vs May in S9 and Ash vs Roark in S10, but actually I liked some of the dub cues generally from Seasons 1-10 most in the English Version 4Kids & TAJ composed i.e. from 1998 to 2008.

I didn't really like most of DuArt's dub music cues from Seasons 11-19, nothing stood out and it all to me just felt like baroquey synth under Loeffler save one: I think Paul's theme was the only piece I thought was decent, the guitar riff. The less said about Goldfarb's stuff, the better, my least favorite cue that said is the "Batman" dub cue in SM in the dub's run.

 

[Arceusgjengen]

Yeah. Pretty much all I have heard so far.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

Yeah. Pretty much all I have heard so far.

Interesting. Can't say I'm a fan of most of Goldfarb's stuff at all, but glad to know someone liked it.

 

[RetroPokeFan]

Paul's theme from the dub is one that kinda sticks in my mind sometimes.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

Paul's theme from the dub is one that kinda sticks in my mind sometimes.

It's a pretty good guitar riff, I have to admit:

Pokémon D/P Recreation - Paul Battle (HQ)

Hi!This music has been created by Myself in it's entirety using Fl Studio Software.This theme took me considerable time to create. I hope you enjoy it. Happy...

www.youtube.com

Loeffler said he liked his newest stuff most, supposedly, I prefer his older but this was easily the best piece he came up with in later years IMO.

 

[Arceusgjengen]

I gotta say, I really, really like the instrumentals during Sun and Moon.

 

[Die-Hard Dragon Devotee]

Literally just found this on Youtube, but this one was always special .


(Sorry if the quality's kinda poor, but then again I'm lucky I was even able to find this at all.)

 

[Nicolas721]

• Tears of Life from Movie 1, fits the asthethic perfectly, as well as Dragonite's flight. The whole soundtrack as well as Pikachu's Vacation's counts.
• The legend comes to life from Movie 2. Sounds very epic and doesn't have as much mickey-mousing.
• The theme that plays when Misty comes back in AG.
• The background music in the Hoopa movie was surprisingly decent and fitted the atmosphere.
• The "Caribbean remix" of Under the Alolan Sun, it's very relaxing.
• The Paul theme is always a mandatory mention, like others I was surprised it was dub music.

 

[Ricbolog]

Yes. The first seasons I watched were from DP, so I have a soft spot for some of the TAJ produced music that was used through the series, like this track or even this sadder one. Meanwhile, I don't find the BW dub music much memorable and the XY one was boring to me at times, even though I kinda liked Ed Goldfarb's Team Rocket theme. I also appreciate some of the SM dub score, this track in particular. I'm generally neutral on the 4kids score for TV episodes (having in mind, for example, a clip like this).

 

[Poke Trey]

Just about any Goldfarb's JN music is this for me. His action music is way better in this series compared to his previous outings, his emotional/dramatic music still hits like in XY and SM, not as much as Mickey mousing, he let's his tracks play out more even during the comedic scenes and generally his score feels more structured this time I noticed. If JN is his last series honestly, going out with some of his best music yet.

 

[Gabo2oo]

The post-credits scene in the XYZ finale has a short snippet using two leitmotifs, one being Goldfarb's usual "To Be Continued" theme and other I don't really know what's supposed to be. But I really like those two and the way he incorporated them for the final scene.

 

[Die-Hard Dragon Devotee]

• Tears of Life from Movie 1, fits the asthethic perfectly, as well as Dragonite's flight. The whole soundtrack as well as Pikachu's Vacation's counts.
• The legend comes to life from Movie 2. Sounds very epic and doesn't have as much mickey-mousing.

I was literally going to put Dragonite's flight! I hesitated becuase I wasn't sure the ost from the movies would count. All of the ost from the 2nd movie is excellent, not to mention the ost from the 3rd movie too. Like this for example:

 

[Flynn]

I like the 4Kids tracks that are used in Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64. Also the 4Kids stuff TAJ used in seasons 9 and 10 are pretty good.

 

[Insanish Danish]

Honestly I really liked 4Kids' music in general...opening themes and BGM and all. I still prefer the original Japanese soundtrack because there's really no competition, but if they were going to replace the music I'd take 4Kids' music over season 9 and onward any day.

 

[Die-Hard Dragon Devotee]

I like the 4Kids tracks that are used in Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64. Also the 4Kids stuff TAJ used in seasons 9 and 10 are pretty good.

