Generation VI: The Future

[Zweilous]

It was always obvious that Kyurem would be unique in its relation to Zekrom and Reshiram. If anything, Game Freak managed to underdeliver in that they gave it two fusions rather than one representing the Original Dragon.

Zygarde's ability and entries suggest a similarity to Rayquaza's role, and I have yet to see interesting ideas about how it would be all that different. Two secret moves have been done before with Kyurem, and honestly, those were more interesting.

That's pretty subjective, some like that the Original Dragon is shrouded in mystery, and others prefer that it would be its own Pokémon like Regigigas. Regardless of your preference though, that wasn't the point, it was something done differently then what we got from Rayquaza or Giratina and wasn't that expected as we only believed we get one form instead of two. So in short, saying Zygarde is doomed to not be interesting is denying the possibility that something new can be done.

They've never explained much about Mewtwo, let alone the legendary birds, either. I do find it irritating that some people treat Zygarde as if it were more important than Mewtwo, which was brought back for XY without any exposition.

Mewtwo isn't nearly in the same position as Zygarde. Mewtwo wasn't built up to have a connection or overlying plotline, it was just in a cave with no explanation. The birds are in the same position, but they never had any story in the games anyway, so there's not much to expect out of them in general. Zygarde is being built up to have something due to its Pokedex entry, and with the two moves found in the data, that idea is supported. That's why Zygarde gets the attention over the others, it has something to lend to the belief it'll get an expansion on the story for itself, Mewtwo and the birds are pretty much just there.

 

[Silktree]

that wasn't the point,

My point is that it was always clear that something different would be done with Kyurem. The fact that it ended up being two fusions rather than one isn't even all that significant.

So in short, saying Zygarde is doomed to not be interesting is denying the possibility that something new can be done.

I have yet to see any ideas about what that might be.

That's why Zygarde gets the attention over the others, it has something to lend to the belief it'll get an expansion on the story for itself, Mewtwo and the birds are pretty much just there.

I know why it gets the attention - because it follows a pattern and little else. Most fans love to stick to safe assumptions.

And please don't pretend that no one ever thought that the Pokémon Mansion journal entries would lead somewhere beyond a Mew distribution. It's simply been years since then.

 

[WallflowerCanyon]

That's pretty subjective, some like that the Original Dragon is shrouded in mystery, and others prefer that it would be its own Pokémon like Regigigas. Regardless of your preference though, that wasn't the point, it was something done differently then what we got from Rayquaza or Giratina and wasn't that expected as we only believed we get one form instead of two. So in short, saying Zygarde is doomed to not be interesting is denying the possibility that something new can be done.

Mewtwo isn't nearly in the same position as Zygarde. Mewtwo wasn't built up to have a connection or overlying plotline, it was just in a cave with no explanation. The birds are in the same position, but they never had any story in the games anyway, so there's not much to expect out of them in general. Zygarde is being built up to have something due to its Pokedex entry, and with the two moves found in the data, that idea is supported. That's why Zygarde gets the attention over the others, it has something to lend to the belief it'll get an expansion on the story for itself, Mewtwo and the birds are pretty much just there.

I think you put my thoughts into better words than what I could earlier. I was also afraid that if I had said that about Mewtwo and the Birds, that people who are die-hard fans of Gens 1 and 2 would chime in and try to start something... assuming those kinds of people are members here.

 

[Piplup]

Regarding the "original dragon" - I wonder what are the chances of a future game revealing it... a potential BW/BW2 remake (yes, it'll take some time until this happens but I'm convinced it's happening) could possibly introduce it by giving Kyurem a primal form (or whatever they'll want to call it, but I think "primal" could fit for this)

 

[WallflowerCanyon]

I know that it's been said that they don't really plan on making 3rd versions again, but on the off chance that they decided to make sequels for X/Y instead, I wonder if they would have Steven show up in Kalos. I can't exactly remember his dialogue to Wallace at the end of Delta, but doesn't he decide to start traveling abroad in search of more stones and doing more research on Mega-Evolution after he fulfilled his duties as the Hoenn Champion?

