Pokemon and Animal Cruelty

[Kholdstare]

Hmm...

Interesting, although I don't think that Satoshi Tajiri or anyone else really thought that anyone would think this hard about it. I mean, when you look at it, Pokemon has all sorts of aspects that can't be reasonably explained by real life standards. When looked at from a distance (at least), there are many things in Pokemon that do not add up, or simply seem immoral if they were present in real life. But I've never really considered Pokemon to be animals, nor humans. They're just Pocket Monsters, and I think that there could be many things that will be officially explained in the future.

Anyway, like you guys said, usually Pokemon seem to have a rather sporting attitude towards battling, and are not permanently harmed by it, so long as the trainer doesn't push them too far, so I don't consider it extremely similar to cock fighting and the like. And like Emeray said, they're not slaves. They can easily escape their trainers if they don't like how they're treating them.

 

[Roses Ablaze]

Anyone besides me think that this idea would have never been developed in the United States due to differences between our views on animal rights and definition of dignity? I'm no expert on Japan, but I have heard that the ideal in Japan is one who conforms to society, one who is obedient and humble. Exactly the opposite of America, which values individualism and freedom.

 

[Kholdstare]

They enjoy it, and it's like people having playfights with each other, or in the case of gyms and the elite 4, boxing.
I have no tolerance of people telling me it's cruel and hurts them lots; if it was, would Ash let his Pikachu EVER go into battle? Nopes. (I can't think of a game parallel for that last example >_>)

Right, these are not animals, and I don't think they feel as much pain from Pokémon moves as they do from some sort of "real" equivalent (Such as being hit by lightning as opposed to being hit by a Pikachu's Thunder).

 

[PikaCheeks]

Aw Comeon. Pokemon battles are more like Football (U.S.A) games than cock fights. Besides, What about Ash's Lapras? Because it served him in battle it was deemed stronng enough to take the leadership of its School (Pod? Lump?
What do you call a whole bunch of Lapras, anyways?)

 

[Another Fan]

Well, taking little into account of the other individual posts, I'm gonna post my own opinion.

Those intelligent enough can choose, for those that aren't intelligent enough it is as cruel as anything we do to unintelligent animals.

 

[Roses Ablaze]

Those intelligent enough can choose

Can they really though? That swimming rhyhorn certainly didn't choose to be captured and I'm sure it's not alone. And although pokemon may be stronger physically than humans, humans control what and when they eat and how long and when they're confined to a pokeball. If a pokemon disobeys, the trainer just recalls it.

 

[Another Fan]

I have no idea what swimming rhydon you are referring to. Like, at all.

I never saw pokeballs as something that pokemon can not escape from. Except master balls of course. I see pokeballs as being something that they enjoying being in however, so that the capture part being simply, accepting the inside of the pokeball.

Plus, if we account for that trainers decide to be kind to pokemon, the ones that are normal trainers would allow their pokemon to leave if they are not happy. If there are trainers that continually make the intelligent pokemon do something against their will, then yes, it would be animal cruelty.

I just don't see that happening that much.

 

[Roses Ablaze]

Did Ash release Charizard upon seeing that it didn't want to be his pokemon?

 

[The Outrage]

I have no idea what swimming rhydon you are referring to. Like, at all.

It's a Pokemon episode.

And for those inteligent enough can choose thing....

I doubt that any of your GSC rival's Pokemon intially wanted to be with him, especially that Sneasel he stole. Out of all th epokemon enslaved by Team rocket, I am pretty sure a good number of them are intelligent but are still unable to escape. In the fourth movie, the hunter had caught a Tyranitar in a cage. Despite the fact that Tyranitar could basically walk out any time, it didn't. Even if they are intelligent enough, fear may stop them from acting.

 

[Another Fan]

Huh, I always thought that charizard was just lazy. But either way, Ash didn't do the right thing. It is the anime, anyway.

Well, I see that most pokemon are caught at limited intelligence states, in which they are highly like, um... what's it called, hmmm... dunno. Anyway, quick to accept things. So, even Team Rocket's pokemon would be quite fine with the way they have it. Probably because if they don't question anything, and just play along, they get enough stuff to be happy.

I just don't see what pokemon have to fear really. I am no way suggesting that they can actually attack or anything, no no, Pokemon Control would be there and have them taken away.

The idea to me is that, intelligent pokemon can choose to leave, unless they are put under animal cruelty. Yes, if you have a kadabra who always goes out of the ball in order to escape and you kick it in the face and break his legs every time, so that it fears escaping, yes, that would be cruelty. But I doubt people do that. At least those who are good pokemon trainers, and those who do that, are looked down upon, and are considered criminals.

 

[ルカリオ]

Again with the worldwide dogfighting scandal that seems to be going on:
- Poochyena, I choose you!
- Go, Growlithe!

We do know the difference between video games/anime and reality, don't we?

 

[ImJessieTR]

It's a Pokemon episode.

And for those inteligent enough can choose thing....

I doubt that any of your GSC rival's Pokemon intially wanted to be with him, especially that Sneasel he stole. Out of all th epokemon enslaved by Team rocket, I am pretty sure a good number of them are intelligent but are still unable to escape. In the fourth movie, the hunter had caught a Tyranitar in a cage. Despite the fact that Tyranitar could basically walk out any time, it didn't. Even if they are intelligent enough, fear may stop them from acting.

But that is a good point ... the abusive people are blatant villains. In no way, shape, or form do the heroes ever abuse their pokemon. Even that unofficial jerk with the sandshrew (you guys know the one "You'll be my 100th win" or something like that) was strict but never abusive because he was a good guy. Villains are very clear-cut on Pokemon (J&J&M notwithstanding): they were distinctive uniforms, they're more heavily shadowed (sometimes), they have that little evil glint in their eye -- they have no redeeming qualities (again, except for J&J&M) and are rather 1 dimensional.