I remember the exact track they used for the scene your avatar is from, when Croagunk blushed after Cynthia smiled at him from Top-Down Training. It was this, Mew's theme from the first movie:

 

[InfiniteBakuphoon]

The very fact that the title of this thread says “no openings or endings!” shows exactly why this topic is so interesting, haha. After all, I think that a lot of us in here can agree that regardless of our feelings about the dub BGM, said openings and endings are at least on a very different level from that, if not straight-out legitimately kickass on their own merits. Indeed, I actually believe that the first English OP — the so-called “Pokémon Theme” — is better as a song overall than “Aim to be a Pokémon Master” (itself an outstanding OP, but I digress; back on topic!)

Now, I’m not exactly enamored with any of the dub BGM from the actual TV show, which I find rather bland and uninteresting like most of 4Kids’ BGM across almost all of their dubs. And although there’s clearly a vocal circle in the fandom that greatly dislikes Ed Goldfarb’s work for the dub (and a smaller circle perhaps less constructively so, I’ll call it, but again I digress), I haven’t listened to a lot of his work given that almost everything that I’ve watched post-Unova is original Japanese version only, so I simply don’t have much of an opinion on that. The only exception is dub-version I Choose You!, whose dub BGM I disliked overall — with quite flat and generic compositions in my opinion — compared the better parts of Miyazaki’s BGM (which itself I remember being rather indistinct — and probably with a lot of recycled stuff as well, I don’t remember — save for a handful of really outstanding tracks near the end).

That said, I do have an appreciation for some of the dub BGM from the first three movies. As far as Mewtwo Strikes Back goes, “Tears of Life” is frequently mentioned as a fan-favorite track, and for good reason. I actually think that it’s superior to its Miyazaki equivalent (“Miracle Tears”) in isolation given how the latter, well, kind of lacks energy and momentum in its arrangement to the point where it lets down the composition somewhat, which otherwise gets the job done for the scene that it plays in. “Flat” is the word I’d use; like it’s building up to something that never actually “hits”, if you know what I mean. Whereas “Tears of Life”, somehow, manages to be an emotional gut-punch from start to finish (or at least until the song truly starts around the two-minute mark), taking every single opportunity that the composition gives it and running with it. And just when you think it might start to disappoint — as it sometimes does on the dub BGM’s other tracks — it never does. It also helps that it has some of the highest production quality of all of the dub BGM, with many parts apparently being played with real instruments or at least something very close to it (which helps a lot with invoking genuine emotion out of the listener compared to the more synth-heavy version that we could’ve gotten). However, I do believe that Miyazaki’s track is equivalent to it in the context of the movie itself — if only barely; a high compliment to “Tears of Life” — and that the remade version in EVOLUTION does manage to surpass it, as it provides exactly that kind of energy and momentum that I was so longing for with the original (although your opinion on whether the opening medley drags it down will depend on your opinion on the tracks used, and perhaps more importantly on how many times you’ve listened to them; they appeared a lot in the TV show already at that point). Even so, “Tears of Life” has nothing to be ashamed of; on the contrary! While I highly doubt that it “made the original creators cry” as the dub producers so dubiously claimed among other highly questionable things, it probably represents the peak of the dub’s overall creative powers (outside of, again, opening and ending themes, haha) in what’s otherwise arguably the nadir of it, and it’s completely worthy of its reputation in my opinion.

The rest of the dub BGM doesn’t quite reach those heights, but there are some highlights for me, or at least some tracks that I can respect. “Dragonite Takes Flight”, for instance, is easily the equal of its Miyazaki counterpart (“FLYING Dragonite”), although in that case it’s probably because the latter was already a “just OK” track for me to begin with. “Mew’s Theme” is also a nice theme that’s cute and has its moments, although I find it rather unambitious compared to Miyazaki’s version of the same, which has always felt almost emblematic of the movie as a whole in a way that the dub version doesn’t really manage to do. And then, there’s a genuine favorite of mine in the form of “Three on Three”, a rather melancholy piece that takes a darker, almost militaristic turn later on, almost as if it’s attempting to convey Mewtwo’s emotional journey in music form (which it arguably does better than the dubbed movie itself). I’d say that it’s the best track on the dub BGM besides “Tears of Life”, which is saying something. While there are parts of the song that are… messier compared to the others, I’ll just say, the best parts of it show sparks of true greatness, one that it comes dangerously close to achieving on the whole. As it is, it’s still a highly effective piece that I unironically enjoy along with — to a lesser extent — the rest of the dub BGM.