Also, I had another thought. What if they decide to release this fall a pair of games that serves as sequels to both X/Y and ORAS, because of all the connections between them? And then release Gen 7 next year? Having games serve as sequels to both X/Y and ORAS would almost make it like a trilogy of sorts, since ORAS seems like it's a prequel of sorts to X/Y, which is something that is somewhat new up to a point. But could it work? To change it up a bit more, instead of re-visiting Kalos and Hoenn, maybe make a new region that has ties to both.

HOWEVER, there is one problem about that. With hints of Gen 6 on the verge of ending already, it would be redundant to make a new region on games that would still be considered Gen 6. Like what many have suggested already, DLC would probably be the best option for a sequel of sorts that would have ties to both.

 

[BlackButterfree]

I know that it's been said that they don't really plan on making 3rd versions again, but on the off chance that they decided to make sequels for X/Y instead, I wonder if they would have Steven show up in Kalos. I can't exactly remember his dialogue to Wallace at the end of Delta, but doesn't he decide to start traveling abroad in search of more stones and doing more research on Mega-Evolution after he fulfilled his duties as the Hoenn Champion?

Also, I had another thought. What if they decide to release this fall a pair of games that serves as sequels to both X/Y and ORAS, because of all the connections between them? And then release Gen 7 next year? Having games serve as sequels to both X/Y and ORAS would almost make it like a trilogy of sorts, since ORAS seems like it's a prequel of sorts to X/Y, which is something that is somewhat new up to a point. But could it work? To change it up a bit more, instead of re-visiting Kalos and Hoenn, maybe make a new region that has ties to both.

HOWEVER, there is one problem about that. With hints of Gen 6 on the verge of ending already, it would be redundant to make a new region on games that would still be considered Gen 6. Like what many have suggested already, DLC would probably be the best option for a sequel of sorts that would have ties to both.

They never said no more 3rd versions. They just said everyone expected them to release it after X and Y (which btw, they didn't. OR/AS was released instead. Take that however you want it. I'll take it as an Emerald repeat, AKA 3rd version after remakes.) and that they'd tie X/Y with OR/AS in a unique way, which they did through Mega Evolution touching both regions. They have every possibility (sequels, Z, prequels, non-Mega Kalos, DLC, nothing at all) wide open right now and anything could happen, honestly.

 

[Zweilous]

My point is that it was always clear that something different would be done with Kyurem. The fact that it ended up being two fusions rather than one isn't even all that significant.

Considering that it was a change that we didn't see coming and led to us getting two games that were sequels, I would say that was significant. Even if you guessed that fusion was in the cards, the end result did surprise the fanbase overall.

I know why it gets the attention - because it follows a pattern and little else. Most fans love to stick to safe assumptions.

Except we also have other pieces of evidences that supports it getting an expanded storyline, so it's not just a pattern.

And please don't pretend that no one ever thought that the Pokémon Mansion journal entries would lead somewhere beyond a Mew distribution. It's simply been years since then.

Here's the thing though, as you said, Mewtwo had nothing in terms of that or otherwise in XY. In fact, little (if anything) of substance was given to Mewtwo in terms of story, lore, nods to its origins or the like, it was just in the cave sitting around waiting for you to catch it. Compare that to Zygarde, who got a Pokedex entry that basically spelled out that it balances out Kalos ecosystem that would fit in perfectly with the other two members of its trio, and that's ignoring the data that strengthens that connection via the aforementioned two moves. So it's not comparable to say that Mewtwo is getting overlooked for Zygarde when the former has no build-up to anything in terms of XY's story while the latter has a good amount of build-up to an expanded storyline for XY.

 

[Silktree]

Considering that it was a change that we didn't see coming and led to us getting two games that were sequels, I would say that was significant. Even if you guessed that fusion was in the cards, the end result did surprise the fanbase overall.

I did predict sequels. That was significant, but the two versions? Not so much. The sequel formula could have worked with a single version had Game Freak wanted that. It turned out that they wanted two versions regardless of sequels.

Except we also have other pieces of evidences that supports it getting an expanded storyline, so it's not just a pattern.

The "expanded storyline has to mean giving Zygarde its own game" conclusion is very much pattern-based.

