Fire starters... Are Game Freak beating a dead horse?

[Gaga]

I never had a problem with the Fire/Fighting starter combo. It's pretty awesome. People just want to complain and whine about everything.

You complained about two pure Water and Grass starters, but there were two Fire/Fighting starters before Gen V as well.
It's a similar situation.

 

[Envoy]

I never had a problem with the Fire/Fighting starter combo. It's pretty awesome. People just want to complain and whine about everything.

You complained about two pure Water and Grass starters, but there were two Fire/Fighting starters before Gen V as well.
It's a similar situation.

@FairyRed Also, your complaining is hypocritical since you just criticized people for whining (about Fire/Fighters) and then proceeded to whine (about Grass and Water.)

 

[Ghetsis-Dennis]

I think what she's trying to say is that you guys never bothered the fact that we have 3 pure Grass types and 3 pure Water types, which are the same number of Fire/Fighting types, and we shouldn't waste our breath on complaining only one of the three.

 

[Enzap]

The reason people complain isn't because they have a problem with the type combination itself, which has been established to be very useful. The problem is that this rut that they've dug is in the way of other type combinations. We want something new and interesting. Something that will give us a new experience.

True, just giving the Pokemon a single type isn't anything new, but there's still a lot more room for opportunity if they do that than if they give it the same two types.

 

[Envoy]

Also Water and Grass are the defaults. You can't really complain about a Pokemon being its default type (though people have, especially with Serpy and Samurott.) Fire/Fighting is not the default, which is a very important distinction to make.

 

[proserpina]

Oh god I couldn't agree more with so much of what has been said. It really is a case of the fact that they're starting to make the rut that is Fire/Fighting the default. It's a cool set. I like it and I'd like it on other well-designed 'mon. But on the starter? Three times in a row? If you don't wanna come up with a new concept entailing new typing in that way, just stick with the classic Grass/Water/Fire. I'd rather that than Grass/Water/Fire+Fighting all the time.

It's not whining about the typing (and whining about people whining before proceeding to whine about something else isn't exactly useful or the topic at hand here either), it's "whining" about the fact that for all of the new concepts GF is bringing into the series they're still not delivering new and interesting type combinations on starters and they're still regurgitating Fire/Fighting like the awesomeness didn't wear off a bit a generation ago.

 

[Articwolf10]

I really think Emboar should've been Pure Fire or part Dark and Samurott getting Fighting...

I kinda hope the next trio could be
Water/Fighting
Fire/Psychic
Grass/Dark

who;s with me?

 

[Kastigar]

Torchic is probably my favorite starter ever, with Blaziken being one of my favorite pokemon ever. That being said, I feel that the fire starters since have been down hill. I really feel like if they want to make starters evolve into multitypes, they should never have identical combos back to back.

We'll see a Gen VI eventually, it's almost a certainty. I really hope they surprise us with some interesting combos when the time comes.

 

[Ghetsis-Dennis]

Why doesn't anyone ever listen to my theories about the Fire/Fighting trend?

I really think Emboar should've been Pure Fire or part Dark and Samurott getting Fighting...

I kinda hope the next trio could be
Water/Fighting
Fire/Psychic
Grass/Dark

who;s with me?

Again with the Fighting/Dark/Psychic thing? It's not trio, it's a square: Fighting/Dark/Ghost/Psychic. Remember that Psychic is ineffective against Dark, which ruins the point of a starter trio.

 

[Articwolf10]

Why doesn't anyone ever listen to my theories about the Fire/Fighting trend?

I really think Emboar should've been Pure Fire or part Dark and Samurott getting Fighting...

I kinda hope the next trio could be
Water/Fighting
Fire/Psychic
Grass/Dark

who;s with me?

Again with the Fighting/Dark/Psychic thing? It's not trio, it's a square: Fighting/Dark/Ghost/Psychic. Remember that Psychic is ineffective against Dark, which ruins the point of a starter trio.

Notice how I gave each type to the Pokemon who are weak against each other... for Example a Fire/Psychic Pokemon would be both SE and weak against the Grass/Dark Pokemon and vice-versa with Water/Fighting so it's still a triangle as long a reverse traingle in a way combined with Fire/Water/Grass

 

[Envoy]

I really think Emboar should've been Pure Fire or part Dark and Samurott getting Fighting...

I kinda hope the next trio could be
Water/Fighting
Fire/Psychic
Grass/Dark

who's with me?

