Things about Anime that non-fans get wrong, annoying you

[Blazaking]

Married couples sleeping in different bedrooms (or at the very least different beds) appears in pretty much every piece of visual American fiction produced in the 40s and 50s that shows a married person's bed. Still doesn't make it an actual part of that time's culture.

While that may be true, we're talking about anime, not fiction in general. Do you have any other examples besides 40s and 50s movies?

 

[Adamant]

While that may be true, we're talking about anime, not fiction in general. Do you have any other examples besides 40s and 50s movies?

"1960s Marvel Comics had Jack Kirby's artwork accurately represent the dress style of the era, while Stan Lee accurately depicted 60's teenage slang in Spider-man."
Not an illogical way of thinking for a modern reader of these comics, but laughably wrong nevertheless.

 

[Blazaking]

I was hoping for something a bit more "recent", but I understand what you're trying to prove. I was just pointing out that anime doesn't need to completely ruled out when it comes to learning about Japan, because even if it isn't the actual reality, it does tend to give you a general idea which usually leads to you researching more into it.

 

[Adamant]

Yes, in which case you're learning the factoids from whatever trustworthy source you're using for research, not your "lots of bullshit with some truthful facts sprinkled around" cartoon.

The point is that "I learned that from anime" is a huge warning sign that, whether said factoid is true or not, a whole lot of the stuff this person "knows" about Japan is probably not true. And to your average guy who doesn't know better, "Japanese students change shoes at school, I learned that from Haruhi" doesn't sound any less stupid nor less trustworthy than "White and black Americans served in the same commando troops in World War 2, I learned that from Sgt. Fury".

 

[TokyoShojo]

You don't understand! When I said that anime isn't my "sole source" of information about Japan, I meant that there are plenty of things that I know about Japan that I didn't learn from anime! Plus, many subtitled anime and translated manga have notes at the top of the screen or in the back of the book, respectively, that explain that Japanese cultural elements of the anime/manga. For example, I was watching an anime in which a character sneezed and said "Oh no! Some one must be talking about me!" and the top of the screen said "note: There is a superstition in Japan that says that when one sneezes, some one is talking about them." Cultural notes appear not only in fansubs, but also in subbed anime DVD releases and officially translated manga volumes. There's no way the professionals would get it wrong!

 

[Adamant]

There's no way the professionals would get it wrong!

You'd be surprised.

And again, what you argued is that people who back up their knowledge with "I learned it from a cartoon" shouldn't be written off as talking out of their asses, which is exactly what one should do. Citing a notoriously unreliable source as the base of your facts means there's a pretty good chance what you said wasn't true, and thus should be taken with a good dozen boatloads of salt.
If you want to back up the tidbits you know about a subject, cite something that's actually trustworthy.

 

[TokyoShojo]

You have no way of knowing that that professional translators are wrong and it is possible to learn things from animation! Things like married couples sleeping in different rooms and black and white soldiers fighting together in WWII are used to avoid what some people consider dirty imagery and racism, but there is no reason why they would have to make up things like changing shoes when getting to school or eating rice for breakfast. Of course things like weird hair colours are made up to make it look more interesting and make it so that the characters don't all look the same, but some things are so minor that they are hardly noticed, so like I said, there is no point in making stuff like that up. And I find it mean to accuse people of "talking out of their asses"...

 

[Adamant]

You have no way of knowing that that professional translators are wrong

Sure I do. If they're factually wrong, they're factually wrong.

Look, I'm sure you agree that the argument "Black and white Americans served in the same commando troops in World War 2. Look, it says so right here in this Sgt. Fury comic book!" is a pretty dumb argument. You can't back up factual arguments about cultural topics with "it says so in this cartoon". They're cartoons, they're made to entertain, not to educate foreigners, and they're not going to go out of their way to accurately represent things to the point that you can use them as sources of information.

Mean or not, if you back up your arguments with "this cartoon says so", you are talking out of your ass, and your argument shouldn't be taken seriously. If you cross-checked with a reliable source and learned that said factoid is true, then back up your argument with that source, not the cartoon. People won't take you seriously otherwise, and they're quite right in not doing so, since "assuming cartoons aren't reliable sources" is not a fallacy.

 

[TokyoShojo]

You have made me so angry that I will probably never forgive you, but can we please just stop this?! I'm tired of arguing! We will never have to see each other in real life, so your opinion doesn't matter to me, and my opinion doesn't matter to you. I'm so stubborn that you will never change my mind on this subject, and the same seems to be true for you too. So let's both just stop.

 

[Adamant]

Look, I have nothing against you personally, and I apologize if I came across as a bit crass. All I'm saying is that you can't really go around claiming that your statements are true because you learned them from a cartoon, and then criticize people for not taking your arguments seriously.

Cartoons aren't accurate sources of cultural facts, they aren't meant to be educative tools, and citing them as the source of your claim is a bad idea if you want to be taken seriously. Surely we can both agree on that?

 

[TokyoShojo]

Well, if you get to put in some last words even after I said we should stop trying to sway each others' opinions, I suppose it's okay for me to say this.

I admit that I had some silly misconceptions about Japan when I first started watching anime. But that was four years ago. When you are an anime fan for a long time, it becomes much easier to separate fact from fiction from possibility when watching anime. As long as you have seen it in more than one anime and the claim is not ridiculous, it's okay to pick up information from anime. "It must be common to eat bento for lunch in Japan because I have seen it on just about every school life anime I have watched" is a valid argument because it has been on many anime and it's not ridiculous, but "Ninjas wore orange and I know because Naruto does" is not because it was only on one anime and it's kind of ridiculous.