Here's the thing though, as you said, Mewtwo had nothing in terms of that or otherwise in XY.

I was talking in general about unfufilled potential from past generations. While I expect something to be done with Zygarde, I think that some people are giving it too much weight.

 

[WallflowerCanyon]

While I expect something to be done with Zygarde, I think that some people are giving it too much weight.

I don't quite understand what you mean by this, but I haven't been around the fandom for very long to see exactly what people are speculating about it. The most that I've seen is that most people in general seem to agree that something will be done with Zygarde before Gen 6 is done with.

I think the issue with the supposed overhype is that we don't know exactly how it's supposed to bring balance to the ecosystem, or why and how it's supposed to be a foil to Xerneas and Yveltal. The only thing that I can think of comes from dealing with the ecosystem balance involving the life-and-death energy cycle is something that hasn't been done yet for the main series plot. Me personally, I don't follow the hype or set high expectations because of "patterns", or find something interesting because of hype created by other people. I usually take what's given and usually still pleased about it in the end.

 

[BlackButterfree]

Considering that it was a change that we didn't see coming and led to us getting two games that were sequels, I would say that was significant. Even if you guessed that fusion was in the cards, the end result did surprise the fanbase overall.

I know why it gets the attention - because it follows a pattern and little else. Most fans love to stick to safe assumptions.

Except we also have other pieces of evidences that supports it getting an expanded storyline, so it's not just a pattern.

And please don't pretend that no one ever thought that the Pokémon Mansion journal entries would lead somewhere beyond a Mew distribution. It's simply been years since then.

Here's the thing though, as you said, Mewtwo had nothing in terms of that or otherwise in XY. In fact, little (if anything) of substance was given to Mewtwo in terms of story, lore, nods to its origins or the like, it was just in the cave sitting around waiting for you to catch it. Compare that to Zygarde, who got a Pokedex entry that basically spelled out that it balances out Kalos ecosystem that would fit in perfectly with the other two members of its trio, and that's ignoring the data that strengthens that connection via the aforementioned two moves. So it's not comparable to say that Mewtwo is getting overlooked for Zygarde when the former has no build-up to anything in terms of XY's story while the latter has a good amount of build-up to an expanded storyline for XY.

Sorry for the off-topic post, but this made me realize we know nothing about Mewtwo aside from its origin.

Spoiler

We really do need more Mewtwo backstory. We know Mr. Fuji created him because of the New Island event (which may have been a reference to Dr. Fuji of Team Rocket from the 1st movie?), we know Mew gave birth to him (which considering that in X & Y, an NPC suggests Eggs are actually cradles for the Pokémon while they mature into babies, might not be all that far-off), and we know he somehow fled to Cerulean Cave, then Kalos where he guards a Mewtwonite. But we know nothing of the in-between.

Why did Mewtwo go to Kalos? Why did it flee Pokémon Mansion? What about Mew? What happened to his Mother? Remember, in the games Mewtwo isn't a clone of Mew, he's a baby that was genetically tampered with as a fetus to become stronger. For that matter, how did Mew get pregnant? Was she already pregnant in Guyana, or was another Mew captured and mated with her? Or is Mewtwo's father a Mew at all? Could that be the connection between Celebi and Mew?

Either way, back to the topic at hand, Zygarde having two exclusive moves doesn't really mean anything. Hoopa and Diancie both had exclusive moves, and both have a bigger albeit still irrelevant role to play in Hoenn than Kalos. Also, two more Pokémon have exclusive moves and have yet to be distributed (I'm not counting Hoopa, 'cause he's been revealed lol): Volcanion and AZ's Floette. Volcanion's Steam Eruption and Floette's Light of Ruin are signature moves, much like Thousand Waves and Thousand Arrows are. And btw, just because the animations are reminiscent of Zygarde's scales and color scheme does not mean that our Mosquito Snake is getting his own version.

Trust me, I would love to be wrong and have Kalos tie up a huge amount of its loose ends, but I really don't think it's gonna happen. Game Freak isn't showing any signs of announcing something big soon and every major announcement the past few years has been in January to May (X/Y, B/W, B2/W2, OR/AS, HG/SS, Platinum), so we still have a few months before we rule anything out.