I'm not so sure about that, much as I would love "Special" sub-types. Allow me to quote myself:

Anyone else notice that all of the Starter's sub-types until now have been of the former 'physical' category?

Back before Gen IV, Poison (Venusaur,) Flying (Charizard,) Ground (Swampert/Torterra,) Steel (Empoleon,) and Fighting (Blaziken/Infernape/Emboar) were all considered physical types. I'm not saying it's a trend, but it is a pattern.

Maybe that explains why we haven't seen a Starter with a Dragon/Ice/Electric/Psychic/Dark sub-type yet.

As a side-note, I do agree that Emboar should have been pure Fire, Samurott should have been Water/Fighting and Serperior would have benefited from a sub-type (though I can't think of a good one right now.)

 

[Ghetsis-Dennis]

Notice how I gave each type to the Pokemon who are weak against each other... for Example a Fire/Psychic Pokemon would be both SE and weak against the Grass/Dark Pokemon and vice-versa with Water/Fighting so it's still a triangle as long a reverse traingle in a way combined with Fire/Water/Grass

I'm still skeptical about this, especially the fact that the Fire/Psychic will be vulnerable to Stealth Rock. Smogon said it's a terrible defensive type due to its status as a glass cannon, which is why they don't appreciate pure fire types, so it's best for Emboar to stay as a Fire/Fighting type.

 

[Articwolf10]

Notice how I gave each type to the Pokemon who are weak against each other... for Example a Fire/Psychic Pokemon would be both SE and weak against the Grass/Dark Pokemon and vice-versa with Water/Fighting so it's still a triangle as long a reverse traingle in a way combined with Fire/Water/Grass

I'm still skeptical about this, especially the fact that the Fire/Psychic will be vulnerable to Stealth Rock. Smogon said it's a terrible defensive type due to its status as a glass cannon.

And? a Pokemon vulnerable to SR is still a million times more preferable then another Fire/Fighting type... good god GF does not give a shit about the meta-game when it comes to making types Fire/Fighting is a good type combo but we are sick of it on a starter because 3 in a row is enough... besides Fire/Psychic could be a beast in the Special Sweeper department and they dropped the ball on Emboar

 

[Ghetsis-Dennis]

And? a Pokemon vulnerable to SR is still a million times more preferable then another Fire/Fighting type... good god GF does not give a shit about the meta-game when it comes to making types Fire/Fighting is a good type combo but we are sick of it on a starter because 3 in a row is enough... besides Fire/Psychic could be a beast in the Special Sweeper department and they dropped the ball on Emboar

GF does care about the metagame actually. Joshawott said that they pay attention to the tournament to see which Pokemon is used more often in order to decide they could create a counter to nerf it. Besides, the starters' secondary types are formerly physical, so they won't use formly special types like Psychic as a secondary type. And since Fire starters are always glass cannons, Fighting is needed to give it some resistances to survive (they're not planning on making a bulky Fire starter anytime soon).

 

[Envoy]

GF does care about the metagame actually. Joshawott said that they pay attention to the tournament to see which Pokemon is used more often in order to decide they could create a counter to nerf it. Besides, the starters' secondary types are formerly physical, so they won't use formly special types like Psychic as a secondary type. And since Fire starters are always glass cannons, Fighting is needed to give it some resistances to survive (they're not planning on making a bulky Fire starter anytime soon).

Enough with the Stealth Rock thing, will ya? If GF really cared that much about SR's impact on the metagame, they wouldn't have brought it back as a Tutor move. Of course Game Freak keeps an eye on metagame trends, but they do not, have not, and will not base all or even most of their decisions on the freaking metagame. EVER. How many times do people have to tell you this?

 

[Articwolf10]

And? a Pokemon vulnerable to SR is still a million times more preferable then another Fire/Fighting type... good god GF does not give a shit about the meta-game when it comes to making types Fire/Fighting is a good type combo but we are sick of it on a starter because 3 in a row is enough... besides Fire/Psychic could be a beast in the Special Sweeper department and they dropped the ball on Emboar

GF does care about the metagame actually. Joshawott said that they pay attention to the tournament to see which Pokemon is used more often in order to decide they could create a counter to nerf it. Besides, the starters' secondary types are formerly physical, so they won't use formly special types like Psychic as a secondary type. And since Fire starters are always glass cannons, Fighting is needed to give it some resistances to survive (they're not planning on making a bulky Fire starter anytime soon).

