Finalization discussion~

[paperfairy]

Perhaps we can allow them in our league? BTW, Shadow Tag doesn't work on other Wobbuffet in Gen Four. But perhaps that's another topic all together....

 

[Zeta]

All I've ever needed to beat a Wobuffet is a decent annoyer. Toxic, Confusion, Leech Seed, Spore, any annoyance move pretty much destroys a Wobuffet.

 

[Surgo]

All I've ever needed to beat a Wobuffet is a decent annoyer. Toxic, Confusion, Leech Seed, Spore, any annoyance move pretty much destroys a Wobuffet.

You've clearly never fought someone who actually knows how to use Wobbuffet. Any intelligent user of Wobbuffet should be absolutely slavering at the use of annoyer moves.

For the uninitiated, here is how it works:
1) Wobbuffet is switched in.
2) Wobbuffet encores the next move its opponent makes.
3a) If the move was an attacking move, it counters or mirror coats it back for the KO.
3b) If the move was not an attacking move, it switches to something else (immune or immune enough if necessary) capable of setting up. This pokemon has now received a free set-up turn as you are forced to switch to remove the encore. If you stay in, it can just set up more. Good luck stopping a Tyranitar or Salamence with more than one Dragon Dance, or if it's late game, even one.

This thing was put in the uber tier in advance for a reason, and it wasn't because Wobbuffet vs. Wobbuffet with no tickle-users was a draw.

 

[paperfairy]

Then perhaps we should stick with leaving it in the uber metagame.

Anyways, back to the League. Surgo, what did you think of the last post on the first page? A compromise to keep moves secret, yet still have some of that "Oh, I can plan before the match" essence

 

[Zeta]

On another note, what was the decision on limiting one Demiuber per team to keep people from entering tournaments with a team of Dragonite, Slaking, Aggron, Tyranitar, Metagross, and Salamence? I personally think that would be just as cheap as using a Mewtwo, but I don't want those Pokemon banned completely - just stopped from stacking the deck, so to speak.

 

[paperfairy]

You're the only person to have brought it up. I don't think it's nessecery at all, (nor does an entire community of competitive battlers) but I'll have Surgo back me up. ^_^

 

[Argy]

Allowing players to choose a certain number of Pokémon from each (non-uber) tier might work... I have to agree with Zeta; I hate seeing the same demi-ubers over and over again with little variation in team. Playing against people with those types of Pokémon really turns me off because it's often difficult to win (or even stay alive) if you don't use those types in return.

 

[paperfairy]

1. Aggron sucks, so does Slaking. Let's just get that out there.

2. So? You do what you have to in order to win. If there is a threat and you fail to stand up to the challenge, then you should not have to limit other players because you can't handle an easy threat.

Salamence - Anything with Ice at the beginning; hell, even a Powder Snow will take this thing down. Also, hi there Claydol.

Dragonite - Hasn't seen competive play since RBY, hun. It's just too difficult to use IMO. Next~

Slaking - Protect and Substitute, two very common moves in today's metagame own Slaking. Also TRUANT seems like a big problem for it.

Aggron - Yes, Aggron is deadly. In the UU metagame. Wake up people. >_>

Tyranitar - Deadly yes, but Swampert, Zapdos, Heracross, Metagross, and friends all seem to deal with Tyranitar just fine.

Metagross - Donphan destroys it, and most of the Water types in the OU metagame deal with it.

 

[Argy]

You just demonstrated what I said in my last post. If you want to beat some of those Pokémon, you have to use certain ones (Zapdos, Swampert, those other ones you listed, etc.) or else you're likely doomed. Then everyone ends up using the same group of 20 or so Pokémon, and that's boring.

 

[Surgo]

I'm assuming by demiuber, you mean pokemon usable in standard with a 600 or higher base stat total?

The following pokemon have a base stat total of 600 or higher and are usable in standard:
* Dragonite
* Tyranitar
* Salamence
* Metagross
* Slaking
(Note, Aggron is not in this list. It has a base stat total of 530.)

A team made up of all these and one other pokemon would probably not be very good. Swampert is easily capable of stopping all of these save Slaking, who takes both prediction to use and prediction to swap. So, if you're looking for something capable of taking on all the demi-ubers, I suggest Swampert. In addition, Skarmory will stop them all but Dragonite, etc...I could go on.

I disagree with any demiuber limits, seeing as how they are almost as easily walled as any other pokemon in the standard metagame.

Then everyone ends up using the same group of 20 or so Pokémon, and that's boring.

Everyone will end up using the same 20 pokemon anyway, the only thing will change if a ban is enacted is the pokemon that are used.

 

[paperfairy]

Argy; those aren't the ONLY Pokémon that can take them out. I just named a few to point out that demiubers do not need to fight other demis to create a fair fight.

 

[Surgo]

Anyways, back to the League. Surgo, what did you think of the last post on the first page? A compromise to keep moves secret, yet still have some of that "Oh, I can plan before the match" essence

At the very least, remove nature (gee, I wonder what kind of Tyranitar he's using...). But also...

I really hate this pokemon registration idea. The whole reason for putting it together in the first place was to make battling a little more 'anime style' but in-game battling is nothing like anime-styling. I really wish my Articuno could use Steel Wing and touch some rafters to keep itself from being electrocuted by that Electivire but alas I cannot do that ingame.

If people insist on knowing at least the pokemon used beforehand, I'd be much happier without any sort of 'registration' and instead they just tell each other beforehand. That way I can change teams to my heart's content. At the very least, let people change their registered pokemon up to a certain number of days before the match.

 

[paperfairy]

Anime style? I want to do this because I like being fully prepared before a match, as does Pie, and a few other people.

Who else is strongly against this? I'm less interesting in doing it now, now that I realize that I'll be changing a lot too.....

 

[Geoffrey]

Well, I'm heavily against revealing Pokemon movesets for the reasons I stated previously. As for the Pokemon teams, I'm not sure. If it is revealed, it could ruin your strategy or your opponent's, but if it's not revealed, you have no clue what you'll be up against. And as for registering, I think it's completely unnecessary.

 

[Surgo]

I'm actually fine with it if I can change my registered pokemon whenever I want up to a certain point before a match.

 

[paperfairy]

So you agree with Surgo, that teams should be revealed before a match, but not registered somewhere?

I just had an idea, but I don't have have time to type it up.... gimme a sec.

EDIT: What if Pokémon were recorded AFTER the battle? Two people battle, and when the win is being recorded, both players record the Pokémon they used. That way, in the future, I can look back and go: Oh, Surgo tends to use that Tyranitar a lot. I should counter it!

 

[Geoffrey]

EDIT: What if Pokémon were recorded AFTER the battle? Two people battle, and when the win is being recorded, both players record the Pokémon they used. That way, in the future, I can look back and go: Oh, Surgo tends to use that Tyranitar a lot. I should counter it!

That sounds like a good idea.

 

[paperfairy]

Seems reasonable to me; everyone gets what they want. I can see what I'm up against, and you can still have the element of surprise.

 

[Surgo]

As long as movesets aren't revealed I'm fine with it.

 

[paperfairy]

Species Name(Gender)** Nickname
Nature (+Stat, -Stat)
Visual Variation? (i.e. shiny, Unown letter, Deoxys form, east/west Shellos)