 

[Mitchman]

Gamefreak wasn't showing signs of ORAS happening either. Hell, ORAS wasn't teased in XY but a new region was of all things. I think we'll get a direct next month or in March, with the Investor's Meeting that's coming up for Nintendo holding some sort of hint, much like how they outright said gen 5 is coming to the DS back in 2010. Zygarde's two moves do mean something, just what is unknown.

 

[shiny_magikarp]

Gamefreak wasn't showing signs of ORAS happening either. Hell, ORAS wasn't teased in XY but a new region was of all things. I think we'll get a direct next month or in March, with the Investor's Meeting that's coming up for Nintendo holding some sort of hint, much like how they outright said gen 5 is coming to the DS back in 2010. Zygarde's two moves do mean something, just what is unknown.

Mega Blaziken was a sign, at least for me. I was saying before ORAS announcement that Mega Blaziken could be a teaser of remakes because of being the only Hoenn starter to have Mega, being event only and featured in anime as quite important character. All of this wouldn't be done for no reason.

Now there's the ME Act III coming this spring. It's supposed to feature both Kyogre and Groudon. I hope it will be connected with ORAS DLC which might contain 3D cutscene of weather crisis that happened in ancient past. Also Battle Frontier of course and maybe something with Looker.

 

[Morningstar]

just what is unknown.

Well Unknown is the Japanese name for the Pokemon Unown, which is based on the Latin Alphabet and ...oh. you didn't mean it like that...

In certain ways though, ORAS did get Foreshadowed. The marathon swimmer, Mega Blaziken and Absol (especialy Blaziken), MegaLati@s in the code, the color schemes of the XY legends and the games themselves, the fact that the box legends claimed to be foiled by Zygarde, but both of them can easily win against it...

 

[Kallyle]

Considering that it was a change that we didn't see coming and led to us getting two games that were sequels, I would say that was significant. Even if you guessed that fusion was in the cards, the end result did surprise the fanbase overall.

I know why it gets the attention - because it follows a pattern and little else. Most fans love to stick to safe assumptions.

Except we also have other pieces of evidences that supports it getting an expanded storyline, so it's not just a pattern.

And please don't pretend that no one ever thought that the Pokémon Mansion journal entries would lead somewhere beyond a Mew distribution. It's simply been years since then.

Here's the thing though, as you said, Mewtwo had nothing in terms of that or otherwise in XY. In fact, little (if anything) of substance was given to Mewtwo in terms of story, lore, nods to its origins or the like, it was just in the cave sitting around waiting for you to catch it. Compare that to Zygarde, who got a Pokedex entry that basically spelled out that it balances out Kalos ecosystem that would fit in perfectly with the other two members of its trio, and that's ignoring the data that strengthens that connection via the aforementioned two moves. So it's not comparable to say that Mewtwo is getting overlooked for Zygarde when the former has no build-up to anything in terms of XY's story while the latter has a good amount of build-up to an expanded storyline for XY.

Sorry for the off-topic post, but this made me realize we know nothing about Mewtwo aside from its origin.

Spoiler

We really do need more Mewtwo backstory. We know Mr. Fuji created him because of the New Island event (which may have been a reference to Dr. Fuji of Team Rocket from the 1st movie?), we know Mew gave birth to him (which considering that in X & Y, an NPC suggests Eggs are actually cradles for the Pokémon while they mature into babies, might not be all that far-off), and we know he somehow fled to Cerulean Cave, then Kalos where he guards a Mewtwonite. But we know nothing of the in-between.

Why did Mewtwo go to Kalos? Why did it flee Pokémon Mansion? What about Mew? What happened to his Mother? Remember, in the games Mewtwo isn't a clone of Mew, he's a baby that was genetically tampered with as a fetus to become stronger. For that matter, how did Mew get pregnant? Was she already pregnant in Guyana, or was another Mew captured and mated with her? Or is Mewtwo's father a Mew at all? Could that be the connection between Celebi and Mew?

