The Timeline (Warning: Wailord Sized Spoilers)

[Necrozma]

I don't know why it's hard to believe that XY and ORAS are separate from other games.

Kanto, Johto, Hoenn, Sinnoh and Unova all still exist in the 'Mega' universe. As ORAS demonstrated, most things and events remain identical. XY was free to make references to other regions because they still exist in this universe, and so do all the characters.

 

[Kallyle]

Spoiler

I think that what Sycamore meant in XY is that Mega Evolution and the Fairy type were discovered in the past 2 decades, which is still pretty recent when compared to that one war 3000 years ago. Maybe it was re-discovered sometime in the Origins time-frame?

 

[Oshakpop]

I know that this is an ORAS thread.. but do you think those whole "alternate dimension/reality" stuff could end up being the focus of the next generation?

 

[Silktree]

I know that this is an ORAS thread.. but do you think those whole "alternate dimension/reality" stuff could end up being the focus of the next generation?

Spoiler

It depends on whether or not they're willing to phase out Mega Evolution. They may depart from the Mega universe if they want to introduce a new evolution mechanic at some point, which is obviously a possibility they're already considering:

Q: The games became more exciting with Mega Evolution. Does this mean we won't have normal evolutions in the future?

Masuda: Mega Evolution is a special evolution which indicates a deeper relationship between humans (trainers) and their Pokémon. There are diverse evolution methods within Pokémon, and thus I imagine there will be many diverse evolution methods everyone could enjoy (in the future).

Sugimori also said a year ago that he wanted to "revert to simplicity" in the next generation. The question is if a new evolution mechanic could be simpler than Mega Evolution and easier to fit into the previous universe. You'd think that they would just revisit cross-generational evolutions, but who knows.

Considering the lack of full compatibility between XY and ORAS, it isn't hard to imagine a single generation containing games from separate universes. That way, Mega Evolution wouldn't really be phased out, and the games would be compatible barring Mega Evolution and the new mechanic.

 

[Jun]

I wonder how is Kalos in the universe without Mega Evolution. This war destroyed many species of Pokemon I think (maybe I'm wrong). The worst case of scenario would be that 7th gen setting in Kalos-Universe A with new species of Pokemon.

 

[Silktree]

This war destroyed many species of Pokemon I think (maybe I'm wrong).

That was never stated. Actually, Prof. Birch says that Hoenn had many more Pokémon 3000 years ago, but suffice to say that the original games didn't reflect that.

 

[The Outrage]

I wonder how is Kalos in the universe without Mega Evolution. This war destroyed many species of Pokemon I think (maybe I'm wrong). The worst case of scenario would be that 7th gen setting in Kalos-Universe A with new species of Pokemon.

My idea on how this all works out covers that. Essentially, it'll be very boring since the events that led up to Mega Evolution was the driving force behind both Lysandre's plot and Sycamore sending you on your journey.

 

[Jun]

I wonder how is Kalos in the universe without Mega Evolution. This war destroyed many species of Pokemon I think (maybe I'm wrong). The worst case of scenario would be that 7th gen setting in Kalos-Universe A with new species of Pokemon.

My idea on how this all works out covers that. Essentially, it'll be very boring since the events that led up to Mega Evolution was the driving force behind both Lysandre's plot and Sycamore sending you on your journey.

Sorry I didn't read it at first. That's pretty good. Zinnia explain in Delta Episode that Mega Evolution doesn't exist in Universe A, but there is something else. I'm sure if Game Freak wants to show us that new way of evolution, they would show Kalos from Universe A. It would be so predictable but Sycamore would study this new way of evolution and Kalos would be very different. I can even imagine Sycamore from this universe being good at Pokemon battle. Also if they plan to remake 4G, Rowan would fit well , he studies evolution. New characters and a new story would be important such as Aster.

 

[firepanda]

Spoiler

Sugimori also said a year ago that he wanted to "revert to simplicity" in the next generation.

Oh dear God no. Not again. They did a lot of good things from gen IV to gen V, but they took away so much!

 

[hwrdjacob]

Spoiler

It makes sense that ORAS would be an alternate continuity. In fact, I called bull**** on "It's a remake" when it was first announced. XY, however, I can't. For several reasons, one being how it's stated how Fairies are brand spanking new, and if I recall so were Mega Evolutions. Plus, the way they refer to other regions generally implies it to be the same we've had since Gen 3. Finally, when Toshinobu Matsumiya revealed the official timeline on Twitter, he placed XY after BW. While I have some doubts it is Exactly at the same time as BW2 (A few months at least I can see passing between every "concurrent" game), it's at least in the same canon.

Playing OR right now, it is far from a straight remake. Even the opening convo with Prof. Birch has slightly altered dialogue, plus a "meteor shower" is mentioned at the end of the interview with Norman, which is more than likely foreshadowing of Episode Delta. Plus, you start with the running shoes.

 

[Robo-Floatzel]

You know, with all this, I think that the Pokemon franchise now has a timeline like Zelda does, except this time we have two seperate timelines that co-exist together for the main series games, and that's not counting the timelines of the anime, manga, and other adaptations such as spinoffs, which may prove further splits. In other words, through the war 3000 years ago, virtually every single part of the Pokemon franchise is linked together in some way.

Spoiler

The timeline in which the weapon ends the war is the one we are looking at in X/Y and OR/AS, while one where the weapon never works and/or the war never happened becomes the timeline of the first five generations in which Mega Evolutions are unknown. Another timeline is that the weapon backfires and causes the near-extinction of humanity, leading to the Mystery Dungeon games, or it kills all Pokemon, leading to what one may consider our own universe or something like it. And then we have the fact that each generation we have multiple different versions, which further split the timeline up depending on which version we play and what choices we make.