As far as The Power of One goes, I’d call it a wash between dub and original BGM. Miyazaki’s score is excellent — if sadly highly under-appreciated in official form outside of a rather pathetic number of tracks provided on the OST — and the best tracks there probably surpasses the best tracks of the dub BGM (with the track that plays during a certain famous scene involving Ash and Misty — if you’ve seen the movie, you know what I’m talking about — being especially lovely and affecting while also, again, being criminally under-appreciated). But the dub BGM deserves credit for bringing a kind of… energy to the proceedings that’s sometimes missing in Miyazaki’s BGM; not that it’s lethargic or ineffective, but playing both one after the other shows a very stark difference. And given that the dub BGM actually isn’t completely embarrassed by Miyazaki here, it shows that its more on-the-nose, very American “action” approach does has merit. Not that it necessarily succeeds all of the time, mind, especially because I feel that the overall production quality isn’t as good as it was in Mewtwo Strikes Back, let alone “Tears of Life”, with lots of obviously synth instruments where real ones would’ve been far more effective. Indeed, that’s kind of the story of the whole dub BGM for me: actually pretty good, but imagine if Miyazaki’s orchestra was playing it instead! Alas.

That said, with the movie’s big song — Lugia’s song, that is — the dub version can once again have a fair fight with its Miyazaki equivalent (“The Heartbeat of the Planet”, or “The Planet’s Pulse” if you like alliteration; such epic-sounding translations nonetheless!). I have to say, though, the dub version, how should I say this… goes places that I honestly was not expecting it to go, especially with the flute- and string-heavy first two minutes that I’d unironically say consists of the single greatest piece of composition that the dub crew has ever composed for a Pokémon project. It’s so good that it’s arguably deserves a better film, really, and as good as Miyazaki’s version of this theme is, I genuinely believe that the best parts of the dub version blow the latter out of the water. Again, those first two minutes just… go places; I can’t describe it other than that it’s the kind of feeling that you get when you listen to truly great music: the kind that stirs something deep in your spirit. Obviously someone had a serious lightning-in-a-bottle burst of inspiration while they were composing those first two minutes, as nothing before or since — save perhaps “Tears of Life” at the peak of its emotional powers — from the dub crew has ever come close. “Epic” is as succinct as I can put it, in the truest and most genuine sense of the word.

Unfortunately, the song doesn’t keep up that glory for its remainder, which is frustrating because it gets so damn close. While one could argue about the composition quality of the latter half of the track — which might lean more towards the messiness and lack of focus that sometimes plagued portions of Mewtwo Strike Back’s dub BGM — I think that the real thing that holds the song as a whole back from true greatness is… that freakin’ synth! A bad arrangement can ruin even the greatest of songs, and the critical, very prominent horn sections that feature throughout the latter half of this song are not only most definitely synth of the cheapest- and cheesiest-sounding variety, they are also quite loud, not in a literal sense but rather in that they completely dominate the song, removing any chance of things being redeemed by some superior part of the arrangement. They let the composition down, and ultimately make for a lesser song when it’s all taken as a whole. Now, however I might feel about the varying effectiveness of some of Miyazaki’s tracks, one of the best things you can say about his work is that it always maintains a certain high level of production quality no matter what, such that even the most mediocre tracks are at least listenable while the best tracks are always absolutely outstanding. It, again, shows the importance of a good arrangement in music, and the poor choice of instrumentation here betrays its dub origins and specifically the obviously lower amount of importance that 4Kids — that is, its higher ups, not necessarily the composers themselves — places on quality orchestrated music, which is a shame.

That said, even the song in this state isn’t absolutely terrible; it’s just disappointing and a bit of a rough ride compared to those glorious first two minutes. And the really good news? It does stick the landing in the end with a reprise of that lovely flute composition that was heard in the beginning of the song and indeed throughout the entire movie, concluding things with one of the best parts about it. Oh, and the other really good news, kind of, is that a truly fully orchestrated version of it would be absolutely outstanding; I’d kill for someone to do it one day. At least we have a plentiful amount of lovely fan remixes from people who were obviously stirred at least as much by this song as I was (even if many of them erroneously attribute the composition to Miyazaki rather than the dub crew, which, annoying and disappointing as it is to see, is actually quite a high compliment to the latter, haha!).