 

[SSJ_Jup81]

If you don't know whether what you "learned" is true or not, it's not much of a learning tool, is it? It's like using Bugs Bunny cartoons as your sole source of information about 1940s American society.

"Learning" stuff about other cultures from their cartoons should be discouraged, because... well, they aren't accurate representations. Use trustworthy sources for your education purposes.

I feel that it depends on what you're intending to learn (or unintentionally notice). For example, seems that most shows that aren't exaggerated that show school life tends to be pretty accurate. Take Inuyasha for example. Of course most of that is unbelievable (the traveling through time thing), but Kagome missing a lot of school and not getting in trouble for it is realistic in the sense that over there, with the way the school system is set up, a student can miss a lot of school and get away with it, just as long as the student passes his/her main exams.

When it comes to everyday life stuff, I can see some anime portraying that well or in a realistic manner, especially if it's something that's consistently seen.

Look, I have nothing against you personally, and I apologize if I came across as a bit crass. All I'm saying is that you can't really go around claiming that your statements are true because you learned them from a cartoon, and then criticize people for not taking your arguments seriously.

Cartoons aren't accurate sources of cultural facts, they aren't meant to be educative tools, and citing them as the source of your claim is a bad idea if you want to be taken seriously. Surely we can both agree on that?

I partially disagree with this, as there are shows made with the intention of teaching, animated and non-animated. You can't really say that there are none with accurate sources of teaching. It could even be unintentional. I'm sure Japan has many shows that teaches something. Detective Conan comes to mind. They're always tossing out random trivia in that series. It could be dealing with mythology or something involving a death message that has a kanji trick to it. You're still learning something.

I feel that what TokyoShojo was pointing out that you can learn something from these shows or manga series, and if you're interested (or curious) you look into it further to see just how accurate the information you obtained actually is (was). I wouldn't rule out that you can't learn stuff from an anime series or get introduced to some knowledge through one.

You know, that ep of Pokemon comes to mind. The one with Suzie and the "fashion" of the episode that reflected what the current trends were in Japan at the time. That's just pop cultural knowledge in that regard. Of course most of us westerners didn't get it, but it was still an interesting tidbit of information.

 

[Chibster]

I hate it when people automatically think its for 5 yr olds because its animated and not live action. I remember about a month ago, I went to a friends house(not really my friend anymore) and she asked me what my favorite thing to watch was and i said anime. She then starts telling me how I should watch live action shows like pretty little liars, because she thinks anime is for little kids(i hate these type of shows. nothing about it interests me...).

 

[Princess Viola]

"All anime is either kid's shows, giant robots, or hardcore tentacle porn."

By that logic, all Western animation is kid's shows full of fart jokes.

 

[Genbeeb]

"All anime is either kid's shows, giant robots, or hardcore tentacle porn."

By that logic, all Western animation is kid's shows full of fart jokes.

But they are just full of fart jokes!

No but really, I don't get that annoyed when people think it's for kids. I'm an adult, and therefore, I prove them wrong just by existing along with my many fellow adult otaku. I proudly display my nerdiness, and make no apologies or defensive statements about it. I like what I like. Take it or leave it.

Things I do find funny are other observations. Like: "What was that ghost that just blew out of his mouth?" "Why does that giant teardrop appear?" "Are they eating really tiny octopi?" (Last one is a reference to the sausages cut to look like an octopus.)

 

[Almonds]

I don't get that annoyed when people think it's for kids. I'm an adult, and therefore, I prove them wrong just by existing along with my many fellow adult otaku. I proudly display my nerdiness, and make no apologies or defensive statements about it. I like what I like. Take it or leave it.

You, are super cool. You deserve the admiration of an anime fan here XD

Though, I still get annoyed when people think anime is only for kids (especially the grown-ups, which includes my parents). Yeah, a lot of stuff such as Pokemon and Digimon had been made to be targeted for kids. But there are millions of other stuff that was intended for an older audience. Wait, take Digimon back. Digimon Savers had been targeted for people in their older teens and up (at least in the Japanese version, it had more dark tones).

I would love to bring every single adult who thinks anime is only for kids and is a brainless thing and SHOW THEM really good anime. Sorry for keep bringing up Death Note, but Death Note is a seriously good anime with brain challenging plots. A lot of adults would find it worth their time. One Piece is practically the ruler of all anime (even non-fans have heard about how well made it is) and although it is shounen, it isn't just for kids.

 

[Princess Viola]

I'm thinking of forcing my grandparents to watch End of Evangelion with me, to prove it's not a kid's movie.

 

[Genbeeb]

You, are super cool. You deserve the admiration of an anime fan here XD

Awe, Thanks! X3

I'm thinking of forcing my grandparents to watch End of Evangelion with me, to prove it's not a kid's movie.

Oooh, that might be a little too trippy. I would suggest Grave of the Fireflies. It's set in WWII Japan. It focuses on the lives of two children. It's an incredibly sad yet provocative anti-war movie done by studio ghibli. Roger Ebert said it was the most powerful anti-war movie ever made.

When introducing someone to anime, you have to think what would suit there tastes best. There are so many genres and subgenres. Something you might like, I might find horrible. I'll use Death Note as an example since darkqueen seems to be a fan. Many people love Death Note, and I thought it was good but not great. I saw potential for it to be more. It's a tricky line to find.