To put it simply, this isn't just a timeline, this is a multiverse, an even bigger and more complex one than the Zelda timeline is, or what people thought the Zelda timeline was before the official one was revealed. To make a comparison to comic book franchises, the main timeline from the first five generations is basically like Earth 1 in the DC comics, or Earth 616 in the Marvel Comics, while the Mega timeline is Earth 2 (or Earth 1610), and so forth.

If you notice closely, the cries of Pokemon are also different, which could also hint at this being another universe, but that's another story. Personally, I want to go with something along the lines of what @TheOutrage said in an earlier post about his theory, because it's very similar to my own.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Oh dear God no. Not again. They did a lot of good things from gen IV to gen V, but they took away so much!

Agreed. XY and by consequence, ORAS, lacked a lot of cool stuff from generations IV and V. Reverting even further to simplicity (e.g mediocrity) would be such a bad idea.

Not featuring mega evolutions in Generation VII games would also suck a lot.

 

[Okami Takahashi]

Spoiler

Honestly, I'm not sure what to make of the timeline. I've gathered evidence both from my playthrough and the whole alt-universe thing that 4chan mapped out after seeing Zinnia's claim of RSE being an alt universe.

What I found is a little boy in a Pokemon Center talking about the Cable Club, and one of Brawly's Battle Girls talking about how they used to train in the dark. To me this suggests that it's a sequel set 10 years after the originals, with history repeating itself albeit in an altered manner. This would put the Protags in their 20's and starting fresh for reasons unknown, and Steven reclaiming his place as champ among other things, such as the complete rebuilding of Mauville with the help of folks from Kalos.

The second statement I found through my playthrough was at the Marine Museum, claiming the Royal Unova isn't even built yet and won't be finished for X amount of years- suggesting this is just a retconning of the originals.

So we have 3 statements to go by- Zinnia's- the little boy and battle girl's, and the museum. All conflicting accounts that all make sense in their own right. There's more evidence of the 10 years theory as far as I'm aware, I'll keep looking for more clues.

 

[TheFatPanda]

Spoiler

Honestly, I'm not sure what to make of the timeline. I've gathered evidence both from my playthrough and the whole alt-universe thing that 4chan mapped out after seeing Zinnia's claim of RSE being an alt universe.

What I found is a little boy in a Pokemon Center talking about the Cable Club, and one of Brawly's Battle Girls talking about how they used to train in the dark. To me this suggests that it's a sequel set 10 years after the originals, with history repeating itself albeit in an altered manner. This would put the Protags in their 20's and starting fresh for reasons unknown, and Steven reclaiming his place as champ among other things, such as the complete rebuilding of Mauville with the help of folks from Kalos.

The second statement I found through my playthrough was at the Marine Museum, claiming the Royal Unova isn't even built yet and won't be finished for X amount of years- suggesting this is just a retconning of the originals.

So we have 3 statements to go by- Zinnia's- the little boy and battle girl's, and the museum. All conflicting accounts that all make sense in their own right. There's more evidence of the 10 years theory as far as I'm aware, I'll keep looking for more clues.

This is how I interpret those factors:

Spoiler

ORAS takes place in a universe where technology is further ahead than the one of the original RSE.

 

[hwrdjacob]

I still think XY is after BW2... I mean, it was an official statement by Toshinobu Matsumiya. ORAS I can still see being an alternate timeline taking place after FRLG, with this universe's plot taking place around the same time as the original's Emerald perhaps.

 

[Okami Takahashi]

Your quote's broken?

@TheFatPanda That's essentially what Theory 1 and 3 suggest.

 

[Champion Red]

Spoiler

My personal opinion is that Universe A (The Dual-Slot Universe) is that it contains the events from FRLG/Emerald to B2W2/XY

Of course, the events of XY would be drastically different, but I think Calem/Serena would still go on a journey, and end up becoming Champion possibly. For Universe B (The Pokebank Universe), it contains similar events, although with Mega Evolution. So if we get Kanto or Johto remakes, they'll likely be from the Pokebank Universe, as well as future Sinnoh and Unova remakes. Based of Mr. Bonding's backstory, it seems ORAS takes place BEFORE XY, so likely alongside Kanto/Origins just like the Dual-Slot Universe (after all, Zinnia describes the universes as extremely similar, besides Mega Evolution and the effects its existence has on the world)

 

[hwrdjacob]

Can someone tell me where it says in XY that AZ's War created Megas?!?

 

[TheFatPanda]

My intepretations of the timelines:

Spoiler

Timeline 1: the events of the original Red/Green/Blue/Yellow then Gold/Silver/Crystal two years later.

Timeline 2: the events of FireRed/LeafGreen happening concurrently with the original Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, followed two years later by the events of HG/SS happening concurrently with Diamond/Peal/Platinum.

Timeline 3: the events of ORAS happening concurrently with X/Y and Pokemon Origins.

Black/White/B2/W2 can fit into any of them.

 

[Necrozma]

Can someone tell me where it says in XY that AZ's War created Megas?!?

Sycamore's dialogue:

"Let's talk about Mega Stones briefly."

"My theory is that they're special stones irradiated by the light--the energy of the Legendary Pokemon YveltalY/XerneasX--fired from the ultimate weapon 3,000 years ago."

"And that's what I think they are."

"It's even possible that stones like Fire Stones
were what turned into these Mega Stones."

I still think XY is after BW2... I mean, it was an official statement by Toshinobu Matsumiya. ORAS I can still see being an alternate timeline taking place after FRLG, with this universe's plot taking place around the same time as the original's Emerald perhaps.

Wasn't that tweet deleted though?