Finally, I don’t have much of an opinion about Spell of the Unown’s dub BGM, probably because of a combination of it never having an official soundtrack release (only a fan leak relatively recently, which I have yet to seriously listen to) and it genuinely sticking out less to me that either of its two predecessors. The only criticism I could seriously give it is that it still seems to rely heavily on synth, which remains disappointing on the tracks that really scream for real instruments instead. That said, I’d give one particular track (“I Want Things Real Again”) credit for staring off as a lovely little piano piece that transitions into a more sweeping and equally-as-good string-heavy piece, with both parts succeeding greatly at bringing out plenty of appropriate emotions during a certain critical scene. The music that plays after another certain critical set of scenes is also highly effective for what happens there, easily equaling Miyazaki’s work in the same set of scenes to my great surprise and pleasure.

 

[MimeyTheKeeper]

That said, with the movie’s big song — Lugia’s song, that is — the dub version can once again have a fair fight with its Miyazaki equivalent (“The Heartbeat of the Planet”, or “The Planet’s Pulse” if you like alliteration; such epic-sounding translations nonetheless!). I have to say, though, the dub version, how should I say this… goes places that I honestly was not expecting it to go, especially with the flute- and string-heavy first two minutes that I’d unironically say consists of the single greatest piece of composition that the dub crew has ever composed for a Pokémon project. It’s so good that it’s arguably deserves a better film, really, and as good as Miyazaki’s version of this theme is, I genuinely believe that the best parts of the dub version blow the latter out of the water. Again, those first two minutes just… go places; I can’t describe it other than that it’s the kind of feeling that you get when you listen to truly great music: the kind that stirs something deep in your spirit. Obviously someone had a serious lightning-in-a-bottle burst of inspiration while they were composing those first two minutes, as nothing before or since — save perhaps “Tears of Life” at the peak of its emotional powers — from the dub crew has ever come close. “Epic” is as succinct as I can put it, in the truest and most genuine sense of the word.

Perfectly put. I would probably call it more "art" than "epic", but we share the sentiment. It is the only piece of music that transcends Pokémon and Anime in western world I would say. I am great OST fan in general and Lugia's Song takes its place alongside the greatest pieces of film music ever composed in last 30 years and even relative strangers (like at workplace) listening to my instrumental playlists quite often single it out.

That is alongside such pieces as Ezio's Family by Jesper Kyd from Assassins's Creed II, Halo from Halo CE by Martin O'Donnell & Michael Salvatori or The Dike by Pawel Blaszczak & Adam Skorupa from first Witcher game in gaming world, and movie pieces like Lasiurus by Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard from Batman begins, Ibelin by Harry-Gregson-Williams, Concerning Hobbits by Howard Shore from Fellowship of the Ring, Spectres in The Fog by Hans Zimmer from The Last Samurai, For the Love of a Princess by James Horner from Braveheart, Auto Rock by Mogwai from Miami Vice or The Kingsroad by Ramin Djawadi from GoT, to name just a few that come to mind from the top of my head.

That is - the beefed up cover versions which concentrate on the first iconic flute half as you also distinguished. The rest is rather unimpressive. But the first half continues to inspire many - just looking at all those covers. Probably my favourite is this one (available also on Spotify or iTunes if you wish):



Actually, it quite reminds me of similar piece of flute music from Star Trek - Suite from episode Inner Light, which also transcended to something entirely different. But to be fair, this had inspirational and philosophical, albeit also quite boring, episode narrative to back it up. But the inspiring tune, which the covering video-piece is almost unworthy of, is IMHO similar:

 

[P_S_B]

The music where Ash is running away from the Spearow in episode 1. I also like the instrumental version of You Can Do It If You Really Try that they used a few times in Johto, notably when Bulbasaur almost got crushed by the boulder.

 

[ShaneM]

I'm not sure what to say that hasn't been said yet, So I'll sum it down to this.
Whenever the dub composers used real instruments as opposed to just synthesizers, they made some amazing tracks. The dub score from Movies 1-3, Paul's Battle Theme, both great examples of this. When it comes to a favorite, one of my personal favorites is the one that plays in the first episode over the ending scene where Ash and Pikachu walk into the city. While I do prefer Meeting and Parting in this context, both are very fitting regardless. It's sad that so many of Miyazaki's Hoenn tracks were omitted in favor of dub music, regardless of what it was replaced with. Some examples I can think of are Petalburg City, which was never kept at all in the dub, along with Advance Adventure ~The Travels Continue~ from movie 6. Lilycove City is another example- although it was kept later on in Sinnoh.
TL;DR: It's good when they use real instruments, but still sad when they replace tracks so often they never get heard in the dub.

 

[Die-Hard Dragon Devotee]

This track was used a lot, especially when a Pokemon evolved or something else big happened, but it was never bad. A little repetitive maybe, but not bad.