Mafia The 100 Mafia (Endgame - Mafia and Independents Victory)

[Zexy]

Agreed on Flash. What I don't like is how he's tunneling on me.
At some point he asked for content from other people, yet he didn't bother reading too many other people.
He also accused me of being inactive when there are WAY more inactive players around.
Not gonna vote him yet, though; town!him may play like this for all I know

 

[FrogSC2]

Hey all - haven't read a thing yet

If I have a radio I'm on frequency 2
If I had a N0 town peek it was on MovingPictures

 

[FrogSC2]

A list of possible roles would mean it's not completely closed, wouldn't it? :-D

Lol - fair enough

I will speculate in any event

Judging by how the radio mechanics work, if someone with a radio is either lynched or killed the radio will be randomed or passed onto whoever the killer decides.

In order for balance to occur to ensure that this isn't an anti town mechanic, I have to assume the radio is more of a pro-town mechanic.

If it is pro-town, and if players lose the pro-town mechanic via lynch or kill, making it potentially anti-town with a strong + for anti-town D2 onwards, we have to assume town has the ability to make this a pro town mechanic once again.

In other words, we can expect town killings to be in the mix:
Jailor - I assume this would work as a jailkeeper + communication + killing? If I'm mistakeb please correct me
Vigilante - striaght forward killing
Bodyguard - protection + killing - depends on the sites, but I wonder how this mechanic would work - assuming bodyguard were to defend someone who was supposed to be night killed, but died and killed the killer instead, if the killer had the radio - would the bodyguard be able to choose who the radio goes to?

Further more - the radio mechanic is essentially a replacement for mason/neighborizer mechanics so I doubt we can expect those to be in the game

Taking the scum kill(s) + town kill(s) in order, we can assume there must be protectives in order to balance the setup as well.

Roles to be expected upon deduction:
Doctor - stops kills, straight forward
Bodyguard - same same, stops kill, and kills the killer
Escort/Roleblocker - stops a potential kill
Jailkeeper/Jailor - stops actions including kill

Seeing as we're in a 20-ish setup, we can assume ±25-30% are wolves according to mashes in general, which would presuppose 5-6 scums in this setup.

The last 21er game I played was "Don't Trust the Cop" by Titus over on MU called "Pirates" - which included 5 scum and 1 neutral killer.

I really really really hope there isn't cult in this game, as I generally don't play cult games. I'm going to assume no cult here on out.

I fully expect there to be at minimum 2 night kills tonight - one wolf, one neutral scum - I further expect a possible town kill to match the kills, especially considering this radio mechanic.

If we were to boil this down entirely, I'd say:

5 Wolves
1 Neut killing
14 Townies (of which ±4 are power roles) - of the 4 power roles, I'd assume at least one killing, at least one protective, and probably 2 investigatives

The alternative to this setup type is more of a 2 opposing scum teams type of a game, which I've played before as a Town, figured all of the scum, but still lost, even though we lynched scum every day 0_o. So hopefully if we roll this setup balance is in our favor.

In this scenario it would be along the lines of:
3 scum team 1
3 scum team 2
1 neut (true evil/evil/benign)
13-14 town (in which case I would expect 6 TPRS - 2 killings, 2 prots, 2 invests)

Basically what this boils down to this is - pretty much can't trust the cops which sucks, but I'm looking forward to some claim battles.

Considering we should expect scum and town killings, I'd fully expect protectives and invests as well on possibly both sides, maybe manipulators on scum side to throw off the town invests to throw off town killings and roleblockers.

Basically - manipulators should be expected - all off of the basis of Radio mechanics. Lol.

With setup spec in mind - Can I ask - can we request no maj please? Vote swapping would be awesome.

 

[FrogSC2]

Oh yeah - I randed Town. Figured it was obvious but I'll declare it anyway.

 

[FrogSC2]

Asking to receive a radio is like asking Youngster Joey to talk about anything besides Rattatas: it's a moot point, and not worth the time at this point.

Do we know we have a hand in selecting who gets them? Did I miss that part?

This whole mechanic of asking to receive a radio N0 is bad and I won't even discuss it. At all.

 

[Zexy]

Oh my, Frog... there are so many options we shouldn't even bother analyze. I agree that there should be 5-6 anti-towns, if there's only one mafia team I'd go with 5 members, judging by Bulbagarden meta. Cop + Doc + Vig (but not every night) is common stuff here. 2 mafias isn't, 1 mafia and anti-town indeps like SK/arsonist is. Survivor is. Cops should be trusted because I doubt there's more than one, at worst there may be a CC or something. Hypoclaiming wouldn't be bad if everyone understood how it works, but people will inevitably make mistakes.