Emboar is hardly bulky... his Def is pathetic and is HP us useless... he's quite easily take out because his paper-thin defeses and terrible speed he's by far the worst Fire Start by a mile... there is no saying the can change that and his resistances are useless for him because of his horrid stat distribution... if they really cared Emboar wouldn't be the trainwreck he is now...

No SR doesn't automatically make a pokemon useless need I remind you Vulcarona is 4x's weak and still top tier OU... Psychic along with Fire would have a shit ton of weakness yes but it's still a powerful STAB combo

 

[Ghetsis-Dennis]

Emboar is hardly bulky... his Def is pathetic and is HP us useless... he's quite easily take out because his paper-thin defeses and terrible speed he's by far the worst Fire Start by a mile... there is no saying the can change that and his resistances are useless for him because of his horrid stat distribution... if they really cared Emboar wouldn't be the trainwreck he is now...

I never said Emboar was bulky. And Lucario is frail yet can still take a hit or two from a move he resists due to its Steel typing.

No SR doesn't automatically make a pokemon useless need I remind you Vulcarona is 4x's weak and still top tier OU... Psychic along with Fire would have a shit ton of weakness yes but it's still a powerful STAB combo

Because Volcarona is backed up by actual bulk followed by Quiver Dance (and soon Giga Drain), unlike Victini, who is Psychic/Fire but is standing in UU because of its many weaknesses and vulnerability to SR.

Enough with the Stealth Rock thing, will ya? If GF really cared that much about SR's impact on the metagame, they wouldn't have brought it back as a Tutor move. Of course Game Freak keeps an eye on metagame trends, but they do not, have not, and will not base all or even most of their decisions on the freaking metagame. EVER. How many times do people have to tell you this?

There's actually some negative responses about Stealth Rock's return as a move tutor, and I suspected that it's because GF was listening to Smogon's mourn for the loss of the move being common in their metagame. Of course, Joshawott and Silktree doubt that's the real reason.

 

[Articwolf10]

Emboar is hardly bulky... his Def is pathetic and is HP us useless... he's quite easily take out because his paper-thin defeses and terrible speed he's by far the worst Fire Start by a mile... there is no saying the can change that and his resistances are useless for him because of his horrid stat distribution... if they really cared Emboar wouldn't be the trainwreck he is now...

I never said Emboar was bulky. And Lucario is frail yet can still take a hit or two from a move he resists due to its Steel typing.

No SR doesn't automatically make a pokemon useless need I remind you Vulcarona is 4x's weak and still top tier OU... Psychic along with Fire would have a shit ton of weakness yes but it's still a powerful STAB combo

Because Volcarona is backed up by actual bulk followed by Quiver Dance (and soon Giga Drain), unlike Victini, who is Psychic/Fire but is standing in UU because of its many weaknesses and vulnerability to SR.

Enough with the Stealth Rock thing, will ya? If GF really cared that much about SR's impact on the metagame, they wouldn't have brought it back as a Tutor move. Of course Game Freak keeps an eye on metagame trends, but they do not, have not, and will not base all or even most of their decisions on the freaking metagame. EVER. How many times do people have to tell you this?

There's actually some negative responses about Stealth Rock's return as a move tutor, and I suspected that it's because GF was listening to Smogon's mourn for the loss of the move being common in their metagame. Of course, Joshawott and Silktree doubt that's the real reason.

Exactly but Steel>>>> Fighting as a Defensive type... Fighting does nothing for Emboar besides reminding us how terrible he is compared to the other Fire Starters... he's the only one who's stuck in NU without a good reason. Charizard is a very good Pokemon but he's crippled by SR... Emboar resists SR but is in NU because he isn't good at all and 70/70/70 isn't a very good bulk but he has a good defensive type combo to make up for it plus great speed (90)

Emboar however has a very bad def stats of 110/65/65 good HP pathetic Def... not to mention his 65 base speed and a weakness to Ground, Water, Flying and Psychic.. so plenty of Pokemon will OHKO him...

 

[Water Max]

I am also annoyed that every Fire starter since Generation III has fully evolved into a Fire/Fighting type Pokémon but I think that Generation VI will continue this trend with its Fire starter evolving into a Fire/Fighting type Pokémon.

 

[Envoy]

I am also annoyed that every Fire starter since Generation III has fully evolved into a Fire/Fighting type Pokémon but I think that Generation VI will continue this trend with its Fire starter evolving into a Fire/Fighting type Pokémon.

Why?