Mafia Cells at Work Mafia - Endgame (09/02/2020)

[Tood]

Still think a point that we are all not taking seriously enough is that it's Snowy vote that doomed LG. I also suspect Felly being Anti Town, and I really suspect that if we wait too long before lynching her, it will be too late. I know I'm going a bit meta here, but that Anti-Lynch thing seriously ressemble how a disease would act, being Cancer or whatever.

I disagree that it's that impossible for Felly to have an anti-town role, but I don't have enough proof for that, besides the fact that in our cells-based setting a cell that is undetectable till it's too late might be bad news. I can't really come up with a cell based role that would have that ability and be pro-town. Also she comes across very defensive in her posts. But again, that's not enough proof.

I don't know how meta we're allowed to get, but:

I agree with your assessment that Felly's role may be anti-town due to meta reasons involving cancer or other diseases, but there is a possible context in which she could be town:

Granted, I'm not familiar with the source material and its characters, but in the context of an immune system itself, there are two stages of sorts: an innate response (involving cells like macrophages and neutrophils...), followed by an adaptive response (involving T cells, B cells and the production of more potent antibodies in the bodt). Generally, the innate response has to signal to the adaptive one to begin working, so if Felly is a T cell or something like that, I can see her role being delayed.

But I do not dismiss the idea of her being a disease either, I just need to point out that it's not impossible for her to be town.

@MegaPod @Lone_Garurumon

Thoughts? Do you want a claim from KingofSparta?

Granted, I'm relatively new at these games, so I'm not too sure what convention is, but isn't it a bit early to be considering claiming right now?

 

[Tood]

Also

Vote: Felly

Because despite the possibility she could be town, I also see her as a very possible independent or mafia player. I think it would be best to take the risk and lynch her so that we may have one less of those two running around.

 

[HumanDawn]

Granted, I'm relatively new at these games, so I'm not too sure what convention is, but isn't it a bit early to be considering claiming right now?

It's not a mass claim. A player can claim whenever they want. KingofSparta says he doesn't have to offer much so I am wondering what Megapod and Lone_Garurumon would think.

 

[CyanideCrystal]

The player you voted on has been subbed out. Thoughts?

I think I haven't heard enough from LG today to really tell, and TheMalevolentOne wasn't really in the game so I will wait for the current player to say something more before I decide who to vote for.

Unvote: Lone_Garurumon

For now. I also want to hear more from other previously inactive roles.

 

[CyanideCrystal]

Granted, I'm not familiar with the source material and its characters, but in the context of an immune system itself, there are two stages of sorts: an innate response (involving cells like macrophages and neutrophils...), followed by an adaptive response (involving T cells, B cells and the production of more potent antibodies in the bodt). Generally, the innate response has to signal to the adaptive one to begin working, so if Felly is a T cell or something like that, I can see her role being delayed.

That's pretty interesting. And it would be a great way to throw the town on a loop and mislead them into a lynching.

But Im also worried that Felly might have some kind of a night time power that she can only use now that she can talk.

 

[MegaPod]

I don't get why it is faulty

She wasn't lynchproof, she was unvotable
and this was something LG had already considered:

In fact that was the only reason for him to fear getting lynched when he noticed AE still had his vote on him since if Felly was a -1 she would've still get lynched

if any other wagon had another vote Lone would've been able to shift the lynch instead of sacrificing himself who he knew to be guaranteed town
any person that had a 1-vote vote wagon on them would've become a viable option for a lynch
people dissolving them last time is pretty suspicious to me because it reduces the amount of viable options for that day

So, you think HumanDawn’s vote switch to Felly doomed Lone 1.0 because there were no other players besides him with a vote on them? That would assume HumanDawn knew Felly’s role from the start, but that wouldn’t stop anyone else from changing their own votes to save Lone (if they even knew for sure he was in any danger of being lynched) or start a new wagon. The flaw with your accusation is that you imply HD made any other outcome of D1 impossible by voting Felly. Granted, if HD and Felly are scum together, HumanDawn could’ve still placed the vote for distancing knowing there’d be no immediate consequences for either of them, but at best that makes it plausible they’re scumbuds, and isn’t concretely scummy behavior. Do you see now what we mean?

As for King’s response, it makes sense that a new player would go along with an existing wagon, though new can of course still be scum and there may still be scum motive involved after all. Perhaps it would be fine to see how he does as the game progresses, though. I notice that the Felly wagon is back, and considering players’ arguments for the likelihood that her role could be scum, I’m not opposed to the idea of her lynch instead.

 

[Felly]

Hi, another quickie to answer some suspicions about my role. Not gonna drop too many things on the basis that it'll put a bigger target on my back than there already is, but I am what is considered a T cell, which from what I'm reading in Tood's post, it can cause delayed reactions, hence my delayed arrival.