Either way, back to the topic at hand, Zygarde having two exclusive moves doesn't really mean anything. Hoopa and Diancie both had exclusive moves, and both have a bigger albeit still irrelevant role to play in Hoenn than Kalos. Also, two more Pokémon have exclusive moves and have yet to be distributed (I'm not counting Hoopa, 'cause he's been revealed lol): Volcanion and AZ's Floette. Volcanion's Steam Eruption and Floette's Light of Ruin are signature moves, much like Thousand Waves and Thousand Arrows are. And btw, just because the animations are reminiscent of Zygarde's scales and color scheme does not mean that our Mosquito Snake is getting his own version.

Trust me, I would love to be wrong and have Kalos tie up a huge amount of its loose ends, but I really don't think it's gonna happen. Game Freak isn't showing any signs of announcing something big soon and every major announcement the past few years has been in January to May (X/Y, B/W, B2/W2, OR/AS, HG/SS, Platinum), so we still have a few months before we rule anything out.

Game Freak better not abandon what they started or else they'[re going to lose a lot of fans, which means they lose money.

 

[WallflowerCanyon]

I actually never thought of those things as hints and thought it was all coincidence when that Backpacker omitted Hoenn as his home, but what I did think was that it was all pretty eerie. Maybe that was my "gut" telling me that R/S/E remakes were on the way.

Now that it seems my gut has proven itself to me, maybe I should join NCIS or SHIELD?

 

[BlackButterfree]

Game Freak better not abandon what they started or else they'[re going to lose a lot of fans, which means they lose money.

Do you mean the Mewtwo backstory? Or finishing up Kalos? Because I'm sure Volcanion will get distributed to OR/AS eventually, and AZ's Floette could be distributed a la Arceus.

Also, there were no outright hints to a Hoenn remake. There were TONS of references to Hoenn, but also to Kanto, Johto, Sinnoh, Unova and even Sevii. I think the main hint was the strategy guide saying that Berries could be traded over from other regions and all the missing berries were the Hoenn/Sinnoh berries, and since we couldn't get Sinnoh remakes before Hoenn...

 

[Kallyle]

Game Freak better not abandon what they started or else they'[re going to lose a lot of fans, which means they lose money.

Do you mean the Mewtwo backstory? Or finishing up Kalos? Because I'm sure Volcanion will get distributed to OR/AS eventually, and AZ's Floette could be distributed a la Arceus.

Also, there were no outright hints to a Hoenn remake. There were TONS of references to Hoenn, but also to Kanto, Johto, Sinnoh, Unova and even Sevii. I think the main hint was the strategy guide saying that Berries could be traded over from other regions and all the missing berries were the Hoenn/Sinnoh berries, and since we couldn't get Sinnoh remakes before Hoenn...

Mainly Kalos, because I much as I want Mewtwo's appearance in Kalos and its Mega Stones explained, that's the least likely thing Game Freak would do. All I want is for Game Freak to finish up Kalos on a strong note, preferably with Zygarde. Heck, at least Mewtwo already had some sort of backstory beforehand, were as Zygarde's got nothing so far. This is mainly because leaving a newer Legendary Pokémon unexplained like the Legendary Birds is more of a step backwards for Game Freak than forwards, even by their standards

Even if Game Freak decided not have Zygarde related to Xerneas and Yveltal, Kalos' identity is almost barren without Mega Evolution. Heck, we don't even know about the lore between Xerneas and Yveltal, or if there even is a connection beyond having opposing concepts and powers. Since the Mega Evolution plot was already expanded upon by ORAS, Kalos preety much has nothing to it. There's no side features or unique lore to it. I just don't want Game Freak to constantly make the games as simple as Generation 1. In fact, one could say that Kalos was even simpler than the Kanto games were if you ignore the box Legendaries and the ultimate weapon thing.

I just don't want Game Freak to undermine their most-recent region they created just to move on and only make half-decent games that reduce the series to be like mobile apps. Overall, it feels like Generation 6 was intentionally rushed.

 

[Bolt Strike]

just what is unknown.

Well Unknown is the Japanese name for the Pokemon Unown, which is based on the Latin Alphabet and ...oh. you didn't mean it like that...