Also lol @ that Jailor role you mentioned; I've only seen that stuff in Town Of Salem; I wonder if DB would've known of it and include it in the setup (host meta discussion's not angleshooty here). That would be an interesting surprise...

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

Oh yeah - I randed Town. Figured it was obvious but I'll declare it anyway.

I find statements like this to be redundant and potentially indicative of scum allignment. After all, would anyone actually go out and declare:
"I randed scum. Please kill me."

Well, a Jester might, but nobody who is actually scum is going to declare themselves as scum.

That said, you do seem to be putting in a good information gathering effort, so I'm leaning town on you.

Gotta go for now, PT session in 15 minutes. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in.

 

[Zexy]

Potential roles in the setup isn't necessarily town discussion, but town!Frog could've done that.
He also tends to say "I'm town" a lot, I guess regardless of alignment, haven't seen scum!him but I doubt he would avoid saying it when scum.

So, while I like his effort etc. I think all that setup speculation may be a bit redundant. And some ideas are just too outlandish (although that's because of knowing our meta I guess). Town of Salem Jailor, really?

 

[FrogSC2]

I'm liking Scotty so far, he seems civvie.

Saying you like someone without giving a reason is about as useless as a can of hair.

Vote:Sigurd

I can deduce based on Sigurd's limited posts that you like him because:

A) He doesn't like discussing radio distribution N0
Why is this a town tell to you?
B) He shits on flashbrite
What do you scum read about flashbrite and why?
C) He shits on Pikochu aggressivey
Why is aggressive behavior indicative for you?

I can answer these for you, but it'd be just as useless for analysis if I thought for you.

 

[Zexy]

This is the kind of Frog I like seeing. While not that sure that Sigurd's scum myself (I'm afraid to form any kind of read on him after the scrimmage) I can see some townstuff in Frog posts

 

[FrogSC2]

I find statements like this to be redundant and potentially indicative of scum allignment. After all, would anyone actually go out and declare:
"I randed scum. Please kill me."

Well, a Jester might, but nobody who is actually scum is going to declare themselves as scum.

That said, you do seem to be putting in a good information gathering effort, so I'm leaning town on you.

Gotta go for now, PT session in 15 minutes. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in.

Meh - I'd put it to you this way. Scum hardly has the balls to declare their alignment off the bat.

 

[FrogSC2]

This is the kind of Frog I like seeing. While not that sure that Sigurd's scum myself (I'm afraid to form any kind of read on him after the scrimmage) I can see some townstuff in Frog posts

Yeah, I kind of a give a shit about this game so I'll play all out. I will only drink 1/4 of the time. And you can hold me to that! :-D

 

[Zexy]

Meh - I'd put it to you this way. Scum hardly has the balls to declare their alignment off the bat.

Objection; people like you who've done this "I'm town" thing early on countless times wouldn't have any problems faking it as scum lol

 

[FrogSC2]

Objection; people like you who've done this "I'm town" thing early on countless times wouldn't have any problems faking it as scum lol

That's entirely a fair point.

Knowledge of Knowledge of Rationality

KKR for shortform

^ these are the technical terms for game theory.

Speaking of, this is pretty much intuitive but a nice intro anyway:
[video=youtube;qQ3kFydI_xQ]
View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQ3kFydI_xQ
[/video]

Honestly - watch the entire series, good stuff if you want to become an optimal mechanical player

 

[FrogSC2]

Oh yeah, I'll start out by claiming vanilla shitizen

I'm mafia so I've been reading and i will come up with reads soon. By soon i mean like 6 p.m. my time.

Don't do this - no one likes self lynch baiting, ever.

I love FPS (fancy play syndrome) more than most, but self lynch bait almost always backfires. I'll expect you to be the lynch by end of day.

Imagine we're in an entirely vanilla setup - there is NO way to confirm you at all. You claiming Scum results in two options if you make it to final 3:
1) You're honest - and you're scum
2) You're untrustworthy - and your posts are muddled in absurdity beyond redemption

Bottom line - don't do this.

If you want to FPS later, maybe save it for D2 at minimum, it works best D3-4.

Question - do you guys normally CFD (Chinese FireDrill) at the End of Day?

 

[FrogSC2]

so I should come out as a PR then?

