• Hey Trainers! Be sure to check out Corsola Beach, our newest section on the forums, in partnership with our friends at Corsola Cove! At the Beach, you can discuss the competitive side of the games, post your favorite Pokemon memes, and connect with other Pokemon creators!
  • Due to the recent changes with Twitter's API, it is no longer possible for Bulbagarden forum users to login via their Twitter account. If you signed up to Bulbagarden via Twitter and do not have another way to login, please contact us here with your Twitter username so that we can get you sorted.

Were Team Aqua/Magma treated kinder than Team Rocket?

N

Nekusagi

Badass office lady
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
4,591
Reaction score
8
With the eventual appearance of Team Galactic in the anime, I had to ask..

Am I the only one who thought Aqua and Magma were treated kinder in the anime than Team Rocket?

I ask this because watching their various episodes, I get the impression that Aqua and Magma were portrayed more sympathetically than Team Rocket ever was. Evil, yes, but on the other hand, they seemed to be implied more as two factions of misguided people with a strong emphasis on loyalty than anything else. Especially that scene at the end of the Groudon/Kyogre story arc where Shelly is comforting Archie- she's actually helping him up and everything. The closest that's ever happened for Team Rocket is in Mewtwo Returns, after Mewtwo's wiped TR's memory- and then, Domino just kinda gives Giovanni this really weird look. TR, in comparison, has basically been treated like a bunch of Nazis, or something, when the characters are other than James/Jessie/Meowth. Kidnapping mothers, Gyarados, Rayquaza, abusing clones, torturing old men... you name a vile, depraved act, and they've probably done it. The only way they could make them look worse at this point is to show Giovanni kicking Persian or something (I don't count the implication of it in Gotta Dance, since that was one of Meowth's fantasies.)

I have to wonder if I'm just asking this because I'm seeing things through my rosy glasses of Rocket fandom, but either way, it's interesting how the various evil teams have been treated, and it also raises the question of how we'll see Galactic whenever they make their debut on the anime.
 
That's pretty much how they're portrayed in the games, too.
 
They definitely were portrayed more sympathetically that way later on, 'specially Aqua.

Though earlier on they seemed pretty terrible, almost Rocket-level.
 
Neku said:
TR, in comparison, has basically been treated like a bunch of Nazis, or something
Click to expand...

rocket_j.jpg

What gave you that idea?
 
Dogasu wins thread.

Though, I've always pictured Team Rocket has a rather heartless group. The ranks filled with hardened criminals and the malcontent with little respect for life or property. Considering they murdered Pokemon in the games, I'd have to say they're pretty evil. Though that's why I love Team Rocket.

On the other hand I've pictured Magma/Aqua as delusional more than evil.
 
That doesn't even look like a Nazi salute. That would be out to the front, not straight up in the air.

And do I see a dark-skinned agent? That'd be the second one, wouldn't she?
 
Even so, this looks more like a Roman salute (which, yes, the Nazi salute was *based* on, but they're not identical), which ties in with Giovanni's Roman Emperor complex.
 
Blackjack Palazzo said:
That doesn't even look like a Nazi salute. That would be out to the front, not straight up in the air.
Click to expand...

Well, it's more "Nazi-ish" than all those supposed "Hitler mustache" episodes.

Here's the dubbed version of that shot:

rocket_u.jpg

Obviously someone thought it looked similar enough.
 
The Big Al said:
Dogasu wins thread.
Click to expand...

Team Rocket was formed on greed, where as Aqua and Magma are groups trying to help the earth.

Rocket views themselves as the bad guys.
Aqua/Magma view themselves as the good guys.
 
Yes.

I do indeed agree Dogasu wins the thread.

But the real question comes to mind: do they really CONSIDER themselves evil? I mean, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, and although directly trying to do what they think is best for the world is never directly stated, I'm sure some of them think so.
 
Neku said:
But the real question comes to mind: do they really CONSIDER themselves evil? I mean, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, and although directly trying to do what they think is best for the world is never directly stated, I'm sure some of them think so.
Click to expand...

Oh, the evil question. My fav. <3

Some of them are probably delusioned into thinking they're fighting for a good cause, and then there are probably some of them that just really get off on being evil.

I think a lot of them have the attitude, " I'll do whatever I have to so that I can make a living. It's every man for himself. There's nothing wrong with me for living by that."

^ I think this makes up most of the grunts.

It depends on the individual.

Like, Jessie and James aren't really EVIL. They're not all like, OMG I'LL KILL YOUR GROWLITHE AND RAPE YOUR MOM. I think they're more like...fight the system, the man can't keep us down, let's be rebels or something. Then there are others, like the Iron Masked Marauder and Professor Sebastian, for example, who seem to really enjoy being bad. It seems like Sebastian probably joined Team Rocket so that he could get away with all kinds of sadistic experiments that the normal ethics code would never allow. (He seems to enjoy electrocuting things, doesn't he? :/ I mean, all three times we've seen him. Rayquaza, Raikou, AND Gyarados.)
 
On the other hand, does, say, Sebastian, consider his experiments wrong personally? Or does he simply feel the establishment feared his work and feels his work is necessary?

I have to wonder if even Giovanni recognizes what he does as wrong, or just accepts it as something that he was supposed to carry on after his mother was gone. Anyone who's read some of my fanfiction knows I've always figured he goes so much more deeper than just the typical villain/evil overlord type.

As for Vicious... he's just psycho. I don't think morality even comes into the question for him.

But I would like to see TR portrayed with just a bit more sympathy (and I don't mean J&J, either). The fourth movie came pretty close to that- treason's treason, after all (though I wonder how many Americans figured out the slightly pro-TR slant to the storyline).
 
Well, y'know. Aqua and Magma really ARE a bunch of misguided people who use illegal means (stealing and threatening, mostly) to make the world better in their eyes. In Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, as you come near the very end of the Aqua-Magma plotlines, Archie and Maxie start realizing just how misguided they were after seeing the destruction their actions were causing, and I recall that they came to the same conclusion in the anime too.

As for Team Rocket... despite how adorable the TRio can get sometimes and how dorky they are in general, they're members of the most sadistic and cruel organization presented in the Pokemon franchise. They kill and torture Pokemon on a regular basis for the sake of money and personal gain in just about every media they appear in. In the anime in particular, Team Rocket has plenty of agents who are sadistic and power-hungry and they're all willing to electrocute and capture Pokemon in less than humanitarian means.

So yeah. I can see why Aqua and Magma get portrayed in a more sympathetic manner. They don't kill people. Not intentionally, at least.

Funny how I still like Team Rocket after all that. =P I like the less dangerous Rockets (the TRio and Mondo) more than the others and it's a bunch of interesting people, in any case.
 
I think the most sadistic "evil" dude is definately Cyrus, the leader of Galatic.

Giovanni wants to get rich and have control of many of the world's business.
Aqua and Magma want to "help" Pokemon.

But Cyrus (from what I've heard, his followers are unaware of this) wants to destroy the universe and become god.

That's friggin cool.
 
So Cyrus is his English name?

That's... awesome. Yay mythology.
 
What's it mythological basis?

I like it cuz it reminds me of Syrus from Yugioh GX, except...you know, not a wimp.
 
I'm pretty sure we read about a guy called Cyrus last year in Mythology...

Greek, if you're wondering.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrus

There. Persian, actually.

(Resists urge to play "Six Degrees of Evil Pokemon Character Separation")
 
Please note: The thread is from 17 years ago.
Please take the age of this thread into consideration in writing your reply. Depending on what exactly you wanted to say, you may want to consider if it would be better to post a new thread instead.
Back
Top Bottom