In certain ways though, ORAS did get Foreshadowed. The marathon swimmer, Mega Blaziken and Absol (especialy Blaziken), MegaLati@s in the code, the color schemes of the XY legends and the games themselves, the fact that the box legends claimed to be foiled by Zygarde, but both of them can easily win against it...

The Torchic line is very popular in Japan and has gotten special treatment before (it was the only starter in DP to be let into Amity Square, it was the only starter to be obtainable via Pokewalker) and Absol is nothing special. Color schemes and mascot patterns are coincidence. The marathon swimmer is just a minor reference, and like @BlackButterfree; said, a bunch of other regions got similar references too. The only thing that arguably was an ORAS hint was the Mega Latis.

 

[BlackButterfree]

Game Freak better not abandon what they started or else they'[re going to lose a lot of fans, which means they lose money.

Do you mean the Mewtwo backstory? Or finishing up Kalos? Because I'm sure Volcanion will get distributed to OR/AS eventually, and AZ's Floette could be distributed a la Arceus.

Also, there were no outright hints to a Hoenn remake. There were TONS of references to Hoenn, but also to Kanto, Johto, Sinnoh, Unova and even Sevii. I think the main hint was the strategy guide saying that Berries could be traded over from other regions and all the missing berries were the Hoenn/Sinnoh berries, and since we couldn't get Sinnoh remakes before Hoenn...

Mainly Kalos, because I much as I want Mewtwo's appearance in Kalos and its Mega Stones explained, that's the least likely thing Game Freak would do. All I want is for Game Freak to finish up Kalos on a strong note, preferably with Zygarde. Heck, at least Mewtwo already had some sort of backstory beforehand, were as Zygarde's got nothing so far. This is mainly because leaving a newer Legendary Pokémon unexplained like the Legendary Birds is more of a step backwards for Game Freak than forwards, even by their standards

Even if Game Freak decided not have Zygarde related to Xerneas and Yveltal, Kalos' identity is almost barren without Mega Evolution. Heck, we don't even know about the lore between Xerneas and Yveltal, or if there even is a connection beyond having opposing concepts and powers. Since the Mega Evolution plot was already expanded upon by ORAS, Kalos preety much has nothing to it. There's no side features or unique lore to it. I just don't want Game Freak to constantly make the games as simple as Generation 1. In fact, one could say that Kalos was even simpler than the Kanto games were if you ignore the box Legendaries and the ultimate weapon thing.

I just don't want Game Freak to undermine their most-recent region they created just to move on and only make half-decent games that reduce the series to be like mobile apps. Overall, it feels like Generation 6 was intentionally rushed.

Well, we've had quite a few unexplained non-event legendaries before.
The birds (only connected to Lugia through anime, but it seems to be canon now due to the Sea Spirit's Den in Kalos?)
Lati@s (get tons of backstory in Anime movie, but none in-game)
Heatran
Genesect (real form)
Tao Trio (original dragon)

But I agree that every legendary should have at least a paragraph or two's worth of information.

And I also agree that Kalos has no lore out of Mega Evolution. The war and AZ are very interesting, but that's so far in the past, it has nothing to do with the present. If we had more exposition about the war, about AZ, about the legendaries, if everything in Kalos was expanded, I think it'd be amazing. And yeah, I agree that these games are definitely easier than the Kanto games. The original R/B/Y, I've never made it past Erika. FR/LG, I've never made it past Lorelei. I've never made it to the league in Kanto.

Whereas Johto, Hoenn, Sinnoh, Unova and Kalos all have me as their Champion. So I would argue that Kanto are actually the hardest. Especially considering how incredibly hard it is to soft reset for good IV's and train up EV's. Actually, do they even exist in Gen. 1?

 

[WallflowerCanyon]

This announcement probably isn't anything new, but something that I only recently found a couple days ago:

‘Pokemon’ Developers Hint at Upcoming Game Announcement

Whether they're specifically talking about a Pokémon game or not, I'm not sure. Though, something new that we haven't heard of yet is going to be announced pretty soon. Another thing that's mentioned is the time it takes to develop a "good game" VS the pace of today's gaming market. That part kind of worries me.