Yo, does anyone with a radio want to come out and say so?

I hate day 1's. Let that be known. I usually want to vote for low posters or no-shows on day 1 since I ain't got crap to go on right now.

You play almost exactly like my friend FireBringer

I bet you're an awesome gut reader and I will suspect the fuck out of you if you're wrong twice in a row

 

[FrogSC2]

First things first; I stopped posting because it was Easter over here and I was pretty busy. I also see little point in Night 0 as a concept. Another reason I stopped participating is explained right in the next paragraph.

@Flashranite; I still think there is no point to that best/worst case scenario debate you started, which is kinda scummy, since scum!you could’ve set it up to look active and distract townies from actually scumhunting.

Even though Sigurd said that I am scummy (for asking that I receive a radio) I think his thoughts are pretty towny.



Is it better to just continue discussions that lead nowhere?



Agreed. You look civvie enough as well.

Next up,@FrogSC2; … Welcome to Bulbagarden! Discussing setup strategy is totally acceptable. You should expect that people have discussed in private before outright calling any kind of buddying scummy, there might have even been a private claim exchange. Please read some past Bulbagarden game if you’d like to understand it better, I would suggest Monty Python Mafia as it had lots of private talking. As for hypo claiming, this stuff should be confusing to most Bulbagarden players and lead to people outing themselves as not-PR or the PRs not doing what they are supposed to.

WAIT WAIT WAIT - There's OOG communication after people receive their roles?! WTF is the point of the game then?

Hypoclaiming is ALWAYS the way to go. Always Always Always.

I see you find both Sigurd and Scotty as scum, so I guess same questions apply to you @Zexy

I'd rather not touch on the radio topic, avoid it as tactfully as you can if possible

 

[Zexy]

We know jackatlasred well enough to not just lynch him because of his "I'm mafia" joke, please. You probably don't understand the meta you came in well enough yet; this place is inactive, jokes run rampant yet we don't consider this day 1 stuff FPS at all, and there are no CFDs.

... it was made clear in the rules that there is limited out of thread (but not out of GAME) communication. The way we play here is just different.
Hypoclaiming is the way to go when most people know what it is. Over here we never bothered because the cop/seer/whatever could just PM their checks and say "hey I'm the cop and checked you town, want an alliance?"

I think Sigurd is slightly scummy because of what you said, yet Scotty is slightly civvie like Sigurd said.

The radios are the only way for us to use outside chat this game, and Bulbagarden is used to outside chat, so it's in our best interest to try to touch the radio topic. Not that everyone would comply with the in-thread consensus, though

... now that the culture clashes become more and more obvious, do you all realize why I suggested I get a radio?

 

[Qing'e]

WAIT WAIT WAIT - There's OOG communication after people receive their roles?! WTF is the point of the game then?

Hypoclaiming is ALWAYS the way to go. Always Always Always.

I see you find both Sigurd and Scotty as scum, so I guess same questions apply to you @Zexy

Welcome to a new reality, there's always a spot open for you. :-D

Even if it is, it's not something usually practiced here. So you're going to have to go beyond promoting it, and work to teach people how to effectively use it.

Nope, he said they both seem like town, actually, or is that what you meant?

 

[FrogSC2]

We know jackatlasred well enough to not just lynch him because of his "I'm mafia" joke, please. You probably don't understand the meta you came in well enough yet; this place is inactive, jokes run rampant yet we don't consider this day 1 stuff FPS at all, and there are no CFDs.

... it was made clear in the rules that there is limited out of thread (but not out of GAME) communication. The way we play here is just different.
Hypoclaiming is the way to go when most people know what it is. Over here we never bothered because the cop/seer/whatever could just PM their checks and say "hey I'm the cop and checked you town, want an alliance?"

I think Sigurd is slightly scummy because of what you said, yet Scotty is slightly civvie like Sigurd said.

The radios are the only way for us to use outside chat this game, and Bulbagarden is used to outside chat, so it's in our best interest to try to touch the radio topic. Not that everyone would comply with the in-thread consensus, though

... now that the culture clashes become more and more obvious, do you all realize why I suggested I get a radio?

Hmmmm, you're suggesting that the cop has the radio then - since the cop can "just Pm their checks and say "hey I'm the cop and checked you town, want an alliance?"

Otherwise, you're suggesting literally anyone can pm anyone. In which case - expect scum to randomly pm non scum saying they checked people - and this game revolves almost entirely off thread.

I seriously seriously hope tehre is no OOG communication