I also do have a night action that'll help the town, but with no doctor to protect me at this point (rip), I don't want to leak the finer details of it.

Also, the vote counts from midday are correct; I am lynchable this round, and all future rounds; my protection lasted only the first day and the first night to coincide with my inability to post in the thread. Now that I'm here and able to post, all lynch votes and night actions will count against me. If there's something funky going on with votes counting or nah from here on out, it's not because of me.

As for the defensive play, I think that might just be my play style, I'm not sure, haha; it's honestly been a little while since I last played text based Mafia, and I've always been a little inconsistent about playing.

 

[HumanDawn]

I also do have a night action that'll help the town, but with no doctor to protect me at this point (rip), I don't want to leak the finer details of it.

That's interesting, so you're sure you don't want to claim it?

 

[ExLight]

No, HD didn't have to know Felly's role. The possibility of her being unvotable was already know and was previously pointed ou by me and by LG 1.0; all he had to do was consider that possbility. If they're scumbuds then sure, he knew about it, but if she's town then there are a few scenarios where HD's actions were scummy:

If Felly were a -1 self, voting her turned her wagon in a 3vote wagon; while LG had 2 votes. That means either Felly was going to get lynched that day or that a No Lynch would happen.

If LG were voteless then Felly would be lynched, and scum would keep a voteless around.

And if Felly was unvotable then I already addressed how it made other lynches unviable, which were our only chance of hitting scum if LG 1.0 and Felly were Town.

This actually makes Felly a bunch townier to me, but I feel like the HD vs Felly situation can only be verified by one of them flipping or by a cop result.

I'm on mobile and can't answer properly, but once I get home I'll address to some specific counteraeguments directed towards me.

 

[MegaPod]

Errr, I think you just broke the rules by character claiming, Felly...

 

[HumanDawn]

No, HD didn't have to know Felly's role. The possibility of her being unvotable was already know and was previously pointed ou by me and by LG 1.0; all he had to do was consider that possbility. If they're scumbuds then sure, he knew about it, but if she's town then there are a few scenarios where HD's actions were scummy:

You considered it and still told Lone_Garurumon to vote himself.

"All he had to do was consider the possibility"

i don't know what to say man you should look in the mirror

If Felly were a -1 self, voting her turned her wagon in a 3vote wagon; while LG had 2 votes. That means either Felly was going to get lynched that day or that a No Lynch would happen.

If LG were voteless then Felly would be lynched, and scum would keep a voteless around.

And if Felly was unvotable then I already addressed how it made other lynches unviable, which were our only chance of hitting scum if LG 1.0 and Felly were Town.

This actually makes Felly a bunch townier to me, but I feel like the HD vs Felly situation can only be verified by one of them flipping or by a cop result.

I'm on mobile and can't answer properly, but once I get home I'll address to some specific counteraeguments directed towards me.

1. LG had 2 votes with a vote on himself. I don't really see what's so weird about voting Felly and making it a 3 vote wagon with that idea?

2. LG claimed he wasn't Voteless.

3. How does it make Felly a bunch Townier?

 

[Felly]

Errr, I think you just broke the rules by character claiming, Felly...

It is my actual role though, so it's more role claiming than anything else, unless we mean the T cell part, but that too is also part of my role. I claimed what I am, but I'll leave that to mod discretion; if it's determined I broke a rule (albeit accidentally), then I'll accept whatever punishment I get.

I'm just tryna provide info to the people rather than hide stuff, like I unfortunately had to do day 1.

 

[CyanideCrystal]

The rules say we cant claim characters or any aliases only roles. So I'd say telling us what character you are (character as in, the name of the character that appears in the show) was against the rules. Let's see what the mod says though.

 

[KenderCharmeleon]

I'm pretty sure claiming character is against the rules but what's done is done. Anyway, I do not know the characters enough for that to help me much.

Unvote : Felly

We all arguing about other stuff, but I think we are maybe overthinking it a bit. Ok I'll believe you then. Still don't know who to vote for.

 

[ExLight]

You considered it and still told Lone_Garurumon to vote himself.

And I constantly pointed out that we should look for a wagon that wasn't Felly/Lone to place three votes into.
Are you purposely ignoring that?

And, like, can you fucking stop hitting that key? Selfvoting is the best way to identify where a role modifier is coming from without causing a massive WIFOM in town. Are you saying you'd rather have him vote someone else and make us not not how many votes are on them?

 

[ExLight]

2. LG claimed he wasn't Voteless.

Oh yea, because bastard game never have hidden negative modifiers.

3. How does it make Felly a bunch Townier?

Since all of the scenarios where you're both not scum results in either her or Lone's lynch then I think it's fine to assume you and her aren't the same alignment. I'm scumreading you pretty hard, which by consequence makes me town read her a lot more.