 

[The Outrage]

Again with the worldwide dogfighting scandal that seems to be going on:
- Poochyena, I choose you!
- Go, Growlithe!

We do know the difference between video games/anime and reality, don't we?

No.

But that is a good point ... the abusive people are blatant villains. In no way, shape, or form do the heroes ever abuse their pokemon. Even that unofficial jerk with the sandshrew (you guys know the one "You'll be my 100th win" or something like that) was strict but never abusive because he was a good guy. Villains are very clear-cut on Pokemon (J&J&M notwithstanding): they were distinctive uniforms, they're more heavily shadowed (sometimes), they have that little evil glint in their eye -- they have no redeeming qualities (again, except for J&J&M) and are rather 1 dimensional.

I wouldn't say that all evil people wear uniforms and are members of an evil organization. I also wouldn't say people in those organizations are all evil. If I remember correctly, Jessie's mother was only in TR to provide a better life for her children. The Team Aqua/Magma memebers only did evil things under the assumption that what they are doing will benefit Pokemon. Now Cyrus of Team Galaxy is a nutjob, but the majority of his peons are idiots who were most likely easily decieved by his words. Perhaps something bad has happened in their past and Cyrus offered them a better life if they join his cause. Even Cyrus only tried to destroy the entire universe in the belief that under his rule, the world will be a better place. The only person in Pokemon that seems to show "True Evil" is Giovani. He steals Pokemon for profit, he kills them and sells their bodyparts (Cubone Skull for instanse) for profit, of course even he turned over a new leaf, and eventhough he mistreated other people's Pokemon, he seems to be quite fond of his own.

Huh, I always thought that charizard was just lazy. But either way, Ash didn't do the right thing. It is the anime, anyway.

What do you mean Ash didn't do the right thing? Because his Charizard was disobedient he should just let it go? how would that make Charizard feel? It has been abandoned once before by a trainer who deemed it to weak, and if Ash had done the same thing, Charizard may have come to that conclusion as well, and may very well have not trusted any more humans after that point. Even Ash's Pokemon may have lost trust in him, afterall they were all great friends with each other at one time.

If Charizard truely wanted to leave, it would have flown away as soon as it was released from the ball rather than lay there and burn Ash's face. Despite getting 3rd degree burns from Charizard, and being virtually useless in most battles, Ash still kept at it and tried to befriend him.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

The only person in Pokemon that seems to show "True Evil" is Giovani. He steals Pokemon for profit, he kills them and sells their bodyparts (Cubone Skull for instanse) for profit,

I'm presuming you're only going off the games then.

In the games, Giovanni seems only interested in money. And the only pokemon body part I remember anyone selling in the games was Slowpoke tails (which apparently grow right back). As for the Marowak, Giovanni probably didn't even know that had happened. Not to say he wouldn't have condoned it, but he wasn't in Lavender when it happened.

He's a lot more evil on the show than he is in the games, I think.

 

[Roses Ablaze]

What do you mean Ash didn't do the right thing? Because his Charizard was disobedient he should just let it go? how would that make Charizard feel? It has been abandoned once before by a trainer who deemed it to weak, and if Ash had done the same thing, Charizard may have come to that conclusion as well, and may very well have not trusted any more humans after that point.

I think Charizard would have been fine with it, since it didn't respect or even like Ash anymore. It didn't want to battle (and really, why was it obligated to?). Ash wanted it to battle. The show treated it as a bad thing that Charizard went against its trainer's will, but never that Ash wanted Charizard to do something that it didn't want to do.

If Charizard truely wanted to leave, it would have flown away as soon as it was released from the ball rather than lay there and burn Ash's face. Despite getting 3rd degree burns from Charizard, and being virtually useless in most battles, Ash still kept at it and tried to befriend him.

Remember the episode with that Kitsune-ninetails? It was the one that established that a pokeball has the power to keep a pokemon from straying too far from its trainer.

 

[The Outrage]

Remember the episode with that Kitsune-ninetails? It was the one that established that a pokeball has the power to keep a pokemon from straying too far from its trainer.

I doubt the Pokemon themselves actually know that until they try it themselves, and Ash's Charizard has never tried to run away. And what about Pikachu, Ash and Pikachu have been separated countless times due to TR's antics, and I am sure that Ash still carries around his Pokeball.

 

[ImJessieTR]

I wouldn't say that all evil people wear uniforms and are members of an evil organization. I also wouldn't say people in those organizations are all evil. If I remember correctly, Jessie's mother was only in TR to provide a better life for her children. The Team Aqua/Magma memebers only did evil things under the assumption that what they are doing will benefit Pokemon. Now Cyrus of Team Galaxy is a nutjob, but the majority of his peons are idiots who were most likely easily decieved by his words. Perhaps something bad has happened in their past and Cyrus offered them a better life if they join his cause. Even Cyrus only tried to destroy the entire universe in the belief that under his rule, the world will be a better place. The only person in Pokemon that seems to show "True Evil" is Giovani. He steals Pokemon for profit, he kills them and sells their bodyparts (Cubone Skull for instanse) for profit, of course even he turned over a new leaf, and eventhough he mistreated other people's Pokemon, he seems to be quite fond of his own.

I don't know enough about Team Galaxy. Miyamoto's kindness only really explains why Jessie can have a heart. I'm not saying that all evil people wear uniforms ... but a lot of them sure seem to (accept for poachers, etc), or at least have a distinctive style (like the old black-cowboy-hat thing). Also, Domino and the Iron Masked Marauder were just as blood-thirsty as Giovanni. Butch and Cassidy don't have nearly the hearts shown by J&J.