 

[ExLight]

I feel like Felly is fine because T Cells aren't a specific type of cells iirc, so even with the claim there are multiple characters (Killer, Helper, Regulatory, Naive) that might fit into that. I feel like it doesn't deserve a modkill, but it might count as hinting to the character and similar commentaries should by the own person about it (other players might speculate) should be avoided.

 

[Felly]

For what it's worth, I don't even know the characters in the show, haha. But as kender said, what's done is done, and I'll be more cautious about what I say going forward in relation to my role/character, at least until a mod clarifies things.

That's interesting, so you're sure you don't want to claim it?

For now, I'm sure I don't want to claim, especially given I may have broken a rule as it is. I'm already a little uncertain given there's no doctor, but I'm also a little concerned of the potential rule breaking and being modkilled, haha. Once things have been clarified, I'll see about actually claiming, depending on how I feel at that point in the game.

 

[ExLight]

Granted, I'm not familiar with the source material and its characters, but in the context of an immune system itself, there are two stages of sorts: an innate response (involving cells like macrophages and neutrophils...), followed by an adaptive response (involving T cells, B cells and the production of more potent antibodies in the bodt). Generally, the innate response has to signal to the adaptive one to begin working, so if Felly is a T cell or something like that, I can see her role being delayed.

This is actually super interesting, good attempt of flavor solving.

Granted, I'm relatively new at these games, so I'm not too sure what convention is, but isn't it a bit early to be considering claiming right now?

One or Two claims might help us generate more discussion, and hopefully find a contradiction/counterclaim.

I also do have a night action that'll help the town, but with no doctor to protect me at this point (rip), I don't want to leak the finer details of it.

I don't see the point of not claiming tbf
Two protective roles are already dead, so by claiming that you have something here you might've caught scum's attention, so they'll prolly either disrupt or kill you
all this IF you don't get lynched today considering your wagon is a leading one

So, you think HumanDawn’s vote switch to Felly doomed Lone 1.0 because there were no other players besides him with a vote on them? That would assume HumanDawn knew Felly’s role from the start, but that wouldn’t stop anyone else from changing their own votes to save Lone (if they even knew for sure he was in any danger of being lynched) or start a new wagon. The flaw with your accusation is that you imply HD made any other outcome of D1 impossible by voting Felly. Granted, if HD and Felly are scum together, HumanDawn could’ve still placed the vote for distancing knowing there’d be no immediate consequences for either of them, but at best that makes it plausible they’re scumbuds, and isn’t concretely scummy behavior. Do you see now what we mean?

I think I addressed this already, but yea, they didn't have to be buds with Felly or know her role because if HD is scum he'd granted either a mislynch or a no lynch with little to no options for town to pick.

Let's look at it like this:

a) I am scum with Felly because I knew about Felly's role and wanted Lone_Garurumon to get him mislynched.

b) I am scum with Felly to decrease the viable lynch options to trap Lone_Garurumon into him now potentially saving himself or getting mislynched

c) I am scum with Felly & Cyanide because I unvoted Cyanide to save him from Lone_Garurumon potentially voting him and make a no lynch or get himself mislynched

This would be the only thing that makes sense for me changing my vote, but Exlight hasn't supported this anywhere.

I really don't see why you'd have to be scum with any of them to limit town's options.
First of all "potentially saving himself" is a pretty cute way of saying "resulting in an useless No Lynch" that would give town literally nothing to work with the following day.

And sure, all of them kinda work. But assuming we'd get two scum right off the bat like this is kinda a bit too lucky and I'm not that confident in my mafia skills lmfao. So yea, I'd assume at least one of you is scum, focusing more in either you or Felly, and assuming you're the one more likely.

 

[HumanDawn]

And I constantly pointed out that we should look for a wagon that wasn't Felly/Lone to place three votes into.
Are you purposely ignoring that?

If you did it constantly, I wouldn't have forgotten.

You are saying we should have looked for a wagon that wasn't Felly/Lone, but yet, what wagon did you help make in the end? If you voted anyone, that might make your claims about Day 1 more credible. You admit to considering that Felly's role would negate all votes on her, but then did nothing about it, and then you have the face to say I had some sneaky plan to decrease the amount of possible lynches with my change of vote? Get your thinking straight.

And, like, can you fucking stop hitting that key? Selfvoting is the best way to identify where a role modifier is coming from without causing a massive WIFOM in town. Are you saying you'd rather have him vote someone else and make us not not how many votes are on them?

I really don't understand? He could vote anyone other than himself and Felly, and we would know whether he was actually Voteless or not. Basically, what I am trying to say is that I can implicate you regarding the same situation like how you are implicating me, except you are being hypocritical about it.

Oh yea, because bastard game never have hidden negative modifiers.

I don't think I've implied that, please stop putting words in my mouth.